Re: Possible Camera
These were the batteries i was looking at earlier, does the freerunner have room in the battery compartment from these, I think I may have glanced over the dimensions... With this battery listed you can get a small protection circuit for safety. On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 2:38 PM, Travis Tabbal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 2:00 PM, Robin Paulson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> 2008/6/19 christopher bradski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> > I may do that as well, I also saw a 2000 mah battery that's about should >> fit the case as well. >> >> now that i'd definitely be interested in, whereabouts did you see this? > > > > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8483 > > Does the phone have the proper protection/charging circuitry for bare > li-poly cells? Many of them do, just wondering because if it doesn't, you > run the risk of creating a burning battery of death. :) > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: moko running everything as root
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 4:26 PM, Knight Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The root/user separation is the most fundamental part of a security > policy and here is why. Root is by its nature not only unrestricted but > unrestrictable (I think I just made up a new word). A non-root user can > only destroy the data that user "owns". Now while the conventional > desktop, user "johndoe" owns all his MP3s and pr0n and thus can delete > and otherwise destroy them; on the Moko platform, the extensive use of > DBus makes destruction of the "most important part" more difficult. > > What I'm saying is that (Where possible) a daemon holds the important > data (PIM data, calendar data, etc) and is capable of restricting what > the user can do with it. The user account communicates with this daemon > (via DBus or whatever) and gets the data the user wants while protecting > the same. Both being normal users, they are not allowed to step on each > other, but if the user is root, then someone with malicious intents can > exploit that user account to step on the guardian account, either > causing a DoS (crash) or actually manipulating/destroying data. Actually, I think you've just sold me. I'm thinking about Openmoko a lot like I think of a desktop system (having looked at the way the data is on Om currently) that holds "everything is a file" and while it may be true, from an action perspective passing information through a non-root, non-user daemon exposes that information to the user in a way that's more than simply "dealing with a file". That's the goal of the ASU/zhone and it's a management case I wasn't even thinking of. Tradition bit me in the ass, thanks for spelling that one out for me, I like it a lot. :) > > I guess what I'm actually saying is that moving from an unrestricted > account (root) to a restricted account (user) won't automagically buy us > protection from all data-loss possibilities, but the mindset of moving > to a normal user account is a core principle of a real security > architecture. > > Ideally, something like an SELinux policy would be able to restrict > capabilities without requiring different user accounts to do it (e.g. > anything running as browser_r cannot talk to anything running as sms_r > even though they're the same user). > > And if you're worried about deleting random data, a fairly simple > chown/chmod will protect against that. That stuff doesn't work if the > user you're guarding against is root. > >> That's correct if the data is encrypted but encryption isn't what's >> being tossed around here. If all your data is stored in the clear, and >> an intruder has physical access to the device, the distinctions >> between root and non-root user don't matter. That's what I'm saying. > > That also depends on how long the malicious user has physical access and > how fast the malicious user works. If the malicious user has only a few > minutes and isn't proficient in cracking OM devices, the changes of > damage are less. If the user can't keep good physical control of the > device, then yes, they'll get pwn3d eventually, but no one I know of is > that careless with their phones anymore. Even the non-geeky don't let > their phones out of their sight for more than a few minutes. > > Now I'm not saying that such careless users don't exist, just that > physical access and the root/user differentiation are not the same > problem, and one should not override the other. > > Encryption is another matter, and one I will want addressed before too > long. I've got some ideas on how it can be done, but I'll need to see > more of the OM system "live" before I can begin to decide if my ideas > are feasible or if they need changing. > > -KW > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
Am Mi 18. Juni 2008 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: > i don't think it would be a problem. Simple avr processor can handle > this camera. Yep, handle via I2C, no problem. But what are you going to do with the RGB-data-stream??? > And here we have 400Mhz processor with i2c support. The > question is do we have unused i2c bus to connect this camera? I2C is a bus. You don't have to have a "unused" one, you can share the existing system-wide I2C bus. But we don't have *any* sufficient number of GPIO spare on the CPU that you might use, not to mention there's a camera-interface that's dual-used for other things on FR. So no way to get the actual picture data to video-ram realtime for a viewfinder etc. Suggest: use USB /j signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: moko running everything as root
Knight Walker wrote: > Encryption is another matter, and one I will want addressed before too > long. I've got some ideas on how it can be done, but I'll need to see > more of the OM system "live" before I can begin to decide if my ideas > are feasible or if they need changing. > > -KW > > Encryption is of interest to all and it would be very usefull to start some threads about that once the devices start to trickle out. I agree. Rob ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 2:00 PM, Robin Paulson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 2008/6/19 christopher bradski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > I may do that as well, I also saw a 2000 mah battery that's about should > fit the case as well. > > now that i'd definitely be interested in, whereabouts did you see this? http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8483 Does the phone have the proper protection/charging circuitry for bare li-poly cells? Many of them do, just wondering because if it doesn't, you run the risk of creating a burning battery of death. :) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: bluetooth proximity
Ok, I just got this email twice. Something's definitely funky with the mailing list software. Someone asked to be notified if that happened again. Cheers Dave On Wed, 18 Jun 2008, john wrote: > Saw this at some mobile event: > > http://www.vimeo.com/875097 > > 2008/6/18 Ewan Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> W. B. Kranendonk wrote: >>> --- On Mon, 6/16/08, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> AVee wrote: >> (...) There are a lot of reasons >> why this is not feasible. Sorry. >> > I tend to agree, however, things might change if you > add gps. You'd might just (...) That leaves only the 'exact measurement' to be > solved. > > It might work, but the precision will probably still > be far to low to be > useable for anything. > >>> >>> (absolute position...) But the relative position should be extremely high. (As high as DGPS can get) At least in theory. >>> >>> Thanks for thinking along. >>> >>> What I was thinking of, in a game setting, to use the phone as some sort of >>> hack & slash device. Given my opponent and me are withing reasonable >>> proximity, she with -say- a spear-device, me with a sword or so. She could >>> try stabbing me, while I parry. The devices have to calculate the hit ratio. >>> >>> Would a sound-code offer a possible solution? Could we measure some doppler >>> effect with the built in microphone? >>> >> You'll be better off using the accelerometers... >>> And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she try >>> throwing her spear? :-P >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
i don't think it would be a problem. Simple avr processor can handle this camera. And here we have 400Mhz processor with i2c support. The question is do we have unused i2c bus to connect this camera? On 6/18/08, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Wed, 18 Jun 2008, Alexander Frøyseth wrote: > >> christopher bradski skrev: >>> Good Morning Community, >>> I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at >>> http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. >>> Its a 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and >>> under $10. I'm not an electrical engineer but was wondering how >>> feasible(with some soldering skills and a basic electronic >>> understanding) it would be to attach this the the freerunner? The data >>> sheet is included on the site. Thank you all in advance for your help. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> Openmoko community mailing list >>> community@lists.openmoko.org >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >>> >> I want one :D >> It is not soo important on my Neo, but i want one (or two) jsut to have >> and play with :D >> >> After what I know, you can get raw RGB output. >> Is this true? Or is it a little more complicated? > > Yes, you can get raw RGB output. The best forum I've found for playing > with these cameras is this one: > http://forum.sparkfun.com/viewtopic.php?t=10314&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0&sid=01c7b713e0788e0041b2342368248ef6 > > You can also get JPEG output, which is why I was originally interested > in > it (again, not for my Neo). The main problem you'll probably have with the > camera, though, is that is requires that you clock data out of it at at > least > 8MHz - so your processor needs to be considerably faster than that for you > to > be able to fetch a byte and store it somewhere before it comes time to get > the > next byte. > > - Michael > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: moko running everything as root
On Mon, 2008-06-16 at 14:41 -0400, Kevin Dean wrote: > You dispute that the user data is the most important part of the > mobile device "experience? No one (that I've seen thus far) is arguing that the user data is not the most irreplaceable (and to the user, important) part of a mobile device. What most everyone seems to be arguing is that running EVERYTHING as root for convenience is opening us up to a world of possibilities, all of them bad. > My previous e-mail has been clear - I WANT security on the device. > However, I simply don't beleive that the root/user seperation is the > most important consideration in that regard. You tossed out some great > security ideas, onces I'd personally put time into doing on my own > device, but with all due respect, you're saying my statements are > "nonsense" and then offering solutions that (while they work) aren't > what I was saying. Protecting user data is key so encryption and a > built-in, fully automated backup system is somethign I think would be > a GREAT thing to have. But it doesn't refute my point at all - a > non-root user can destroy the most critical part of the system and > doesn't need root to do it. Implimenting a root/user seperation itself > doesn't mitigate this risk. I agree that this risk needs to be > mitigated, I simply don't believe that the root/user split does much > to lessen the risks. The root/user separation is the most fundamental part of a security policy and here is why. Root is by its nature not only unrestricted but unrestrictable (I think I just made up a new word). A non-root user can only destroy the data that user "owns". Now while the conventional desktop, user "johndoe" owns all his MP3s and pr0n and thus can delete and otherwise destroy them; on the Moko platform, the extensive use of DBus makes destruction of the "most important part" more difficult. What I'm saying is that (Where possible) a daemon holds the important data (PIM data, calendar data, etc) and is capable of restricting what the user can do with it. The user account communicates with this daemon (via DBus or whatever) and gets the data the user wants while protecting the same. Both being normal users, they are not allowed to step on each other, but if the user is root, then someone with malicious intents can exploit that user account to step on the guardian account, either causing a DoS (crash) or actually manipulating/destroying data. I guess what I'm actually saying is that moving from an unrestricted account (root) to a restricted account (user) won't automagically buy us protection from all data-loss possibilities, but the mindset of moving to a normal user account is a core principle of a real security architecture. Ideally, something like an SELinux policy would be able to restrict capabilities without requiring different user accounts to do it (e.g. anything running as browser_r cannot talk to anything running as sms_r even though they're the same user). And if you're worried about deleting random data, a fairly simple chown/chmod will protect against that. That stuff doesn't work if the user you're guarding against is root. > That's correct if the data is encrypted but encryption isn't what's > being tossed around here. If all your data is stored in the clear, and > an intruder has physical access to the device, the distinctions > between root and non-root user don't matter. That's what I'm saying. That also depends on how long the malicious user has physical access and how fast the malicious user works. If the malicious user has only a few minutes and isn't proficient in cracking OM devices, the changes of damage are less. If the user can't keep good physical control of the device, then yes, they'll get pwn3d eventually, but no one I know of is that careless with their phones anymore. Even the non-geeky don't let their phones out of their sight for more than a few minutes. Now I'm not saying that such careless users don't exist, just that physical access and the root/user differentiation are not the same problem, and one should not override the other. Encryption is another matter, and one I will want addressed before too long. I've got some ideas on how it can be done, but I'll need to see more of the OM system "live" before I can begin to decide if my ideas are feasible or if they need changing. -KW ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm
The vote is closed. We decided to use 3.5mm. Please see original thread! /jOERG signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
2008/6/19 christopher bradski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > I may do that as well, I also saw a 2000 mah battery that's about should fit > the case as well. now that i'd definitely be interested in, whereabouts did you see this? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: bluetooth proximity
Saw this at some mobile event: http://www.vimeo.com/875097 2008/6/18 Ewan Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > W. B. Kranendonk wrote: >> --- On Mon, 6/16/08, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >>> AVee wrote: >>> > (...) There are a lot of reasons > why this is not feasible. Sorry. > I tend to agree, however, things might change if you >>> add gps. You'd might just (...) That leaves only the >>> 'exact measurement' to be >>> solved. It might work, but the precision will probably still >>> be far to low to be >>> useable for anything. >> >> >>> (absolute position...) But the >>> relative position should be extremely high. (As high as >>> DGPS can get) >>> >>> At least in theory. >>> >> >> Thanks for thinking along. >> >> What I was thinking of, in a game setting, to use the phone as some sort of >> hack & slash device. Given my opponent and me are withing reasonable >> proximity, she with -say- a spear-device, me with a sword or so. She could >> try stabbing me, while I parry. The devices have to calculate the hit ratio. >> >> Would a sound-code offer a possible solution? Could we measure some doppler >> effect with the built in microphone? >> > You'll be better off using the accelerometers... >> And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she try >> throwing her spear? :-P > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
On 18 Jun 2008, at 12:45, Ewan Marshall wrote: > ... > Also how do you get unread message notification on forums? > ... forums only do whole threads, not individual post in thread. I've started using a new forum recently, there being no mailing-lists I can find for this particular subject, and am reminded how damned irritating this is. The forum software shows which threads have new messages, but when I click on them I'm shown the whole page of upto 40 messages. I scroll through them and find something interesting, only to realise that I already read that message yesterday. I then have to scroll all the way to the bottom of the page to work out which messages within the thread are new. If the thread is a long one I have to then go to the next page & do the same thing again. This is the fundamental failing of forums, IMO, but the lack of automatic quoting is also a considerable hindrance. As the thread drifts away from the original topic you can't tell who is replying to whom. It is impossible to know what someone is referring to when they make a short post such as "I have that one too, and it's great" - is it the original device described in the message topic, or the alternative suggested by Dave a few posts in? I wanted to vent my dislike of forums when Leonti posted his first message over a week ago, but refrained because I knew I could easily spend an hour detailing all forums' shortcomings and because I knew that many others would contribute and save me the bother. These two points are a good summary of what pisses me off most about forums, though. Stroller. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[no subject]
Tilman Baumann wrote: >W. B. Kranendonk wrote: >> And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she >try throwing her spear? :-P > >The weakest link is the screen. :p With the invisible shield screen protector it should be as well protected as the leading edge of a helicopter blade :-). Devices with a screen protector could get a 1d6 defensive bonus :P. There would be some practical obstacles though, like walls (unless your spear-throwing arch nemesis can pierce walls or cars with her weapon). When in the open you could use maps to check if there is a normally unobstructed path between you two, but even than the freerunner can’t know if there are cars/waste bins that give you “protection”. Maybe you could overcome this obstacle by using a (usb) infrared receiver? Infrared won’t penetrate obstacles, so when hiding behind a corner you will be safe. I’m not a programmer, but I think it will be very easy: -insert a usb infrared receiver in the neo -hack/slash/throw/cast with a standard tv remote (assign attacks to different buttons on your remote, e.g. 1 is block, 2 is sword attack, 3 is spear, 4 is bow...) -Bluetooth can send the information about you and your stats (hp, armor, weapons, combat modifiers, active spells...) and your opponents freerunner will calculate the amount of damage you inflict with your chosen attack. It then sends that information through Bluetooth to your freerunner. And you can see what damage that you do and the hp the adversary has left. -When you have weapons that can overcome obstacles (railguns combined with x-ray vision, bazookas penetrating walls, you throw the grenade around the corner, use a tactical nuke….) or spells that don’t require your enemy to be in sight you can use the Bluetooth or GPS method. Another nice feature is that you can play your game inside a building, even when there is no GPS. LIRC is a package that allows you to decode and send infra-red signals of many (but not all) commonly used remote controls. http://www.lirc.org/ an IR dongle costs only a few dollar on e-bay hope you found this useful y _ Download Messenger op je mobiel! http://www.windowslivemobile.msn.com/nl/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
bluetooth proximity
Tilman Baumann wrote: >W. B. Kranendonk wrote: >> And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she >try throwing her spear? :-P > >The weakest link is the screen. :p With the invisible shield screen protector it should be as well protected as the leading edge of a helicopter blade :-). Devices with a screen protector could get a 1d6 defensive bonus :P. There would be some practical obstacles though, like walls (unless your spear-throwing arch nemesis can pierce walls or cars with her weapon). When in the open you could use maps to check if there is a normally unobstructed path between you two, but even than the freerunner can’t know if there are cars/waste bins that give you “protection”. Maybe you could overcome this obstacle by using a (usb) infrared receiver/emittor? Infrared won’t penetrate obstacles, so when hiding behind a corner you will be safe. I’m not a programmer, but I think it will be very easy: -insert a usb infrared receiver in the neo -hack/slash/throw/cast with a standard tv remote (assign attacks to different buttons on your remote, e.g. 1 is block, 2 is sword attack, 3 is spear, 4 is bow...) -Bluetooth can send the information about you and your stats (hp, armor, weapons, combat modifiers, active spells...) and your opponents freerunner will calculate the amount of damage you inflict with your chosen attack. It then sends that information through Bluetooth to your freerunner. And you can see what damage that you do and the hp the adversary has left. -When you have weapons that can overcome obstacles (railguns combined with x-ray vision, bazookas penetrating walls, you throw the grenade around the corner, use a tactical nuke….) or spells that don’t require your enemy to be in sight you can use the Bluetooth or GPS method. Another nice feature is that you can play your game inside a building, even when there is no GPS. LIRC is a package that allows you to decode and send infra-red signals of many (but not all) commonly used remote controls. http://www.lirc.org/ an IR dongle costs only a few dollar on e-bay hope you found this useful y ps: irda can also transmit, but it seemed safer/more practical to be swinging around and aiming with a remote than with a freerunner to me. But come to think of it, it would be handy when you attach the freerunner to your wrist in a way that the usb port points away when looking at the freerunner like you would when looking at your watch. That way you can easly aim, give input (touchscreen) and read the data. _ Probeer Live Search: de zoekmachine van de makers van MSN! http://www.live.com/?searchOnly=true___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: bluetooth proximity
Tilman Baumann wrote: > Deamons that trigger events when a bloetooth device comes in range have > already been implemented. In Ubuntu and Fedora, check out "blueproximity" -- you sync your bluetooth device with your PC, and set a proximity level in feet (1..30) and when the device goes out of range for a preset number of seconds, it launches a locked screen saver. When the device comes back into range for another preset amount of seconds, the screensaver is deactivated. It's pretty handy in secure environments -- I just implemented it yesterday with both my Blackberry and Samsung Blackjack2, and it works fine -- I haven't tried it with the Freerunner yet. I imagine someone could port the code to the OpenMoko platform easily enough... then you'd just need to pair the two Freerunners with each other. I don't know whether "sword fighting" would be feasible due to signal processing and calculating distance in a fast-paced environment. -id ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner wallpaper
-1 :( Let's just share! :) Michele Renda escribió: what to make a contest? :) Dale Schumacher wrote: I thought I would share some inspirational (to me at least) wallpaper that may actually have some practical value as well. I would enjoy seeing other Openmoko-inspired wallpaper designs. I hope you enjoy mine. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wallpaper ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
christopher bradski skrev: > Good Morning Community, > I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. > Its a 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and > under $10. I'm not an electrical engineer but was wondering how > feasible(with some soldering skills and a basic electronic > understanding) it would be to attach this the the freerunner? The data > sheet is included on the site. Thank you all in advance for your help. > > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > I want one :D It is not soo important on my Neo, but i want one (or two) jsut to have and play with :D After what I know, you can get raw RGB output. Is this true? Or is it a little more complicated? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: bluetooth proximity
W. B. Kranendonk wrote: > And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she try throwing her spear? :-P The weakest link is the screen. :p -- Drucken Sie diese Mail bitte nur auf Recyclingpapier aus. Please print this mail only on recycled paper. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SMT is running!
Hi steve, what relese from the Freerunner ist now in massproduction? I asked becaus in the wiki http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_GTA02_Hardware#GTA02v6 is some important info about the different vom the GTA02v5 to the GTA02v6 / "Add GSM IR resistor for better GSM deep sleep" /What version i buy now, when the shop opens? gta02v5 or gta02v6? Thanks for your answer Greets Einstein steve wrote: > > So I got word from the factory that we have our date. > > And we got the line. > > And parts are being planted on boards this week. > > I know it's been a long wait for everybody, but the stone is almost to the > top of the hill. > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GSM Layer 3 Tracing
On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 10:20:41AM +0200, Thomas Jund wrote: > Does the TI Calypso chipset support GSM Layer 3 tracing (AT Command)? yes. > Is there a specification available to decode the Layer 3 trace from TI? yes. Under NDA :( -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: bluetooth proximity
W. B. Kranendonk wrote: > --- On Mon, 6/16/08, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> AVee wrote: >> (...) There are a lot of reasons why this is not feasible. Sorry. >>> I tend to agree, however, things might change if you >>> >> add gps. You'd might just (...) That leaves only the >> 'exact measurement' to be >> >>> solved. >>> >>> It might work, but the precision will probably still >>> >> be far to low to be >> >>> useable for anything. >>> > > >> (absolute position...) But the >> relative position should be extremely high. (As high as >> DGPS can get) >> >> At least in theory. >> > > Thanks for thinking along. > > What I was thinking of, in a game setting, to use the phone as some sort of > hack & slash device. Given my opponent and me are withing reasonable > proximity, she with -say- a spear-device, me with a sword or so. She could > try stabbing me, while I parry. The devices have to calculate the hit ratio. > > Would a sound-code offer a possible solution? Could we measure some doppler > effect with the built in microphone? > You'll be better off using the accelerometers... > And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she try > throwing her spear? :-P ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: moko running everything as root
When I think about it, I realize that it is important that the device is secure to use on a network. Someday the Openmoko devices will support stuff like flash, java, java script and much more. When this device connects to the Internet, and the client on the device runs as an unprivileged user, the security risks are dramatically reduced. The users data can be devided into two categories: normal and sensitive. The sensitive data can be protected in some way (only accessable to the superuser or on an encrypted place). What about the 4 users model: root: - only for root stuff superuser: - for accessing sensitive/personal data - may be encrypted normal: - the normal user mode nobody: - restricted - cannot run sudo - can not do any harm to the system - no direct hardware access - can not access sensitive data - should be used for untrusted things (games & network) If the device owner wants less security, it is just to log in as superuser or even root. With this kind of setup, the freedom of choice belongs to the user. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Freerunner wallpaper
what to make a contest? :) Dale Schumacher wrote: > I thought I would share some inspirational (to me at least) wallpaper > that may actually have some practical value as well. I would enjoy > seeing other Openmoko-inspired wallpaper designs. I hope you enjoy mine. > > http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wallpaper > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Freerunner wallpaper
I thought I would share some inspirational (to me at least) wallpaper that may actually have some practical value as well. I would enjoy seeing other Openmoko-inspired wallpaper designs. I hope you enjoy mine. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wallpaper ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Sony's WII phone - bluetooth proximity
http://www.physorg.com/news132919041.html Copy cats.. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of W. B. Kranendonk Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 7:14 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: bluetooth proximity --- On Mon, 6/16/08, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > AVee wrote: > >> (...) There are a lot of reasons > >> why this is not feasible. Sorry. > > > > I tend to agree, however, things might change if you > add gps. You'd might just (...) That leaves only the > 'exact measurement' to be > > solved. > > > > It might work, but the precision will probably still > be far to low to be > > useable for anything. > (absolute position...) But the > relative position should be extremely high. (As high as > DGPS can get) > > At least in theory. Thanks for thinking along. What I was thinking of, in a game setting, to use the phone as some sort of hack & slash device. Given my opponent and me are withing reasonable proximity, she with -say- a spear-device, me with a sword or so. She could try stabbing me, while I parry. The devices have to calculate the hit ratio. Would a sound-code offer a possible solution? Could we measure some doppler effect with the built in microphone? And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she try throwing her spear? :-P ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 5:40 AM, christopher bradski < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Good Morning Community, > I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. Its a > 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and under $10. I'm > not an electrical engineer but was wondering how feasible(with some > soldering skills and a basic electronic understanding) it would be to attach > this the the freerunner? The data sheet is included on the site. Thank you > all in advance for your help. I took a quick look at the datasheet. You need an 8 bit parallel data port and I2C to control it. Does freerunner even have enough pins available to attempt an interface? I'm not sure what we have available in terms of expansion ports. I also seem to remember some talk in the sparkfun forums about it needing to clock the data out high enough speeds that microcontrollers have trouble keeping up. I know the Freerunner CPU is a lot faster than a normal micro, but it's also busy doing other things. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
> just expressing my interest in this thread. Replying for the same reason. I was comparing the phone with the PCB, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Menu9.jpg with http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Gta02a5_pcba_cs.JPG , and it seems that there is quite "not a lot" of space left. The site got a link to such a nice datasheet (http://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/Sensors/Imaging/TCM8240MD.pdf); it seems not up to date though: the last page (30) states: "Reference Drawing Module shape is not finalized yet in detail. Following drawings are only reference for initial study. " The properties say it is a document from somewhere in 2004, so you'd say we're on the safe side then. The numbers are not so easy to read, do you also read the total height of the module is 7 mm? Anyway, it seems interesting. Boudewijn > > On 6/18/08, christopher bradski > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Good Morning Community, > > I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos > camera at > > > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. > Its a > > 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much > current draw and under $10. I'm > > not an electrical engineer but was wondering how > feasible(with some > > soldering skills and a basic electronic understanding) > it would be to attach > > this the the freerunner? The data sheet is included on > the site. Thank you > > all in advance for your help. > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: When it will be possible to buy OpenMoko?
Well, he is not from China and he is in Brazil. He will not work on any software stuff but HW. He is working on a new case for the Freerunner though. Those who have writen with ideas for a different case might want to send him an email.His name is Abel Chang. an this is his email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] But hell yeah! some of them have landed! Cheers! Kosa - Un mundo mejor es posible - Andy Selby escribió: There was a post on engadget mobile that suggested some have been released. I cant find it, you got a link? On Sunday 15 June 2008 00:03, steve wrote: I'm not exactly sure. I havent asked if they have a continous process or if they build a bunch of PCB and then assemble. Like, build a thousand, assemble a thousand, etc. I know some shipments (university customers) have already landed. Could you explain what you meant by that last sentence? In the neofreerunner thread on the device owners list a guy from china explains that he bought one for a university project, there are pics of it as well. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
I may do that as well, I also saw a 2000 mah battery that's about should fit the case as well. The camera, if I remember correctly might be able to be used one the i2c bus? Well off to work, ill do some research later. Thank you for expressing interest. :) Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 12:35:47 To:"List for Openmoko community discussion" Subject: Re: Possible Camera I was thinking about soldering camera myself(also I will try to change 2.5 jack to 3.5). just expressing my interest in this thread. On 6/18/08, christopher bradski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Good Morning Community, > I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. Its a > 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and under $10. I'm > not an electrical engineer but was wondering how feasible(with some > soldering skills and a basic electronic understanding) it would be to attach > this the the freerunner? The data sheet is included on the site. Thank you > all in advance for your help. > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
On Wed, June 18, 2008 12:40 pm, christopher bradski wrote: > Good Morning Community, > I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. Its a > 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and under $10. > I'm > not an electrical engineer but was wondering how feasible(with some > soldering skills and a basic electronic understanding) it would be to > attach > this the the freerunner? The data sheet is included on the site. Thank you > all in advance for your help. I assume you are thinking of building a small daughter board with the camera on, connecting that board to the freerunner mainboard somehow, and mounting the camera in a modded case? I would say your chances of adding one to an existing freerunner is quite slim. The freerunner has an I2C bus to control it so that part would be easy, but it looks like it needs an 8 bit I/O port to get the picture data out, and I don't think the freerunner has an accessable one you could tap into. Also the whole camera is surface mount, which would make it fairly tricky to mount on your daughter board. None of these things would prevent a camera like this being included in a future OpenMoko design, but don't think it would be possible for anyone to add a camera like this to an existing phone. If you want a working camera on your freerunner, then I suggest you look for one that connects via USB, as that is a much easer bus to connect to. -- David Pottage Error compiling committee.c To many arguments to function. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Possible Camera
I was thinking about soldering camera myself(also I will try to change 2.5 jack to 3.5). just expressing my interest in this thread. On 6/18/08, christopher bradski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Good Morning Community, > I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. Its a > 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and under $10. I'm > not an electrical engineer but was wondering how feasible(with some > soldering skills and a basic electronic understanding) it would be to attach > this the the freerunner? The data sheet is included on the site. Thank you > all in advance for your help. > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm
I vote for 3.5 mm too. My reasons: 1. There is 4-rings standard(good example is computer headfons with mic - it would be cool to be able to use it with OM). 2. I use handsfree more often to listen to music than to talk. my point - it's better to have an adaptor on handsfree and use it when you need it and be able to use any headphones to listen to music than to have special headphones or adaptor all the time with OM On 6/17/08, Dotan Cohen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 2008/6/17 Mike Hodson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> I also vote for the 4 conductor 3.5mm jack. >> > > I vote for the same. There is already a standard headphone jack, and > has been for over 30 years. Use it. > > Dotan Cohen > > http://what-is-what.com > http://gibberish.co.il > א-ב-ג-ד-ה-ו-ז-ח-ט-י-ך-כ-ל-ם-מ-ן-נ-ס-ע-ף-פ-ץ-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת > > A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. > Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum?
Crane, Matthew wrote: > That's debatable. > > If the average user reads a small set of messages. If the forum is > easily cached by a browser. If the mail readers use gmail or similar > and already download ads everytime they view a messsage. > > But yea the dvd comment was kind of stupid. > > Matt > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andy Powell > Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 12:10 PM > To: community@lists.openmoko.org > Subject: Re: Why not use forum? > > On Friday 13 June 2008 13:07, Crane, Matthew wrote: > > Matt, > > there's a lot more crap transferred when using a forum (graphics + html > + the > actual message) than when using a mail client. The main disadvantage is > that > you have to be online to read a forum. For email you don't. > > Your DVD comment is irrelavant. > > Have you written forum software? If so you'll know it's not easily cached at all. Also how do you get unread message notification on forums? With mail your clients can store whether you have read a message or not for every message (it is a distributed system so you only have yours to worry about), a forum has to do it for every user and every message... Most allow admin to set a hard limit timewise, but you yourself may want older messages marked as read... Also forums only do whole threads, not individual post in thread. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Possible Camera
Good Morning Community, I was browsing around the other day and found a cmos camera at http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8668. Its a 1.3 mega pixel camera and doesn't have much current draw and under $10. I'm not an electrical engineer but was wondering how feasible(with some soldering skills and a basic electronic understanding) it would be to attach this the the freerunner? The data sheet is included on the site. Thank you all in advance for your help. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: "tossing" contacts / bluetooth proximity
> (Macross tossing...) > Would be a cool application of the gesture project. The > receiver would > have to catch, not exactly at the same time, in order to > confirm > receipt. > > Possibly incompatible with consumption of buttered > toast. Hey, that app would also enable my opponent to throw her spear! Boudewijn ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: bluetooth proximity
--- On Mon, 6/16/08, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > AVee wrote: > >> (...) There are a lot of reasons > >> why this is not feasible. Sorry. > > > > I tend to agree, however, things might change if you > add gps. You'd might just (...) That leaves only the > 'exact measurement' to be > > solved. > > > > It might work, but the precision will probably still > be far to low to be > > useable for anything. > (absolute position...) But the > relative position should be extremely high. (As high as > DGPS can get) > > At least in theory. Thanks for thinking along. What I was thinking of, in a game setting, to use the phone as some sort of hack & slash device. Given my opponent and me are withing reasonable proximity, she with -say- a spear-device, me with a sword or so. She could try stabbing me, while I parry. The devices have to calculate the hit ratio. Would a sound-code offer a possible solution? Could we measure some doppler effect with the built in microphone? And, on a side note... How impact proof will the phone be, might she try throwing her spear? :-P ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Maxima port
Milos Mandaric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Hi list, > > Would it be possible to run maxima on openmoko? Probably once I get clisp working. I'm still working on this, but I've been sidetracked with other stuff for a few weeks. I've finally found time for working on this again, and should have an installable clisp package in a week or two (step one: get some work I did on mcclim merged, step two: figure out how to generate the clisp lisp core in a bitbake postinstall hook, step three: merge patches to ffcall I received that should fix the FFI, step four: package up common-lisp-controller/clisp/asdf/ffcall properly and setup an opkg repo ...). Do you know if Maxima needs CFFI? If not it should be fine otherwise it may be a while if the ffcall patches I have don't work. -- And did those feet in ancient time Walk upon England's mountains green? And was the holy Lamb of God On England's pleasant pastures seen? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: quemu w/ gat02
> In short, qemu (now) isn't capable to emulate gta02, just gta01. i remember having read somewhere that qemu could be patched. there's a gta02 patch somewhere in the svn -- but it's not clear to me which purpose it serves. furthermore i think i could start qemu with gta02fake with the gtk-based images, since asu gta02fake fails complaining about mtdsomething. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: handwriting recognition?
Am Dienstag, 17. Juni 2008 schrieb Martin Šenkeřík: > Once I have OpenMoko, I surely try this: http://risujin.org/cellwriter/ Just tried it on my desktop and I am impressed. Definitely recommended for integration into OpenMoko. regards, Andreas Micklei P.s. Hello list. I subscribed just a few days ago. :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: quemu w/ gat02
Wilkinson, Alex wrote: > 0n Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 09:26:20AM +0400, Evgeny Ginzburg wrote: > > >arne anka wrote: > >> using openmoko/download.sh i always get the gta01 files. now i changed > > >> "gta01" in openmoko/env to gta02 or gta02fake and the gta02 files are > >> downloaded -- but flash.sh fails horribly while printing > >> s3c_nand_read: Bad register 0x20 > >> infinitely. > >> google shows two irc-logs with a question regarding this, but no > answer. > >> could somebody please give a hint how to get qemu running w/ gta02 asu? > >> > >In short, qemu (now) isn't capable to emulate gta02, just gta01. > >You can build and use ASU images on qemu. There is no big difference > >between two versions. > > Has anyone written up the process on how to to emulate ASU on Qemu ? > Hm, I just use Mokomakefile: make update-makefile make update setup make openmoko-devel-image # OR make qtopia-x11 make flash-qemu-local make run-qemu * notice I haven't tried it for a week or something like this. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: quemu w/ gat02
0n Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 09:26:20AM +0400, Evgeny Ginzburg wrote: >arne anka wrote: >> using openmoko/download.sh i always get the gta01 files. now i changed >> "gta01" in openmoko/env to gta02 or gta02fake and the gta02 files are >> downloaded -- but flash.sh fails horribly while printing >> s3c_nand_read: Bad register 0x20 >> infinitely. >> google shows two irc-logs with a question regarding this, but no answer. >> could somebody please give a hint how to get qemu running w/ gta02 asu? >> >In short, qemu (now) isn't capable to emulate gta02, just gta01. >You can build and use ASU images on qemu. There is no big difference >between two versions. Has anyone written up the process on how to to emulate ASU on Qemu ? -aW IMPORTANT: This email remains the property of the Australian Defence Organisation and is subject to the jurisdiction of section 70 of the CRIMES ACT 1914. If you have received this email in error, you are requested to contact the sender and delete the email. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
