Cryptography-Digest Digest #737

[Digestifier]

Cryptography-Digest Digest #737, Volume #9   Sat, 19 Jun 99 09:13:02 EDT

Contents:
  Re: rc4 vs. rand() ("Roger Schlafly")
  Re: DES Encryption Function and an MLP ("Earl Cox")
  VIC cipher now described on web site (John Savard)
  More on Chaos ("John E. Kuslich")
  Re: test ("Erik Avat'R")
  Re: test ("Erik Avat'R")
  Re: Phone scrambler : what encryption used ? ("Major Wood")
  Re: SLIDE ATTACK FAILS ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  Re: Question about Cryptography/Encryption... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  Re: GA and 64-bit XOR Encryption (James Pate Williams, Jr.)
  IDEA Questions (Casey Sybrandy)
  Re: SLIDE ATTACK FAILS ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  D - CD-R crypt (Dupavoy)
  Re: D - CD-R crypt ("Steven Alexander")
  Re: RSA example with small numbers (Dan Moschuk)



From: "Roger Schlafly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: rc4 vs. rand()
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 14:10:48 -0700

Aidan Skinner wrote in message ...
>>keep it trade secret for a while, but it was released into the public
>>domain several years ago.
>
>Has The Company accepted this yet? Just curious.

Yes. There are companies that have been using the RC4 algorithm
freely, openly, and without objection for several years.




--

From: "Earl Cox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.ai.neural-nets
Subject: Re: DES Encryption Function and an MLP
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 18:34:05 -0400

Doug, you have my vote!

Conference proceedings, academic books, and papers are filled with complex
solutions to toy problems. I just made a similar comment about evolutionary
programming. I must have a two inch thick stack of EP papers on evolving
LISP programs to solve toy problems (like solving a quadratic function),
some with words like "A Real Word Approach to..." where "real world" means
that the grad student was assigned the problem by his/her professor.

Well, I don't mean to belabor the point. I just seldom find someone else in
the group who knows the difference between the real world and academic
exercises.

Earl

Douglas A. Gwyn wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>fungus wrote:
>> That was an interestign project. How much progress did you actually
>> make? Did you ever manage to solve DES for small number of rounds?
>
>I'm absolutely not interested in applying the methodology to toy
>problems, except as a debugging aid.  The problem with starting
>out with the idea of using toys is that one tends to develop methods
>that don't scale well to the real problems.

*** http://www.metus.com *
Earl D. Cox Fuzzy Logic and Computational Intelligence
CEO/PresidentSoftware, Consulting, Training
Metus SystemsData Mining and Intelligent Rule Discovery
Chapel Hill, NC  C/C++ Java Visual Basic

(919) 859-1736 (vox) Exploring the Mind of Business
(919) 851-3525 (fax)
**
AUTHOR:
"The Fuzzy Systems Handbook" (1994)
"Fuzzy Logic for Business and Industry" (1995)
"Beyond Humanity: CyberEvolution and Future Minds"
(1996, with Greg Paul, Paleontologist/Artist)
"The Fuzzy Systems Handbook, 2nd Ed." (1998)
"Fuzzy Tools for Data Mining and Knowledge Discovery"
(due Early Summer, 1999)



--

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Savard)
Subject: VIC cipher now described on web site
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 22:34:40 GMT

Over the past few days, I've been making a number of minor changes and
additions to the paper-and-pencil ciphers portion of my web site. The
first one I already mentioned, which also accompanied a change in the
section on teletypewriter ciphers: I mentioned the one-time-pad.

Since then, I made a number of other changes, ranging from a
one-letter correction of an example in the section on transposition
ciphers to the addition of a new diagram of my cipher wheel invention.

As there is some interest in secure paper and pencil ciphers, I now
added a new section to the paper and pencil chapter describing the
"hollow nickel" cipher: it's at

http://members.xoom.com/quadibloc/pp0104.htm

and of course the information was obtained from the works of David
Kahn, which are credited.

John Savard ( teneerf<- )
http://members.xoom.com/quadibloc/crypto.htm

--

From: "John E. Kuslich" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: More on Chaos
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 07:16:10 -0700

There is a beautiful book on fractals with some incredible plates.  If
fractal graphics turns you on, this is a book you should own.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0387158510/craksoftwarpassw

JK

--
CRAK Software (Password Recovery Software)
Http://www.crak.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
602 863 9274 or 1 800 505 2725 In the USA



--

From: "Erik Avat'R" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: test
Date:

Cryptography-Digest Digest #738

[Digestifier]

Cryptography-Digest Digest #738, Volume #9   Sat, 19 Jun 99 09:13:02 EDT

Contents:
  [SSL-Talk List FAQ] Secure Sockets Layer Discussion List FAQ v1.1.1 (Shannon Appel)



From: Shannon Appel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: 
alt.security,comp.security.misc,comp.protocols,comp.infosystems.www.misc,alt.answers,comp.answers,news.answers,sci.answers
Subject: [SSL-Talk List FAQ] Secure Sockets Layer Discussion List FAQ v1.1.1
Date: 19 Jun 1999 12:22:31 GMT

Content-type: text/x-usenet-FAQ;
version=1.1;
title="[SSL-Talk List FAQ] Secure Sockets Layer Discussion List FAQ v1.1.1"
Archive-name: computer-security/ssl-talk-faq
Posting-Frequency: monthly
Last-modified: Nov 16 12:00:00 PST 1998
Version: 1.1.1 (text) Mon Nov 16 12:00:00 PST 1998
URL: http://www.consensus.com/security/ssl-talk-faq.html
Copyright-Notice: (c) Copyright 1996-1998 by Consensus Development Corporation -- All 
Rights Reserved


  SSL-Talk FAQ
Secure Sockets Layer Discussion List FAQ v1.1.1

  Mon Nov 16 12:00:00 PST 1998

   FAQ Maintained by:
  Shannon Appel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Consensus Development Corporation


 The latest edition of this FAQ can always be found at:
  
   

  Copyright (c) 1996-1998 Consensus Development Corporation - All Rights 
  Reserved

* 
Due to the November 15, 1998 dissolution of the SSL-Talk mailing 
list, this will be the last version of this FAQ in its current form. 
It will be replaced by a more general TLS & SSL FAQ in the near 
future that is not tied to any mailing list or newsgroup. 
*

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Tim Dierks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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Remaining ambiguities, errors, and difficult-to-read passages are
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==

Cryptography-Digest Digest #739

[Digestifier]

Cryptography-Digest Digest #739, Volume #9   Sun, 20 Jun 99 00:13:03 EDT

Contents:
  Re: IDEA Questions ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  Re: SLIDE ATTACK FAILS ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  Re: test (Gergo Barany)
  Re: test (Chris Eilbeck)
  Re: F-secure (kurt wismer)
  Re: *** FAKE KEYS AGAIN *** ("Soylent Grin")
  Re: *** FAKE KEYS AGAIN *** ("Michel Bouissou")
  Re: IDEA Questions (Casey Sybrandy)
  Re: SLIDE ATTACK & large state SYSTEMS (Boris Kazak)
  Re: SLIDE ATTACK & large state SYSTEMS (Tim Redburn)
  Re: SLIDE ATTACK & large state SYSTEMS (Tim Redburn)
  Re: IDEA Questions (John Savard)
  Re: F-secure (Tom McCune)
  Re: Graph of DES Encryption Function (James Pate Williams, Jr.)
  Re: DES versus Blowfish ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
  Re: Graph of DES Encryption Function ([EMAIL PROTECTED])



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: IDEA Questions
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 11:28:50 GMT

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
  Casey Sybrandy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have a couple questions about IDEA that I was wondering if anyone
knew
> the answer to.  I'll be referencing AC2 pages 320&321 instead of
trying
> to redescribe everything on my own.
>
> 1. Steps 5, 6, 11-14 all use XOR.  Why can't you change these to
> additions or subtractions?
>
> 2. In steps 7-10, there is a mixing of additions and multiplications.
> Why can't you add in some data dependency into this mixing, like data
> dependant rotates?

The purpose was that if a register was added in one round, it would
xor'd in the next.  These operations are non-isomorphic, i.e they do
not commute.  They are also non linear.  The idea was to not be
dependant on one form of operation.  They could have written the entire
cipher with mul/add but they commute.

Rotations were not added because only three primitives were focused
on.  And by have data dependant round structures you are not sure to
get the same form of mixing.

Tom
--
PGP key is at:
'http://mypage.goplay.com/tomstdenis/key.pgp'.


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

--

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: SLIDE ATTACK FAILS
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 11:31:33 GMT

In article <7kev33$1ak4$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Ever notice how much Mr. DSCOTT uses projection as a defense
mechanism?  He
> goes off about how the NSA is shrouded in secrecy and yet fails to
produce
> an easy-to-understand flow chart of his code.  He attacks other
people as
> "hating" him, when really he's the one that hates the rest of the
world.

I can only wonder why...He is not very mature, but is fun to read (well
funny to read).  He just wants to be king of the castle, problem is
there is no castle :)

Tom

--
PGP key is at:
'http://mypage.goplay.com/tomstdenis/key.pgp'.


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

--

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gergo Barany)
Subject: Re: test
Date: 19 Jun 1999 12:35:39 GMT

In article <7kehoa$63v$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Erik Avat'R wrote:
>Firstly sorry about the computer thing.
>was being a jerk...
>and if you dont mind me asking what do you mean by "...HTML practically
>posts your article twice..."?

First, there is a header saying "this is a multipart message, blabla,"
followed by the plaintext. Then, there's another header indicating the
beginning of the HTML part followed by the complete text including
formatting. Try finding an HTML post, saving it to a file and looking at
it in an editor.

Gergo

-- 
Never settle with words what you can accomplish with a flame thrower.

GU d- s:+ a--- C++>$ UL+++ P>++ L+++ E>++ W+ N++ o? K- w--- !O !M !V
PS+ PE+ Y+ PGP+ t* 5+ X- R>+ tv++ b+>+++ DI+ D+ G>++ e* h! !r !y+

--

From: Chris Eilbeck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: test
Date: 19 Jun 1999 15:41:47 +0100

"Erik Avat'R" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> and if you dont mind me asking what do you mean by "...HTML practically
> posts your article twice..."?

Please read this web site http://www.ping.be/houghi/nohtml/

Chris
-- 
Chris Eilbeck mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

--

From: kurt wismer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: F-secure
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 00:07:27 GMT

Dupavoy wrote:
> 
> Has anyone used F-secure 2.0 by F-prot?

just a nitpick, f-secure is not made by f-prot, f-prot is not a company,
it is an anti-virus product produced by frisk software international...
the f-prot engine is used in the f-secure anti-virus product produced by
datafellows, not to be confused with the f-secure encryption product
produced by datafellows which i suspect you have done...

haven't used the f-secure line of products (encryption or av) though...

-- 
"sometimes i cannot take this place
 sometimes it's my life i can't taste
 sometimes i cannot feel my face
 you'll never see me fall from grace"


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