Re: UK intelligence agencies want 7 years of records of all phone calls, emails and internet connections

2000-12-04 Thread Clive D.W. Feather

Caspar Bowden said:
 ..Britain's intelligence services are seeking powers to seize all records
 of telephone calls, emails and internet connections made by every person
 living in this country. A document circulated to Home Office officials and
 obtained by The Observer reveals that MI5, MI6 and the police are demanding
 new legislation to log every phone call made in this country and store the
 information for seven years at a vast government-run 'data warehouse', a
 super computer that will hold the information...
 
 The document referred to in the Observer front page story today appears to
 have been posted on the US website "Cryptome".
 
 == http://cryptome.org/ncis-carnivore.htm

Calling this "NCIS carnivore" is misleading. It's concerned with
transaction logs (who logged in when, web site logs, the sort of thing
covered as "communications data" in RIP). Nothing to do with the contents
of phone calls or email.

I've been aware of these proposals for some time. Basically, the police
*have* the power to obtain this data *where the CSP has retained it*. What
this paper wants is to retain all the data for the length of time that it
could be useful, and for ease of access (under lawful authority, of course)
consolidate it in a single database.

It is pointed out that defence lawyers have use for such data as well.

[I disagree strongly with the proposals, both on civil liberties grounds
and because I think maintaining a "clean" database will be impractical.]

-- 
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Re: UK intelligence agencies want 7 years of records of all phone calls, emails and internet connections

2000-12-04 Thread John Young

Clive Feather wrote:

Calling this "NCIS carnivore" is misleading. It's concerned with
transaction logs (who logged in when, web site logs, the sort of thing
covered as "communications data" in RIP). Nothing to do with the contents
of phone calls or email.

I've been aware of these proposals for some time.

The connection to Carnivore was made by the anonymous source
of the document, probably a person within one of the CSPs which
had been given the document for consultation -- as it sets forth. A
person who likely has access to other yet undisclosed consultations,
as Clive suggests is a fact of life for providers.

In the US we have learned that the capabilities of Carnivore are more 
than has been publicly admitted, that it is only one in a series of 
developing surveillance technologies, one of a series of legislative 
initiatives, one of a series of trial balloons lofted for public reaction.

The major ISPs in the US are being consulted on these rapidly
developing means and methods, as were the telcos in days past 
and telecomms in the present. And it has been established that these 
corporations have been presented with, and themselves initiated, 
surveillance and interception programs, as ever, in the national 
interest -- which means in the interest of favorable regulation
and economic advantage, now global not merely national.

"Carnivore" is an apt term for the process of ravenous cooperation 
between telecommunications providers and their regulators in all
the countries where that is occurring -- the list of admitted participants 
is growing daily. And the FBI and DoJ make no secret of their drive 
to have seamless global cooperation, helped as ever by US legal and 
technological prowess and lubricated by financial incentives.

What is striking is how often HMG is willing to serve as stalking
horse for draconian surveillance programs that later get adopted in 
some form by other countries. What the dark side of HMG is being 
promised for that contemptible role is worth sunshining by whoever
gets hands on evidence.