Re: Neo Sound and USB Questions
I have just seen that this topic is extensively documented on the wiki. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Battery_Charger Especially the dump charger method is something i did not know. Regards Tilman ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Balancing simplicity with complexity
Dear Community! A top ten complaint that we have received is directed at our user interface. Many people feel like the current interface doesn't address their exact needs. The organization is not "intuitive"; the colors are not pleasing; there is no simple way to navigate "exactly" where you want, exactly when you want. All Hardware has limits. All FOSS runs on hardware. Our current interface (OM-2007) was drawn almost in it's entirety before our designers had seen a working Neo. We had to live without an embedded stylus in the current version. And we had to learn to adapt to the lip on the touch screen preventing us from using interface elements on the edge of the display -- prime real estate regions. It was tough. We pressed on, faithful in our belief that our community would overcome this limitation and begin exploring our new found oceans. Personally, I feel that one of the most important areas for this project is the development and exploration of the mobile user interface. The human-machine interface is the intersection of art and technology. Great interfaces blend the visual with the technical. They balance simplicity with complexity. Often times, I feel, really great new interfaces are not immediately intuitive. They are not instantly natural. In fact, I would even argue this can be detrimental to improving interface design. If an interface is to be superior it must be different. Therefore it can't be intuitive, that is, familiar. A better metric, perhaps, is the learning time it takes until the interface feel's natural and intuitive. Now that we have freed phones, everyone can contribute to an improved baseline interface. This is our collective challenge. Can we create something truly different? Can we lead this incredibly important field? Recently, emails have been pouring in, questioning the community's ability to make our user interface into something insanely great. While some doubted, others stepped up. Thomas Wood, of our extended team (AKA: OpenedHand), sent an email, entitled, "OpenMoko Design Suggestions" proposing -- in detail -- a redesigned interface concept that was totally finger-based, optimized for GTK+ at 285ppi and, might I add, very cool looking. We went back to the drawing board with OpenedHand -- lead by their vast experience with GTK+, Matchbox, and mobile user interfaces -- and redesigned an incredibly promising new interface. Today I'm extremely excited to announce that everyone can find this, right now, in our subversion repository, under the name OM-2007.2. We have already converted the following applications to the new framework: * Dialer, * Contacts, * Today, * Calculator, * Feedreader You can find an official snapshot here: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/ The remaining applications and wiki specifications will be converted as we approach phase 2. We have new style guidelines here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GUI_Style_Guidelines Here's a list of the major changes we've made with respect to this new interface: 1) We redesigned the user interface to better fit both the hardware capability of the Neo and its physical form factor. 2) Performance was improved by streamlining the visual appearance, still keeping it attractive, but at the same time lessening the resource impact. The current design allows for further future performance improvements. 3) We vastly simplified the UI design and optimized the available screen real estate and physical characteristics. This included the following: * Improved the interface clarity by taking into account the screen's ultra-high DPI. * Allowed functions to be accessible using less accurate finger methods with requiring the stylus. * Placed common functions on easy access prominent buttons and increased the button target areas. * Reduced the number of objects on screen at once by splitting applications into tabs and redesigned the application layout. * Added more natural interaction methods, such as finger scrolling. * Removed some unnecessary elements such as the footer. Improved usage and accessibility of existing ones. 3) Application management and navigation is now improved by with a completely rewritten today app and by using the Neo's hardware keys. 4) This is now an interface that uses the strengths of our toolkit so that we can keep the extra framework and developer learning curve to a minimum. Please keep in mind that this new interface is still, very much, a work in progress. This is the earliest possible stage than we can release something with enough of a framework for you all to start exploring. It's a huge advancement in balancing simplicity with it's digital antagonist -- complexity. Also, thanks to Jon Phillips help, we've finally got around to licensing our artwork for this new interface under Creative Commons (CC BY-SA 3.0). The introduction of OM-2007.2 goes hand in hand with merging the OpenMoko OpenEmbedded overl
Re: T-Mobile [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 8/17/07, Mike Hodson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 8/16/07, Richard Boehme <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Does anyone know how we can get the GTA02 onto this program? It seems > > like we would be a natural fit, as GTA02 has Wi-Fi. Can any one just > > contact T-Mobile about it and apply for developer status and say that > > we want to be a part of the Hotsopt at Home program? > > This service requires a UMA/GAN capable phone; I do not believe the TI > chipset used by the Neo has this ability. I know more people are > probably going to jump on the wifi calling bit, but UMA is decidedly a > network-provided service. > Hmm is there any way to use the t-Mobile at home service when in WiFi range if I don't care about disconnecting when I go out of WiFi range? The Asterix route seems very complex. Thanks. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Test
On Friday 10 August 2007 16:04:06 Donald Organ wrote: > I havent gotten anything from this list in a while. Just testing. > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Just another test, did not receive anything since Saturday... ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Can't flash smaller root-fs through dfu-util?
After unsuccessfully flashing different root-filesystems, I finally found this note: If you upload rootfs image that is smaller that previous one it won't work - you need to attach to bootloader, erase NAND and then upload your rootfs first: cu -l /dev/ttyACM0 GTA01Bv3 # nand erase rootfs This *should* help but I am trying to understand why dfu-util can't do that? And what do I do if I have no serial interface? Does this mean I can't ever again flash a (smaller) rootfs? Or is it a design flaw of the .jffs2 file system that searches for an END OF FILE marker instead of storing the real file allocation? Is it possible to append some 0-bytes to the .jffs2 image? Any known solutions? quite puzzled, hns ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Test
On Friday 10 August 2007 16:04:06 Donald Organ wrote: > I havent gotten anything from this list in a while. Just testing. > > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Test? Is the list broken? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
How about a slim Openmoko design?
Moto Razr was slim and even slimmer on features but caught on because of the design. If one could have the openness of openmoko and make it a slim elegant design it will be a killer. What say? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: USB host
Guys, hardware questions go to neo1973-hardware, not to community !! On Mon, Aug 13, 2007 at 04:35:38PM +0200, Lars Hallberg wrote: > Giles Jones skrev: >> Marcin Domanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote : >>> Yep it shouldn't be a problem - let's take an usb hub with external >>> power supply - connect it to neo and then connect the device to the >>> hub. I dont know how's the support for it but its an idea :) >> Here's how you solve the power issue: >> http://www.radioshack.com/sm-cyberpower-4-port-battery-powered-hub--pi-2259675.html >> A rechargable battery powered USB hub. > > I'm still not clear over this... > > 1) Will it be possible to charge the neo over the usb connection while the > neo is in host mode. for Neo1973 GTA01: definitely yes. For GTA02 we will most likely supply power to the USB in host mode, so that doesn't work, at least not without complicated hacks ;) > Will that raise special demand on the hub? yes, or a special cable. > A flexible powered hub (Wall, external battery pack, car-power(12V)... ) > that have any 'extra' function that the neo needs/benefits from would be > the perfect companion... almost a obligatory companion to the neo... But... > exactly what does it take to make such a beast? > We did think about this for some time, and actually I've designed the architecture of such a device fairly far. The idea was to even further integrate that with the debug board, i.e. debug board plus battery-powered hub in one device :) But now that GTA01 is not really running at any reasonable quanatity, and GTA02 will be able to supply 5V in host mode, it was abandoned. We'd rather get GTA02 finished, then spend time on accessories that only make sense for GTA01. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Neo Sound and USB Questions
Has anybody actually tried the 40KOhm resister trick on the neo? Does it really work? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Neo Sound and USB Questions
please, this is a _community_ list! IF youre interested in hardware issues, please post to neo1973-hardware. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: mailing list management
Hi! For the various reasons cited in the many mails on this subject, there is a general concensus in the FOSS community and among maybe the hacking community in general _not_ to add subject prefixes. Filtering can be done on List-ID header (or with other commonly-used list software on Mailing-List or even the Sender-header) The vast majority of all FOSS-related mailing lists that I've ever seen follow this policy. We see no reason why we should deviate from that. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: suggested video chip for next neo
Guys, hardware questions go to neo1973-hardware, not community !!! On Mon, Aug 13, 2007 at 11:18:05AM -0700, Laine Walker-Avina wrote: >> The chip has more power then a ps2 or the Wii. >> This could bring some serious graphical power to the phone. >> >> what do you say? >> >> Edwyn > > I'd say that the Freescale iMX31 would probably be better since it has > almost everything you need on board including GPU and it already has vendor > supported Linux BSP. > > http://www.freescale.com/imx31 iMX31 doesn't exist in the free software universe since their drivers are proprietary. As are AMD/ATI Imageon. As are the Ti OMAP graphics drivers. Completely inacceptable for an open device. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FM Radio
On Thu, Aug 16, 2007 at 01:45:12PM +0530, Ashok Kumar wrote: > Any plans of adding it in future? not really. It's still somewhat of a strange conception to me why peopel would be interested in listening to hours and hours of crappy commercials interrupted with one or two (mostly crappy, too) songs in between, if they have a choice to listen to their collection of .ogg (and patent-encumbered .mp3) files. Also, I currently don't know what effects this has on things like FCC approval. Furthermore, some countries have some kind of levy-based scheme for funding the public broadcasting companies. This means that they would have to pay extra money for a device that has FM radio capabilities. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Release schedule GTA-2
On Fri, Aug 17, 2007 at 12:39:14PM +0200, Jurian Sluiman wrote: > I was wondering when the GTA-2 Neo comes out. Before GTA-1 everyone said > it would be October, but after a while it became September. Some wiki > pages are still saying September, others October. depends on what you think. GTA02 phase-1 will probably be october. > Is openMoko in September ready for an early mass market release? no. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OK, the forum is coming..
Ben Burdette wrote: I'd have to say that for the casual or occasional user, there are significant advantages to a web forum. For me, monitoring an active email list like openmoko in my email client is a fairly sizable undertaking - there are many emails per day to look through. I take time several times a day to look through these, or just mark the folder 'read'. If I were only want to look at the forum once every few weeks, then subscribing to the list would be overkill. On the other hand, in order to participate in the list you need to subscribe. So web-search only users are in effect barred from posting. Even if our casual users wanted 70-80 emails a day for something they only use once in a while, its still a hassle to set up if you don't know about email filtering and etc. Lots of people don't. Compare this to the effort needed to visit slashdot. You register once, and you never need to worry about it again. Visit every day or every 6 months, doesn't matter. The other aspect is that you are putting your real email address out there on the internet for lots of people to look at. This means its an excellent place for spammers to harvest email accounts. With a forum your personal data is more anonymous. Plus there is potential for other social networking style things like user profiles - what users are working on, etc. You are exactly correct. Quite frankly I am completely, totally, overwhelmingly baffled at the resistance to the forums. Quite a few people have expressed their dislikes of mailing lists and how they were *very* reluctant (like myself) to join. Although I consider my self a developer and on somewhat on top of technical stuff, I still would prefer a web forum. I think that *most* non-technical people would also be more comfortable with a forum. I'm really not sure what the motive for NOT wanting a forum is, other than people being set in their ways and unwilling to accommodate people less technically proficient as they are. Now, the title of this thread is "OK, the forum is coming.." because I thought that someone was going to set one up on at least until FIC/OpenMoko created an official one. I think phpBB is the general consensus. I would do it myself, but my servers are located at my house on a cable modem. I have decent uptime, but it isn't as stable as a box in a noc. I don't mind running it, but would prefer a more stable environment. That said, just let me know if you want me to go ahead and set it up. FYI, you can easily import/export to a different instance if we do want/need to change its location. -Jonathon ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: $3000 roaming Iphone/AT&T story
UPDATE, 12:18PM PT: Dave says, "AT&T just called and agreed to waive all charges due to the 'miscommunication.' I think they have a customer for life now." [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: "http://www.boingboing.net/2007/07/31/att_iphone_intl_roam.html"; I guess that happens if you dont know what you are really charged for when locked into a provider such as AT&T. Even more reason to have an unlocked phone. If you want to unlock the Iphone, all you have is a PDA. It should be clear that the Iphone is a bit dead in the water. Anyway, this definitely helps to justify the wait for the FIC NEO. This looks like to me as if you HAVE TO use AT&T when in Europe!? No wonder it is so expensive to roam. If this is true, the the Iphone is a dead duck for business. Seemingly the poor Iphone users cannot negotiate better deals, why because there is no competition .. only AT&T for the Iphone. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: "Open Source In Mobile (OSiM)" conference, September, Spain
Sean Moss-Pultz wrote: On Jul 12, 2007, at 2:31 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From their website: "The World's Largest Forum for Mobile Linux and Open Source OSiM 2007 responds to the explosive growth of Open Source and Linux integration in mobile devices. It provides the information you require as you enter this complex space; bringing together the key players in this new ecosystem for hundreds of networking and partnership opportunities. http://www.osimconference.com/newt/l/handsetsvision/osim/index.html Anyone going to be there? If there is no official OpenMoko representation, perhaps one of you would organize a BoF? Mickey, Harald, and I will all be there. This will be our one year anniversary where things all began ;-) -Sean ONE YEAR anniversary? You mean this unique idea and the resulting phone have been done in ONE YEAR? I'm stunned Maybe something for the WIKI a history page? When did it start and who where these bright people? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 3G sim cards
fwiw - I have one of the 3g fireball cards that has yet-to-work: 73000 O 4021 cheers, -scott Eric Johnson wrote: Michael Welter wrote: Here is a Cingular pay-as-you-go SIM: 73000G3021 Does that SIM work? It is a Gemalto SIM and to the best of my knowledge is identical to the latest cards from Gemalto apart from the rebranding to AT&T. The new AT&T branded cards should be marked 71234 G 3022 Eric ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: What's the real scope of hardware openness?
i presume bastards = telcos call your congresscritter, explain why spectrum should be licensed off in a fair way, to organisations who won't abuse it. educate people why most current telcos are bad. invent a new, cheap technology that has the features you want and doesn't need at&t to work On 8/7/07, Luca Dionisi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Thanks for your explanation. > > So, what are the current proposal for starting the real revolution? > I'm getting bored and frustrated. :) > > There has to be something that we could do from the > base to get rid of the bastards. > > ___ > OpenMoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
