Re: [Gta04-owner] Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community
On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 07:38:13AM +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote: > Wow, > this is a really impressive list with new ideas > I have not yet heard of! > > And the most interesting thing is that I think > almost all can be done and don't have major > technical hurdles to overcome. The main > challenge is to make them user friendly > and bug free. > > It appears that we more have a lack of active > developers doing it. And are missing some > coordination to get a complete solution. I fully agree on this. From distro mainainer POV, we (SHR) have many small but usefull apps which were contributed by someone at "gta02 times" and there is no upstream for them since then. So just to keep those apps in feed we have to update them to be compatible with newer glib/gcc/efl/whatever. That takes a lot of time which could be spent better and also all those apps have some bugs or needs for improvements but nobody is actively working on them anymore :/. Similar situation is with browsers as Denis mentioned.. there is quite a few browsers available each with some issues, but those should be mostly reported upstream and fixed there as we IMHO shouldn't work on just another browser, because some doesn't support armv4t (firefox) some are segfaulting or lack some feature we would like to see... I'm trying to keep them up2date in feeds and hoping that each new version will fix few bugs... > Maybe we should again think about a more > formal organization of the Openmoko.org > (software) project? > > Some Foundation or Association? I'm not sure about this, because I don't know why so many developers left or haven't joined :/ some say they have different interests now or that they are not using those devices anymore.. but now *why*. Maybe something like GSOC would help, users voting for features like Benjamin listed and then proposed them as GSOC projects. I don't know what are requirements for tutors etc.. just an idea. Cheers, > Nikolaus > > > Am 30.04.2012 um 00:59 schrieb Benjamin Deering: > > > The infrared thermometer on my GTA02 has been very useful and it is not > > something that the iphone guys have. I will probably not be doing any > > soldering on my GTA04 for a while, but it might be something interesting to > > add to GTA05. > > > > I think the BMP085 in GTA04 is something the iphone guys don't have. > > Getting some clues for the upcoming weather is very useful when you are > > completely without signal. > > > > A threaded/prepared camera hole for attaching a microscope or telescope > > lense would be nice. > > > > This is probably best done over USB, but it could be done over an I2C adc > > converter > >volt-meter > >ph meter > >ohm-meter > > > > > > GPS that reliably gets a fix and displays in an app such as foxtrotgps > > while driving and hiking. I can wake the phone from suspend and find our > > location on the map before my friends who are using a paper map.(GTA02 does > > not do this) > > > > GPS app is able to download map tiles from my home server if I find myself > > outside of the area I planned to be (GTA02 does this) > > > > Phone tracks barometric pressure overnight while camping to give an > > indication of the upcoming day's weather. (my GTA02 does this, most do not, > > GTA04 does) > > > > Phone is able to play pre-downloaded podcasts or radio over headphones or > > speakers in the evening(GTA02 does half of this - headphone issues) > > > > Finger-friendly email(qtmoko does this, noone else has it yet) > > > > A web browser that works well enough to buy something online using the > > phone (from a site where I have not purchased before) (noone has this yet) > > > > While driving I can hand the phone to a passenger who is tech-savvy but not > > familiar with openmoko. They are able to wake, unlock, dial, start gps, > > start browser without much coaching from me. (qtmoko is closest, but noone > > has this yet) > > > > I take the phone from my pocket, wake it up, and take a picture faster than > > I can take off and open my backpack, take out my real camera, and take a > > picture. (not sure if anyone has this) > > > > I can enable an option so the phone makes noise when it associates with a > > tower(noone has this) > > > > I can reliably write an SMS, click send, and know it will be sent next time > > the phone has signal(I don't think anyone has this) > > > > I can enable Wifi tethering that a friend with a non-linux laptop can > > use(noone has this) > > > > I can keep most of my data on a dmcrypt partition that is decrypted after > > entering a pin in a gui login screen(noone has this) > > > > I can boot from NAND into an OS that runs at low brightness with everything > > but GSM turned off, access to contacts on my SIM, a dialer, ability to > > answer, SMS (aurora is working on this) > > > > Turn off the tv at my table at the resturaunt using IR (limited range is ok > > - the TV is at my table, not accross the bar)
Re: [Gta04-owner] Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community
Hi, Can we do such discussion please in only one mailing-list; it really does not help sending every message twice :-) I propose using Thanks matthias -- Matthias Apitz e - w http://www.unixarea.de/ UNIX since V7 on PDP-11, UNIX on mainframe since ESER 1055 (IBM /370) UNIX on x86 since SVR4.2 UnixWare 2.1.2, FreeBSD since 2.2.5 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community
On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 07:38:13 +0200 "Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller" wrote: > Wow, > this is a really impressive list with new ideas > I have not yet heard of! > > And the most interesting thing is that I think > almost all can be done and don't have major > technical hurdles to overcome. The main > challenge is to make them user friendly > and bug free. > > It appears that we more have a lack of active > developers doing it. And are missing some > coordination to get a complete solution. > > Maybe we should again think about a more > formal organization of the Openmoko.org > (software) project? > > Some Foundation or Association? What benefit would a Foundation or Association bring? I think they bring value in co-ordination when you have lots of people who are finding it difficult to work together. But I don't think that is the problem that we have. As you said: "lack of active developers". What can we do to encourage those developers that we do have, and to entice some on-lookers who aren't developers yet but might be in the future? Maybe instead of asking "what would you like to see" (which certainly does have a place) we should be asking something more down to earth, immediate, and practical. - what are you working on? - what have you recently achieved? - what one thing would you like help with? For myself: I'm mostly working on aligning the kernel we use with the upstream kernel. I recently submitted a collection of patches upstream and am hoping some will stick. I've recently discovered that my approach to power-management for wifi and bluetooth is less than perfect. Among other things it doesn't actually set the voltage properly, so we are running on 2.8V rather than 3.1V. I think I know how to fix it though. I recently tried 3.4-rc4 on my GTA04 and it was less than a brilliant success. No sound cards appear and the X server keeps crashing. I would love it if someone else had a look You can find the code in the 'gta04/mainline' branch of g...@github.com:neilbrown/linux.git NeilBrown signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community
Am 01.05.2012 um 05:46 schrieb NeilBrown: > On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 07:38:13 +0200 "Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller" > wrote: > >> Wow, >> this is a really impressive list with new ideas >> I have not yet heard of! >> >> And the most interesting thing is that I think >> almost all can be done and don't have major >> technical hurdles to overcome. The main >> challenge is to make them user friendly >> and bug free. >> >> It appears that we more have a lack of active >> developers doing it. And are missing some >> coordination to get a complete solution. >> >> Maybe we should again think about a more >> formal organization of the Openmoko.org >> (software) project? >> >> Some Foundation or Association? > > What benefit would a Foundation or Association bring? > I think they bring value in co-ordination when you have lots of people who > are finding it difficult to work together. But I don't think that is the > problem that we have. As you said: "lack of active developers". Hm. I think we *have* a problem finding people to work together. Is there a roadmap? Are there big visible and coordinated activities to recruit new developers on big events like FOSDEM, LinuxTag etc.? I think a foundation/association can help here because it has the ability to collect some money and distribute to specific efforts. And can elect persons to do something... Currently, all developers (and marketeers) are pure volunteers driven by their own agenda. Although this allows impressive progress in some areas just because it is not coordinated (like your or Radek's work) it has limits if we want to maintain and improve the overall quality of the software stacks. And get the visibility of e.g. Debian or Suse. I regularily hear complaints that the (user space) software isn't complete, is broken in areas that had been working before, important features are missing etc. Well, this mailing lists are one means of collecting such complaints and making it known to (potential) developers. But I can imagine another level of development process, i.e. hackathons (hosted by some Openmoko association or foundation and sponsored by donations). But usually good developers aren't that good in organizing such events. And vice versa. It has also been suggested to me that Golden Delicious Comp. should take such a role (like Openmoko. Inc. did have) - but I am hesitating. I see the role of GDC to provide future open hardware but remain software agnostic, i.e. completely open. And some of our community software is hardware agnostic (well, to some degree). E.g. SHR runs on several different platforms. This IMHO excludes such a leadership role. > > What can we do to encourage those developers that we do have, and to entice > some on-lookers who aren't developers yet but might be in the future? Such an organization could give more visibility. It can give some "empowerment" if someone becomes elected as project leader. Maybe even provide some financial compensation (e.g. for travel expenses, free participation in Hackathons). Finally, who is the person for press contacts? If someone wants to write an article about Openmoko software - whom to contact first place? But overall: we (and new users and developers) must feel that it is important for mankind that we are member of this community (being formal or informal) and contribute. > > Maybe instead of asking "what would you like to see" (which certainly does > have a place) we should be asking something more down to earth, immediate, > and practical. > > - what are you working on? > - what have you recently achieved? > - what one thing would you like help with? > > For myself: > I'm mostly working on aligning the kernel we use with the upstream kernel. > I recently submitted a collection of patches upstream and am hoping > some will stick. ++ > I've recently discovered that my approach to power-management for wifi > and bluetooth is less than perfect. Among other things it doesn't actually > set the voltage properly, so we are running on 2.8V rather than 3.1V. I > think I know how to fix it though. 2.8V is a little low which reduces transmission power. But on the GTA04A4 you can't set the voltage any more. It has a fixed 3.3V LDO. > I recently tried 3.4-rc4 on my GTA04 and it was less than a brilliant > success. No sound cards appear and the X server keeps crashing. I would love > it if someone else had a look You can find the code in the > 'gta04/mainline' branch of g...@github.com:neilbrown/linux.git > > NeilBrown Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
