Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
So it is! It needs an external monitor that also needs power, but definitely one to keep in mind. Thanks Ross. On 7 October 2011 20:43, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: By the time you're up and running, this http://www.raspberrypi.org/ may be an option for you, as well. A lot cheaper than an iPhone... -Ross. On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 5:36 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Well I thought that we could plug either an iphone or computer (eg netbook or your dev. board) into an UPS and extend the battery life that way. It would be on standby most of the time. The longest it would have to last would be a week because any on the committee could plug it in while they are in the library. And maybe other people could plug it in but it would have more chance of being left plugged in. Whatever we had would have to be secured and yes, it will be difficult to do and one of the reasons we do everything manually - nothing to steal. I used to run an undergrad computer lab in the 80s that was unstaffed and everything tied down. People used to nick the cables. I suppose the choice between an iphone and a computer would be price and running time on an UPS. At the moment the only access to the internet from the library is over the mobile phone net so whether we use computer or iphone the cost will be the same. They have just put up poles for fibre optic, but I've learnt not to hold me breath over things like that. I have to say, it seems like the librarian is starting to consider it. When I first brought it up 2 years ago the reaction was, we could never automate here! I said something the other day about it taking 3 years and she said, oh way longer than that. By then, who knows what there will be? On 7 October 2011 12:35, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: One other thing to consider with the iPhone is that it's going to be a recurrent monthly fee, and that cellular internet tends to run more expensive than regular internet collections. This could easily run over replacement costs for a wired computer, for instance. Also, that while a regular computer might be a theft risk, an iPhone is a giant, gold-plated theft risk, in a super-portable size. Also, there's no way you're going to get a week's worth of service per charge out of it, while using it as a terminal. - Dave Mayo On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 11:41 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Nicole, people here tell me that computers get zapped even with surge protectors here, or even with lightning protectors. Then someone told me the other day that they need to be properly earthed and almost nothing is here. One problem is I don't even know if there is such a thing as a real electrician here who understands how do do these things. At the moment we're looking at the WSSL trial because it would be a big overhead to us to run our own software when we know nothing about it, but we'll still need something to connect to it. I'm thinking that we cut our losses by doing it as cheaply as possible and accept that that we'll lose it occasionally - make it less worth stealing. The library is open and unstaffed 24hrs and people say nothing keeps thieves out. But Dave Mayo pointed out you can get a kind of computer in a power plug now. Or we could use an iphone. Then they could be plugged into an UPS and charged once a week. That could work. We'd still need a cage and I don't really want to encourage thieves to bring welding gear into the library! I don't know if we're going to be able to afford the WSSL system. They don't know how much it will cost yet. So we could end up having to run our own system anyway. Even the WSSL system is more sophisticated than we need. We don't need a web site or to be able to place holds on books. All we really need is a db with 2 tables - users and collection and queries to do loans, returns and overdues. Hey, I could write it! But surely I don't have to. If we went with your suggestion, what software would you suggest? Thanks Rowan On 7 October 2011 08:45, Nicole Miller nikludesi...@gmail.com wrote: Rowan, you mentioned that a computer might be stolen or fried by lightning. The more I read, the more I think a computer is the way to go, at the very least to set up the database. Is there a way you can use surge protectors and create a cage to go around the computer with it's scanner? Nicole MLS Student Southern Connecticut State University On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 11:50 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, I'm betting WSSL will be what we're looking for. It's whether we can afford it and whether we can set up a secure self check point in an unstaffed library that doesn't have to be plugged into power
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Thanks Nicole, I'll check it out. Of course I have to add on the 3 years it will take to create a db of the collection, or so I'm told. Cheers Rowan On 8 October 2011 15:53, Nicole Miller nikludesi...@gmail.com wrote: Rowan, I think a caged computer is the best way to go to house the software. As far as software goes, I've been looking into some open source library systems. I wonder if perhaps NewGenLib might work for you. http://www.verussolutions.biz/web/ They state that they system will fully automate within 4 days, but that seems to be a bit of a hefty claim, in my opinion. Nicole On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 3:12 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: So it is! It needs an external monitor that also needs power, but definitely one to keep in mind. Thanks Ross. On 7 October 2011 20:43, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: By the time you're up and running, this http://www.raspberrypi.org/ may be an option for you, as well. A lot cheaper than an iPhone... -Ross. On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 5:36 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Well I thought that we could plug either an iphone or computer (eg netbook or your dev. board) into an UPS and extend the battery life that way. It would be on standby most of the time. The longest it would have to last would be a week because any on the committee could plug it in while they are in the library. And maybe other people could plug it in but it would have more chance of being left plugged in. Whatever we had would have to be secured and yes, it will be difficult to do and one of the reasons we do everything manually - nothing to steal. I used to run an undergrad computer lab in the 80s that was unstaffed and everything tied down. People used to nick the cables. I suppose the choice between an iphone and a computer would be price and running time on an UPS. At the moment the only access to the internet from the library is over the mobile phone net so whether we use computer or iphone the cost will be the same. They have just put up poles for fibre optic, but I've learnt not to hold me breath over things like that. I have to say, it seems like the librarian is starting to consider it. When I first brought it up 2 years ago the reaction was, we could never automate here! I said something the other day about it taking 3 years and she said, oh way longer than that. By then, who knows what there will be? On 7 October 2011 12:35, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: One other thing to consider with the iPhone is that it's going to be a recurrent monthly fee, and that cellular internet tends to run more expensive than regular internet collections. This could easily run over replacement costs for a wired computer, for instance. Also, that while a regular computer might be a theft risk, an iPhone is a giant, gold-plated theft risk, in a super-portable size. Also, there's no way you're going to get a week's worth of service per charge out of it, while using it as a terminal. - Dave Mayo On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 11:41 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Nicole, people here tell me that computers get zapped even with surge protectors here, or even with lightning protectors. Then someone told me the other day that they need to be properly earthed and almost nothing is here. One problem is I don't even know if there is such a thing as a real electrician here who understands how do do these things. At the moment we're looking at the WSSL trial because it would be a big overhead to us to run our own software when we know nothing about it, but we'll still need something to connect to it. I'm thinking that we cut our losses by doing it as cheaply as possible and accept that that we'll lose it occasionally - make it less worth stealing. The library is open and unstaffed 24hrs and people say nothing keeps thieves out. But Dave Mayo pointed out you can get a kind of computer in a power plug now. Or we could use an iphone. Then they could be plugged into an UPS and charged once a week. That could work. We'd still need a cage and I don't really want to encourage thieves to bring welding gear into the library! I don't know if we're going to be able to afford the WSSL system. They don't know how much it will cost yet. So we could end up having to run our own system anyway. Even the WSSL system is more sophisticated than we need. We don't need a web site or to be able to place holds on books. All we really need is a db with 2 tables - users and collection and queries to do loans, returns
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Hi Nicole, people here tell me that computers get zapped even with surge protectors here, or even with lightning protectors. Then someone told me the other day that they need to be properly earthed and almost nothing is here. One problem is I don't even know if there is such a thing as a real electrician here who understands how do do these things. At the moment we're looking at the WSSL trial because it would be a big overhead to us to run our own software when we know nothing about it, but we'll still need something to connect to it. I'm thinking that we cut our losses by doing it as cheaply as possible and accept that that we'll lose it occasionally - make it less worth stealing. The library is open and unstaffed 24hrs and people say nothing keeps thieves out. But Dave Mayo pointed out you can get a kind of computer in a power plug now. Or we could use an iphone. Then they could be plugged into an UPS and charged once a week. That could work. We'd still need a cage and I don't really want to encourage thieves to bring welding gear into the library! I don't know if we're going to be able to afford the WSSL system. They don't know how much it will cost yet. So we could end up having to run our own system anyway. Even the WSSL system is more sophisticated than we need. We don't need a web site or to be able to place holds on books. All we really need is a db with 2 tables - users and collection and queries to do loans, returns and overdues. Hey, I could write it! But surely I don't have to. If we went with your suggestion, what software would you suggest? Thanks Rowan On 7 October 2011 08:45, Nicole Miller nikludesi...@gmail.com wrote: Rowan, you mentioned that a computer might be stolen or fried by lightning. The more I read, the more I think a computer is the way to go, at the very least to set up the database. Is there a way you can use surge protectors and create a cage to go around the computer with it's scanner? Nicole MLS Student Southern Connecticut State University On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 11:50 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, I'm betting WSSL will be what we're looking for. It's whether we can afford it and whether we can set up a secure self check point in an unstaffed library that doesn't have to be plugged into power. Thanks Cary On 27 September 2011 07:51, Cary Gordon listu...@chillco.com wrote: I'll bet that WSSL has a report generator that, while not necessarily better than the eight of you, will allow you to more easily get information about what your patrons are doing. Cary On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 11:33 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Wow, that's amazing. That certainly opens up possibilities. It would be quite a challenge to get it all working buy they reckon it takes 3 years to barcode the books anyway, so it might keep me busy trying to figure it out. I signed up for WSSL and just said I was in Philadelphia and emailed them and it does look like a possibility if we can afford it. Maybe the could license it out to a developing country to run it for the 3rd world at a tenth of the cost! Thanks so much for all your help. I've called a committee meeting this afternoon. The librarian is very resistant to automating and is highly skeptical that it can be made to work here. In the mean time eight of us sit around on a monday afternoon being computers, just as they have for the last 60 years! Cheers Rowan On 26 September 2011 09:43, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: Here's an example of the kind of thing I'm talking about when I say micro-development board: http://technabob.com/blog/2011/02/03/dreamplug-mini-power-plug-computer/This isn't the best example - it's obviously being sold to a certain extent as novelty hardware, and it shows, but something like this could work fairly well as a web server for the area. You can actually get substantially cheaper than this, if you're willing to do some digging and/or do some component assembly - although, of course, then your mailing expenses might rise. It won't solve the lightning problem (which is fascinating/terrifying to me - outlet to device arcing is freaky!), but many of the small linux single-board computers are low enough power draw that an APC or other battery solution could run them for a long time off of wall power; you'd need someone to unplug it when the storm was coming, but that's going to be true of the iPhone, too, likely. If you were able to find or build the right software, I could see something like this working as a server, with an iPod touch serving as the scanner, for example. You could also (if you got one with a video output) attach a scanner via USB, and use it for both check-in and check-out
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Well I thought that we could plug either an iphone or computer (eg netbook or your dev. board) into an UPS and extend the battery life that way. It would be on standby most of the time. The longest it would have to last would be a week because any on the committee could plug it in while they are in the library. And maybe other people could plug it in but it would have more chance of being left plugged in. Whatever we had would have to be secured and yes, it will be difficult to do and one of the reasons we do everything manually - nothing to steal. I used to run an undergrad computer lab in the 80s that was unstaffed and everything tied down. People used to nick the cables. I suppose the choice between an iphone and a computer would be price and running time on an UPS. At the moment the only access to the internet from the library is over the mobile phone net so whether we use computer or iphone the cost will be the same. They have just put up poles for fibre optic, but I've learnt not to hold me breath over things like that. I have to say, it seems like the librarian is starting to consider it. When I first brought it up 2 years ago the reaction was, we could never automate here! I said something the other day about it taking 3 years and she said, oh way longer than that. By then, who knows what there will be? On 7 October 2011 12:35, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: One other thing to consider with the iPhone is that it's going to be a recurrent monthly fee, and that cellular internet tends to run more expensive than regular internet collections. This could easily run over replacement costs for a wired computer, for instance. Also, that while a regular computer might be a theft risk, an iPhone is a giant, gold-plated theft risk, in a super-portable size. Also, there's no way you're going to get a week's worth of service per charge out of it, while using it as a terminal. - Dave Mayo On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 11:41 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Nicole, people here tell me that computers get zapped even with surge protectors here, or even with lightning protectors. Then someone told me the other day that they need to be properly earthed and almost nothing is here. One problem is I don't even know if there is such a thing as a real electrician here who understands how do do these things. At the moment we're looking at the WSSL trial because it would be a big overhead to us to run our own software when we know nothing about it, but we'll still need something to connect to it. I'm thinking that we cut our losses by doing it as cheaply as possible and accept that that we'll lose it occasionally - make it less worth stealing. The library is open and unstaffed 24hrs and people say nothing keeps thieves out. But Dave Mayo pointed out you can get a kind of computer in a power plug now. Or we could use an iphone. Then they could be plugged into an UPS and charged once a week. That could work. We'd still need a cage and I don't really want to encourage thieves to bring welding gear into the library! I don't know if we're going to be able to afford the WSSL system. They don't know how much it will cost yet. So we could end up having to run our own system anyway. Even the WSSL system is more sophisticated than we need. We don't need a web site or to be able to place holds on books. All we really need is a db with 2 tables - users and collection and queries to do loans, returns and overdues. Hey, I could write it! But surely I don't have to. If we went with your suggestion, what software would you suggest? Thanks Rowan On 7 October 2011 08:45, Nicole Miller nikludesi...@gmail.com wrote: Rowan, you mentioned that a computer might be stolen or fried by lightning. The more I read, the more I think a computer is the way to go, at the very least to set up the database. Is there a way you can use surge protectors and create a cage to go around the computer with it's scanner? Nicole MLS Student Southern Connecticut State University On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 11:50 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, I'm betting WSSL will be what we're looking for. It's whether we can afford it and whether we can set up a secure self check point in an unstaffed library that doesn't have to be plugged into power. Thanks Cary On 27 September 2011 07:51, Cary Gordon listu...@chillco.com wrote: I'll bet that WSSL has a report generator that, while not necessarily better than the eight of you, will allow you to more easily get information about what your patrons are doing. Cary On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 11:33 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Wow, that's amazing. That certainly opens up possibilities. It would be quite a challenge to get it all working buy they reckon it takes 3
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Yes, I'm betting WSSL will be what we're looking for. It's whether we can afford it and whether we can set up a secure self check point in an unstaffed library that doesn't have to be plugged into power. Thanks Cary On 27 September 2011 07:51, Cary Gordon listu...@chillco.com wrote: I'll bet that WSSL has a report generator that, while not necessarily better than the eight of you, will allow you to more easily get information about what your patrons are doing. Cary On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 11:33 AM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Wow, that's amazing. That certainly opens up possibilities. It would be quite a challenge to get it all working buy they reckon it takes 3 years to barcode the books anyway, so it might keep me busy trying to figure it out. I signed up for WSSL and just said I was in Philadelphia and emailed them and it does look like a possibility if we can afford it. Maybe the could license it out to a developing country to run it for the 3rd world at a tenth of the cost! Thanks so much for all your help. I've called a committee meeting this afternoon. The librarian is very resistant to automating and is highly skeptical that it can be made to work here. In the mean time eight of us sit around on a monday afternoon being computers, just as they have for the last 60 years! Cheers Rowan On 26 September 2011 09:43, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: Here's an example of the kind of thing I'm talking about when I say micro-development board: http://technabob.com/blog/2011/02/03/dreamplug-mini-power-plug-computer/This isn't the best example - it's obviously being sold to a certain extent as novelty hardware, and it shows, but something like this could work fairly well as a web server for the area. You can actually get substantially cheaper than this, if you're willing to do some digging and/or do some component assembly - although, of course, then your mailing expenses might rise. It won't solve the lightning problem (which is fascinating/terrifying to me - outlet to device arcing is freaky!), but many of the small linux single-board computers are low enough power draw that an APC or other battery solution could run them for a long time off of wall power; you'd need someone to unplug it when the storm was coming, but that's going to be true of the iPhone, too, likely. If you were able to find or build the right software, I could see something like this working as a server, with an iPod touch serving as the scanner, for example. You could also (if you got one with a video output) attach a scanner via USB, and use it for both check-in and check-out. If you do go the iDevice route (or Android, etc), you might be able to get away without a physical scanner attached - there are several apps that do barcode recognition through the devices' cameras. Hope at least some of this is helpful. - Dave On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 10:24 AM, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: From the person in a position to know: We have not yet figured out pricing. We are definitely considering the needs of the developing nations but don't have answers yet. At this point we are most focused on the feature set that can be activated with no human intervention. Looking for the intersection of the basic need and most automatable (that probably is not a word). Roy On Sun, Sep 25, 2011 at 3:14 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, I tried to sign up for WSSL and you have to be in US. Also, if it will cost 'a cup of coffee a day' am I right that would be at least $700 a year? That's our entire annual budget. So probably only for first world countries anyway. And you're meant to have one or two full-time staff which we don't have. Still, I'll email them and see what they say. There are probably 1000s of 3rd world libraries doing everything manually still and if there are economies of scale we may be able to afford it. Cheers Rowan On 24 September 2011 17:10, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: It's so experimental, that it's having a Free *Trail*. That is a good suggestion, by the way - I'm just amused by the typo. It appears twice on this page, once on the sign-up page, and perhaps elsewhere. Also, absolutely is misspelled as absolutley on the sign-up page. - Dave Mayo On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 6:45 PM, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: Actually, I have an even better option from OCLC: Web Site for Small Libraries (WSSL) http://experimental.worldcat.org/lib/ It is really aimed at very small libraries, so it is very easy to use but still has some basic circulation capabilities. It's in free trial mode now, so take a look and see if it does what you need. Roy Tennant
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Wow, that's amazing. That certainly opens up possibilities. It would be quite a challenge to get it all working buy they reckon it takes 3 years to barcode the books anyway, so it might keep me busy trying to figure it out. I signed up for WSSL and just said I was in Philadelphia and emailed them and it does look like a possibility if we can afford it. Maybe the could license it out to a developing country to run it for the 3rd world at a tenth of the cost! Thanks so much for all your help. I've called a committee meeting this afternoon. The librarian is very resistant to automating and is highly skeptical that it can be made to work here. In the mean time eight of us sit around on a monday afternoon being computers, just as they have for the last 60 years! Cheers Rowan On 26 September 2011 09:43, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: Here's an example of the kind of thing I'm talking about when I say micro-development board: http://technabob.com/blog/2011/02/03/dreamplug-mini-power-plug-computer/This isn't the best example - it's obviously being sold to a certain extent as novelty hardware, and it shows, but something like this could work fairly well as a web server for the area. You can actually get substantially cheaper than this, if you're willing to do some digging and/or do some component assembly - although, of course, then your mailing expenses might rise. It won't solve the lightning problem (which is fascinating/terrifying to me - outlet to device arcing is freaky!), but many of the small linux single-board computers are low enough power draw that an APC or other battery solution could run them for a long time off of wall power; you'd need someone to unplug it when the storm was coming, but that's going to be true of the iPhone, too, likely. If you were able to find or build the right software, I could see something like this working as a server, with an iPod touch serving as the scanner, for example. You could also (if you got one with a video output) attach a scanner via USB, and use it for both check-in and check-out. If you do go the iDevice route (or Android, etc), you might be able to get away without a physical scanner attached - there are several apps that do barcode recognition through the devices' cameras. Hope at least some of this is helpful. - Dave On Mon, Sep 26, 2011 at 10:24 AM, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: From the person in a position to know: We have not yet figured out pricing. We are definitely considering the needs of the developing nations but don't have answers yet. At this point we are most focused on the feature set that can be activated with no human intervention. Looking for the intersection of the basic need and most automatable (that probably is not a word). Roy On Sun, Sep 25, 2011 at 3:14 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, I tried to sign up for WSSL and you have to be in US. Also, if it will cost 'a cup of coffee a day' am I right that would be at least $700 a year? That's our entire annual budget. So probably only for first world countries anyway. And you're meant to have one or two full-time staff which we don't have. Still, I'll email them and see what they say. There are probably 1000s of 3rd world libraries doing everything manually still and if there are economies of scale we may be able to afford it. Cheers Rowan On 24 September 2011 17:10, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: It's so experimental, that it's having a Free *Trail*. That is a good suggestion, by the way - I'm just amused by the typo. It appears twice on this page, once on the sign-up page, and perhaps elsewhere. Also, absolutely is misspelled as absolutley on the sign-up page. - Dave Mayo On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 6:45 PM, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: Actually, I have an even better option from OCLC: Web Site for Small Libraries (WSSL) http://experimental.worldcat.org/lib/ It is really aimed at very small libraries, so it is very easy to use but still has some basic circulation capabilities. It's in free trial mode now, so take a look and see if it does what you need. Roy Tennant OCLC Research On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 12:22 AM, JONATHAN LEBRETON lebre...@temple.edu wrote: You may be able to do something with OCLCs so-called Web Management System whereby your OPAC (in the form of WorldCat local.) and circ functions are in the cloud.. Jonathan LeBreton Senior Associate University Librarian Temple University Libraries Philadelphia PA 19122 Voice: 215-204-3184 Fax: 215-204-5201 Mobile: 215-284-5070 lebre...@temple.edu jonat...@temple.edu - Original Message - From: rowan eisner [mailto:rowaneis...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, September 23, 2011 11:51 PM
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Hi Kyle Our collection is over 13,000 and we have several thousand more waiting to be processed that we just can't get on top of. We could expand the library by a third or so if we had a more efficient system. We get 100-200 returns a week about half of which have been taken out. About 15-20% of borrowings aren't returned but we get a similar number of donations. So that's a lot of the work, typing catalogue cards and pulling them when they don't come back then retyping them when they're donated again. And figuring out what's overdue. We type the same books over and over again and yet never have db of what we've got. Our librarian tend to agree that it's not worth automating given all the difficulties and she may be right. I am very used to using computers for this sort of work and it seems kind of crazy how much time we spend on card handling. Several of the long-term volunteers are very frustrated at the lack of progress. I suppose even if I look into it and we make an informed decision against it, that's progress of a kind! Cheers Rowan On 26 September 2011 09:50, Kyle Banerjee baner...@uoregon.edu wrote: On Sun, Sep 25, 2011 at 3:14 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, I tried to sign up for WSSL and you have to be in US. Also, if it will cost 'a cup of coffee a day' am I right that would be at least $700 a year? That's our entire annual budget. So probably only for first world countries anyway. And you're meant to have one or two full-time staff which we don't have. Still, I'll email them and see what they say. There are probably 1000s of 3rd world libraries doing everything manually still and if there are economies of scale we may be able to afford it. How big are your collections, and roughly how many circulations do you do? My concern would be that since you lack staff and resources, you'd have some real headaches if you became dependent on a system and something went wrong or whoever sets things up goes away. A traditional system with checkout cards actually works quite well and will let you see what you own, what is out, and who has it if it should have been returned. When you add up the time for keeping all the info in the system up to date, maintaining the system, teaching people how to use it, and dealing with changes in technology you may not come out ahead with automation. kyle -- -- Kyle Banerjee Digital Services Program Manager Orbis Cascade Alliance baner...@uoregon.edu / 503.877.9773
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Thanks Thomas. I had a look through what they are suggesting last night. It looks like you would have to run the software on a system in the library. I find it amazing that it's cheaper for 1000s of libraries to all run their own computers and software than for us to have accounts on a central system and access it over the web. Maybe WSSL can be licensed to India or something. When they email me back I'm going to plug that! Cheers Rowan On 26 September 2011 07:55, Thomas Bennett bennet...@appstate.edu wrote: You may want to take a look at: http://librarysupportstaff.com/4automate.html There are several free and low cost solutions but I don't know if there is one that will be a viable solution for you. Sounds like you need a self checkout system like the 3m unit that connects to III although that particular system would be priced way outside your budget. But the idea is a patron scans there card, mag stripe or bar code and then scans bar code from book/books. Still it would be the honor system. You may want to check other links from the Google I used: Linux personal library software with bar code Thomas On Friday 23 September 2011 18:27:33 you wrote: Apologies if this is the wrong forum, but if anyone can point me in the right direction... We have an unstaffed library and can't leave a computer in it. Is there a way to automate 1) with no computer - do circulation and catalog in the cloud. Volunteers bring in laptops to do circulation and clients access catalog with iphones 2) that doesn't cost a fortune Thanks so much Rowan -- == Thomas McMillan Grant Bennett Appalachian State University Operations Systems AnalystP O Box 32026 University LibraryBoone, North Carolina 28608 (828) 262 6587 Library Systems Help Desk: https://www.library.appstate.edu/help/ ==
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Aha, the plot thickens! This sounds very promising. I'll sound very keen when they email me back! Thanks so much Roy. -Rowan On 26 September 2011 08:24, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: From the person in a position to know: We have not yet figured out pricing. We are definitely considering the needs of the developing nations but don't have answers yet. At this point we are most focused on the feature set that can be activated with no human intervention. Looking for the intersection of the basic need and most automatable (that probably is not a word). Roy On Sun, Sep 25, 2011 at 3:14 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, I tried to sign up for WSSL and you have to be in US. Also, if it will cost 'a cup of coffee a day' am I right that would be at least $700 a year? That's our entire annual budget. So probably only for first world countries anyway. And you're meant to have one or two full-time staff which we don't have. Still, I'll email them and see what they say. There are probably 1000s of 3rd world libraries doing everything manually still and if there are economies of scale we may be able to afford it. Cheers Rowan On 24 September 2011 17:10, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: It's so experimental, that it's having a Free *Trail*. That is a good suggestion, by the way - I'm just amused by the typo. It appears twice on this page, once on the sign-up page, and perhaps elsewhere. Also, absolutely is misspelled as absolutley on the sign-up page. - Dave Mayo On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 6:45 PM, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: Actually, I have an even better option from OCLC: Web Site for Small Libraries (WSSL) http://experimental.worldcat.org/lib/ It is really aimed at very small libraries, so it is very easy to use but still has some basic circulation capabilities. It's in free trial mode now, so take a look and see if it does what you need. Roy Tennant OCLC Research On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 12:22 AM, JONATHAN LEBRETON lebre...@temple.edu wrote: You may be able to do something with OCLCs so-called Web Management System whereby your OPAC (in the form of WorldCat local.) and circ functions are in the cloud.. Jonathan LeBreton Senior Associate University Librarian Temple University Libraries Philadelphia PA 19122 Voice: 215-204-3184 Fax: 215-204-5201 Mobile: 215-284-5070 lebre...@temple.edu jonat...@temple.edu - Original Message - From: rowan eisner [mailto:rowaneis...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, September 23, 2011 11:51 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet? Hi Dave It's an honesty system, card based, the way most community libraries used to work before computers. Because it's unstaffed about 15% of books aren't returned but we get a similar amount of donations. So we have that constant churn to take in and out of a card catalog manually. We need borrowers to be able to check out books. I was thinking maybe with a scanner attached to an iphone running an app. I didn't think librarything could do circulation. I thought it was just a catalog. What do you reckon? Cheers Rowan On 23 September 2011 21:34, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: I think it's going to be difficult to find a solution that's entirely cloud based. What functionality do you need? If you have a very limited subset of ILS/OPAC functions in mind, theoretically a LibraryThing paid account or similar quasi-library service might suffice. I'm having trouble understanding how circulation works/is expected to work when librarians aren't present. Is there a sign-out sheet? How do you monitor for lossage? - Dave Mayo On Fri, Sep 23, 2011 at 10:42 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks Esme No, the library is open all hours but volunteers just come in 2 hrs a week. I'm not sure how it could work but if we leave anything plugged in it will get stolen or struck by lightning. We're in cloud forest. With koha and open-ils do we have to run the software on a server or do we just get an account on an existing system? Running a system ourselves might take a lot for us to figure out. Cheers Rowan On 23 September 2011 16:38, Cowles, Esme escow...@ucsd.edu wrote: Rowan- Having a hosted catalog and circ system seems very easy to do. There are several open source library systems such as Koha and Evergreen that might suit your needs: http://www.koha.org/ http://open-ils.org
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Ok, I tried to sign up for WSSL and you have to be in US. Also, if it will cost 'a cup of coffee a day' am I right that would be at least $700 a year? That's our entire annual budget. So probably only for first world countries anyway. And you're meant to have one or two full-time staff which we don't have. Still, I'll email them and see what they say. There are probably 1000s of 3rd world libraries doing everything manually still and if there are economies of scale we may be able to afford it. Cheers Rowan On 24 September 2011 17:10, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: It's so experimental, that it's having a Free *Trail*. That is a good suggestion, by the way - I'm just amused by the typo. It appears twice on this page, once on the sign-up page, and perhaps elsewhere. Also, absolutely is misspelled as absolutley on the sign-up page. - Dave Mayo On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 6:45 PM, Roy Tennant roytenn...@gmail.com wrote: Actually, I have an even better option from OCLC: Web Site for Small Libraries (WSSL) http://experimental.worldcat.org/lib/ It is really aimed at very small libraries, so it is very easy to use but still has some basic circulation capabilities. It's in free trial mode now, so take a look and see if it does what you need. Roy Tennant OCLC Research On Sat, Sep 24, 2011 at 12:22 AM, JONATHAN LEBRETON lebre...@temple.edu wrote: You may be able to do something with OCLCs so-called Web Management System whereby your OPAC (in the form of WorldCat local.) and circ functions are in the cloud.. Jonathan LeBreton Senior Associate University Librarian Temple University Libraries Philadelphia PA 19122 Voice: 215-204-3184 Fax: 215-204-5201 Mobile: 215-284-5070 lebre...@temple.edu jonat...@temple.edu - Original Message - From: rowan eisner [mailto:rowaneis...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, September 23, 2011 11:51 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet? Hi Dave It's an honesty system, card based, the way most community libraries used to work before computers. Because it's unstaffed about 15% of books aren't returned but we get a similar amount of donations. So we have that constant churn to take in and out of a card catalog manually. We need borrowers to be able to check out books. I was thinking maybe with a scanner attached to an iphone running an app. I didn't think librarything could do circulation. I thought it was just a catalog. What do you reckon? Cheers Rowan On 23 September 2011 21:34, David Mayo pobo...@gmail.com wrote: I think it's going to be difficult to find a solution that's entirely cloud based. What functionality do you need? If you have a very limited subset of ILS/OPAC functions in mind, theoretically a LibraryThing paid account or similar quasi-library service might suffice. I'm having trouble understanding how circulation works/is expected to work when librarians aren't present. Is there a sign-out sheet? How do you monitor for lossage? - Dave Mayo On Fri, Sep 23, 2011 at 10:42 PM, rowan eisner rowaneis...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks Esme No, the library is open all hours but volunteers just come in 2 hrs a week. I'm not sure how it could work but if we leave anything plugged in it will get stolen or struck by lightning. We're in cloud forest. With koha and open-ils do we have to run the software on a server or do we just get an account on an existing system? Running a system ourselves might take a lot for us to figure out. Cheers Rowan On 23 September 2011 16:38, Cowles, Esme escow...@ucsd.edu wrote: Rowan- Having a hosted catalog and circ system seems very easy to do. There are several open source library systems such as Koha and Evergreen that might suit your needs: http://www.koha.org/ http://open-ils.org/ Are there volunteers present the entire time the library is open to borrowers? Or are you counting on borrowers having smartphones to complete self-checkout? -Esme -- Esme Cowles escow...@ucsd.edu I don't need to be forgiven. -- The Who, Baba O'Reilly On Sep 23, 2011, at 3:27 PM, rowan eisner wrote: Apologies if this is the wrong forum, but if anyone can point me in the right direction... We have an unstaffed library and can't leave a computer in it. Is there a way to automate 1) with no computer - do circulation and catalog in the cloud. Volunteers bring in laptops to do circulation and clients access catalog with iphones 2) that doesn't cost a fortune Thanks so much Rowan
[CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Apologies if this is the wrong forum, but if anyone can point me in the right direction... We have an unstaffed library and can't leave a computer in it. Is there a way to automate 1) with no computer - do circulation and catalog in the cloud. Volunteers bring in laptops to do circulation and clients access catalog with iphones 2) that doesn't cost a fortune Thanks so much Rowan
Re: [CODE4LIB] Can a library automate without a computer yet?
Thanks Esme No, the library is open all hours but volunteers just come in 2 hrs a week. I'm not sure how it could work but if we leave anything plugged in it will get stolen or struck by lightning. We're in cloud forest. With koha and open-ils do we have to run the software on a server or do we just get an account on an existing system? Running a system ourselves might take a lot for us to figure out. Cheers Rowan On 23 September 2011 16:38, Cowles, Esme escow...@ucsd.edu wrote: Rowan- Having a hosted catalog and circ system seems very easy to do. There are several open source library systems such as Koha and Evergreen that might suit your needs: http://www.koha.org/ http://open-ils.org/ Are there volunteers present the entire time the library is open to borrowers? Or are you counting on borrowers having smartphones to complete self-checkout? -Esme -- Esme Cowles escow...@ucsd.edu I don't need to be forgiven. -- The Who, Baba O'Reilly On Sep 23, 2011, at 3:27 PM, rowan eisner wrote: Apologies if this is the wrong forum, but if anyone can point me in the right direction... We have an unstaffed library and can't leave a computer in it. Is there a way to automate 1) with no computer - do circulation and catalog in the cloud. Volunteers bring in laptops to do circulation and clients access catalog with iphones 2) that doesn't cost a fortune Thanks so much Rowan
