Re: Stus-List Contributing to Stu's costs

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Sorry - to Stu's email address is what I meant

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Hoyt, Mike 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2016 10:53 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Hoyt, Mike
Subject: Re: Stus-List Contributing to Stu's costs

I sent emil transfers in the past to Stus-List email. Tht worked

Stus-List pretty good at being flexible

Mike
Persistence
Halifax ns

From: CnC-List [cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] on behalf of Colin Binkley via 
CnC-List [cnc-list@cnc-list.com]
Sent: October 13, 2016 9:59 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Colin Binkley
Subject: Stus-List Contributing to Stu's costs

So how does one go about assisting in defraying costs that Stu is now fronting? 
We have a nation of 700 boats I have been told.  You ALL are the Greatest. 
Thank you Colin Binkley SV Lindsey Layne
71 C&C 40C #3
Black Beard Island Ga.
Wintering in the Great Lakes
Sent from my iPhone
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Stus-List Contributing to Stu's costs

[Stu via CnC-List]

Thanks for the contributions -- they are all greatly appreciated.

If you want to use PayPal
- Logon to your account
- click on "Pay or send money"
- click on "Send money to Friends or Family"
- send to "s...@cncphotoalbum.com"

If you want to send a check, money order, etc.
Make payable to:
Stu Murray
33 Langton Rd
London, ON, CA
N5V 2L9

Some Canadian banks have email money transfer -- that works to -- transfer 
to "s...@cncphotoalbum.com"


Thanks again
Stu 




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Stus-List Mainsail replacement considerations

[Bradley Lumgair via CnC-List]

Dave
Maybe we should combine our orders, I'll be looking for a new main this winter 
for our '85 33-2. Have dealt with Spike here at Doyle Boston, and am happy with 
what we got. He's "very" local and an active part of our race program here in 
Sarnia.
Brad
"Pulse" 
1985 C&C 33-2
Lake Huron


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Stus-List PayPal update

[Stu via CnC-List]

Colin & others -- no I am not able to accept debit card or credit card 
payments - the credit card companies don't like me.


Marek -- thanks for the PayPal link.

I am now set up for a direct payment method through PayPal.  The new link 
is:  http://mailtrack.me/tracking/raWzMz50paMkCGZlZwpmAmpkAwNzMKWjqzA2pzSaqaR9ZwH2ZGDjBGp1Way2LKu2pG0kZQH3ZGt0ZmV0A1N


Thanks again to all who have contributed.

Stu 




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Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F

[David Platt via CnC-List]

Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out. Won't 
antifreeze drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the 
water pump?


Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer

On 2016-10-13 12:07 PM, Tim Sippel via CnC-List wrote:


In Water :

Change oil

Check Coolant / change if necessary

Out of water

Run anti-freeze though engine (capture and dispose of properly) I’m 
not brave enough to simply drain it !


Remove impeller and store with engine key

*Tim Sippel*

**

*C&C 33mk ii Matico*

**

**

**

**

**

**

**

**

*:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Dave 
S via CnC-List

*Sent:* Monday, October 10, 2016 8:36 PM
*To:* C&c Stus List 
*Cc:* Dave S 
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F

Hi Doug,

Third GTA winter coming up and I have not yet run the red stuff 
through windstar's engine.  (IIRC the manual does not mention doing 
this)   What I have done is drain the water lock muffler and raw water 
strainer, remove the hoses to the water pump, then drain the block 
through the two valves on the engine block.  (access under the galley 
sink)  Blow any water out though the water pump hose.


Not sure whether that's optimal or not

Anyway, If I were to use the red stuff, (and I may) I would drain 
everything first so I could be sure that the antifreeze was not too 
diluted.


It really is a good time to look in on the water pump impeller..

I would also check the specific gravity of the coolant to ensure its 
freeze point is low enough.  You can get a tester at Crappy tire for 
this for less than $10.


Top up the batteries with distilled water.

Dave (we met on pier 7 - whitby)

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:34:55 + (UTC)
From: mailto:doug.we...@rogers.com>>
To: C&C List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Subject: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F
Message-ID: <1911996305.1436982.1476131695...@mail.yahoo.com 
>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

It's my first year with the 2GM20F and it's almost time to winterize 
it. Is there anything I need to do other running anti freeze through 
the fresh water intake until it comes out the exhaust??

Cheers,Doug
Celtic Knot33-2
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Re: Stus-List PayPal update

[bushmark4--- via CnC-List]

 Stu and Marek; I like the paypal; very easy to do; I feel much better now!

 


Richard
S/V Bushmark4; C&C 37 CB; Ohio River Mile 584.4

Richard N. Bush  
2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
502-584-7255

 

 

-Original Message-
From: Stu via CnC-List 
To: C&C Email List 
Cc: Stu 
Sent: Fri, Oct 14, 2016 10:33 am
Subject: Stus-List PayPal update

Colin & others -- no I am not able to accept debit card or credit card 
payments - the credit card companies don't like me.

Marek -- thanks for the PayPal link.

I am now set up for a direct payment method through PayPal.  The new link 
is:  
http://mailtrack.me/tracking/raWzMz50paMkCGZlZwpmAmpkAwNzMKWjqzA2pzSaqaR9ZwH2ZGDjBGp1Way2LKu2pG0kZQH3ZGt0ZmV0A1N

Thanks again to all who have contributed.

Stu 



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Re: Stus-List Mainsail replacement considerations

[Dave S via CnC-List]

Interestingly, I have asked only for a replacement mainsail, and two lofts
(both have a sense of my intended use, and know the dimensions) are going
to quote, without having asked me any further questions.
I am working my way through the Sailpower blog as recommended here by Kevin
Driscoll.  Interesting stuff, and between that and the comments from
listers I should come out the other end with a clear specification for my
purposes.

Combined purchase?   Might make sense, especially if shipping and customs
clearance is involved. The border and foreign exchange add to the
commercial complexity, so local is good for a few reasons.   That said, I
found for my a-spin that Rolly Tasker in Thailand was extrememly
competitive and reliable,  (sail not used yet...)  even though mine was
custom, and not an off the rack model. Couldn't hurt to share knowledge
anyway. I have a few people interested in quoting, some directed my
list members. (thanks!)   I think I've had some discussions with Spike in
the past...

Once the smoke clears I will probably post findings/specification on my own
blog page and here, where the advice of list members has helped a lot
already.

Dave




Message: 5
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 12:39:48 +
From: Bradley Lumgair 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Stus-List  Mainsail replacement considerations
Message-ID:


Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Dave
Maybe we should combine our orders, I'll be looking for a new main this
winter for our '85 33-2. Have dealt with Spike here at Doyle Boston, and am
happy with what we got. He's "very" local and an active part of our race
program here in Sarnia.
Brad
"Pulse"
1985 C&C 33-2
Lake Huron
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Stus-List paypal

[Howard and Skippy via CnC-List]

I want to send $ to Stu using paypal.  Do I use the 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com as the email for payment?

Howard Paul

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Re: Stus-List paypal

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

http://mailtrack.me/tracking/raWzMz50paMkCGZlZwpmAmpkAwNzMKWjqzA2pzSaqaR9ZwH2ZGDjBGp1Way2LKu2pG0kZQH3ZGt0ZmV0A1N

On Oct 14, 2016 12:47 PM, "Howard and Skippy via CnC-List" <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I want to send $ to Stu using paypal.  Do I use the cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> as the email for payment?
> Howard Paul
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
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Re: Stus-List PayPal update

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

Actually, it is a much simpler link: 
www.paypal.me/stumurray .

probably, one could even remember it.

Marek

From: Stu via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:33
To: C&C Email List
Cc: Stu
Subject: Stus-List PayPal update

Colin & others -- no I am not able to accept debit card or credit card
payments - the credit card companies don't like me.

Marek -- thanks for the PayPal link.

I am now set up for a direct payment method through PayPal.  The new link
is:  
http://mailtrack.me/tracking/raWzMz50paMkCGZlZwpmAmpkAwNzMKWjqzA2pzSaqaR9ZwH2ZGDjBGp1Way2LKu2pG0kZQH3ZGt0ZmV0A1N

Thanks again to all who have contributed.

Stu



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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Platt
Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F


Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer
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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Platt
Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F


Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer
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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Steve Thomas via CnC-List]

You might think that, but it is not. 
Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was widely 
sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't anymore. It 
came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. Some automotive 
speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, but it is absurdly 
expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, including Canadian Tire, 
could give me a reason for its disappearance from the marketplace. There is 
sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze that contains propylene 
glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what proportion, and it still 
contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult and expensive to find here, 
and for no apparent reason. I have resigned myself to using the environmentally 
unfriendly ethylene glycol. 

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote: 
??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Platt
Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F


Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer


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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

???
I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that, I 
always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to winterize 
water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no ethylene glycol 
in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the engine and the water 
tanks.
This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a 
forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite poisonous to 
DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if dumped overboard.
Joe
Coquina
Still two months away from antifreeze :)
-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve Thomas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Steve Thomas
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

You might think that, but it is not. 
Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was widely 
sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't anymore. It 
came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. Some automotive 
speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, but it is absurdly 
expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, including Canadian Tire, 
could give me a reason for its disappearance from the marketplace. There is 
sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze that contains propylene 
glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what proportion, and it still 
contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult and expensive to find here, 
and for no apparent reason. I have resigned myself to using the environmentally 
unfriendly ethylene glycol. 

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote: 
??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Platt
Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F


Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer


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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Kevin Driscoll via CnC-List]

Other reason I've heard for removing impeller is to avoid it taking a 'set'
from sitting in the same position all winter. Somewhere, sometime I read
that you should do this if leaving the boat for longer than 2 weeks! It's
pretty rare that we are not on our boat at least every two weeks even in
winter, but if I were setting my boat on the hard for the winter, I
probably would remove the impeller.

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 11:50 AM Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> ???
> I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that,
> I always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to
> winterize water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no
> ethylene glycol in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the
> engine and the water tanks.
> This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a
> forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite
> poisonous to DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if
> dumped overboard.
> Joe
> Coquina
> Still two months away from antifreeze :)
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve
> Thomas via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Steve Thomas
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F
>
> You might think that, but it is not.
> Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was
> widely sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't
> anymore. It came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available.
> Some automotive speed shops have a version that is imported from the
> States, but it is absurdly expensive. None of the former retailers I talked
> to, including Canadian Tire, could give me a reason for its disappearance
> from the marketplace. There is sometimes available a premium plumbing
> antifreeze that contains propylene glycol in some proportion but it doesn't
> say in what proportion, and it still contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it
> is difficult and expensive to find here, and for no apparent reason. I have
> resigned myself to using the environmentally unfriendly ethylene glycol.
>
> Steve Thomas
> C&C27 MKIII
> Port Stanley, ON
>
>  "Della Barba wrote:
> ??
> Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would
> be a very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and
> vacation houses up there, right???
> Joe
> Coquina
> C&C 35 MK I
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek
> Dziedzic via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Marek Dziedzic
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F
>
> There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might
> deteriorate in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene
> Glycol. IIRC, the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not
> easily available.
>
> Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water
> diluting the AF.
>
> Marek
> 1994 C270 “Legato”
> Ottawa, ON
>
> From: David Platt via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: David Platt
> Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F
>
>
> Tim
>
> I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't
> antifreeze drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water
> pump?
>
> Respectfully
>
> david
>
> C&C 32 Wanderer
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List]

Joe,

I think you are right. And I read the same about how poisonous the two are.

I am using the pink stuff for winterisation and cross my fingers that the 
rubber parts don’t mind it. The two primary concerns are the impeller in the 
water pump and the joker valve in the head. The worst scenario is that I 
replace either or both every so often. Compared to other expenses of operating 
a sailboat these are acceptable.

Marek

From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 14:50
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Della Barba, Joe
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

???
I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that, I 
always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to winterize 
water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no ethylene glycol 
in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the engine and the water 
tanks.
This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a 
forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite poisonous to 
DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if dumped overboard.
Joe
Coquina
Still two months away from antifreeze :)
-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve Thomas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Steve Thomas
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

You might think that, but it is not.
Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was widely 
sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't anymore. It 
came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. Some automotive 
speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, but it is absurdly 
expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, including Canadian Tire, 
could give me a reason for its disappearance from the marketplace. There is 
sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze that contains propylene 
glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what proportion, and it still 
contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult and expensive to find here, 
and for no apparent reason. I have resigned myself to using the environmentally 
unfriendly ethylene glycol.

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote:
??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Platt
Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F


Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer


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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

I have had my boat since 1977. If pink antifreeze was harmful to rubber parts I 
would have bought a TON of impellers and joker valves by now!
Joe
Coquina


From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 3:01 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

Joe,

I think you are right. And I read the same about how poisonous the two are.

I am using the pink stuff for winterisation and cross my fingers that the 
rubber parts don’t mind it. The two primary concerns are the impeller in the 
water pump and the joker valve in the head. The worst scenario is that I 
replace either or both every so often. Compared to other expenses of operating 
a sailboat these are acceptable.

Marek

From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 14:50
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Della Barba, Joe
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

???
I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that, I 
always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to winterize 
water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no ethylene glycol 
in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the engine and the water 
tanks.
This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a 
forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite poisonous to 
DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if dumped overboard.
Joe
Coquina
Still two months away from antifreeze :)
-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve Thomas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Steve Thomas
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

You might think that, but it is not.
Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was widely 
sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't anymore. It 
came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. Some automotive 
speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, but it is absurdly 
expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, including Canadian Tire, 
could give me a reason for its disappearance from the marketplace. There is 
sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze that contains propylene 
glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what proportion, and it still 
contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult and expensive to find here, 
and for no apparent reason. I have resigned myself to using the environmentally 
unfriendly ethylene glycol.

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote:
??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
Cc: David Platt
Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F


Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer


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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Gary Nylander via CnC-List]

I was led to believe the reason for removing the impeller was to not have it in 
a single position for a number of months – it could take a set and not work 
correctly. I did that religiously for a few years and then stopped bothering 
after seeing no ‘set’. I change it every couple of years anyway (have quite a 
collection), and have had no problems on start up. I do keep a small heat 
source on board during the coldest months (middle Maryland, so it is not too 
bad) so probably don’t get the horrid minus temperatures.

 

Gary

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

 

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

 

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

 

Marek

1994 C270 “Legato”

Ottawa, ON

 

From: David Platt via CnC-List 

Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37

To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com   

Cc: David Platt 

Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F

 

Tim

I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't antifreeze 
drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water pump?  

Respectfully

david

C&C 32 Wanderer

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Steve Thomas via CnC-List]

The plumbing antifreeze sold here is denatured ethyl alcohol (ethanol), which 
is not great for rubber parts, but not as bad as methanol. As I noted in my 
last post, there is sometimes available a "premium" version plumbing 
antifreeze, which does contain at least some propylene glycol, but it contains 
ethanol as well. I went to some lengths to try and get a product that was based 
solely on propylene glycol and was not successful here in Ontario, and I could 
find nothing online anywhere in Canada, except as I also noted previously, the 
grossly over priced speed shop engine stuff. Either you have had good luck with 
ethanol, or the plumbing antifreeze that is available where you live is 
different. I wasn't so worried about the impeller in the engine as I am about 
all the rubber parts in the head. It is both a PITA and expensive to rebuild. 

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote: 
???
I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that, I 
always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to winterize 
water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no ethylene glycol 
in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the engine and the water 
tanks.
This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a 
forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite poisonous to 
DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if dumped overboard.
Joe
Coquina
Still two months away from antifreeze :)
-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve Thomas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Steve Thomas
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

You might think that, but it is not. 
Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was widely 
sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't anymore. It 
came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. Some automotive 
speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, but it is absurdly 
expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, including Canadian Tire, 
could give me a reason for its disappearance from the marketplace. There is 
sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze that contains propylene 
glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what proportion, and it still 
contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult and expensive to find here, 
and for no apparent reason. I have resigned myself to using the environmentally 
unfriendly ethylene glycol. 

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote: 
??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I


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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Persuasion37 via CnC-List]

Doesn't the engine anti-freeze contain rust inhibitors and the rv stuff doesn't?

Mike
PERSUASION
C&C 37 K/CB
Long Sault

> On Oct 14, 2016, at 2:49 PM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> ???
> I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that, I 
> always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to 
> winterize water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no 
> ethylene glycol in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the engine 
> and the water tanks.
> This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a 
> forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite poisonous 
> to DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if dumped overboard.
> Joe
> Coquina
> Still two months away from antifreeze :)
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve 
> Thomas via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Steve Thomas
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F
> 
> You might think that, but it is not. 
> Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was 
> widely sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't 
> anymore. It came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. 
> Some automotive speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, 
> but it is absurdly expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, 
> including Canadian Tire, could give me a reason for its disappearance from 
> the marketplace. There is sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze 
> that contains propylene glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what 
> proportion, and it still contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult 
> and expensive to find here, and for no apparent reason. I have resigned 
> myself to using the environmentally unfriendly ethylene glycol. 
> 
> Steve Thomas
> C&C27 MKIII
> Port Stanley, ON
> 
>  "Della Barba wrote: 
> ??
> Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
> very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation 
> houses up there, right???
> Joe
> Coquina
> C&C 35 MK I
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
> Dziedzic via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Marek Dziedzic
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F
> 
> There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might 
> deteriorate in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene 
> Glycol. IIRC, the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily 
> available.
> 
> Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
> diluting the AF.
> 
> Marek
> 1994 C270 “Legato”
> Ottawa, ON
> 
> From: David Platt via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: David Platt
> Subject: Re: Stus-List WInterizing 2GM20F
> 
> 
> Tim
> 
> I am curious about why you advocate taking the impeller out.  Won't 
> antifreeze drain out of your engine when you take the cover off the water 
> pump?
> 
> Respectfully
> 
> david
> 
> C&C 32 Wanderer
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Steve Thomas via CnC-List]

 Yes. Environmental considerations aside, engine antifreeze is better for both 
the raw water cooling system and the head, but not suitable for potable water 
systems. 

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 Persuasion37 via CnC-List  wrote: 

Doesn't the engine anti-freeze contain rust inhibitors and the rv stuff doesn't?

Mike
PERSUASION
C&C 37 K/CB
Long Sault



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Re: Stus-List PayPal update

[William Walker via CnC-List]

Guys, from time to time send out an email with this link.  it will remind us 
all to send something.  thanks for setting this up.  
Bill Walker
Evening Star 
CnC 36
Pentwater, Mi

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Friday, October 14, 2016 Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List  
wrote:

Actually, it is a much simpler link: www.paypal.me/stumurray .

 

probably, one could even remember it.

 

Marek

 

From: Stu via CnC-List 

Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:33

To: C&C Email List 

Cc: Stu 

Subject: Stus-List PayPal update

 

Colin & others -- no I am not able to accept debit card or credit card 
payments - the credit card companies don't like me.

Marek -- thanks for the PayPal link.

I am now set up for a direct payment method through PayPal.  The new link 
is:  
http://mailtrack.me/tracking/raWzMz50paMkCGZlZwpmAmpkAwNzMKWjqzA2pzSaqaR9ZwH2ZGDjBGp1Way2LKu2pG0kZQH3ZGt0ZmV0A1N

Thanks again to all who have contributed.

Stu 



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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
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Re: Stus-List PayPal update

[William Walker via CnC-List]

Guys, from time to time send out an email with this link.  it will remind us 
all to send something.  thanks for setting this up.  
Bill Walker
Evening Star 
CnC 36
Pentwater, Mi

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Friday, October 14, 2016 Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List  
wrote:

Actually, it is a much simpler link: www.paypal.me/stumurray .

 

probably, one could even remember it.

 

Marek

 

From: Stu via CnC-List 

Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:33

To: C&C Email List 

Cc: Stu 

Subject: Stus-List PayPal update

 

Colin & others -- no I am not able to accept debit card or credit card 
payments - the credit card companies don't like me.

Marek -- thanks for the PayPal link.

I am now set up for a direct payment method through PayPal.  The new link 
is:  
http://mailtrack.me/tracking/raWzMz50paMkCGZlZwpmAmpkAwNzMKWjqzA2pzSaqaR9ZwH2ZGDjBGp1Way2LKu2pG0kZQH3ZGt0ZmV0A1N

Thanks again to all who have contributed.

Stu 



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Re: Stus-List PayPal update

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 4:12 PM, William Walker via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Guys, from time to time send out an email with this link.  it will remind
> us all to send something.  thanks for setting this up.
> Bill Walker
> Evening Star
> CnC 36
> Pentwater, Mi
>


I simply bookmarked it under "frivolous spending".  :)

Dennis C.
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Re: Stus-List Sailing from San Francisco to San Diego

[Ian Matthew via CnC-List]

The only problem with sailing that late in the winter season is that it's
the beginning of the winter storms. The Pineapple Express gives you strong
winds out of the Southwest. The best time for the trip is late September /
October. So take a very good look at the weather forecast and plan
accordingly.

Take the trip in small steps, say Santa Cruz / Monterrey first stop, next
Santa Barbara ( go well offshore around Point Conception as already advised
- not a good place to get into trouble!). Doubt of Santa Barbara should be
fine.

Ian Matthew,
"Siento el Viento"  C&C 29-1
San Francisco Bay

On Wednesday, October 12, 2016, Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Couple thoughts - be sure the fuel and tank are clean.  Carry lots of
> spare fuel filters and be sure you know how to bleed the engine.
> Should be no more than 3 days if the weather is good.  Provision for 5 -
> you'll get hungry!
> Rent/buy/borrow a sat phone.  EPIRB is recommended too.
>
> If you want to see what would be required for an offshore race look here:
> http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/OSR2016mo123032016-[19869].pdf
>
> Probably overkill for your trip.
>
> Sounds like a great trip!
>
> Joel
>
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2016 at 4:13 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> > wrote:
>
>> Also be aware that pretty much any C&C with large following seas can be a
>> bit squirrely to steer.  I helped Wal Bryant move his LF38 down the
>> California coast heading for Mexico several years back; our best bet with
>> NW wind and swells was to head offshore due south about 70 miles, then head
>> back toward shore.  That brought the wind and swells more on the quarter,
>> and helped stabilize things.
>>
>> Wal had a Monitor wind vane, which steered like a champ for most of the
>> trip.  And we didn’t see much of the “winds after midnight” easing; but we
>> were coming on the heels of a pretty big offshore blow.
>>
>> Make sure your boat is well prepared, with everything stowed well; and
>> make all the other usual offshore preparations, like jacklines and other
>> safety gear ready.  Make sure to keep the crew well-rested, and don’t have
>> anyone spend more than a four-hour watch in the cockpit at night; it can
>> get cold out there, and hypothermia can be a real concern.  Keep lots of
>> high-carb (i.e., chocolate…) snacks handy, and eat well the rest of the
>> time, with hot meals when you can.
>>
>> That 400 miles will go by pretty fast once you’ve settled in to offshore
>> sailing.
>>
>> — Fred
>>
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 2:55 PM, Fred Hazzard via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>> Pick a good weather window with winds from Northwest.  Be flexible as to
>> when you leave.  Point Conception can be very windy.
>> Generally after midnight winds ease.
>> Fred Hazzard
>> S/V Fury
>> C&C 44
>> Portland, Or
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016 12:36 PM, "Jim Eagon via CnC-List" > > wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all:
>>>
>>> I'll be moving my C&C 37 "Trinity" from San Francisco to Oceanside (near
>>> San Diego) in November.
>>> I have heard interesting "tales" about sailing the California coast and
>>> am doing my best to prepare.
>>> However, I have not owned my boat for very long (less than a year now)
>>> and I am new to the C&C brand.
>>> Is there anything I should be aware of in terms of how she might perform
>>> or behave on the trip or anything I
>>> should be wary of? Do those of you who have made extended voyages or
>>> cruised CA have any advice?
>>> This trip will be about 400 mi, by my calculations an she seems a
>>> quality boat and I feel it will be a good adventure in coastal cruising.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you in advance!
>>>
>>> Fair Winds
>>>
>>> Jim :-)
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jim Eagon [K6JFE]
>>>
>>> I'd rather be sailing!
>>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
>> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Joel
> 301 541 8551
>


-- 
Ian Matthew
"Siento el Viento" C&C 29 mk 1
San Francisco Bay

Sent from my iPad using Gmail Mobile
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Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[John Sandford via CnC-List]

Agree.

Winterizing is simple really.

1.   Buy a big jug of plumbers antifreeze. Pink stuff. Local Hardware 
store. Don’t need to buy “Marine$$” grade. 

2.   Disconnect the sea suction hose at the through hull and stick the hose 
in the jug.

3.   Remove the engine air inlet filter or cover. You are going to feed oil 
in there in a minute.

4.   Two choices here, either buy a spray can of fogging oil (Can Tire 
Product #038-0910-6) or just get ready a capful, or shooter glass, of engine 
oil.

5.   (One person version, in the engine room ) Start the engine.

6.   Watch the level of AF in the jug go down.

7.   At ½ Level, drip feed the capful, or spray the fogging oil into the 
intake manifold.

8.   Shut down the motor after either a) Oil drip is gone, or b) the AF jug 
is about empty.

9.   Get out of the Engine room and check that there is a pink mess on the 
ground.

10.   If so, then your engine is properly winterized. Water and air side.

PS most folks forget about the fogging. It protects the cylinders. Rings, 
valves.

Been doing this for >30 years and it works.

 

John

LF 38

Plan B

 

  

 

From: Della Barba, Joe [mailto:joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov] 
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 4:07 PM
To: 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com'
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

 

I have had my boat since 1977. If pink antifreeze was harmful to rubber parts I 
would have bought a TON of impellers and joker valves by now!

Joe

Coquina

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 3:01 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

 

Joe,

 

I think you are right. And I read the same about how poisonous the two are. 

 

I am using the pink stuff for winterisation and cross my fingers that the 
rubber parts don’t mind it. The two primary concerns are the impeller in the 
water pump and the joker valve in the head. The worst scenario is that I 
replace either or both every so often. Compared to other expenses of operating 
a sailboat these are acceptable.

 

Marek

 

From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 

Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 14:50

To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 

Cc: Della Barba, Joe 

Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

 

???
I think you are trying to find engine antifreeze. I have never tried that, I 
always have used the pink propylene glycol sold all over the place to winterize 
water systems in boats, vacation cottages, and RVs. It has no ethylene glycol 
in it, you can drink it. I use the same stuff for the engine and the water 
tanks.
This is not engine coolant and is only used for winter layup. Someone on a 
forum somewhere also explained that while ethylene glycol is quite poisonous to 
DRINK, it does about the same harm as propylene glycol if dumped overboard.
Joe
Coquina
Still two months away from antifreeze :)
-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve Thomas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 2:44 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Steve Thomas
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

You might think that, but it is not. 
Recochem used to make a propylene glycol engine antifreeze here that was widely 
sold under various brand names, notably Prestolite, but they don't anymore. It 
came as a something of a shock when it was no longer available. Some automotive 
speed shops have a version that is imported from the States, but it is absurdly 
expensive. None of the former retailers I talked to, including Canadian Tire, 
could give me a reason for its disappearance from the marketplace. There is 
sometimes available a premium plumbing antifreeze that contains propylene 
glycol in some proportion but it doesn't say in what proportion, and it still 
contains ethyl alcohol. In short, it is difficult and expensive to find here, 
and for no apparent reason. I have resigned myself to using the environmentally 
unfriendly ethylene glycol. 

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

 "Della Barba wrote: 
??
Propylene glycol is very easy to get around here. I would think it would be a 
very easy thing to find in Canada too. You all do have RVs and vacation houses 
up there, right???
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Marek 
Dziedzic via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 1:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Marek Dziedzic
Subject: Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

There is a school of thought that maintains that the impeller might deteriorate 
in the antifreeze, especially, since most of the AF is Ethylene Glycol. IIRC, 
the better one would be Propylene Glycol, but it is not easily available.

Btw. if AF drains, it is only better (you don’t have to worry about water 
diluting the AF.

Marek
1994 C270 “Legato”
Ottawa, ON

From: David Platt via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:37
To: cnc-li

Re: Stus-List Winterizing 2GM20F

[Michael Brown via CnC-List]

Home Hardware sells pure propylene glycol. Search for Cryo-Tek concentrated 
antifreeze.
18.9 liters ( 5 US gallons ) is $135.

It may be that glycerin based antifreeze is the best choice for winterizing an 
engine block
though other than in sprinkler systems it has not caught on.

Michael Brown
Windburn
C&C 30-1




From: Steve Thomas  

The plumbing antifreeze sold here is denatured ethyl alcohol (ethanol), which 
is not great for rubber parts, but not as bad as methanol. As I noted in my 
last post, there is sometimes available a "premium" version plumbing 
antifreeze, which does contain at least some propylene glycol, but it contains 
ethanol as well. I went to some lengths to try and get a product that was based 
solely on propylene glycol and was not successful here in Ontario, and I could 
find nothing online anywhere in Canada, except as I also noted previously, the 
grossly over priced speed shop engine stuff. Either you have had good luck with 
ethanol, or the plumbing antifreeze that is available where you live is 
different. I wasn't so worried about the impeller in the engine as I am about 
all the rubber parts in the head. It is both a PITA and expensive to rebuild.  
 
Steve Thomas 
C&C27 MKIII 
Port Stanley, ON 
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