Re: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
when we are at it, limiting calls to only certain numbers is a standard GSM feature, it's just seldom used, as most people just forget their PIN2 ;) Andreas * Dean Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] [070227 10:41]: Took 4 minutes of googling to find both Cingular and Verizon have kids phones and restricted access plans. Stop your bitching and go save the world. Cingular's FireFly phone has buttons for preprogrammed phone numbers for Mom and Dad, along with a button for 911 emergencies. Up to 20 additional numbers can also be programmed into the phone. Verizon's Migo phone from LG also offers a dedicated emergency button, along with four buttons that parents can program. Even though the big carriers' services and phones don't match the functionality of newcomer Disney Mobile, they still may have an edge over Disney. For one, most parents who'd even consider buying a cell phone for their kids are already customers of one of the big cell phone companies. It might be easier and more cost-effective for them to wait for new features to be added to their current provider's packages. Limits on kids Parents can designate the times when a kid can call particular numbers or play games. With TicTalk, Mom and Dad can also limit the number of minutes for calls to certain numbers - say to a best friend. As with Firefly, the phone operates on the GSM cellular network. For some reason, the unit I had never properly updated the time. TicTalk costs $99, plus a $10 activation fee. An hour of prepaid talk is $15. The phone is available online now and in stores by year's end. Regards, Dean Collins -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:community- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 26 February 2007 6:27 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) Dean... Its been a while since I looked, but I do stand corrected. The Disney plan indeed launched last June. The Disney plan is not, however prepaid, and worse, it is Disney, the folks who bought and paid for our Sonny Bono Copyright Tem Extension Act. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonny_Bono_Copyright_Term_Extension_Act Which, of course, puts them on my List. Thanks again. Alan Original Message: - From: Dean Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:35:21 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. Alan, Totally incorrect, this was one of the main themes behind the Disney MVNO and I also think Verizon or cingular have this option as well (I know I saw a tv ad for one of them a few months ago but cant remember which one) Regards, Dean Collins Cognation Pty Ltd [EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-212-203-4357 Ph +1-917-207-3420 Mb +61-2-9016-5642 (Sydney in-dial). -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:community- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 26 February 2007 2:27 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) Sam... Thanks for posting that link. A great write up on the Fundamentally Immoral business practices in the cellullar communications industry today. What I expect from the Operators or Carriers (depending on which oceans are nearby) is that they cease and desist using obfuscation and bundling to hide the true cost of their services. Ala-carte pricing that can be compared business to business. Another Mini-Rant of my own: Cell Plans That Help Parents Teach Responsibility As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. But the cell industry in not interested in what is best for Society as a whole, namely young people who can demonstrate the ability to conserve and manage resources. Thanks for being such good citizens, guys. ( Sarcasm) Alan McSwain Original Message: - From: Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:18:59 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones
RE: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.
Dean Collins writes: Sim only plans are available. I've been looking for a sim-only plan (that costs less than a plan with a free phone) in the US. Could you point me at one? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
SIMs are great - I don't like SIM-free phones like Verizon ones that require somebody at Verizon to switch the service to a different phone. With GSM you just switch the SIM yourself. Of course it would also be nice to be able to use different devices without having to physically switch the SIM (like use the GPRS connection in a laptop or PDA). Anyway SIM-free is misleading as you are using it, because you are actually complaining about locked phones that will only work on one network. And BTW it's not so hard to buy new unlocked phones on the net if you are willing to pay unsubsidized prices for them. As for Jobs, I think he negotiated a lot of unique stuff that cannot typically be negotiated with a carrier. It's too bad the phone still costs $500-600 even with a contract. Makes me wonder what the real manufacturing cost is; is the hardware that super-duper or are they just wanting to have even better margins than they get on ipods? On 2/26/07, Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We should paper the world with (something like) this rant ahead of the wide release of Neo1973. The fettered masses really don't get it yet. Covers 8 myths which drive folks to buy locked phones and/or 2yr contracts: http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/features/item/Its_time_to_buy_SIM-free_phones.php How would Apple fans react if the latest Mac computer was exclusively locked to a particular ISP, was only available to people who live in that ISP's service area, and people had to sign up to a 2 year contract with that ISP? The Apple fans would be mad as hell, so why on earth are they having to put up with exactly the same restrictions on a portable, pocket-sized Mac computer called the iPhone? How is it that Finland, a poorer, lower-density country without phone contracts, and with a law banning locked phones, developed far better phone coverage than America, the land of locked phones and 2 year contracts? Sam Kome UX Team Member www.motricity.com view corporate video NOTICE: This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information of Motricity. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
I think that the article I linked to really clearly covers all of the issues presented in the email responses. The price subsidies, the locked/unlocked, the SIM buying, the phone w/o SIM buying, etc. That's why I brought it to this group, because I respect the intelligence of the folks here, and I think they care about furthering the efficacy and usability of mobile computing and communication. I took it for granted that everyone on the list, including myself, knows the difference between T/CDMA (also available with SIMs, but nevermind) and GSM devices in terms of subscriber identity management. I _don't_ take for granted that anyone not working in or around the cell phone industry can even spell SIM, let alone understand the implications of whether or not their phone has a removable chip, or if that chip will work in another device, let alone with another carrier. When my mother/brother/friend in the US wants to buy a phone, they are very likely to go to one or two cell phone outlet stores, RTFMA, and see a plethora of plans with minutes and calling circles and free-after-x-o'clock. They will not be able to reasonably compare these to each other without performing sophisticated systems analysis on the fly. They will and do sign up for 2 year contracts _and/or_ locked devices. This by the way, makes my job (creating mobile content) more difficult, so I have both the philosphical and selfish professional incentives to try to both educate the general public and solve the core problem as I see it, which is a sea of proprietary devices that have lousy software and worse user interfaces. How'd I do? Still childish boring bullshit? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Shawn Rutledge Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 12:51 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) SIMs are great - I don't like SIM-free phones like Verizon ones that require somebody at Verizon to switch the service to a different phone. With GSM you just switch the SIM yourself. Of course it would also be nice to be able to use different devices without having to physically switch the SIM (like use the GPRS connection in a laptop or PDA). Anyway SIM-free is misleading as you are using it, because you are actually complaining about locked phones that will only work on one network. And BTW it's not so hard to buy new unlocked phones on the net if you are willing to pay unsubsidized prices for them. As for Jobs, I think he negotiated a lot of unique stuff that cannot typically be negotiated with a carrier. It's too bad the phone still costs $500-600 even with a contract. Makes me wonder what the real manufacturing cost is; is the hardware that super-duper or are they just wanting to have even better margins than they get on ipods? On 2/26/07, Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We should paper the world with (something like) this rant ahead of the wide release of Neo1973. The fettered masses really don't get it yet. Covers 8 myths which drive folks to buy locked phones and/or 2yr contracts: http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/features/item/Its_time_to_buy_SIM-free_ph ones.php How would Apple fans react if the latest Mac computer was exclusively locked to a particular ISP, was only available to people who live in that ISP's service area, and people had to sign up to a 2 year contract with that ISP? The Apple fans would be mad as hell, so why on earth are they having to put up with exactly the same restrictions on a portable, pocket-sized Mac computer called the iPhone? How is it that Finland, a poorer, lower-density country without phone contracts, and with a law banning locked phones, developed far better phone coverage than America, the land of locked phones and 2 year contracts? Sam Kome UX Team Member www.motricity.com view corporate video NOTICE: This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information of Motricity. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community NOTICE: This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information of Motricity. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message
Re: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
* Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] [070226 19:41]: When my mother/brother/friend in the US wants to buy a phone, they are very likely to go to one or two cell phone outlet stores, RTFMA, and see a plethora of plans with minutes and calling circles and free-after-x-o'clock. They will not be able to reasonably compare these to each other without performing sophisticated systems analysis on the fly. They will and do sign up for 2 year contracts _and/or_ locked devices. Stupid users^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^Husers that don't care, or don't compare plans are an universal problem. Trust me, comparing calling plans in Europe is not less complicated than in the US. This by the way, makes my job (creating mobile content) more difficult, so I have both the philosphical and selfish professional incentives to try to both educate the general public and solve the core problem as I see it, which is a sea of proprietary devices that have lousy software and worse user interfaces. How'd I do? Still childish boring bullshit? Well, it's not exactly a stellar observation, and yes, the OpenMoko platform has some promise, if it succeeds, to change the realities in the cellular industry. But it won't be fast, nor do I expect it to happen without some severe backfighting. (Consider, not only there is a known ecosystem that is to the (shortsighted) benefit of the companies involved, the group that has the most to gain from OpenMoko are the endusers. Worse the powerusers, which are a bad deal for the networks anyway. I do compare plans, and I tend to use what I buy.) Andreas -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Shawn Rutledge Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 12:51 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) SIMs are great - I don't like SIM-free phones like Verizon ones that require somebody at Verizon to switch the service to a different phone. With GSM you just switch the SIM yourself. Of course it would also be nice to be able to use different devices without having to physically switch the SIM (like use the GPRS connection in a laptop or PDA). Anyway SIM-free is misleading as you are using it, because you are actually complaining about locked phones that will only work on one network. And BTW it's not so hard to buy new unlocked phones on the net if you are willing to pay unsubsidized prices for them. As for Jobs, I think he negotiated a lot of unique stuff that cannot typically be negotiated with a carrier. It's too bad the phone still costs $500-600 even with a contract. Makes me wonder what the real manufacturing cost is; is the hardware that super-duper or are they just wanting to have even better margins than they get on ipods? On 2/26/07, Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We should paper the world with (something like) this rant ahead of the wide release of Neo1973. The fettered masses really don't get it yet. Covers 8 myths which drive folks to buy locked phones and/or 2yr contracts: http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/features/item/Its_time_to_buy_SIM-free_ph ones.php How would Apple fans react if the latest Mac computer was exclusively locked to a particular ISP, was only available to people who live in that ISP's service area, and people had to sign up to a 2 year contract with that ISP? The Apple fans would be mad as hell, so why on earth are they having to put up with exactly the same restrictions on a portable, pocket-sized Mac computer called the iPhone? How is it that Finland, a poorer, lower-density country without phone contracts, and with a law banning locked phones, developed far better phone coverage than America, the land of locked phones and 2 year contracts? Sam Kome UX Team Member www.motricity.com view corporate video NOTICE: This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information of Motricity. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community NOTICE: This e-mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information of Motricity. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies
RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
Sam... Thanks for posting that link. A great write up on the Fundamentally Immoral business practices in the cellullar communications industry today. What I expect from the Operators or Carriers (depending on which oceans are nearby) is that they cease and desist using obfuscation and bundling to hide the true cost of their services. Ala-carte pricing that can be compared business to business. Another Mini-Rant of my own: Cell Plans That Help Parents Teach Responsibility As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. But the cell industry in not interested in what is best for Society as a whole, namely young people who can demonstrate the ability to conserve and manage resources. Thanks for being such good citizens, guys. ( Sarcasm) Alan McSwain Original Message: - From: Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:18:59 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) I think that the article I linked to really clearly covers all of the issues presented in the email responses. The price subsidies, the locked/unlocked, the SIM buying, the phone w/o SIM buying, etc. That's why I brought it to this group, because I respect the intelligence of the folks here, and I think they care about furthering the efficacy and usability of mobile computing and communication. I took it for granted that everyone on the list, including myself, knows the difference between T/CDMA (also available with SIMs, but nevermind) and GSM devices in terms of subscriber identity management. I _don't_ take for granted that anyone not working in or around the cell phone industry can even spell SIM, let alone understand the implications of whether or not their phone has a removable chip, or if that chip will work in another device, let alone with another carrier. When my mother/brother/friend in the US wants to buy a phone, they are very likely to go to one or two cell phone outlet stores, RTFMA, and see a plethora of plans with minutes and calling circles and free-after-x-o'clock. They will not be able to reasonably compare these to each other without performing sophisticated systems analysis on the fly. They will and do sign up for 2 year contracts _and/or_ locked devices. This by the way, makes my job (creating mobile content) more difficult, so I have both the philosphical and selfish professional incentives to try to both educate the general public and solve the core problem as I see it, which is a sea of proprietary devices that have lousy software and worse user interfaces. How'd I do? Still childish boring bullshit? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Shawn Rutledge Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 12:51 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) SIMs are great - I don't like SIM-free phones like Verizon ones that require somebody at Verizon to switch the service to a different phone. With GSM you just switch the SIM yourself. Of course it would also be nice to be able to use different devices without having to physically switch the SIM (like use the GPRS connection in a laptop or PDA). Anyway SIM-free is misleading as you are using it, because you are actually complaining about locked phones that will only work on one network. And BTW it's not so hard to buy new unlocked phones on the net if you are willing to pay unsubsidized prices for them. As for Jobs, I think he negotiated a lot of unique stuff that cannot typically be negotiated with a carrier. It's too bad the phone still costs $500-600 even with a contract. Makes me wonder what the real manufacturing cost is; is the hardware that super-duper or are they just wanting to have even better margins than they get on ipods? On 2/26/07, Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We should paper the world with (something like) this rant ahead of the wide release of Neo1973. The fettered masses really don't get it yet. Covers 8 myths which drive folks to buy locked phones and/or 2yr contracts: http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/features/item/Its_time_to_buy_SIM-free_ph ones.php How would Apple fans react if the latest Mac computer was exclusively locked to a particular ISP, was only available to people who live in that ISP's service area, and people had to sign up to a 2 year contract with that ISP? The Apple fans would be mad as hell, so why on earth are they having to put up with exactly the same restrictions on a portable, pocket-sized Mac computer called the iPhone? How is it that Finland, a poorer, lower-density country without phone
RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. Alan, Totally incorrect, this was one of the main themes behind the Disney MVNO and I also think Verizon or cingular have this option as well (I know I saw a tv ad for one of them a few months ago but cant remember which one) Regards, Dean Collins Cognation Pty Ltd [EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-212-203-4357 Ph +1-917-207-3420 Mb +61-2-9016-5642 (Sydney in-dial). -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:community- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 26 February 2007 2:27 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) Sam... Thanks for posting that link. A great write up on the Fundamentally Immoral business practices in the cellullar communications industry today. What I expect from the Operators or Carriers (depending on which oceans are nearby) is that they cease and desist using obfuscation and bundling to hide the true cost of their services. Ala-carte pricing that can be compared business to business. Another Mini-Rant of my own: Cell Plans That Help Parents Teach Responsibility As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. But the cell industry in not interested in what is best for Society as a whole, namely young people who can demonstrate the ability to conserve and manage resources. Thanks for being such good citizens, guys. ( Sarcasm) Alan McSwain Original Message: - From: Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:18:59 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) I think that the article I linked to really clearly covers all of the issues presented in the email responses. The price subsidies, the locked/unlocked, the SIM buying, the phone w/o SIM buying, etc. That's why I brought it to this group, because I respect the intelligence of the folks here, and I think they care about furthering the efficacy and usability of mobile computing and communication. I took it for granted that everyone on the list, including myself, knows the difference between T/CDMA (also available with SIMs, but nevermind) and GSM devices in terms of subscriber identity management. I _don't_ take for granted that anyone not working in or around the cell phone industry can even spell SIM, let alone understand the implications of whether or not their phone has a removable chip, or if that chip will work in another device, let alone with another carrier. When my mother/brother/friend in the US wants to buy a phone, they are very likely to go to one or two cell phone outlet stores, RTFMA, and see a plethora of plans with minutes and calling circles and free-after-x-o'clock. They will not be able to reasonably compare these to each other without performing sophisticated systems analysis on the fly. They will and do sign up for 2 year contracts _and/or_ locked devices. This by the way, makes my job (creating mobile content) more difficult, so I have both the philosphical and selfish professional incentives to try to both educate the general public and solve the core problem as I see it, which is a sea of proprietary devices that have lousy software and worse user interfaces. How'd I do? Still childish boring bullshit? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Shawn Rutledge Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 12:51 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) SIMs are great - I don't like SIM-free phones like Verizon ones that require somebody at Verizon to switch the service to a different phone. With GSM you just switch the SIM yourself. Of course it would also be nice to be able to use different devices without having to physically switch the SIM (like use the GPRS connection in a laptop or PDA). Anyway SIM-free is misleading as you are using it, because you are actually complaining about locked phones that will only work on one network. And BTW it's not so hard to buy new unlocked phones on the net if you are willing to pay unsubsidized prices for them. As for Jobs, I think he negotiated a lot of unique stuff that cannot typically be negotiated with a carrier. It's
Re: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
* Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] [070226 21:20]: companies involved, the group that has the most to gain from OpenMoko are the endusers. Worse the powerusers, which are a bad deal for the networks anyway. I do compare plans, and I tend to use what I buy.) I agree that users will benefit. I don't think most of them know it. But to your point - there's a big upside for carriers. The problem is manyfold: a) corporate view points can be quite twisted for no reason. b) carriers in many countries overpaid for the 3G licenses, and are now in the bad situation that they are hardpressed to show any profits. c) 3G means fast data connection, but only for a small number of users = these means that the carriers are in the bad situation of cable internet providers, it's just worse for them. ;) Andreas ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
Dean... Its been a while since I looked, but I do stand corrected. The Disney plan indeed launched last June. The Disney plan is not, however prepaid, and worse, it is Disney, the folks who bought and paid for our Sonny Bono Copyright Tem Extension Act. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonny_Bono_Copyright_Term_Extension_Act Which, of course, puts them on my List. Thanks again. Alan Original Message: - From: Dean Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:35:21 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. Alan, Totally incorrect, this was one of the main themes behind the Disney MVNO and I also think Verizon or cingular have this option as well (I know I saw a tv ad for one of them a few months ago but cant remember which one) Regards, Dean Collins Cognation Pty Ltd [EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-212-203-4357 Ph +1-917-207-3420 Mb +61-2-9016-5642 (Sydney in-dial). -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:community- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 26 February 2007 2:27 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) Sam... Thanks for posting that link. A great write up on the Fundamentally Immoral business practices in the cellullar communications industry today. What I expect from the Operators or Carriers (depending on which oceans are nearby) is that they cease and desist using obfuscation and bundling to hide the true cost of their services. Ala-carte pricing that can be compared business to business. Another Mini-Rant of my own: Cell Plans That Help Parents Teach Responsibility As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. But the cell industry in not interested in what is best for Society as a whole, namely young people who can demonstrate the ability to conserve and manage resources. Thanks for being such good citizens, guys. ( Sarcasm) Alan McSwain Original Message: - From: Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:18:59 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) I think that the article I linked to really clearly covers all of the issues presented in the email responses. The price subsidies, the locked/unlocked, the SIM buying, the phone w/o SIM buying, etc. That's why I brought it to this group, because I respect the intelligence of the folks here, and I think they care about furthering the efficacy and usability of mobile computing and communication. I took it for granted that everyone on the list, including myself, knows the difference between T/CDMA (also available with SIMs, but nevermind) and GSM devices in terms of subscriber identity management. I _don't_ take for granted that anyone not working in or around the cell phone industry can even spell SIM, let alone understand the implications of whether or not their phone has a removable chip, or if that chip will work in another device, let alone with another carrier. When my mother/brother/friend in the US wants to buy a phone, they are very likely to go to one or two cell phone outlet stores, RTFMA, and see a plethora of plans with minutes and calling circles and free-after-x-o'clock. They will not be able to reasonably compare these to each other without performing sophisticated systems analysis on the fly. They will and do sign up for 2 year contracts _and/or_ locked devices. This by the way, makes my job (creating mobile content) more difficult, so I have both the philosphical and selfish professional incentives to try to both educate the general public and solve the core problem as I see it, which is a sea of proprietary devices that have lousy software and worse user interfaces. How'd I do? Still childish boring bullshit? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Shawn Rutledge Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 12:51 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) SIMs are great - I don't like SIM-free phones like Verizon ones that require somebody at Verizon to switch the service
RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.)
Took 4 minutes of googling to find both Cingular and Verizon have kids phones and restricted access plans. Stop your bitching and go save the world. Cingular's FireFly phone has buttons for preprogrammed phone numbers for Mom and Dad, along with a button for 911 emergencies. Up to 20 additional numbers can also be programmed into the phone. Verizon's Migo phone from LG also offers a dedicated emergency button, along with four buttons that parents can program. Even though the big carriers' services and phones don't match the functionality of newcomer Disney Mobile, they still may have an edge over Disney. For one, most parents who'd even consider buying a cell phone for their kids are already customers of one of the big cell phone companies. It might be easier and more cost-effective for them to wait for new features to be added to their current provider's packages. Limits on kids Parents can designate the times when a kid can call particular numbers or play games. With TicTalk, Mom and Dad can also limit the number of minutes for calls to certain numbers - say to a best friend. As with Firefly, the phone operates on the GSM cellular network. For some reason, the unit I had never properly updated the time. TicTalk costs $99, plus a $10 activation fee. An hour of prepaid talk is $15. The phone is available online now and in stores by year's end. Regards, Dean Collins -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:community- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 26 February 2007 6:27 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) Dean... Its been a while since I looked, but I do stand corrected. The Disney plan indeed launched last June. The Disney plan is not, however prepaid, and worse, it is Disney, the folks who bought and paid for our Sonny Bono Copyright Tem Extension Act. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonny_Bono_Copyright_Term_Extension_Act Which, of course, puts them on my List. Thanks again. Alan Original Message: - From: Dean Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:35:21 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. Alan, Totally incorrect, this was one of the main themes behind the Disney MVNO and I also think Verizon or cingular have this option as well (I know I saw a tv ad for one of them a few months ago but cant remember which one) Regards, Dean Collins Cognation Pty Ltd [EMAIL PROTECTED] +1-212-203-4357 Ph +1-917-207-3420 Mb +61-2-9016-5642 (Sydney in-dial). -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:community- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 26 February 2007 2:27 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) Sam... Thanks for posting that link. A great write up on the Fundamentally Immoral business practices in the cellullar communications industry today. What I expect from the Operators or Carriers (depending on which oceans are nearby) is that they cease and desist using obfuscation and bundling to hide the true cost of their services. Ala-carte pricing that can be compared business to business. Another Mini-Rant of my own: Cell Plans That Help Parents Teach Responsibility As a parent, one of my great angers with the cellular industry is that NO-ONE has offered a pre-paid plan that limits the child's monthly use of the air-time resource by cutting it off once the minute limit is exceeded for the month. Calls FROM and TO the parent account would still go through and be billed to the parent account. But the cell industry in not interested in what is best for Society as a whole, namely young people who can demonstrate the ability to conserve and manage resources. Thanks for being such good citizens, guys. ( Sarcasm) Alan McSwain Original Message: - From: Sam Kome [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:18:59 -0500 To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: Locked phones (was Re: A timely rant: Time for SIM-free phones.) I think that the article I linked to really clearly covers all of the issues presented in the email responses. The price subsidies, the locked/unlocked, the SIM buying, the phone w/o SIM buying, etc. That's why I brought it to this group, because I respect the intelligence of the folks here, and I
