Re: Stus-List Winch replacement and winch failures

[Richard via CnC-List]

Tim, I'll offer...; I out on boat now, but will email you Sun or Mon if they're 
still available thanks

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 26, 2016, at 5:46 PM, Tim Goodyear via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I have two spare (non-ST) 28's that are currently being used as paper 
> weights.  They  were cleaned and greased after being taken out of service.  
> Low-ball offers great fully received...
> 
> Tim
> Ex-35-3
> 
>> On Aug 26, 2016, at 12:28 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Well, some of the 28's are indestructible.  The alloy Barient and Barlows 
>> suffer from metal failures.
>> 
>> Failure mode 1 - wallowing out of the pawl sockets.  This can result in the 
>> pawl not operating smoothly or at all.
>> 
>> Failure mode 2 - breaking off of teeth in the drum skirt.  This usually 
>> happens when the headsail flogs violently with a wrap or two on a winch.
>> 
>> Note: I've only seen these failures on alloy winches.  Stainless and 
>> chrome/bronze winches are much more robust.
>> 
>> When Touche' had alloy winches, I kept a spare 28 just in case.  I have 
>> upgraded to chrome/bronze or stainless winches so the spare 28 (non-ST) is 
>> available.  I also have some spare roller bearings for Barient 28 Non-ST's 
>> if anybody needs them.  Sorry, no pawls or springs.
>> 
>> Dennis C.
>> Touche' 35-1 #83
>> Mandeville, LA
>> 
>>> On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 11:06 AM, Joel Aronson via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> Those 28s are virtually indistructable but they are heavy. What size are 
>>> you going up to?  
>>> Joel  
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Re: Stus-List Winch replacement and winch failures

[Tim Goodyear via CnC-List]

I have two spare (non-ST) 28's that are currently being used as paper weights.  
They  were cleaned and greased after being taken out of service.  Low-ball 
offers great fully received...

Tim
Ex-35-3

> On Aug 26, 2016, at 12:28 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Well, some of the 28's are indestructible.  The alloy Barient and Barlows 
> suffer from metal failures.
> 
> Failure mode 1 - wallowing out of the pawl sockets.  This can result in the 
> pawl not operating smoothly or at all.
> 
> Failure mode 2 - breaking off of teeth in the drum skirt.  This usually 
> happens when the headsail flogs violently with a wrap or two on a winch.
> 
> Note: I've only seen these failures on alloy winches.  Stainless and 
> chrome/bronze winches are much more robust.
> 
> When Touche' had alloy winches, I kept a spare 28 just in case.  I have 
> upgraded to chrome/bronze or stainless winches so the spare 28 (non-ST) is 
> available.  I also have some spare roller bearings for Barient 28 Non-ST's if 
> anybody needs them.  Sorry, no pawls or springs.
> 
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
> 
>> On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 11:06 AM, Joel Aronson via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> Those 28s are virtually indistructable but they are heavy. What size are you 
>> going up to?  
>> Joel  
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Re: Stus-List Winch replacement and winch failures

[Kevin Driscoll via CnC-List]

Dennis, I would definitely be interested in the Barient 28 to replace one
of my sad cabin top winches. Is it a two speed 28? Would take the bearings
too for backup. Let me know what you want for the winch.

Kevin
30-2

On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 9:29 AM Dennis C. via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Well, some of the 28's are indestructible.  The alloy Barient and Barlows
> suffer from metal failures.
>
> Failure mode 1 - wallowing out of the pawl sockets.  This can result in
> the pawl not operating smoothly or at all.
>
> Failure mode 2 - breaking off of teeth in the drum skirt.  This usually
> happens when the headsail flogs violently with a wrap or two on a winch.
>
> Note: I've only seen these failures on alloy winches.  Stainless and
> chrome/bronze winches are much more robust.
>
> When Touche' had alloy winches, I kept a spare 28 just in case.  I have
> upgraded to chrome/bronze or stainless winches so the spare 28 (non-ST) is
> available.  I also have some spare roller bearings for Barient 28 Non-ST's
> if anybody needs them.  Sorry, no pawls or springs.
>
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
>
> On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 11:06 AM, Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Those 28s are virtually indistructable but they are heavy. What size are
>> you going up to?
>> Joel
>>
>>
>> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Neil Gallagher]

The Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches are going on sale for $650 tomorrow at 
Defender, should you be considering them.


They had 16 in stock,  14 now :-)

Neil Gallagher
Weatherly, 35 -1
Glen Cove, NY


On 3/22/2014 5:46 PM, Rick Brass wrote:

   IIRC the Barient 28 is about equivalent to a Lewmar 48 or 54 in terms of 
power ratio.

Have you thought about converting your Barients to self tailers. Winchmate 
makes a conversion kit for $500 - 550 per winch. Practical Sailor gave a 
favorable review and I've talked to a couple of people who have them and like 
them.

Rick Brass

Sent from my iPad


On Mar 22, 2014, at 17:14, Tim Goodyear  wrote:

I saw some Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches for sale at $900 at Defender yesterday 
(they may be gone).  Does anyone have an opinion on tees for primary winches on 
a 35-3 (currently with non-ST Barient 28s)?

Thanks,

Tim
Mojito
C&C 35-3
Branford, CT
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Russ & Melody]

Oh. You mean foreplay?!

At 09:06 PM 24/03/2014, you wrote:

I make weird moaning sounds and cry a lot, it works for me.

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC


On 23 March 2014 22:15, Russ & Melody 
<russ...@telus.net> wrote:


Wow, Jim.

I can learn a few things from you... I can't "make" my wife, Melody, 
do anything. It gets done 'cause she wants it to be done. :)

But I will try the next time we're out, if she lets me steer.

Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1



At 05:57 PM 23/03/2014, you wrote:
Tim, it depends on how you are sailing the boat. If you have strong 
crew, you can get by with lower power or you can luff up and make 
it easy to suck it in. I singlehand a lot, and make my wife tack 
the genny when we sail together, so extra power is good. Even so, 
grinding in the 135 the last few inches can be tedious.


Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC


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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Jim Watts]

I make weird moaning sounds and cry a lot, it works for me.

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC


On 23 March 2014 22:15, Russ & Melody  wrote:

>
> Wow, Jim.
>
> I can learn a few things from you... I can't "make" my wife, Melody, do
> anything. It gets done 'cause she wants it to be done. :)
> But I will try the next time we're out, if she lets me steer.
>
> Cheers, Russ
> *Sweet *35 mk-1
>
>
>
> At 05:57 PM 23/03/2014, you wrote:
>
> Tim, it depends on how you are sailing the boat. If you have strong crew,
> you can get by with lower power or you can luff up and make it easy to suck
> it in. I singlehand a lot, and make my wife tack the genny when we sail
> together, so extra power is good. Even so, grinding in the 135 the last few
> inches can be tedious.
>
> Jim Watts
> Paradigm Shift
> C&C 35 Mk III
> Victoria, BC
>
>
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Russ & Melody]

Wow, Jim.

I can learn a few things from you... I can't "make" my wife, Melody, 
do anything. It gets done 'cause she wants it to be done. :)

But I will try the next time we're out, if she lets me steer.

Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1


At 05:57 PM 23/03/2014, you wrote:
Tim, it depends on how you are sailing the boat. If you have strong 
crew, you can get by with lower power or you can luff up and make it 
easy to suck it in. I singlehand a lot, and make my wife tack the 
genny when we sail together, so extra power is good. Even so, 
grinding in the 135 the last few inches can be tedious.


Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC

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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Tim Goodyear]

Thanks Jim, I'm servicing the 28's next weekend.  If they're not great inside, 
that's probably the way I'll go. The winch monkeys are pretty strong, and we 
tend to cruise with the 110%.

Tim

> On Mar 23, 2014, at 8:57 PM, Jim Watts  wrote:
> 
> Tim, it depends on how you are sailing the boat. If you have strong crew, you 
> can get by with lower power or you can luff up and make it easy to suck it 
> in. I singlehand a lot, and make my wife tack the genny when we sail 
> together, so extra power is good. Even so, grinding in the 135 the last few 
> inches can be tedious.
> 
> Jim Watts
> Paradigm Shift
> C&C 35 Mk III
> Victoria, BC
> 
> 
>> On 22 March 2014 18:27, Tim Goodyear  wrote:
>> It seems the Lewmar 44 (44:1) is an almost exact replacement for the Barient 
>> 28 (42.6:1).  I have been thinking about the Winchmate self tailers, but 
>> $500 will still leave old gears and bearings; $400 more would in my mind be 
>> a pretty good value to replace those too.  Jim, the 28's are about on the 
>> limit, but they have worked for me for the last few years - did you need the 
>> increased power or find it useful?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Tim
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sat, Mar 22, 2014 at 6:57 PM, Jim Watts  wrote:
>>> I replaced the original Barients (I can't remember, I think they were 25's) 
>>> with Lewmar ST48's. If I could have got the same kind of deal on 52's I 
>>> would have done it. I wouldn't be happy with 44's.
>>> 
>>> My Barient catalogue shows the 28+ as 42.6:1 with a 10" handle, not sure if 
>>> it's exactly the same winch as the 28.
>>> 
>>> Jim Watts
>>> Paradigm Shift
>>> C&C 35 Mk III
>>> Victoria, BC
>>> 
>>> 
 On 22 March 2014 14:46, Rick Brass  wrote:
   IIRC the Barient 28 is about equivalent to a Lewmar 48 or 54 in terms of 
 power ratio.
 
 Have you thought about converting your Barients to self tailers. Winchmate 
 makes a conversion kit for $500 - 550 per winch. Practical Sailor gave a 
 favorable review and I've talked to a couple of people who have them and 
 like them.
 
 Rick Brass
 
 Sent from my iPad
 
 > On Mar 22, 2014, at 17:14, Tim Goodyear  wrote:
 >
 > I saw some Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches for sale at $900 at Defender 
 > yesterday (they may be gone).  Does anyone have an opinion on tees for 
 > primary winches on a 35-3 (currently with non-ST Barient 28s)?
 >
 > Thanks,
 >
 > Tim
 > Mojito
 > C&C 35-3
 > Branford, CT
 > ___
 > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
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 ___
 This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Jim Watts]

Tim, it depends on how you are sailing the boat. If you have strong crew,
you can get by with lower power or you can luff up and make it easy to suck
it in. I singlehand a lot, and make my wife tack the genny when we sail
together, so extra power is good. Even so, grinding in the 135 the last few
inches can be tedious.

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC


On 22 March 2014 18:27, Tim Goodyear  wrote:

> It seems the Lewmar 44 (44:1) is an almost exact replacement for the
> Barient 28 (42.6:1).  I have been thinking about the Winchmate self
> tailers, but $500 will still leave old gears and bearings; $400 more would
> in my mind be a pretty good value to replace those too.  Jim, the 28's are
> about on the limit, but they have worked for me for the last few years -
> did you need the increased power or find it useful?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tim
>
>
> On Sat, Mar 22, 2014 at 6:57 PM, Jim Watts wrote:
>
>> I replaced the original Barients (I can't remember, I think they were
>> 25's) with Lewmar ST48's. If I could have got the same kind of deal on 52's
>> I would have done it. I wouldn't be happy with 44's.
>>
>> My Barient catalogue shows the 28+ as 42.6:1 with a 10" handle, not sure
>> if it's exactly the same winch as the 28.
>>
>> Jim Watts
>> Paradigm Shift
>> C&C 35 Mk III
>> Victoria, BC
>>
>>
>> On 22 March 2014 14:46, Rick Brass  wrote:
>>
>>>   IIRC the Barient 28 is about equivalent to a Lewmar 48 or 54 in terms
>>> of power ratio.
>>>
>>> Have you thought about converting your Barients to self tailers.
>>> Winchmate makes a conversion kit for $500 - 550 per winch. Practical Sailor
>>> gave a favorable review and I've talked to a couple of people who have them
>>> and like them.
>>>
>>> Rick Brass
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>> > On Mar 22, 2014, at 17:14, Tim Goodyear  wrote:
>>> >
>>> > I saw some Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches for sale at $900 at Defender
>>> yesterday (they may be gone).  Does anyone have an opinion on tees for
>>> primary winches on a 35-3 (currently with non-ST Barient 28s)?
>>> >
>>> > Thanks,
>>> >
>>> > Tim
>>> > Mojito
>>> > C&C 35-3
>>> > Branford, CT
>>> > ___
>>> > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
>>> > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
>>> > CnC-List@cnc-list.com
>>>
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>>
>>
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>>
>
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Tim Goodyear]

It seems the Lewmar 44 (44:1) is an almost exact replacement for the
Barient 28 (42.6:1).  I have been thinking about the Winchmate self
tailers, but $500 will still leave old gears and bearings; $400 more would
in my mind be a pretty good value to replace those too.  Jim, the 28's are
about on the limit, but they have worked for me for the last few years -
did you need the increased power or find it useful?

Thanks,

Tim


On Sat, Mar 22, 2014 at 6:57 PM, Jim Watts  wrote:

> I replaced the original Barients (I can't remember, I think they were
> 25's) with Lewmar ST48's. If I could have got the same kind of deal on 52's
> I would have done it. I wouldn't be happy with 44's.
>
> My Barient catalogue shows the 28+ as 42.6:1 with a 10" handle, not sure
> if it's exactly the same winch as the 28.
>
> Jim Watts
> Paradigm Shift
> C&C 35 Mk III
> Victoria, BC
>
>
> On 22 March 2014 14:46, Rick Brass  wrote:
>
>>   IIRC the Barient 28 is about equivalent to a Lewmar 48 or 54 in terms
>> of power ratio.
>>
>> Have you thought about converting your Barients to self tailers.
>> Winchmate makes a conversion kit for $500 - 550 per winch. Practical Sailor
>> gave a favorable review and I've talked to a couple of people who have them
>> and like them.
>>
>> Rick Brass
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> > On Mar 22, 2014, at 17:14, Tim Goodyear  wrote:
>> >
>> > I saw some Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches for sale at $900 at Defender
>> yesterday (they may be gone).  Does anyone have an opinion on tees for
>> primary winches on a 35-3 (currently with non-ST Barient 28s)?
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> >
>> > Tim
>> > Mojito
>> > C&C 35-3
>> > Branford, CT
>> > ___
>> > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album
>> > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
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>>
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>
>
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Jim Watts]

I replaced the original Barients (I can't remember, I think they were 25's)
with Lewmar ST48's. If I could have got the same kind of deal on 52's I
would have done it. I wouldn't be happy with 44's.

My Barient catalogue shows the 28+ as 42.6:1 with a 10" handle, not sure if
it's exactly the same winch as the 28.

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC


On 22 March 2014 14:46, Rick Brass  wrote:

>   IIRC the Barient 28 is about equivalent to a Lewmar 48 or 54 in terms of
> power ratio.
>
> Have you thought about converting your Barients to self tailers. Winchmate
> makes a conversion kit for $500 - 550 per winch. Practical Sailor gave a
> favorable review and I've talked to a couple of people who have them and
> like them.
>
> Rick Brass
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Mar 22, 2014, at 17:14, Tim Goodyear  wrote:
> >
> > I saw some Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches for sale at $900 at Defender
> yesterday (they may be gone).  Does anyone have an opinion on tees for
> primary winches on a 35-3 (currently with non-ST Barient 28s)?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Tim
> > Mojito
> > C&C 35-3
> > Branford, CT
> > ___
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Re: Stus-List : winch replacement

[Rick Brass]

  IIRC the Barient 28 is about equivalent to a Lewmar 48 or 54 in terms of 
power ratio.

Have you thought about converting your Barients to self tailers. Winchmate 
makes a conversion kit for $500 - 550 per winch. Practical Sailor gave a 
favorable review and I've talked to a couple of people who have them and like 
them.

Rick Brass

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 22, 2014, at 17:14, Tim Goodyear  wrote:
> 
> I saw some Lewmar Astor 44 ST winches for sale at $900 at Defender yesterday 
> (they may be gone).  Does anyone have an opinion on tees for primary winches 
> on a 35-3 (currently with non-ST Barient 28s)?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Tim
> Mojito
> C&C 35-3
> Branford, CT
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Re: Stus-List Winch replacement, holes, etc.

[djhaug...@juno.com]

Defender has a spring sale every year in march I believe.  Its like a mini bat 
show.  LewMar was offering some really good deals last year.  If I recall it 
was like half off MSRP.

If you aren't in any great hurry but, want them fir this year you may want to 
wait and see the prices at the spring sale.

Danny.

T-Mobile. America’s First Nationwide 4G Network

- Reply message -
From: blhick...@yahoo.com
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Stus-List Winch replacement, holes, etc.
Date: Sat, Dec 28, 2013 8:42 am


Thank you thank you thank you for all the great advice, suggestions and 
cautionary tales.  I've got a bit more homework to do but I like the idea of 
winch pads if necessary. (I've seen them for ages, why didn't I think of 
that?!). Thx for the polishing suggestions too, Dennis. Aside from waxing and 
buffing, haven't messed with the gel coat.  Will post a pic of finished work 
whenever that great day arrives.  
And now... Aside from the fall boat show discounts, is there any other time of 
year that is good for discounts.  Defender looks like the best prices right 
now.   
Cheers, 
Barbara Hickson Fellers
Flight Risk, 33-1
Charleston, SC. 


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Re: Stus-List Winch replacement, holes, etc.

[Chuck S]

Read somewhere that the Barient model number relates to a designed line load. 
28 equates to 2800# line load. The winches were improved over time (80's) with 
better roller bearings and made stronger so that the load ratings became higher 
than their model number. Barient's catalog of 1986 is on Stu's website, with a 
spreadsheet showing the gear ratios of the whole line. 
The Barient 28 has 42.6 to 1 power ratio w a 10" handle so seems equivalent to 
a Lewmar 43 if there was one. 
The Barient 36 has a power ratio of 48 to 1, closer to a Lewmar 50. 

Looked like Barient 27 or Lewmar 40 was recommended for a 33 to 36 ft boat. 

Sources to check besides defender.com 
apsltd.com 
ebay.com 
marine.com 
mauriprosailing.com 
Pyacht.com 



Chuck 
Resolute 
1990 C&C 34R 
Atlantic City, NJ 
- Original Message -
From: blhick...@yahoo.com 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Sent: Saturday, December 28, 2013 8:42:28 AM 
Subject: Stus-List Winch replacement, holes, etc. 

Thank you thank you thank you for all the great advice, suggestions and 
cautionary tales. I've got a bit more homework to do but I like the idea of 
winch pads if necessary. (I've seen them for ages, why didn't I think of 
that?!). Thx for the polishing suggestions too, Dennis. Aside from waxing and 
buffing, haven't messed with the gel coat. Will post a pic of finished work 
whenever that great day arrives. 
And now... Aside from the fall boat show discounts, is there any other time of 
year that is good for discounts. Defender looks like the best prices right now. 
Cheers, 
Barbara Hickson Fellers 
Flight Risk, 33-1 
Charleston, SC. 


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