Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
Interesting that CC put a third cross member in. My boat is a 1973, #166, and it only has the two.When I repaired the step last year, I put a third member in between the other two.Also, my two original, and the third I put in, all rest on the curved shoulder of the bilge. They don't appear to be structural other than dedicated to hold up the mast.Trying to conform to the curve of the bilge, it was not regular, was the toughest part.RonWild CheriSTL From: Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Gary Nylander gnylan...@atlanticbb.net Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 2:58 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593. There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily. Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years. The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides. Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible. Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry. I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there. Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice. ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
Oh, no. Are the nomenclature police offended? Stringer vs floor? Didn't we have a lengthy thread on these terms a couple of years ago? I recall reading it in the salonuh main cabinuhsaloon. Dennis C. On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 5:16 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: There appears to be three or more bundles of fibers (glass?) which follow the contour of the hull from side to side - each one of the cross members rests on one of these bundles and the keel bolts (as I remember) go through the bundles as well. I'll check as soon as it quits raining. Gary Wet Maryland - Original Message - *From:* Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com *Cc:* Ronald B. Frerker rbfrer...@yahoo.com *Sent:* Tuesday, June 02, 2015 3:29 PM *Subject:* Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Interesting that CC put a third cross member in. My boat is a 1973, #166, and it only has the two. When I repaired the step last year, I put a third member in between the other two. Also, my two original, and the third I put in, all rest on the curved shoulder of the bilge. They don't appear to be structural other than dedicated to hold up the mast. Trying to conform to the curve of the bilge, it was not regular, was the toughest part. Ron Wild Cheri STL -- *From:* Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com *Cc:* Gary Nylander gnylan...@atlanticbb.net *Sent:* Wednesday, May 20, 2015 2:58 PM *Subject:* Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593. There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily. Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years. The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides. Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible. Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry. I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there. Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice. -- ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
There appears to be three or more bundles of fibers (glass?) which follow the contour of the hull from side to side - each one of the cross members rests on one of these bundles and the keel bolts (as I remember) go through the bundles as well. I'll check as soon as it quits raining. Gary Wet Maryland - Original Message - From: Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Ronald B. Frerker Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2015 3:29 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Interesting that CC put a third cross member in. My boat is a 1973, #166, and it only has the two. When I repaired the step last year, I put a third member in between the other two. Also, my two original, and the third I put in, all rest on the curved shoulder of the bilge. They don't appear to be structural other than dedicated to hold up the mast. Trying to conform to the curve of the bilge, it was not regular, was the toughest part. Ron Wild Cheri STL -- From: Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Gary Nylander gnylan...@atlanticbb.net Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 2:58 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593. There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily. Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years. The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides. Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible. Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry. I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there. Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice. -- ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 9:09 PM, Russ Melody via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: Seriously though Dennis, how could you? Everyone knows that floors run athwartship. Exactly. Dennis C. ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
Please tell me that CC / Rob Ball figured this whole mess out and took a lesson learned by the time the 30-2 came out. I am pretty sure my mast step looks nothing like this. I would rather go sailing than deal with this. On Tue, Jun 2, 2015, 7:09 PM Russ Melody via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: And I see you missed commenting on the ceiling leak that happened at the deckhead. The next thing you know people will be talking about their jib tracks mounted on the topside or converting the sloop to a cutter. As they say up north and down south, Have at 'er mate. Seriously though Dennis, how could you? Everyone knows that floors run athwartship. Cheers, Russ At 05:19 PM 02/06/2015, you wrote: Oh, no. Are the nomenclature police offended? Stringer vs floor? Didn't we have a lengthy thread on these terms a couple of years ago? I recall reading it in the salonuh main cabinuhsaloon. Dennis C. On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 5:16 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: There appears to be three or more bundles of fibers (glass?) which follow the contour of the hull from side to side - each one of the cross members rests on one of these bundles and the keel bolts (as I remember) go through the bundles as well. I'll check as soon as it quits raining.  Gary Wet Maryland - Original Message - From: Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Ronald B. Frerker rbfrer...@yahoo.com Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2015 3:29 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Interesting that CC put a third cross member in. My boat is a 1973, #166, and it only has the two. When I repaired the step last year, I put a third member in between the other two. Also, my two original, and the third I put in, all rest on the curved shoulder of the bilge. They don't appear to be structural other than dedicated to hold up the mast. Trying to conform to the curve of the bilge, it was not regular, was the toughest part. Ron Wild Cheri STL From: Gary Nylander via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Gary Nylander gnylan...@atlanticbb.net Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 2:58 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593.  There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily.  Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years.  The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides.  Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible.  Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry.  I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there.  Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice.  -- ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
And I see you missed commenting on the ceiling leak that happened at the deckhead. The next thing you know people will be talking about their jib tracks mounted on the topside or converting the sloop to a cutter. As they say up north and down south, Have at 'er mate. Seriously though Dennis, how could you? Everyone knows that floors run athwartship. Cheers, Russ At 05:19 PM 02/06/2015, you wrote: Oh, no. Are the nomenclature police offended? Stringer vs floor? Didn't we have a lengthy thread on these terms a couple of years ago? I recall reading it in the salonuh main cabinuhsaloon. Dennis C. On Tue, Jun 2, 2015 at 5:16 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.comcnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: There appears to be three or more bundles of fibers (glass?) which follow the contour of the hull from side to side - each one of the cross members rests on one of these bundles and the keel bolts (as I remember) go through the bundles as well. I'll check as soon as it quits raining.  Gary Wet Maryland - Original Message - From: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.comRonald B. Frerker via CnC-List To: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.comcnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: mailto:rbfrer...@yahoo.comRonald B. Frerker Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2015 3:29 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Interesting that CC put a third cross member in. My boat is a 1973, #166, and it only has the two. When I repaired the step last year, I put a third member in between the other two. Also, my two original, and the third I put in, all rest on the curved shoulder of the bilge. They don't appear to be structural other than dedicated to hold up the mast. Trying to conform to the curve of the bilge, it was not regular, was the toughest part. Ron Wild Cheri STL From: Gary Nylander via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.comcnc-list@cnc-list.com To: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.comcnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Gary Nylander mailto:gnylan...@atlanticbb.netgnylan...@atlanticbb.net Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 2:58 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593.  There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily.  Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years.  The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides.  Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible.  Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry.  I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there.  Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice.  -- ___ Email address: mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.comCnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.comhttp://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: mailto:CnC-List@cnc-list.comCnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.comhttp://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
I used oak last time and didn't seal the ends as well as I thought I had. Water intrusion was noticeable. What also happened was that the oak started bending until finally it was too low for the rig to tighten well.I replaced with a mexican hardwood, very oily, that they use for fenceposts that last over a hundred years. I believe it was called pay-la (phonetic spelling). It's like ironwood in that it's more dense than water; it sinks. A real pain to cut and shape. Broke a band saw tire and went through many sabre saw blades.While at it, I fitted a third support for the mast step out of some extra. That should prevent any future bending in the middle.RonWild CheriCC 30-1STL From: Nate Flesness via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Nate Flesness nateflesn...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 11:12 AM Subject: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want toforestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengtheningit now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate FlesnessSarah Jean1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay MarinaLake Superior ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
Thanks! Exactly what I need. This is an amazing list and great group. Nate Sarah Jean 1980 30-1 #602 On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 9:57 AM, Aaron Rouhi via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I used over sized lag screws to bold them down to stringers. I like your taped aluminum angle bar better though... Cheers, Aaron R. Admiral Maggie, 1979 CC 30 MK1 #540 Annapolis, MD -- Date: Fri, 22 May 2015 07:35:27 -0400 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com CC: m...@tkg.ca That looks pretty much the same as I found on Windburn. I used 2 white oak for two of the girders ( stringers ? ) and 1.5 for the center girder. The challenge was cutting the oak to match the curve of the bilge, which was different on the two sides. Further, the sides did not run parallel bow to stern. I did smooth the worst of the bumps down with a grinder and applied a coating of resin to re-seal everything. I see from your picture #9 it was the same for Admiral Maggie. The area just in front on the foremost keel bolt appeared to be the lowest point in the bilge. A bit of resin was poured in their to level it, and a remote pickup installed for a Whale Gulper 320. Getting the height right was also a process. I assumed the original supports had settled a bit and there is not much square in the boat to compare to. The top surface of the aluminum casting the mast sits on is not the same thickness front to back, and the bottom of the mast is not square. No idea if all of that was by design. I also installed two 4 x 1/4 thick aluminum angle pieces, bolted horizontally through the front and rear girders. They were drilled and tapped to hold the machine screws coming down from the mast step. Was your block screwed down directly into the girders? Michael Brown Windburn CC 30-1 Date: Thu, 21 May 2015 17:10:27 -0400 From: Aaron Rouhi admiralmag...@outlook.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Message-ID: bay179-w44f5e244aa918e2f4a0063a2...@phx.gbl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hey Nate,Here are some pictures from when I replaced my mast step few years back. The stringers were so rotted that I was able to remove them pretty much by hand! It was not pretty... I replaced them with 5 new stringers made out of 8/4 mahogany. Make sure you mark up the height of your oak block so you can match it. This is also a good time to installed a bilge pump pickup hose in front of the mast (lowest part of the bilge). Doing that will keep your bilge dry... Pictures are here: http://imgur.com/a/SOWx6 Cheers,Aaron R.Admiral Maggie,1979 CC 30 MK1 #540Annapolis, MD Date: Wed, 20 May 2015 11:12:16 -0500 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com CC: nateflesn...@gmail.com I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want toforestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengtheningit now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate FlesnessSarah Jean1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay MarinaLake Superior ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
That looks pretty much the same as I found on Windburn. I used 2 white oak for two of the girders ( stringers ? ) and 1.5 for the center girder. The challenge was cutting the oak to match the curve of the bilge, which was different on the two sides. Further, the sides did not run parallel bow to stern. I did smooth the worst of the bumps down with a grinder and applied a coating of resin to re-seal everything. I see from your picture #9 it was the same for Admiral Maggie. The area just in front on the foremost keel bolt appeared to be the lowest point in the bilge. A bit of resin was poured in their to level it, and a remote pickup installed for a Whale Gulper 320. Getting the height right was also a process. I assumed the original supports had settled a bit and there is not much square in the boat to compare to. The top surface of the aluminum casting the mast sits on is not the same thickness front to back, and the bottom of the mast is not square. No idea if all of that was by design. I also installed two 4 x 1/4 thick aluminum angle pieces, bolted horizontally through the front and rear girders. They were drilled and tapped to hold the machine screws coming down from the mast step. Was your block screwed down directly into the girders? Michael Brown Windburn CC 30-1 Date: Thu, 21 May 2015 17:10:27 -0400 From: Aaron Rouhi admiralmag...@outlook.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Message-ID: bay179-w44f5e244aa918e2f4a0063a2...@phx.gbl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hey Nate,Here are some pictures from when I replaced my mast step few years back. The stringers were so rotted that I was able to remove them pretty much by hand! It was not pretty... I replaced them with 5 new stringers made out of 8/4 mahogany. Make sure you mark up the height of your oak block so you can match it. This is also a good time to installed a bilge pump pickup hose in front of the mast (lowest part of the bilge). Doing that will keep your bilge dry... Pictures are here: http://imgur.com/a/SOWx6 Cheers,Aaron R.Admiral Maggie,1979 CC 30 MK1 #540Annapolis, MD Date: Wed, 20 May 2015 11:12:16 -0500 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com CC: nateflesn...@gmail.com I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want toforestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengtheningit now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate FlesnessSarah Jean1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay MarinaLake Superior ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
I used over sized lag screws to bold them down to stringers. I like your taped aluminum angle bar better though... Cheers,Aaron R.Admiral Maggie,1979 CC 30 MK1 #540Annapolis, MD Date: Fri, 22 May 2015 07:35:27 -0400 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com CC: m...@tkg.ca That looks pretty much the same as I found on Windburn. I used 2 white oak for two of the girders ( stringers ? ) and 1.5 for the center girder. The challenge was cutting the oak to match the curve of the bilge, which was different on the two sides. Further, the sides did not run parallel bow to stern. I did smooth the worst of the bumps down with a grinder and applied a coating of resin to re-seal everything. I see from your picture #9 it was the same for Admiral Maggie. The area just in front on the foremost keel bolt appeared to be the lowest point in the bilge. A bit of resin was poured in their to level it, and a remote pickup installed for a Whale Gulper 320. Getting the height right was also a process. I assumed the original supports had settled a bit and there is not much square in the boat to compare to. The top surface of the aluminum casting the mast sits on is not the same thickness front to back, and the bottom of the mast is not square. No idea if all of that was by design. I also installed two 4 x 1/4 thick aluminum angle pieces, bolted horizontally through the front and rear girders. They were drilled and tapped to hold the machine screws coming down from the mast step. Was your block screwed down directly into the girders? Michael Brown Windburn CC 30-1 Date: Thu, 21 May 2015 17:10:27 -0400 From: Aaron Rouhi admiralmag...@outlook.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Message-ID: bay179-w44f5e244aa918e2f4a0063a2...@phx.gbl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hey Nate,Here are some pictures from when I replaced my mast step few years back. The stringers were so rotted that I was able to remove them pretty much by hand! It was not pretty... I replaced them with 5 new stringers made out of 8/4 mahogany. Make sure you mark up the height of your oak block so you can match it. This is also a good time to installed a bilge pump pickup hose in front of the mast (lowest part of the bilge). Doing that will keep your bilge dry... Pictures are here: http://imgur.com/a/SOWx6 Cheers,Aaron R.Admiral Maggie,1979 CC 30 MK1 #540Annapolis, MD Date: Wed, 20 May 2015 11:12:16 -0500 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com CC: nateflesn...@gmail.com I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want toforestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengtheningit now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate FlesnessSarah Jean1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay MarinaLake Superior ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
Do you mean this site: http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/doityourself/maststep/maststep.htm I did essentially the same thing on my CC 30 a few years ago. The plywood had rotted out and my mast was sinking into the bilge. I got some 3/4 inch fiberglass panels from a guy who parts for aircraft. I cut out and laminated the the panels togehter to make them 1.5 inches thick. Put them in, dropped the big wooden block on top and then the mast shoe...all good now. On 20/05/2015 5:20 PM, Peter Fell via CnC-List wrote: I recall reading somewhere who knows where ... that CC changed at some point from plywood to fiberglass for the mast step stringers (or perhaps it was just encapsulating them entirely in glass. Can anyone confirm that and if so when it occurred? On the 30’s we looked at (when we ultimately got the 27) you could reach into the bilge and under the arch of the stringer ... so even without pulling the mast, probing with an awl would give you a good idea how bad things are. Peter Fell Sidney, BC Cygnet CC 27 MkIII *From:* Gary Nylander via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com *Sent:* Wednesday, May 20, 2015 12:58 PM *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com *Cc:* Gary Nylander mailto:gnylan...@atlanticbb.net *Subject:* Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593. There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily. Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years. The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides. Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible. Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry. I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there. Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice. Gary Nylander Maryland gnylan...@atlanticbb.net mailto:gnylan...@atlanticbb.net -- Boat_Sig Cheers, Jeff Nelson Muir Caileag CC 30 Armdale Y.C. Halifax ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
In 2006 when I was delivering from Carrabelle, Fl to New Orleans my new to me 1971 CC 30, the mast step collapsed while under sail on Mobile Bay. The three plywood stringers supporting the wood plate on which the metal mast step rested failed. The step was rebuilt by Donnie Brennan in Mobile. Donnie has been the Boatwright for the US Olympic teams in China and England. I was not present during the re-build but Donnie described his method as follows. Using the remains of the stringers as templates, new stringers were cut from fiberglass laminate. He had to cut a section of the floor pan (my estimate is 3-4 inches wide) to allow him access to the turn of the hull in the bilge in order to be able to prepare the hull for glassing in the new stringers. With the new stringers glassed, he filled in the spaces between them with epoxy and filler, using a section of PVC pipe to leave access to the forward keel bolt through the epoxy fill. There is a similar description in the photo album under Do it Yourself, rebuilding a mast step on a 30Ft MK I Good Luck Ed Briar Patch CC 34 New Orleans On Wed, May 20, 2015 at 11:12 AM, Nate Flesness via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want to forestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengthening it now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate Flesness Sarah Jean 1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay Marina Lake Superior ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593. There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily. Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years. The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides. Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible. Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry. I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there. Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice. Gary Nylander Maryland gnylan...@atlanticbb.net - Original Message - From: Nate Flesness via CnC-List To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Nate Flesness Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 12:12 PM Subject: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want to forestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengthening it now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate Flesness Sarah Jean 1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay Marina Lake Superior -- ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
I recall reading somewhere who knows where ... that CC changed at some point from plywood to fiberglass for the mast step stringers (or perhaps it was just encapsulating them entirely in glass. Can anyone confirm that and if so when it occurred? On the 30’s we looked at (when we ultimately got the 27) you could reach into the bilge and under the arch of the stringer ... so even without pulling the mast, probing with an awl would give you a good idea how bad things are. Peter Fell Sidney, BC Cygnet CC 27 MkIII From: Gary Nylander via CnC-List Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 12:58 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Gary Nylander Subject: Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 Nate, your 30 is the same year as mine, so I would surmise they are built the same. Mine is #593. There are three crosswise stringers under the oak plate. The aluminum box is attached to the oak by long screws and the oak plate is attached with six long screws. The oak comes off easily. Depending on how dry your bilge has been kept, the stringers may or may not be weakened. If so, the fixes have ranged from removal and replacement to just strengthening. I went the strengthening route and framed each stringer with a bit of foam board and drilled a bunch of holes in each and filled with G-Flex up to the level of the oak. No movement in about five years. The problem is that the factory didn't encapsulate the stringers (which are made up of two pieces of 3/4 plywood each) on the bottom, and when the bilge is wet, they soak up moisture and get waterlogged. There's glass just on the sides. Some fixers have just put a large horizontal tube for drainage and another for access to the forward keel bolt and then filled the whole cavity with some sort of filler (microballoons, etc.). You could just fill the lowest part so that your bilge pump keeps things dry, but to get all the water out, the pump has to be in the lowest part of the sump - under the mast. Inaccessible. Another bypass fix would be to put in a bilge drain. My boat had that, and foolishly I filled up that area. I should have replaced it with one which is flush to the outside, then for half of the year, the bilge is totally dry. I don't have pictures, but when you take the screws out of the oak, it will be pretty obvious what is there. Good luck, email if you have questions, I have been down the road twice. Gary Nylander Maryland gnylan...@atlanticbb.net - Original Message - From: Nate Flesness via CnC-List To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Nate Flesness Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 12:12 PM Subject: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1 I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want to forestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengthening it now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate Flesness Sarah Jean 1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay Marina Lake Superior -- ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List mast step redo on a 30-1
SEE ABOVE ED On Wed, May 20, 2015 at 11:39 AM, Edward Levert weeselev...@gmail.com wrote: In 2006 when I was delivering from Carrabelle, Fl to New Orleans my new to me 1971 CC 30, the mast step collapsed while under sail on Mobile Bay. The three plywood stringers supporting the wood plate on which the metal mast step rested failed. The step was rebuilt by Donnie Brennan in Mobile. Donnie has been the Boatwright for the US Olympic teams in China and England. I was not present during the re-build but Donnie described his method as follows. Using the remains of the stringers as templates, new stringers were cut from fiberglass laminate. He had to cut a section of the floor pan (my estimate is 3-4 inches wide) to allow him access to the turn of the hull in the bilge in order to be able to prepare the hull for glassing in the new stringers. With the new stringers glassed, he filled in the spaces between them with epoxy and filler, using a section of PVC pipe to leave access to the forward keel bolt through the epoxy fill. There is a similar description in the photo album under Do it Yourself, rebuilding a mast step on a 30Ft MK I Good Luck Ed Briar Patch CC 34 New Orleans On Wed, May 20, 2015 at 11:12 AM, Nate Flesness via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote: I'll soon have the mast out of my 1980 30-1 (for relocating her by truck) and want to forestall future mast step issues by redoing/strengthening it now. The mast was last out 8 years ago. I've never pulled the oak mast step base plate, so don't know what to anticipate underneath. Advice welcome, pictures very welcome. I'm imagining figuring out the necessary drainage and keel bolt access, then using epoxy-saturated oak board or McMaster Carr fiberglass sheets to built a new support step, and maybe filling in what I hear is a large empty area with micro-balloon slurry? She's an all-freshwater boat which sits in a cradle 7 months a year, which may be why its lasted this long with no signs of trouble yet. Nate Flesness Sarah Jean 1980 30-1 Siskiwit Bay Marina Lake Superior ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
