Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Brian Sowers]

Sooo in reading between the lines AFRINIC, in its defense against this lawsuit, 
failed to offer any exculpatory evidence to unfreeze its bank account. The 
court is simply adjourning a week and a half later to deliberate again. This is 
part of the legal bureaucratic headache I’ve criticized AFRINIC for finding 
finding itself in. It is not conducive to operations at large (the *internet* 
in *africa*)  and short-term financial expedients cannot be sustained forever. 
If AFRINIC simply had kept the internet free for use, it would not find itself 
in this predicament. I appreciate this update from Eddy, but it doesn’t offer 
any hope to pro-AFRINICs other than a false optimism that AFRINIC builds an 
argument in the meantime to be even able to access its own funds. It’s 
ridiculously in denial to the point of having to ask what other alternatives 
there are to AFRINIC. Africa, let’s use RIPE for the global internet’s sake.

-Brian
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Noah]

On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 07:05 Brian Sowers,  wrote:

>  The court is simply adjourning a week and a half later to deliberate
> again.


Legal proceedings are never rushed.


I appreciate this update from Eddy, but it doesn’t offer any hope to
> pro-AFRINICs other than a false optimism that AFRINIC builds an argument in
> the meantime to be even able to access its own funds.


Perhaps you missed all the Pro-AFRINIC public statements that various
African Internet bodies made in support of AFRINIC.

AFRINIC might not be able to access its own funds today but that does not
mean that there are no other alternatives.

AFRINIC during her inception in the earlier days had no money. AFRINIC was
supported financially by African Institutions  to operate and perhaps this
is the part of Pro-AFRINIC history you do not know about.


what other alternatives there are to AFRINIC. Africa,
>

The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20 years
including African Governments.

AFRINIC is not alone as it forms part of the Af* organisations that are
willing to come together and support AFRINIC through financial donation so
as to continue running its core functions and operations.

The ISP associations are the other alternative and ANGOLA ISPA, TISPA,
multiple IXPs across Africa and all those Af* organisations and NRENs and
other members of the wider Internet community in Africa.

The donations shall start with even myself as an individual. I just need to
know which 3rd party supplier AFRINIC uses and I will make payments to them
directly online via VISA or MASTERCARD.

That is "Ubuntu".

Cheers
Noah

>
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Omo Oaiya]

On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 08:04 Noah,  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 07:05 Brian Sowers,  wrote:
>
>>  The court is simply adjourning a week and a half later to deliberate
>> again.
>
>
> Legal proceedings are never rushed.
>
>
> I appreciate this update from Eddy, but it doesn’t offer any hope to
>> pro-AFRINICs other than a false optimism that AFRINIC builds an argument in
>> the meantime to be even able to access its own funds.
>
>
> Perhaps you missed all the Pro-AFRINIC public statements that various
> African Internet bodies made in support of AFRINIC.
>
> AFRINIC might not be able to access its own funds today but that does not
> mean that there are no other alternatives.
>
> AFRINIC during her inception in the earlier days had no money. AFRINIC was
> supported financially by African Institutions  to operate and perhaps
> this is the part of Pro-AFRINIC history you do not know about.
>
>
> what other alternatives there are to AFRINIC. Africa,
>>
>
> The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20
> years including African Governments.
>
> AFRINIC is not alone as it forms part of the Af* organisations that are
> willing to come together and support AFRINIC through financial donation so
> as to continue running its core functions and operations.
>
> The ISP associations are the other alternative and ANGOLA ISPA, TISPA,
> multiple IXPs across Africa and all those Af* organisations and NRENs and
> other members of the wider Internet community in Africa.
>
> The donations shall start with even myself as an individual. I just need
> to know which 3rd party supplier AFRINIC uses and I will make payments to
> them directly online via VISA or MASTERCARD.
>
> That is "Ubuntu".
>

Great end Noah but the philosophy of humanism would be lost on sock
puppets.

Someone has already asked.  Can Brian Sowers identify themselves?  Has
anyone ever met them?

Omo
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Noah]

On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 11:47 Omo Oaiya,  wrote:

>
>> The donations shall start with even myself as an individual. I just need
>> to know which 3rd party supplier AFRINIC uses and I will make payments to
>> them directly online via VISA or MASTERCARD.
>>
>> That is "Ubuntu".
>>
>
> Great end Noah but the philosophy of humanism would be lost on sock
> puppets.
>

Most of the pseudo ghosts do not understand the history.

They do not know that AFRINIC was born out of the collaboration of Af*
organisations and the Internet community.

They do not know that AFRINIC was financially sustained by AFRICAN
organisations and the friends of the global Internet.

They believe that they can rip AFRINIC off its limited finance which is
mostly small contributions from less than  2000 LIRs and end users
operating real Internet infrastructure across Africa for the benefit of our
people.

Their greed has led them to believe they can rip AFRINIC small income and
also the number resources meant for the development of the African Internet
Infrastructure.

All friends of Africa will stand and support AFRINIC to run and operate its
core functions like we did in the past.

We will all make donations which Lu Heng will not have the means to grab in
an attempt to avoid accountability.

Cheers,
Noah

>
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Christian Orozco]

>
> Legal proceedings are never rushed.
>

Yes, correct. But what circumstance could have caused the need to set it
next week? One probable reason could be AFRINIC's incapacity to provide
necessary documents/ evidence. We do not actually know, yet Brian still has
a reason to doubt.

The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20 years
> including African Governments
>

 Indeed, there were instances that this collaboration is truly admirable.
However, there's a lot at stake in AFRINIC's current situation. How certain
are you that mere financial donation can suffice the challenge AFRINIC is
facing? We should now be more attentive in keeping the internet's
stability. And by that, we cannot just presume that AFRINIC will be able to
go back on its feet easily and partake in such stability.



On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 3:03 PM Noah  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 07:05 Brian Sowers,  wrote:
>
>>  The court is simply adjourning a week and a half later to deliberate
>> again.
>
>
> Legal proceedings are never rushed.
>
>
> I appreciate this update from Eddy, but it doesn’t offer any hope to
>> pro-AFRINICs other than a false optimism that AFRINIC builds an argument in
>> the meantime to be even able to access its own funds.
>
>
> Perhaps you missed all the Pro-AFRINIC public statements that various
> African Internet bodies made in support of AFRINIC.
>
> AFRINIC might not be able to access its own funds today but that does not
> mean that there are no other alternatives.
>
> AFRINIC during her inception in the earlier days had no money. AFRINIC was
> supported financially by African Institutions  to operate and perhaps
> this is the part of Pro-AFRINIC history you do not know about.
>
>
> what other alternatives there are to AFRINIC. Africa,
>>
>
> The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20
> years including African Governments.
>
> AFRINIC is not alone as it forms part of the Af* organisations that are
> willing to come together and support AFRINIC through financial donation so
> as to continue running its core functions and operations.
>
> The ISP associations are the other alternative and ANGOLA ISPA, TISPA,
> multiple IXPs across Africa and all those Af* organisations and NRENs and
> other members of the wider Internet community in Africa.
>
> The donations shall start with even myself as an individual. I just need
> to know which 3rd party supplier AFRINIC uses and I will make payments to
> them directly online via VISA or MASTERCARD.
>
> That is "Ubuntu".
>
> Cheers
> Noah
>
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Murungi Daniel via Community-Discuss]

One probable reason could be that CI were caught with their pants down and 
requested for time to cook up a new story :)


> On Aug 5, 2021, at 1:53 PM, Christian Orozco  wrote:
> 
> Legal proceedings are never rushed. 
> 
> Yes, correct. But what circumstance could have caused the need to set it next 
> week? One probable reason could be AFRINIC's incapacity to provide necessary 
> documents/ evidence. We do not actually know, yet Brian still has a reason to 
> doubt. 
> 
> The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20 years 
> including African Governments
> 
>  Indeed, there were instances that this collaboration is truly admirable. 
> However, there's a lot at stake in AFRINIC's current situation. How certain 
> are you that mere financial donation can suffice the challenge AFRINIC is 
> facing? We should now be more attentive in keeping the internet's stability. 
> And by that, we cannot just presume that AFRINIC will be able to go back on 
> its feet easily and partake in such stability.
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 3:03 PM Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>> 
> wrote:
> 
> 
> On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 07:05 Brian Sowers,  > wrote:
>  The court is simply adjourning a week and a half later to deliberate again.
> 
> Legal proceedings are never rushed. 
> 
> 
> I appreciate this update from Eddy, but it doesn’t offer any hope to 
> pro-AFRINICs other than a false optimism that AFRINIC builds an argument in 
> the meantime to be even able to access its own funds.
> 
> Perhaps you missed all the Pro-AFRINIC public statements that various African 
> Internet bodies made in support of AFRINIC.
> 
> AFRINIC might not be able to access its own funds today but that does not 
> mean that there are no other alternatives.
> 
> AFRINIC during her inception in the earlier days had no money. AFRINIC was 
> supported financially by African Institutions  to operate and perhaps this is 
> the part of Pro-AFRINIC history you do not know about.
> 
> 
> what other alternatives there are to AFRINIC. Africa, 
> 
> The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20 years 
> including African Governments.
> 
> AFRINIC is not alone as it forms part of the Af* organisations that are 
> willing to come together and support AFRINIC through financial donation so as 
> to continue running its core functions and operations.
> 
> The ISP associations are the other alternative and ANGOLA ISPA, TISPA, 
> multiple IXPs across Africa and all those Af* organisations and NRENs and 
> other members of the wider Internet community in Africa.
> 
> The donations shall start with even myself as an individual. I just need to 
> know which 3rd party supplier AFRINIC uses and I will make payments to them 
> directly online via VISA or MASTERCARD.
> 
> That is "Ubuntu".
> 
> Cheers
> Noah
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Ibeanusi Elvis]

There is nowhere or an incline mentioning that legal proceeding are rushed. 
We all know how legal proceedings work and know that it requires time to 
ascertain and make clear, definitive judgement and decision. 

Let's face the facts, AFRINIC is a terrible and difficult condition which one 
of the reason is due to some of the decisions that the organization made in the 
past. 
End of story. And also, you are not the only one that know about the history of 
AFRINIC and how it started. 
Additionally, @Noah the fact that some community members do not align with you 
or have the same opinion as you, does not make them “pseudo ghosts” or “sock 
puppets” or whatever name you might come up with. 
Learn to respect the opinions of others, no one is telling you to support it or 
promote it. 

Can I call you a GHOST as well cause we have different views?
And by the ways, Thanks for your future donation. Well appreciated.

Best regards, 
Elvis.  


> On Aug 5, 2021, at 20:18, Murungi Daniel via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> One probable reason could be that CI were caught with their pants down and 
> requested for time to cook up a new story :)
> 
> 
>> On Aug 5, 2021, at 1:53 PM, Christian Orozco > > wrote:
>> 
>> Legal proceedings are never rushed. 
>> 
>> Yes, correct. But what circumstance could have caused the need to set it 
>> next week? One probable reason could be AFRINIC's incapacity to provide 
>> necessary documents/ evidence. We do not actually know, yet Brian still has 
>> a reason to doubt. 
>> 
>> The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20 years 
>> including African Governments
>> 
>>  Indeed, there were instances that this collaboration is truly admirable. 
>> However, there's a lot at stake in AFRINIC's current situation. How certain 
>> are you that mere financial donation can suffice the challenge AFRINIC is 
>> facing? We should now be more attentive in keeping the internet's stability. 
>> And by that, we cannot just presume that AFRINIC will be able to go back on 
>> its feet easily and partake in such stability.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 3:03 PM Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 07:05 Brian Sowers, > > wrote:
>>  The court is simply adjourning a week and a half later to deliberate again.
>> 
>> Legal proceedings are never rushed. 
>> 
>> 
>> I appreciate this update from Eddy, but it doesn’t offer any hope to 
>> pro-AFRINICs other than a false optimism that AFRINIC builds an argument in 
>> the meantime to be even able to access its own funds.
>> 
>> Perhaps you missed all the Pro-AFRINIC public statements that various 
>> African Internet bodies made in support of AFRINIC.
>> 
>> AFRINIC might not be able to access its own funds today but that does not 
>> mean that there are no other alternatives.
>> 
>> AFRINIC during her inception in the earlier days had no money. AFRINIC was 
>> supported financially by African Institutions  to operate and perhaps this 
>> is the part of Pro-AFRINIC history you do not know about.
>> 
>> 
>> what other alternatives there are to AFRINIC. Africa, 
>> 
>> The Af* organisations that have collaborated with AFRINIC for over 20 years 
>> including African Governments.
>> 
>> AFRINIC is not alone as it forms part of the Af* organisations that are 
>> willing to come together and support AFRINIC through financial donation so 
>> as to continue running its core functions and operations.
>> 
>> The ISP associations are the other alternative and ANGOLA ISPA, TISPA, 
>> multiple IXPs across Africa and all those Af* organisations and NRENs and 
>> other members of the wider Internet community in Africa.
>> 
>> The donations shall start with even myself as an individual. I just need to 
>> know which 3rd party supplier AFRINIC uses and I will make payments to them 
>> directly online via VISA or MASTERCARD.
>> 
>> That is "Ubuntu".
>> 
>> Cheers
>> Noah
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Noah]

Oga Elvis,

On Thu, 5 Aug 2021, 15:14 Ibeanusi Elvis,  wrote:

>
> Can I call you a GHOST as well cause we have different views?
>

No you can not because I am still alive with a heart pumping, breath
gasping, warm body and I know you are not a Ghost as well because I have
seen your CV when you attempted to become a Co-Chair.

As for your views, I actually don't agree with all of them and I am ok that
you also don't agree with me as well but at least we are not Ghosts.

I was referring to the sock-puppets of this world, those ones who don't
have the guts to state who they are or their affiliations.

Cheers,
Noah
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Murungi Daniel via Community-Discuss]

Dear Elvis,


> Let's face the facts, AFRINIC is a terrible and difficult condition which one 
> of the reason is due to some of the decisions that the organization made in 
> the past. 

Not this crap again. Whereas you are entitled to your opinion, stop spewing 
misinformation.


Regards,
Murungi Daniel
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Owen DeLong via Community-Discuss]

> On Aug 5, 2021, at 04:18 , Murungi Daniel via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> One probable reason could be that CI were caught with their pants down and 
> requested for time to cook up a new story :)
> 
Not this crap again. Whereas you are entitled to your opinion, stop spewing 
misinformation.


Regards,
Murungi Daniel
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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Brian Sowers]

Noah, 

Your name calling doesn’t take away from the fact that it’s clear that whatever 
AFRINIC presented in court did not immediately clear their name. And yes, I am 
a ghost. I am neither here nor there but am beside you even as you sleep. 
Perhaps when you will have woken up this morning, I will have given you 
nightmares. All jokes aside, I am simply an internet activist and what is it to 
you anyway? The mailing lists are open to all. Or did you forget about that 
part in the RIR’s history? 

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Re: [Community-Discuss] Update 04 Aug 2021

[Ronald F. Guilmette]

In message , 
Brian Sowers  wrote:

>All jokes aside, I am simply an internet activist...

I admire you for the way you have been able to keep your Internet "activism"
so totally secret over the years that it is not even possible to find a
single trace of it, even via diligent Google searches.

That's really an impressive record of achievement you have there!

And I applaud you also for the the kind of selfless determination to your
"activism" that has caused you to subsist on just the odd pineapple and
whatever alms people have thrown into your bowl, even as you have
achieved your impressive record of absolutely no notoriety whatsoever.

Bravo!


Regards,
rfg

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