Re: [Coworking] Re: Getting rid of the co-working hyphen
I'm with Marius on this one. I think the important thing here is to get us in the dictionary with the spelling we use. To me, the spelling issue has always been indicative of a bigger thing, which is official recognition as part of the English language. After 10 years, I think the movement has earned it. William, how would you feel if everyone started calling you Bill or Will-iam? What if the difference between Will-iam and William was just in written language and not in speech? You even stated that the reason you spell it coworking is out of respect for the rest of us that have all settled on coworking (you even prefer co-working!). That's all we're asking of journalists in this case. And if they're denying our requests on the basis of being or not being in the dictionary, then let's get in the dictionary. Also Derek, the cowering autocorrect annoys me too! It never learns! On Wednesday, September 17, 2014 12:47:01 PM UTC-5, Marius Amado-Alves wrote: FWIW, I agree with Will's arguments except the cow one. To summarize, the spelling is irrelevant, because there is only one coworking, irrespectively of how it is spelt. As Will points out, working with others in a company is never referred to as coworking. Nevertheless, I think there is interest in diccionarizing the terms. (And then, while we're at it, with the preferred spelling? It would be interesting to watch what happens to the guides.) -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [Coworking] Re: Getting rid of the co-working hyphen
Hi Oren, I appreciate your reply about this! Actually, my name is Will, not William, damnit!!! : But I don't think this is really the same. First, coworking isn't a company name or a given name / proper noun. It's not your name or my name. It's not even the movement's name. If personal computing became just computing, what would you think if Apple or Microsoft or a handful of influential early players in the personal computing industry campaigned against the change and said that we can't change their name, and that it was as though their given names were being mis-spelled? I'd personally think they should leave the English language alone and that it wasn't the role of people in an industry to try to manage what have become common nouns in the English language. I have run a coworking space for more than 4 years now. I care what you call my space or what you call me and I care about coworking, but the idea that spelling coworking differently from how people who run coworking spaces think it should be spelled, or that misspelling is like misspelling a proper noun seems to me like a stretch. Second, to the extent the name is owned by the community of coworking space owners, or at least we have a meaningful stake in it (which I think we do), then who are *we*? You write that after 10 years, the coworking movement has earned it and that the rest of us have all settled on coworking. But I don't think that's true. I see new coworking spaces all the time that put a hyphen in the term. As I wrote in the previous email, my (unsubstantiated) hypothesis is that there's really a pretty small group of coworking space owners who care about coworking being spelled without a hyphen. I've never seen poll results and I doubt the question has even been put to a wide audience of coworking space owners (and presumably members). Even within the industry I'd guess the vast majority don't care (if there were an option included in the poll), and I wouldn't be at all surprised if an international poll of coworking space owners and members showed that the majority even thought the better spelling would be WITH a hyphen. Why wouldn't you have heard that? The same reason I almost didn't make the last post in the first place: the other side (the side that would prefer a hyphen or just doesn't care), doesn't have a horse in the race, because for that side language is organic and functional and they don't see themselves as owning the name or as there being a meaningful difference in whether it's spelled with or without a hyphen. (To be clear, I have no idea about the other side or what justifications might be; I've never seen any data on this; but it also wouldn't surprise me). And the name coworking belongs to a much wider audience than just us coworking space owners by now, just as personal computing belongs to a much wider audience than Microsoft or Apple. And the Internet (or now internet) belongs to a much wider audience than the people who originally coined the name. That's a sign of the maturity of the word, and something to be proud of as a movement. Not something to fight against. Third, even if we were a coherent community who almost universally agreed that spelling it without a hyphen was superior, wouldn't it be good to examine the counter-arguments? If, after we all gave it some thought, we agreed that it really didn't matter and that we should let its spelling be determined organically, then wouldn't we have saved each other a lot of time working to change something that was better left to grow on its own according to systems that my be wiser than we are about naming? My few cents, anyway. Will On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 9:30 AM, oren.salo...@gmail.com oren.salo...@gmail.com wrote: I'm with Marius on this one. I think the important thing here is to get us in the dictionary with the spelling we use. To me, the spelling issue has always been indicative of a bigger thing, which is official recognition as part of the English language. After 10 years, I think the movement has earned it. William, how would you feel if everyone started calling you Bill or Will-iam? What if the difference between Will-iam and William was just in written language and not in speech? You even stated that the reason you spell it coworking is out of respect for the rest of us that have all settled on coworking (you even prefer co-working!). That's all we're asking of journalists in this case. And if they're denying our requests on the basis of being or not being in the dictionary, then let's get in the dictionary. Also Derek, the cowering autocorrect annoys me too! It never learns! On Wednesday, September 17, 2014 12:47:01 PM UTC-5, Marius Amado-Alves wrote: FWIW, I agree with Will's arguments except the cow one. To summarize, the spelling is irrelevant, because there is only one coworking, irrespectively of how it is spelt. As Will points out, working with others in a company is never referred to as
Re: [Coworking] Re: Basic elements for a definition of coworking
Jon, I do as you do. They are members of a community and at the same time they are clients. They pay for a service, not only for belonging. Ramon Suarez Serendipity Accelerator, Betacowork Author: http://coworkinghandbook.com email hangouts: ra...@betacowork.com Phone: +3227376769 GSM: +32497556284 Twitter:http://twitter.com/ramonsuarez Skype: ramonsuarez Try coworking: http://betacowork.com http://betacowork.com/free-coworking-tryout/?utm_source=emailutm_medium=468x60_bannerutm_content=girl-homeutm_campaign=ramon-signature On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 11:58 AM, Jon Stever, The Office RW jste...@gmail.com wrote: Re: clients vs. members. I would definitely agree on the philosophical distinction. Essentially,it's trying to tease out whether the space exists to build a community (members) or to earn a margin on real estate (clients). This is an important dichotomy, but it's also strictly false as we all exist on a sliding scale between these two extremes. I don't think we want to start to see client as a dirty word...at a nice restaurant the clients will be on a first-name basis with staff, have a special table, regular meal selections, and even Christmas cards in the mail (and may even be called patrons to distinguish the relationship), while at McDonald's clients are a mass of impersonal and transactional relationships. I find myself slipping interchangeably between terms when talking about The Office http://theoffice.rw, because as a coworking space manager and business manager I have to think both in terms of building and strengthening our community (membership) and in terms of making the numbers work and communicating with potential partners and investors (clients). When I'm thinking in terms of investment and expansion, I intellectual categorize members as clients...this is often sub-conscious and I used to even feel ashamed when I realized that I had done it, but I wonder if this is really such a horrible thing. Because, when I think about why I do what I do and the people I work with and for, I think of friends and members... What do you think? - Jon On Friday, 12 September 2014 13:15:23 UTC+2, Alex Hillman wrote: In my opinion a coworking space -- being a *community* of coworkers -- always calls and treats its coworkers *members*. I like this one a lot!! -Alex -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/coworking/Tvf2gg-WZ5w/unsubscribe. To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
[Coworking] Re: Getting rid of the co-working hyphen
YES! love this. Desk Union is in On Thursday, 1 September 2011 10:29:20 UTC+1, sop...@deskwanted.com wrote: Hi everyone, For a while now we've been annoyed about the resurgence in the use of the hyphenated version of the word coworking. As you all know, most major media outlets these days write it as co-working. Deskmag recently published an article explaining why this is happening: it's because the AP Stylebook has decided that co-working is the correct form. However, we'd like to ask for your assistance in helping AP change their minds! We've put out a call for people to bombard AP with the following tweet: @APStylebook #Coworking is not Co-working. It’s an independent movement that doesn’t want to be separated by a hyphen! For a backgrounder on why we think the word should be without a hyphen, have a read of the article: http://www.deskmag.com/en/coworking-or-co-working-with-hyphen-252 What do you all think? I know this is an old issue, but it's important to get the name right, right? Sophie Deskmag/Deskwanted -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
[Coworking] getting rid of the co-working hyphen
Hi All, I’ve done a little research trying to figure out how we might move forward in trying to persuade the AP to reconsider their position on the co-working vs. coworking issue. Most of what follows is less of a concrete plan, and more of the background info we would need in deciding where/how to focus our efforts: *1. **Webster’s New World College Dictionary** (WNWCD) is the official dictionary for the AP Stylebook. * · Interestingly, and importantly, the *WNWCD* is not published by Meriam Webster, but by Houghton Mifflin. · There will be differences, then, between *WNWCD*’s and Meriam-Webster’s treatment of terms. · So, if we want to begin by getting coworking into a dictionary, it seems like focusing our attention on the *WNWCD* would be best. · *BUT*…. The AP’s rules of spelling, grammar, etc. don’t *always* match the *WNWCD.* - For example, the AP spells email without a hyphen, while *WNWCD*’s primary definition retains the hyphen. · So, if *WNWCD* adds coworking to their dictionary it wouldn’t necessarily result in a change in the AP’s approach to spelling co-working. - Although the AP Stylebooks’s values are listed as consistency, clarity, accuracy, and brevity, they definitely seem to be privileging consistency in their continued use of co-working. (We’ve always spelled it this way and will continue to do so…) · Finally, the *WNWCD* just issued its first print revision in decades on August 26. I am guessing that another print edition will not come out for some time. We might lobby for the addition of coworking now, but it would be a while before we saw the change in print. - The online version of *WNWCD* probably publishes updates more regularly, but I can’t view their editorial policy without a subscription. *2. **If we want to argue with the editor(s) at the AP Stylebook directly, we will need a subscription.* · As far as I can tell only subscribers can submit questions to the editor and view the complete archive of past Q and As to the editor. - A yearly subscription to the AP Style Guide is $26. *3. **Why does the New York Times use “coworking” when speaking of the Coworking Visa, but not in other cases, as Jacob mentioned in his post?* · Although the *New York Times* uses the *WNWCD*, they have their very own style guide that conflicts with the AP’s style guide on many points *4. **So, what are our options?* · We can work to have coworking included in various dictionaries. This may not impact the AP Stylebook, but it would contribute to making the distinction between co-working and coworking clearer and bring general awareness to the issue. - I would be happy to do some research on how different dictionaries treat address the issue of co-working v. coworking if at all, and what the editorial policies are for adding/amending entries. · Tweet our discontent - As Carsten Foertsch suggested in his article for deskmag: @APStylebook #Coworking is not Co-working. It’s an independent movement that doesn’t want to be separated by a hyphen! - This was suggested in 2011, however, and there hasn’t been much activity since. Do we want to revitalize this? Perhaps come up with a new hashtag? - Does anyone have other ideas? Hopefully this info will be useful when deciding what steps to take next! -- Lauren Grant Office Nomads officenomads.com 206-323-6500 -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [Coworking] getting rid of the co-working hyphen
Lauren, this is really really handy to know! Does anyone on this group have an active AP Stylebook subscription? On Friday, September 19, 2014, Lauren M Grant lau...@officenomads.com wrote: Hi All, I've done a little research trying to figure out how we might move forward in trying to persuade the AP to reconsider their position on the co-working vs. coworking issue. Most of what follows is less of a concrete plan, and more of the background info we would need in deciding where/how to focus our efforts: *1. **Webster's New World College Dictionary** (WNWCD) is the official dictionary for the AP Stylebook. * · Interestingly, and importantly, the *WNWCD* is not published by Meriam Webster, but by Houghton Mifflin. · There will be differences, then, between *WNWCD*'s and Meriam-Webster's treatment of terms. · So, if we want to begin by getting coworking into a dictionary, it seems like focusing our attention on the *WNWCD* would be best. · *BUT* The AP's rules of spelling, grammar, etc. don't *always* match the *WNWCD.* - For example, the AP spells email without a hyphen, while *WNWCD*'s primary definition retains the hyphen. · So, if *WNWCD* adds coworking to their dictionary it wouldn't necessarily result in a change in the AP's approach to spelling co-working. - Although the AP Stylebooks's values are listed as consistency, clarity, accuracy, and brevity, they definitely seem to be privileging consistency in their continued use of co-working. (We've always spelled it this way and will continue to do so...) · Finally, the *WNWCD* just issued its first print revision in decades on August 26. I am guessing that another print edition will not come out for some time. We might lobby for the addition of coworking now, but it would be a while before we saw the change in print. - The online version of *WNWCD* probably publishes updates more regularly, but I can't view their editorial policy without a subscription. *2. **If we want to argue with the editor(s) at the AP Stylebook directly, we will need a subscription.* · As far as I can tell only subscribers can submit questions to the editor and view the complete archive of past Q and As to the editor. - A yearly subscription to the AP Style Guide is $26. *3. **Why does the New York Times use coworking when speaking of the Coworking Visa, but not in other cases, as Jacob mentioned in his post?* · Although the *New York Times* uses the *WNWCD*, they have their very own style guide that conflicts with the AP's style guide on many points *4. **So, what are our options?* · We can work to have coworking included in various dictionaries. This may not impact the AP Stylebook, but it would contribute to making the distinction between co-working and coworking clearer and bring general awareness to the issue. - I would be happy to do some research on how different dictionaries treat address the issue of co-working v. coworking if at all, and what the editorial policies are for adding/amending entries. · Tweet our discontent - As Carsten Foertsch suggested in his article for deskmag: @APStylebook #Coworking is not Co-working. It's an independent movement that doesn't want to be separated by a hyphen! - This was suggested in 2011, however, and there hasn't been much activity since. Do we want to revitalize this? Perhaps come up with a new hashtag? - Does anyone have other ideas? Hopefully this info will be useful when deciding what steps to take next! -- Lauren Grant Office Nomads officenomads.com 206-323-6500 -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','coworking%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com'); . For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- *--- + Personal: twitter http://twitter.com/tonybgoode * fb http://facebook.com/tonybacigalupo * linkedin https://www.linkedin.com/in/tonybacigalupo+ Projects: NWC http://nwc.co/ * Bossless http://bossless.co/ * Meetup http://meetup.com/coworking-nyc * NYTM http://nytm.org/+ Recent posts: Quarantining new ideas for monthly review http://happymonster.co/2014/08/20/quarantining-new-ideas-for-monthly-review/ * Routine challenges http://happymonster.co/2014/08/14/routine-challenges/ * Act IV http://happymonster.co/2014/08/08/act-iv/* *+ Currently reading: Nonviolent Communication http://amzn.to/1sBVeoR * Passages http://amzn.to/1p8rNai * Work http://amzn.to/1utpc0l* *+ Travel plans: NYC now-9/11 * Boulder 9/11-9/18 * Seattle 9/18-23 * NYC 9/24-Mid-October+ Help: I'm looking for a fab 1BR in south Brooklyn. Let me know if you have any
[Coworking] Free coworking for Climate Week at Impact Hub NYC
Here's a cool promo from the Impact Hub NYC to support the climate movement during the upcoming UN conference on climate change. (Disclosure: My brother Sam Utne runs the Impact Hub NYC.) I like this approach of using their space to support activists while getting more people in the door and building exposure for the space among their target clientele. I'm curious how common this approach is among coworking spaces generally. Do you offer targeted freebies or discounts around big events/conferences in your town (whether or not they have an activist bent)? cheers, Leif -- Heading to NYC for the People's Climate March and UN climate conference? Park yourself for free at the Impact Hub NYC coworking + event space, Sept 22-26. RSVP at http://bit.ly/impacthubclimate. Pass it on. [image: Inline image 1] -- Leif Utne VP of Business Development Warecorp http://warecorp.com / Drupal Squad http://drupalsquad.com +1.612.327.0123 twitter: @leifutne http://twitter.com/leifutne blog: leifutne.com skype: leifutne -- -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
[Coworking] Hiring business partner in Portland Oregon, might you know someone?
I'm hiring a business partner for Collective Agency, one of the main co-working places in Portland Oregon, might you know someone? It pays $50,000-$65,000 per year, and involves sales/marketing, operations, and community organizing. I'd prefer someone who's a woman to balance the gender ratio, although I'm open to the best person for the job. http://collectiveagency.co/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/collective-agency-community-organizer-job-description091914c.pdf Thanks, Alex -- Alex Linsker Collective Agency's Community Organizer / Proprietor (503) 517-6900 http://collectiveagency.co Tax and Conversation's Statewide Community Organizer (503) 517-6904 taxandconversation.com (503) 369-9174 mobile (503) 517-6901 fax 322 NW Sixth Ave, Suite 200, Portland, Oregon 97209 -- Visit this forum on the web at http://discuss.coworking.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Coworking group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
