Re: questions about our mailinglists
Brian C wrote: > If there were to be some benefit from multiple lists, and there could > be, then they would need to be defined differently than "community" and > "device-owners" which contains far too much overlap. If there were a > "support" list that was clearly intended to be questions about how to > get things working (flashing an image, compiling some software, etc.) > and then some other list for all non-support related discussions (not > sure the best name for it, but "community" still seems too broad and > would confuse newcomers), then that could be a useful split. Anyway, > unless two better-defined lists were proposed, I would agree that > removing device-owners and putting everything in "community" is preferable. +1 -- John Reese LeetCode.net ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Sean Moss-Pultz wrote: >>2) Remove 'device-owners'. > > 2) is a bit more controversial. But, being somebody that loves change, I > would like to try it as well. I think device-owners should be removed. It is easier, especially for newbies, to locate a single list "community" where they can expect to get an answer to their questions. If there were to be some benefit from multiple lists, and there could be, then they would need to be defined differently than "community" and "device-owners" which contains far too much overlap. If there were a "support" list that was clearly intended to be questions about how to get things working (flashing an image, compiling some software, etc.) and then some other list for all non-support related discussions (not sure the best name for it, but "community" still seems too broad and would confuse newcomers), then that could be a useful split. Anyway, unless two better-defined lists were proposed, I would agree that removing device-owners and putting everything in "community" is preferable. Brian ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
here we go again XD let's stop it NOW! /j signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Not everyone uses Gmail, but that said, most modern mail clients offer
the same kind of sorting.
Personally, I like modularlity. I'm subscribed to every Openmoko list
except the kernel devel one, but I can see very compelling reasons why
someone might be interested in say, not being on community but
subscribing to device-owners.
As far as the tags in the subject... I think it's a bad idea. If there
is need of distinguishing which "part of the list" a specific message
is part of, it really should have it's own list.
On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Dustin Knie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> FWIW I prefer the mailing list subject lines as they are.
>>
>> [openmoko-users] preppended to the subject line just adds clutter and
>> reduces the useful description of the subject that can be used in
>> that line. Only so much fits in the list of messages in the mail-
>> client's window and [openmoko-users] isn't as useful as "Bug with
>> libfoo.so.1 and SMS sent from Nokia 800. Endianness problem?"
>>
>> Prefixing [openmoko-users] or whatever can cause quite a bit of mess
>> if messages are cross-posted between lists or redirected from one
>> list to the other ("this shouldn't be on -dev, so I'm replying to -
>> users").
>
> I'm of the same feeling. Using GMail for lists and setting up rules to
> auto-label incoming mail removes the need for that entirely, and would
> further clutter up stuff. It's a annoying to see openmoko-community
> [openmoko-community] Subject ...
>
> Just my 2 cents.
>
> Dustin
>
> ___
> Openmoko community mailing list
> community@lists.openmoko.org
> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
>
>
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Re: questions about our mailinglists
> FWIW I prefer the mailing list subject lines as they are.
>
> [openmoko-users] preppended to the subject line just adds clutter and
> reduces the useful description of the subject that can be used in
> that line. Only so much fits in the list of messages in the mail-
> client's window and [openmoko-users] isn't as useful as "Bug with
> libfoo.so.1 and SMS sent from Nokia 800. Endianness problem?"
>
> Prefixing [openmoko-users] or whatever can cause quite a bit of mess
> if messages are cross-posted between lists or redirected from one
> list to the other ("this shouldn't be on -dev, so I'm replying to -
> users").
>
I'm of the same feeling. Using GMail for lists and setting up rules to
auto-label incoming mail removes the need for that entirely, and would
further clutter up stuff. It's a annoying to see openmoko-community
[openmoko-community] Subject ...
Just my 2 cents.
Dustin
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Re: questions about our mailinglists
On 8 Jul 2008, at 12:57, Torfinn Ingolfsen wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 1:44 PM, matt joyce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> Can you elaborate please (not for the sake of debate, I'm just
>> curious
>
> No, I'm not going to restart that discussion. The last time it lasted
> for more than a month, wasting lots of time for anybody reading this
> list, and even more for those participating in the discussion.
Maybe you could simply link to the discussion, then?
FWIW I prefer the mailing list subject lines as they are.
[openmoko-users] preppended to the subject line just adds clutter and
reduces the useful description of the subject that can be used in
that line. Only so much fits in the list of messages in the mail-
client's window and [openmoko-users] isn't as useful as "Bug with
libfoo.so.1 and SMS sent from Nokia 800. Endianness problem?"
Prefixing [openmoko-users] or whatever can cause quite a bit of mess
if messages are cross-posted between lists or redirected from one
list to the other ("this shouldn't be on -dev, so I'm replying to -
users").
As I understand it people who really want the list name added to
their subject lines can do so by (invoking sed from?) their own
mailfilter / procmail recipes.
Stroller.
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Re: questions about our mailinglists
arne anka wrote: >> No, I'm not going to restart that discussion. >> > > so you were speaking about the discussions that may arise from the request > not some drawbacks of the markers as such? > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > Oh I see, I was looking for unpleasant artefacts of subject tagging, not a dichotomising debate. I looked again but searching a mailing list archive for 'subject' is too tedious. mj ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Sean Moss-Pultz wrote: > We want to simplify around key communication points. What do you think > of the following: > >1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. > >2) Remove 'device-owners'. > >3) Remove 'hardware'. It seems like generally speaking people agree with 1). So we'll try this now. 2) is a bit more controversial. But, being somebody that loves change, I would like to try it as well. 3) Had more than a few good arguments against it. Plus we're working on releasing more information about the hardware. So this will been needed soon. Also I read this page for the first time: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Discussion_Forums Seems there is already more than few sites but very little posts. If somebody is interested in becoming the "Official" Openmoko forum I'd be more than happy to make this...well...official. We just don't have anyone here (in the company) that wants to setup and maintain a forum. -Sean ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Torfinn Ingolfsen wrote: > Hello, > > On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 1:44 PM, matt joyce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Can you elaborate please (not for the sake of debate, I'm just curious >> > > No, I'm not going to restart that discussion. The last time it lasted > for more than a month, wasting lots of time for anybody reading this > list, and even more for those participating in the discussion. > I did check the faq (http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Misc) before asking, there was no mention of the problem. Oh well, never mind. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
> No, I'm not going to restart that discussion. so you were speaking about the discussions that may arise from the request not some drawbacks of the markers as such? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Hello, On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 1:44 PM, matt joyce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Can you elaborate please (not for the sake of debate, I'm just curious No, I'm not going to restart that discussion. The last time it lasted for more than a month, wasting lots of time for anybody reading this list, and even more for those participating in the discussion. -- Regards Torfinn Ingolfsen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Torfinn Ingolfsen wrote: > Hi, > > On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 5:08 AM, Matt Joyce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>> Dear Community >>> >> Would there be any support for prefixing the subject with the list names ? >> eg [openmoko-community] >> It's a trivial enough to implement with Mailman (the system being used). >> > > No, please don't do that. I repeat: please do not mess with the subject lines! > To see why, look at the list archives about a year back. > > I looked but other than some mild munging of some subjects, I can't see what you're referring to. I personally have been subbed to numerous mailing lists which [do this], and I have not had a bad experience worthy of the anxiety you seem to suggest. Can you elaborate please (not for the sake of debate, I'm just curious how I have missed the pitfalls for so many years)? MJ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Discussion_Forums Am 08.07.2008 um 07:55 schrieb W.Kenworthy: > I thought someone has already set up a forum - but few can be bothered > using it so perhaps thats your answer. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Hi, On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 5:08 AM, Matt Joyce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Dear Community > Would there be any support for prefixing the subject with the list names ? > eg [openmoko-community] > It's a trivial enough to implement with Mailman (the system being used). No, please don't do that. I repeat: please do not mess with the subject lines! To see why, look at the list archives about a year back. -- Regards, Torfinn Ingolfsen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
I thought someone has already set up a forum - but few can be bothered using it so perhaps thats your answer. I cant see the point of so many mailing lists - it just complicates the procmail recipe so they all sort into the same mailbox :) BillK On Mon, 2008-07-07 at 22:09 -0700, Ben Cadieux wrote: > Is conglomerating mailing lists really such a good idea? There's > already an overwhelming amount of e-mail. While I realize there's > already been some discussion about using a forum, it degraded into > trolling -- I do think a forum would be a good idea. Not that it > would replace the mailing lists, but rather to work in tandem. > > Mailing lists simply aren't effective for every situation; individual > questions/problems that may not interest the larger group, for > example. > > Best Regards, > Ben Cadieux > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
Is conglomerating mailing lists really such a good idea? There's already an overwhelming amount of e-mail. While I realize there's already been some discussion about using a forum, it degraded into trolling -- I do think a forum would be a good idea. Not that it would replace the mailing lists, but rather to work in tandem. Mailing lists simply aren't effective for every situation; individual questions/problems that may not interest the larger group, for example. Best Regards, Ben Cadieux On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 8:08 PM, Matt Joyce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Dear Community >> >> We want to simplify around key communication points. What do you think >> of the following: >> >> 1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called >> 'devel'. >> >> 2) Remove 'device-owners'. >> >> 3) Remove 'hardware'. >> >> Any concerns / comments? >> >> -Sean >> > > I imagine the above questions have been asked in the respective lists, if > they are happy to join Community, I for one am happy to read their threads. > > Would there be any support for prefixing the subject with the list names ? > eg [openmoko-community] > It's a trivial enough to implement with Mailman (the system being used). > > Also, should a link to the wiki be included in the list footers? > Perhaps it would be useful to new users (which I expect and hope there will > be many). > > Regards > > Matt > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
> > Dear Community > > We want to simplify around key communication points. What do you think > of the following: > > 1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. > > 2) Remove 'device-owners'. > > 3) Remove 'hardware'. > > Any concerns / comments? > > -Sean > > I imagine the above questions have been asked in the respective lists, if they are happy to join Community, I for one am happy to read their threads. Would there be any support for prefixing the subject with the list names ? eg [openmoko-community] It's a trivial enough to implement with Mailman (the system being used). Also, should a link to the wiki be included in the list footers? Perhaps it would be useful to new users (which I expect and hope there will be many). Regards Matt ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
well, I have to say Im terrified... I was quite busy lately and have a week vacation so in my _community_ message box there is almost ~1400 unread mails... ufff... Sean Moss-Pultz pisze: [...] >1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. no problems with that... > >2) Remove 'device-owners'. from the very beginnig I liked this division, the _device-owner_ list was naturally focused on neo's usage and sharing knowledge and experiences while _community_ list was more about community staff and literally about everything... so it was quite convenient to me to be up to date with _device_owner_ list and catch up with _community_ list when I have some more free time than usually... > >3) Remove 'hardware'. is there any difference between removing _hardware_list and combining it with new _devel_ list? I hope that U still want to keep being open with hardware too :-D Im happy gta01 owner and IIRC where firsts neos started to arrive into peoples hand the _device-owner_ list was getting a lot of mails... maybe when freerunners start to arrive this list will be live and kicking once again? maybe it is a matter of advertising that we have more list than one only - maybe a lot of new community members are not aware of that? :-) regards Piotr ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
2008/7/7 Sean Moss-Pultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > We want to simplify around key communication points. What do you think > of the following: > > 1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. > > 2) Remove 'device-owners'. > Sounds good. > > 3) Remove 'hardware'. I think it makes sense to keep 'hardware' so that hardware bug discussions don't drown in software development issues. Also, maybe an increasing number of people will be doing hardware interfacing and want a forum. I appreciate the openness of the OpenMoko engineers in the 'hardware' forum, and I guess there are people who mostly work on hardware and who would not follow a 'devel' list as closely. Just my two SEK, Erland ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
>1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. > >2) Remove 'device-owners'. > >3) Remove 'hardware'. +1 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
I was a little confused about all the lists myself. I have started developing apps on the Openmoko, but not for the core - aka I doubt my apps would ever be distributed as part of a standard distro as they focus on robotics. I think it would be good to rationalise the number of lists. Right now I simply subscribe to many lists. On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 1:48 PM, Sean Moss-Pultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear Community > > We want to simplify around key communication points. What do you think > of the following: > > 1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. > > 2) Remove 'device-owners'. > > 3) Remove 'hardware'. > > Any concerns / comments? > > -Sean > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions about our mailinglists
El lun, 07-07-2008 a las 09:48 +0800, Sean Moss-Pultz escribió: > Dear Community > > We want to simplify around key communication points. What do you think > of the following: > >1) Combine 'openmoko-devel' and 'distro-devel' into one list -- called > 'devel'. No comments here. I'm only subscribed to om-devel and the existence of distro-devel was unknown. > >2) Remove 'device-owners'. People subscribed to 'device-owners' must be a subset of people subscribed to 'community' so no harm here. > >3) Remove 'hardware'. 'hardware' has extremely low traffic now, all can be done in the future 'devel'. > > Any concerns / comments? > >-Sean > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Diego Fdez. Durán <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | http://www.goedi.net GPG : 925C 9A21 7A11 3B13 6E43 50DB F579 D119 90D2 66BB signature.asc Description: Esta parte del mensaje está firmada digitalmente ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
