Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Ed Willink]

Hi

I agree that the Oracle JDK can be freely used for development and testing.

But I see a concern wrt the unusual wording “or your application” that 
subsequent use in an application is then infected imposing the 
commercial license on our users.


I'm not the EF or a lawyer, so I look to the EF and its lawyers to guide 
us. Yes OpenJDK is used on Jenkins; no problem. But what if I use Oracle 
JDK on my development machine? Does that infect Eclipse OCL, Papyrus, 
the Modeling EPP or SimRel. If I use Oracle JDK to develop a patch for 
SWT does that infect SWT?


Regards

Ed Willink


On 11/12/2018 20:52, Michael Keppler wrote:

Am 11.12.2018 um 21:10 schrieb Ed Willink:
Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used? 


I'm not the EF, and I'm not a lawyer.

It's a bit long, but worth reading 
https://medium.com/@javachampions/java-is-still-free-c02aef8c9e04, 
where the legal stuff is explained, and a huge number of alternatives 
are listed with pros and cons.


Oracle itself recommends switching to OpenJDK builds (which are 
available from multiple parties), as long as you need no commercial 
support. In fact, you can get an Oracle OpenJDK build, which is almost 
identical with the previous OracleJDK: 
https://blogs.oracle.com/java-platform-group/oracle-jdk-releases-for-java-11-and-later


The change has been announced long ago, and basically it boils down 
to: You can use OracleJDK without a license for development, testing, 
etc. but for commercial deployment you need a license, or you need to 
use a different JVM build.



Ciao, Michael

PS: Doug, for me the AdoptOpenJDK Windows build generally worked fine, 
but its certificate store did not work at all, which was a killer for me.


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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Marcel Bruch]

Sorry. Didn‘t notice that Andreas already answered.



Von meinem iPad gesendet

> Am 12.12.2018 um 07:11 schrieb Marcel Bruch :
> 
> Hi Wayne,
> 
> Andreas is trying to fix this but it looks like he can‘t make it in addition 
> to his other duties :-( I‘ll wait until the end of this week before making 
> the final announcement to see if Andreas gets things running once more.
> 
> But my current assumption is: Starting with 2018-12.
> 
> Marcel
> 
> Von meinem iPad gesendet
> 
>> Am 11.12.2018 um 21:53 schrieb Wayne Beaton 
>> :
>> 
>> Starting when?
>> 
>> i.e. is Eclipse Code Recommenders still in for 2018-12?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Wayne
>> 
>>> On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 3:49 PM Marcel Bruch  
>>> wrote:
>>> Dear Cross-Projects,
>>> 
>>> I‘d like to withdraw Code Recommenders participation from the SimRel and 
>>> EPP packages.
>>> 
>>> The project committers currently do not have enough resources to keep pace 
>>> with the changes in JDT/Java and thus we‘ve to take this necessary and long 
>>> due action.
>>> 
>>> Best,
>>> Marcel
>>> 
>>> Von meinem iPad gesendet
>>> ___
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>>> from this list, visit
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>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Wayne Beaton
>> Director of Open Source Projects | Eclipse Foundation, Inc.
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Marcel Bruch]

Hi Wayne,

Andreas is trying to fix this but it looks like he can‘t make it in addition to 
his other duties :-( I‘ll wait until the end of this week before making the 
final announcement to see if Andreas gets things running once more.

But my current assumption is: Starting with 2018-12.

Marcel

Von meinem iPad gesendet

> Am 11.12.2018 um 21:53 schrieb Wayne Beaton 
> :
> 
> Starting when?
> 
> i.e. is Eclipse Code Recommenders still in for 2018-12?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Wayne
> 
>> On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 3:49 PM Marcel Bruch  
>> wrote:
>> Dear Cross-Projects,
>> 
>> I‘d like to withdraw Code Recommenders participation from the SimRel and EPP 
>> packages.
>> 
>> The project committers currently do not have enough resources to keep pace 
>> with the changes in JDT/Java and thus we‘ve to take this necessary and long 
>> due action.
>> 
>> Best,
>> Marcel
>> 
>> Von meinem iPad gesendet
>> ___
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Wayne Beaton
> Director of Open Source Projects | Eclipse Foundation, Inc.
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Andreas Sewe]

Wayne Beaton wrote:
I believe that we have packages that include Eclipse Code Recommenders. 
We'll need to make sure that they adapt accordingly.


Yes, if I can't make the build work, I will prepare a change for the 
org.eclipse.epp.packages project that removes Code Recommenders from the 
packages that contain it.


Best wishes,

Andreas
--
Codetrails GmbH
The best code possible

Robert-Bosch-Str. 7, 64293 Darmstadt
Phone: +49-6151-276-7092
Mobile: +49-170-811-3791
http://www.codetrails.com/

Managing Director: Dr. Marcel Bruch
Handelsregister: Darmstadt HRB 91940

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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Wayne Beaton]

I believe that we have packages that include Eclipse Code Recommenders.
We'll need to make sure that they adapt accordingly.

Wayne

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 4:04 PM Andreas Sewe 
wrote:

> Wayne Beaton wrote:
> > Starting when?
> >
> > i.e. is Eclipse Code Recommenders still in for 2018-12?
>
> not answering for the project lead, but just as a regular committer, who
> has ATM unfortunately very little time for maintenance work:
>
> I would like to contribute to 2018-12 *if* I can get Code Recommenders
> to build against 2018-12 and Java 11 in time. But currently, I am moving
> from one built-time error message to another and don't know yet whether
> things settle in time for our simrel contribution. So personally, I
> can't make any promises.
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Andreas
> --
> Codetrails GmbH
> The best code possible
>
> Robert-Bosch-Str. 7, 64293 Darmstadt
> Phone: +49-6151-276-7092
> Mobile: +49-170-811-3791
> http://www.codetrails.com/
>
> Managing Director: Dr. Marcel Bruch
> Handelsregister: Darmstadt HRB 91940
>
>

-- 

Wayne Beaton

Director of Open Source Projects | Eclipse Foundation, Inc.
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Andreas Sewe]

Wayne Beaton wrote:

Starting when?

i.e. is Eclipse Code Recommenders still in for 2018-12?


not answering for the project lead, but just as a regular committer, who 
has ATM unfortunately very little time for maintenance work:


I would like to contribute to 2018-12 *if* I can get Code Recommenders 
to build against 2018-12 and Java 11 in time. But currently, I am moving 
from one built-time error message to another and don't know yet whether 
things settle in time for our simrel contribution. So personally, I 
can't make any promises.


Hope this helps,

Andreas
--
Codetrails GmbH
The best code possible

Robert-Bosch-Str. 7, 64293 Darmstadt
Phone: +49-6151-276-7092
Mobile: +49-170-811-3791
http://www.codetrails.com/

Managing Director: Dr. Marcel Bruch
Handelsregister: Darmstadt HRB 91940

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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Wayne Beaton]

Starting when?

i.e. is Eclipse Code Recommenders still in for 2018-12?

Thanks,

Wayne

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 3:49 PM Marcel Bruch 
wrote:

> Dear Cross-Projects,
>
> I‘d like to withdraw Code Recommenders participation from the SimRel and
> EPP packages.
>
> The project committers currently do not have enough resources to keep pace
> with the changes in JDT/Java and thus we‘ve to take this necessary and long
> due action.
>
> Best,
> Marcel
>
> Von meinem iPad gesendet
> ___
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> from this list, visit
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-- 

Wayne Beaton

Director of Open Source Projects | Eclipse Foundation, Inc.
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Michael Keppler]

Am 11.12.2018 um 21:10 schrieb Ed Willink:
Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used? 


I'm not the EF, and I'm not a lawyer.

It's a bit long, but worth reading 
https://medium.com/@javachampions/java-is-still-free-c02aef8c9e04, where 
the legal stuff is explained, and a huge number of alternatives are 
listed with pros and cons.


Oracle itself recommends switching to OpenJDK builds (which are 
available from multiple parties), as long as you need no commercial 
support. In fact, you can get an Oracle OpenJDK build, which is almost 
identical with the previous OracleJDK: 
https://blogs.oracle.com/java-platform-group/oracle-jdk-releases-for-java-11-and-later


The change has been announced long ago, and basically it boils down to: 
You can use OracleJDK without a license for development, testing, etc. 
but for commercial deployment you need a license, or you need to use a 
different JVM build.



Ciao, Michael

PS: Doug, for me the AdoptOpenJDK Windows build generally worked fine, 
but its certificate store did not work at all, which was a killer for me.


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[cross-project-issues-dev] Withdrawing Code Recommenders from SimRel

[Marcel Bruch]

Dear Cross-Projects,

I‘d like to withdraw Code Recommenders participation from the SimRel and EPP 
packages.

The project committers currently do not have enough resources to keep pace with 
the changes in JDT/Java and thus we‘ve to take this necessary and long due 
action.

Best,
Marcel

Von meinem iPad gesendet
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Doug Schaefer]

I've been considering AdoptOpenJDK, especially now that they have builds for 
all three major platform. Is that a road well travelled?

https://adoptopenjdk.net/releases.html

Doug.

On Tue, 2018-12-11 at 21:38 +0100, Mikaël Barbero wrote:
Ed,

See https://wiki.eclipse.org/Jenkins#JDK to see what versions we provide in 
build environments. There is also a note about new Oracle JDK licensing.

HTH.

Mikaël Barbero
Team Lead - Release Engineering | Eclipse Foundation
📱 (+33) 642 028 039 | 🐦 @mikbarbero
Eclipse Foundation: The Platform for Open Innovation 
and Collaboration

Le 11 déc. 2018 à 21:16, Mike Milinkovich 
mailto:mike.milinkov...@eclipse-foundation.org>>
 a écrit :


There is no policy on the Java version. But I don’t understand why anyone would 
elect to use Java under the OTN license when you could also use it under the 
GPL+CE?

Mike Milinkovich
mike.milinkov...@eclipse-foundation.org
(m) +1.613.220.3223

On Dec 11, 2018, at 12:10 PM, Ed Willink 
mailto:e...@willink.me.uk>> wrote:

Hi

Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used?

https://www.computerweekly.com/opinion/Beware-of-Oracles-developer-Trojan

suggests that the Oracle JDK that I have used in the past may no longer be 
appropriate.

Please advise.

Regards

Ed Willink



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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Mikaël Barbero]

Ed,

See https://wiki.eclipse.org/Jenkins#JDK  
to see what versions we provide in build environments. There is also a note 
about new Oracle JDK licensing.

HTH.

Mikaël Barbero
Team Lead - Release Engineering | Eclipse Foundation
📱 (+33) 642 028 039 | 🐦 @mikbarbero
Eclipse Foundation : The Platform for Open Innovation 
and Collaboration

> Le 11 déc. 2018 à 21:16, Mike Milinkovich 
>  a écrit :
> 
> 
> There is no policy on the Java version. But I don’t understand why anyone 
> would elect to use Java under the OTN license when you could also use it 
> under the GPL+CE?
> 
> Mike Milinkovich
> mike.milinkov...@eclipse-foundation.org 
> 
> (m) +1.613.220.3223
> 
> On Dec 11, 2018, at 12:10 PM, Ed Willink  > wrote:
> 
>> Hi
>> 
>> Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used?
>> 
>> https://www.computerweekly.com/opinion/Beware-of-Oracles-developer-Trojan 
>> 
>> 
>> suggests that the Oracle JDK that I have used in the past may no longer be 
>> appropriate.
>> 
>> Please advise.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Ed Willink
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ---
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Ed Willink]

Hi

Familiarity. Oracle: I just 'accept without reading' and then do much 
the same as I have for the last ten years.


I looked at OpenJDK and was confused what to do. I then Googled, found 
the Trojan warning and emailed asking for advice.


AFAICT, the Oracle license is probably legally invalid, but until 
withdrawn/overturned, any SimRel project using Oracle Java 11 might 
infect the whole of the SimRel.


It seems to me that the EF should ban Oracle Java 11 for development; 
only allowing use for verification testing.


    Regards

        Ed Willink



On 11/12/2018 20:16, Mike Milinkovich wrote:


There is no policy on the Java version. But I don’t understand why 
anyone would elect to use Java under the OTN license when you could 
also use it under the GPL+CE?


Mike Milinkovich
mike.milinkov...@eclipse-foundation.org 


(m) +1.613.220.3223

On Dec 11, 2018, at 12:10 PM, Ed Willink > wrote:



Hi

Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used?

https://www.computerweekly.com/opinion/Beware-of-Oracles-developer-Trojan

suggests that the Oracle JDK that I have used in the past may no 
longer be appropriate.


Please advise.

Regards

Ed Willink



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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Mike Milinkovich]

There is no policy on the Java version. But I don’t understand why anyone would 
elect to use Java under the OTN license when you could also use it under the 
GPL+CE? 

Mike Milinkovich
mike.milinkov...@eclipse-foundation.org
(m) +1.613.220.3223

> On Dec 11, 2018, at 12:10 PM, Ed Willink  wrote:
> 
> Hi
> 
> Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used?
> 
> https://www.computerweekly.com/opinion/Beware-of-Oracles-developer-Trojan
> 
> suggests that the Oracle JDK that I have used in the past may no longer be 
> appropriate.
> 
> Please advise.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Ed Willink
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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[cross-project-issues-dev] Java 11 recommendations

[Ed Willink]

Hi

Is there an EF policy on what Java 11 should be used?

https://www.computerweekly.com/opinion/Beware-of-Oracles-developer-Trojan

suggests that the Oracle JDK that I have used in the past may no longer 
be appropriate.


Please advise.

Regards

Ed Willink



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[cross-project-issues-dev] Disk usage report for HIPP/JIPPs

[genie]

Compiled 2018-12-11-13:30:01

Projects exceeding 80G of disk space on HIPP/JIPPs:
===
983G /jobs/genie.packaging
164G /jobs/genie.openj9
152G /jobs/genie.xtext
93G /jobs/genie.capella
88G /jobs/genie.platform
86G /jobs/genie.osee
82G /jobs/genie.ice
80G /jobs/genie.sirius
===

If you find your project's name in the above list, please check
your Hudson/Jenkins configuration and try to lower the disk usage.

You can find more information about CI best practices and disk usage
here: https://wiki.eclipse.org/CI_best_practices#Disk_usage.
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Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] CDT contribution delayed for 2018-12 RC2

[Jonah Graham]

Hello folks,

CDT has now made its contribution: https://git.eclipse.org/r/#/c/133872/

A heads up in case it matters. To get CDT to work we added a Java 11 only
fragment. To be able to build and consume it we needed to upgrade CDT's
tycho version to the upcoming 1.3.0. However the simrel seems to build fine
with Tycho 1.0.0. I flag this in case there is some unintentional
consequence I introduced.

Thanks
Jonah


~~~
Jonah Graham
Kichwa Coders Ltd.
www.kichwacoders.com


On Mon, 10 Dec 2018 at 22:44, Jonah Graham  wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
> It looks like CDT will be a late for making our RC2 contribution today. We
> are working on a Java 8 vs Java 11 issue related to JAXB. If nothing else
> pops up we should have this in tomorrow.
>
> Much detail in the below email chain (from cdt-dev
> ) and in Bug 542644
> .
>
> Thanks,
> Jonah
>
> ~~~
> Jonah Graham
> Kichwa Coders Ltd.
> www.kichwacoders.com
>
>
> -- Forwarded message -
> From: Jonah Graham 
> Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2018 at 22:41
> Subject: Re: [cdt-dev] Can't get CDT checked out in Eclipse to run
> To: William Riley 
> Cc: CDT General developers list. , Doug Schaefer <
> dschae...@blackberry.com>
>
>
> Hi folks
>
> OK. I will pick this up tomorrow. I have kicked CDT 9.6 to build again
> against the newest tools.templates. That will be available in a few hours
> https://download.eclipse.org/tools/cdt/builds/9.6/nightly/
>
> Assuming I can satisfactorily test everything in the morning I will
> release then.
>
> Thanks
> Jonah
>
> ~~~
> Jonah Graham
> Kichwa Coders Ltd.
> www.kichwacoders.com
>
>
> On Mon, 10 Dec 2018 at 22:27, William Riley 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Jonah
>>
>>
>>
>> CDT is already fixed at least for the makefile case, but I had to match
>> it in the non-CDT plugins to get it working without weird runtime but not
>> build time errors. I noticed PTP doesn’t seems to be trying to use 
>> JAXBContext
>> which might explain the issue there.
>>
>>
>>
>> I also see the illegal reflective warning.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> William
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Jonah Graham 
>> *Sent:* 10 December 2018 22:22
>> *To:* William Riley 
>> *Cc:* CDT General developers list. ; Doug Schaefer <
>> dschae...@blackberry.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: [cdt-dev] Can't get CDT checked out in Eclipse to run
>>
>>
>>
>> (Never mind on using the bugzilla. Eclipse's infra problems
>>  today mean
>> Bugzilla emails are too unreliable. Apologies to subscribers who don't want
>> to know details on this!)
>>
>>
>>
>> > Ah, it all works correctly when using ContextFactory.createContext
>> rather than JAXBContext.newInstance in all cases on Java 11 (I missed a
>> couple). Still needs those imports though.
>>
>>
>>
>> William, is this something you can provide a patch for soon?
>>
>>
>>
>> > WARNING: An illegal reflective access operation has occurred
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes Jeff, I get that too.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jonah
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ~~~
>> Jonah Graham
>> Kichwa Coders Ltd.
>> www.kichwacoders.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, 10 Dec 2018 at 22:15, William Riley 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Ah, it all works correctly when using ContextFactory.createContext rather
>> than JAXBContext.newInstance in all cases on Java 11 (I missed a couple).
>> Still needs those imports though.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> William
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* cdt-dev-boun...@eclipse.org  *On
>> Behalf Of *William Riley
>> *Sent:* 10 December 2018 22:03
>> *To:* Jonah Graham ; Doug Schaefer <
>> dschae...@blackberry.com>; CDT General developers list. <
>> cdt-...@eclipse.org>
>> *Subject:* Re: [cdt-dev] Can't get CDT checked out in Eclipse to run
>>
>>
>>
>> Just tried with more of our IDE and can reproduce the OSGI weirdness when
>> other plugins also need JAXB on Java 11. Currently investigating a fix,
>>  the one suggested in
>> https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=541264#c15 doesn’t seem to
>> help.
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> William
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Jonah Graham 
>> *Sent:* 10 December 2018 21:19
>> *To:* Doug Schaefer ; CDT General developers
>> list. 
>> *Cc:* William Riley 
>> *Subject:* Re: [cdt-dev] Can't get CDT checked out in Eclipse to run
>>
>>
>>
>> OK. Lets revert the change  for
>> now. I will kick that off and start releasing CDT 9.6.0 for 2018-12 RC2
>> which will include updated o.e.tools.templates.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Jonah
>>
>>
>> ~~~
>> Jonah Graham
>> Kichwa Coders Ltd.
>> www.kichwacoders.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, 10 Dec 2018 at 19:59, Doug Schaefer 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I'm not getting it now in my dev environment. We can try reverting the
>> change and see if it's a real issue.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, 2018-12-10 at 19:45 +, William Riley wrote:
>>
>> I was trying CDT + one other plugin importing javax.bind. Tried putting
>> PTP into my target platform but eclipse wouldn’t let me (apparently it
>> couldn’t