Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- >> Some pagans did that. Most didnt. The pagans best known to us for the >> practice were the Carthagenians. >Not in my neighborhood. The best known, were the Moloch worshipers. Same guys. They were ethnic Phoenicians, a colony. >Evidently the same didn't apply to the charms of crucifixion which the Romans got to like very well. All cultures have a blind spot when it comes to their own customs. Even we Americans suffer from the demonstrably false belief that we are the good guys. >Bad as all this smiting and rending asunder was, it was nothing compared to the common cruelties of the period. Actually, it was pretty normal for the era. The Israelites were neither better nor worse than the Peoples around them. >They had no choice. They didn't have an army. Jews could have raised an army. They chose not to. Then, in 1943, some of them changed their minds. They raised what is arguably one of the best armies in history. >Samson was a Nazirite too. Robert Graves says the Samson story is a metaphor, one of a broad class of similar solar myths. Im not personally qualified to pass definitive judgment one way or the other, but I like your version better. >> Apparently. Thats certainly what Nag Hammadi points to. >So? It means that the New Testament version of the historical Jesus life has been dramatically garbled. (Surprise!) >I don't know. I would guess that anything found that relates to that period would be sensational and well covered. If it disproves the basic tenets of a major world religion, people WILL try to cover it up. Look at the Nag Hammadi documents themselves. Its been half a century and still we dont know all they contained. www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ÝÝÝCTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. ÝÝÝÚrchives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl o subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Nessie wrote: > > -Caveat Lector- > > >Even so, I doubt that boonie towns were integrated. > > If the OT has any truth to it, the suppression of paganism within > Israelite controlled territory went on for something like 800 years. To > me this says pagans were spread around pretty widely. Of course they were spread widely. There was only ONE group who were not Pagans. Wanna guess? > > >That's my point. She either did or didn't exist, or if she did exist, > she could have been anybody. > > Not just anybody, but there are a number of possibilities. What exactly > she was, well never know. Those guys who say that they do know are > lying. You got that right. > > >Poor Pagans. I guess the I guess the Jews gave them a hard time about > burring their children and other human sacrifices. > > Some pagans did that. Most didnt. The pagans best known to us for the > practice were the Carthagenians. Not in my neighborhood. The best known, were the Moloch worshipers. > They were annihilated as a people by > other pagans, the Romans. > Romans thought the custom was disgusting, > probably because it was something their chief rivals did. Evidently the same didn't apply to the charms of crucifixion which the Romans got to like very well. > Jews of that era tended to treat their rivals harshly, falling upon > them, smiting them, rendering them asunder and what not. They certainly > couldnt claim any moral high ground. Oh yes they could. You are thinking in modern terms. Bad as all this smiting and rending asunder was, it was nothing compared to the common cruelties of the period. > They werent very nice to each > other, either. They stoned adulterers, Don't knock being a stoned adulterer until you've tried it. > for example, also juvenile > delinquents. On the other hand, for almost two thousand years, Jews > were arguably the most peace loving People on earth. They had no choice. They didn't have an army. > Most of them still > are. But that came later. > > >If you mean Hellenism. Yes. If you mean something else, then not > likely. > > Hellenism for sure, what else we dont know. Persian religious thought, > and presumably some practice, was quite popular among a large numbers of > Jews of the time. A case can be made that portions of modern Judaism is > are Persian grafts. Could be. > >This is a good observation, but consider this. James, Jesus' brother > was > a NAZIR. A Nazir is the ONLY instance in Jewish culture where it is > permitted > to put aside the commandment to be fruitful and multiply. In other > words, > if one dedicates his life to the service of god, he may be a monk. > > Good point. I hadnt thought of that. Tell us more about the Nazir. > > >James was a Nazir > > Source on that? Acts ( 21:18-23 ). The final showdown between Paul and James. James tells Paul about penitents in the temple who have taken an oath upon themselves (Consecrated=Nazir). The Nazirite oath as described in the book of numbers and further elucidated in the Talmud. Samson was a Nazirite too. He derived his strength from his personal holyness. Not from his long hair. Nazirs did not cut their hair or play hide the salami. When Delilah cut Samson's hair, it was symbolic that Samson renegged on his oath and was no longer a 'separated one'. A consecrated one. A holy roller. He lost his god given special power. You know the rest. > > He apparently got some part of John the Baptist's movement. > > Apparently. Thats certainly what Nag Hammadi points to. So? > >This of course ALL speculation. But it's speculation within the correct > framework. > > Its still speculation, though. To get really beyond speculation well > need for more data to come in. Hopefully some archeologist will luck out > and find some documentation. Its possible. Given enough time, its even > likely. Seeing it reach the mass media when it happens, is a little > less likely. But we can hope. I don't know. I would guess that anything found that relates to that period would be sensational and well covered. J2 http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMA
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- >Even so, I doubt that boonie towns were integrated. If the OT has any truth to it, the suppression of paganism within Israelite controlled territory went on for something like 800 years. To me this says pagans were spread around pretty widely. >That's my point. She either did or didn't exist, or if she did exist, she could have been anybody. Not just anybody, but there are a number of possibilities. What exactly she was, well never know. Those guys who say that they do know are lying. >Poor Pagans. I guess the I guess the Jews gave them a hard time about burring their children and other human sacrifices. Some pagans did that. Most didnt. The pagans best known to us for the practice were the Carthagenians. They were annihilated as a people by other pagans, the Romans. Romans thought the custom was disgusting, probably because it was something their chief rivals did. Jews of that era tended to treat their rivals harshly, falling upon them, smiting them, rendering them asunder and what not. They certainly couldnt claim any moral high ground. They werent very nice to each other, either. They stoned adulterers, for example, also juvenile delinquents. On the other hand, for almost two thousand years, Jews were arguably the most peace loving People on earth. Most of them still are. But that came later. >If you mean Hellenism. Yes. If you mean something else, then not likely. Hellenism for sure, what else we dont know. Persian religious thought, and presumably some practice, was quite popular among a large numbers of Jews of the time. A case can be made that portions of modern Judaism is are Persian grafts. >This is a good observation, but consider this. James, Jesus' brother was a NAZIR. A Nazir is the ONLY instance in Jewish culture where it is permitted to put aside the commandment to be fruitful and multiply. In other words, if one dedicates his life to the service of god, he may be a monk. Good point. I hadnt thought of that. Tell us more about the Nazir. >James was a Nazir Source on that? > He apparently got some part of John the Baptist's movement. Apparently. Thats certainly what Nag Hammadi points to. >This of course ALL speculation. But it's speculation within the correct framework. Its still speculation, though. To get really beyond speculation well need for more data to come in. Hopefully some archeologist will luck out and find some documentation. Its possible. Given enough time, its even likely. Seeing it reach the mass media when it happens, is a little less likely. But we can hope. http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- >Samaritan is an indicator of how separate the Jewish and Pagan cultures were. Samaritans had the same status as tornado bait trailer trash do in certain circles in Arkansas. The kind Samaritan was the exception to the rule. Samaritans aren't pagans. See: http://lexicorient.com/e.o/index.htm www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ÝÝÝCTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. ÝÝÝÚrchives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl o subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Ynr Chyldz Wyld wrote: > > -Caveat Lector- > > From: "Nurev Ind Research" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Jesus grew up in the boondocks, not the capital. > > > > Even so, I doubt that boonie towns were integrated. > > They weren't 'integrated' as much as being comprised of a mix of peoples, not all of >whom practiced a pure > form of the Judaic faith... I doubt it. > > > > Pagans were common, > > > even after nearly a millennium of Jewish repression. > > > > Poor Pagans. I guess the I guess the Jews gave them a hard time about > > burring their children and other human sacrifices. > > Very few pagan religions in the Middle East practiced human sacrafice, Oh really? How about Christianity? Who do you think the death and resurrection of a god/man appealed to. Not the Jews. Human sacrifice cults were the basis of most, if not all the religions in the post agriculture period. > especially 'burning' one's children... > > The only evidence of ritual infanticide exists in Cyprus, nowhere else... I doubt it. Remember Moloch? He was the national god of the Ammonites. He was worshipped by offering up human sacrifices. Most always a child from the family. Worship of Moloch was expressly forbidden in Leviticus. Later, Solomon permitted alters to be built to him when he consolidated and expanded the country.( This was a millennium before Jesus.) Much later, Josiah, the King of Judah, as part of the purification of Judah, defiled the temples of Moloch. ' That no one might burn his son or his daughter as an offering to Moloch' ( 2 Kgs 23:10 ) Idolatrous priests were killed. The house of male prostitutes was destroyed. this was about 600 BCE. > > > All the Jews did > > > was drive out the temples. The pagans remained. Many Jews themselves > > > were pagans or still practiced elements of pagan religion (as do we > > > today). > > > > If you mean Hellenism. Yes. If you mean something else, then not likely. > > > > > They also married pagans. > > > > I doubt it. > > "Not likely" and "I doubt it" are hardly scholarly answers. I suggest that > you actually RESEARCH the history > of religions of both the area and the era... I have researched that place and time quite thoroughly. I'll stick with the answers I gave. > > Intermarriage between Jews and pagans was a common problem, indicated time > and again in the OT... The parable of the good Samaritan is an indicator of how separate the Jewish and Pagan cultures were. Samaritans had the same status as tornado bait trailer trash do in certain circles in Arkansas. The kind Samaritan was the exception to the rule. > one would > find more temples and altars to Baal in the countryside than Jewish temples... The OT spans about 1600 years if you accept the standard chronology. The period you are talking about is not the time of Mary Magdaline. There were no Jewish temples. There was only THE Temple in Jerusalem. What you are talking about is true early on. By the time the Romans arrived this did not apply. There were Pagan cities which were Hellenistic or Roman. Some Semites were forcibly converted to Judaism and were suspected of backsliding. If these are the people you're talking about, well ok. But these are a special case. Not the norm. > Ongoing archeological digs substantiate this... Good one. J2 > > June > http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Tenorlove wrote: > > -Caveat Lector- > > --- Nurev Ind Research <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Mary could have been his sister. > > Or his wife. Or his mother. J2 > > Tenorlove > http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- From: "Nurev Ind Research" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Jesus grew up in the boondocks, not the capital. > > Even so, I doubt that boonie towns were integrated. They weren't 'integrated' as much as being comprised of a mix of peoples, not all of whom practiced a pure form of the Judaic faith... > > Pagans were common, > > even after nearly a millennium of Jewish repression. > > Poor Pagans. I guess the I guess the Jews gave them a hard time about > burring their children and other human sacrifices. Very few pagan religions in the Middle East practiced human sacrafice, especially 'burning' one's children... The only evidence of ritual infanticide exists in Cyprus, nowhere else... > > All the Jews did > > was drive out the temples. The pagans remained. Many Jews themselves > > were pagans or still practiced elements of pagan religion (as do we > > today). > > If you mean Hellenism. Yes. If you mean something else, then not likely. > > > They also married pagans. > > I doubt it. "Not likely" and "I doubt it" are hardly scholarly answers. I suggest that you actually RESEARCH the history of religions of both the area and the era... Intermarriage between Jews and pagans was a common problem, indicated time and again in the OT...one would find more temples and altars to Baal in the countryside than Jewish temples... Ongoing archeological digs substantiate this... June http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- --- Nurev Ind Research <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Mary could have been his sister. Or his wife. Tenorlove __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- --- Nessie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > There's another explanation. The pagans who lived in the area > practiced > ritual prostitution as part of their religion. The money went to > temple > maintance and to charity. She could have been a practitioner, or even > a > priestess. Which would have definitely rendered her a sinner in the eyes of the Gospel writers. Tenorlove __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Nessie wrote: > > -Caveat Lector- > > >He would not even have had access to such a person. There were no Pagan > temples in Jewish Jerusalem. > > Jesus grew up in the boondocks, not the capital. Even so, I doubt that boonie towns were integrated. > Pagans were common, > even after nearly a millennium of Jewish repression. Poor Pagans. I guess the I guess the Jews gave them a hard time about burring their children and other human sacrifices. > All the Jews did > was drive out the temples. The pagans remained. Many Jews themselves > were pagans or still practiced elements of pagan religion (as do we > today). If you mean Hellenism. Yes. If you mean something else, then not likely. > They also married pagans. I doubt it. > > > Mary could have been his sister. > > Indeed. She could also have been his wife. Some people say that the > miracle of the wine and the water was at Jesus own wedding feast. That's my point. She either did or didn't exist, or if she did exist, she could have been anybody. > > Jewish culture as well as Jewish religion so strongly supported marriage > that it is inconceivable that a man could reach thirty, still be > unmarried, and not be utterly rejected by the other people of the > culture. This is a good observation, but consider this. James, Jesus' brother was a NAZIR. A Nazir is the ONLY instance in Jewish culture where it is permitted to put aside the commandment to be fruitful and multiply. In other words, if one dedicates his life to the service of god, he may be a monk. James was a Nazir and second in line after Jesus in the leadership of the early movement. It would not be a leap to presume that Jesus was a Nazir too. Nazir, Nazarene, Nazareth have gotten jumbled in the translations of the Jesus legends. A Nazir abstained from sex, did not cut his hair, and was bound by strict rules of purity. > He certainly couldnt have gained a following. He could and he did. He apparently got some part of John the Baptist's movement. This of course ALL speculation. But it's speculation within the correct framework. J2 http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- From: "JJ Jones" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Thank you for helping to clear the issue up about Mary Magdalene. I have > been doing some research and find nothing of such reference in the Bible > about her "profession". If memory serves me right, it was her mother who > approached Jesus and asked him if he could help her daughter who suffered > from demon possession. Therefore, in conclusion, being demon possessed is > Mary Magdalene's only and greatest sin, according to the Biblical account. > Also, it is interesting to note that Mary Magdalene was the first Apostle. > The word Apostle meaning, "one sent forth". She was the first one sent > forth with a message to the followers of Christ that he was alive and had > been resurrected. Therefore, I would speculate that the person who > originally dubbed Mary Magdalene as a prostitute was incensed upon realizing > that a woman could possibly have been the first Apostle. According to an article I read in Bible Review, Mary Magdalene enjoyed much honor and respect in the early church, and indeed was elevated to a status not unlike that accorded "Sophia", the Goddess of Wisdom... It was only when Rome imposed its rules, regulations, and customs (carried over from pagan days) -- customs which did NOT allow for women to attain high office -- was the Magdalene painted with the slur of being a prostitute... June http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- >He would not even have had access to such a person. There were no Pagan temples in Jewish Jerusalem. Jesus grew up in the boondocks, not the capital. Pagans were common, even after nearly a millennium of Jewish repression. All the Jews did was drive out the temples. The pagans remained. Many Jews themselves were pagans or still practiced elements of pagan religion (as do we today). They also married pagans. > Mary could have been his sister. Indeed. She could also have been his wife. Some people say that the miracle of the wine and the water was at Jesus own wedding feast. Jewish culture as well as Jewish religion so strongly supported marriage that it is inconceivable that a man could reach thirty, still be unmarried, and not be utterly rejected by the other people of the culture. He certainly couldnt have gained a following. www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ÝÝÝCTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. ÝÝÝÚrchives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl o subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Nessie wrote: > > -Caveat Lector- > > >I would speculate that the person who originally dubbed Mary Magdalene > as a prostitute was incensed upon realizing that a woman could possibly > have been the first Apostle. > > There's another explanation. The pagans who lived in the area practiced > ritual prostitution as part of their religion. The money went to temple > maintance and to charity. She could have been a practitioner, or even a > priestess. Extremely unlikely. Jesus was a practicing Jew. He would not even have had access to such a person. There were no Pagan temples in Jewish Jerusalem. One of the reasons for the first Jewish revolt was because the Romans displayed their shields and eagles in Jerusalem's holy areas where graven images were particularly offensive. There is really no way to know who MM was. The OT is notoriously unreliable with names and characters. Much of this was intentional. The compilers of the OT ( 300 years after the death of Jesus ) did not want Christians to know that Jesus had many siblings. They obfuscated names and used several names for the same people, as well as giving the same people different roles in the mythology. Mary could have been his sister. Joshua2 http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- >I would speculate that the person who originally dubbed Mary Magdalene as a prostitute was incensed upon realizing that a woman could possibly have been the first Apostle. There's another explanation. The pagans who lived in the area practiced ritual prostitution as part of their religion. The money went to temple maintance and to charity. She could have been a practitioner, or even a priestess. www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ÝÝÝCTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. ÝÝÝÚrchives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl o subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- --- JJ Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I would speculate that the person who > originally dubbed Mary Magdalene as a prostitute was incensed upon > realizing > that a woman could possibly have been the first Apostle. Based on what I've read in the Nag Hammadi Gospels http://www.gnosis.org the most likely culprit is Peter. You might also be interested in http://www.magdalene.org which is devoted to MM's spiritual role, and also has a mailing list. Tenorlove __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Tenorlove, Thank you for helping to clear the issue up about Mary Magdalene. I have been doing some research and find nothing of such reference in the Bible about her "profession". If memory serves me right, it was her mother who approached Jesus and asked him if he could help her daughter who suffered from demon possession. Therefore, in conclusion, being demon possessed is Mary Magdalene's only and greatest sin, according to the Biblical account. Also, it is interesting to note that Mary Magdalene was the first Apostle. The word Apostle meaning, "one sent forth". She was the first one sent forth with a message to the followers of Christ that he was alive and had been resurrected. Therefore, I would speculate that the person who originally dubbed Mary Magdalene as a prostitute was incensed upon realizing that a woman could possibly have been the first Apostle. with regards, psephizo http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- Remember Rahab was supposedly a "harlot" which also had a very different meaning in biblical times - for she was an innkeepers daughter. She was also the one who hid the spies - also once some guy out of Dallas kept sending me a red cord - always thought he was trying to say something - for he was a preacher. And then when you look at the last supper always remember Judas, has the bag - the evil kiss of death - da Vinci in his painting portrayed them well 7 devils? Maybe they were Irish? http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- For the record, nowhere in the Bible does it specifically say MM was a prostitute. She is described as either a "sinner" without the specific sinner named, or as "out of whom went seven devils." This could mean she was a member of a pagan cult before she met Jesus. Whether or not her cult included sacred prostitution is still a matter of speculation. Tenorlove __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html">Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED] http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] In search of Mary Magdalene Part 1
-Caveat Lector- WJPBR Email News List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Peace at any cost is a Prelude to War! In search of Mary Magdalene Insider's view of prostitution in modern-day Sodom called Amsterdam -- -- Editorâs note: WorldNetDaily international correspondent Anthony C. LoBaido recently toured Amsterdam's infamous red-light district. This report chronicling the sights, sounds and personalities of the area and delving into the psyches of those who make their living in the "world's oldest profession," is part of an in-depth feature article in the February edition of WorldNetDaily's offline companion publication, the monthly WorldNet Magazine. Readers are invited to subscribe to WorldNet at WND's online store. By Anthony C. LoBaido © 2001 WorldNetDaily.com AMSTERDAM, The Netherlands â As the witching hour approached, the streets of Amsterdamâs red-light district came alive with a plethora of vices, spewing forth as if the gates of hell had been unchained. A light drizzle was falling, and as this reporter walked along the canals, the booming sounds of the bells ringing in the old church towers created an ominous tone. The scene was so overwhelming and mind-boggling that I had to stop every few meters to write down the details in my notebook, so as to capture the very essence of this dark, twisted place. Surely, when Oswald Spengler penned his epic "The Decline of the West," the author had a glimmer of modern Amsterdam in mind. Quaint, two-story houses and hotels lined either side of the canal. The smell of men urinating straight into the canals was nauseating. People were vomiting in various places along the canals. A police boat passing by slowed down to shine a light on a crazed black man who was literally foaming at the mouth and screaming obscenities from his wheelchair. âYou want to watch the Olympics?â the man in the wheelchair shouted out at the police. âWell, I got a new sport for you. Who can pull the most shopping trolleys out of the canal in five minutes? And dead bodies, too!â The smell of marijuana was everywhere. As I passed the well-known cannabis bar, âThe Grasshopper,â the smell became overwhelming -- not to mention the effects. Drug dealers were everywhere, 99 percent of whom were black immigrants from Nigeria, Ghana, Gambia and other African nations. I wondered why Holland doesn't recruit black African Christians as missionaries to teach the white pagans in Amsterdam about the message of Jesus. âCrack? Ecstasy? Cocaine?â the dealers all called to me. I could only reply ânoâ the first 50 times. After that, I began to get more creative in my responses. âNo thanks, I had a big lunch,â âYou shouldnât get people started on that stuff,â and âLet sleeping dogs lie.â These clever answers amused the dealers, who walked confidently, like panthers stalking their prey, under the protective guise of Dutch policemen mounted on horseback around the red-light district. One drug dealer from Nigeria told this writer, âThe Dutch, they took from Indonesia and Surinam. And now the immigrants come here and go on welfare to take back what they feel is rightfully theirs â or that which belonged to their ancestors. I donât do that. I sell drugs -- drugs that people want. I provide a service to help people escape -- from life.â I continued to make my way through the twisting alleys. The roads were being torn up and refitted for new sewer pipes -- the irony didn't escape me. While turning around one particular corner, I disturbed a group of pigeons, which immediately took to flight all around me like an outtake from Alfred Hitchcockâs film "The Birds." When the fluttering and cooing of the birds dissipated, two teen-age Dutch girls dressed up for Halloween in old-style black nunâs habits rushed past me. The girls were, of course smoking cigarettes, something all people outside the U.S. seem to do. I immediately thought of my 12 years of Catholic school and suddenly had newfound respect for those old nuns, who in their old-fashioned ways had tried to instill morals and virtues in their students. Their desire for purity, humility and holiness that lay hidden behind their reliance on rituals was remarkable. Those old nuns knew that we children would one day grow up to participate in a great war -- a war against principalities and powers in high places. They were right. The bells were tolling once again, and the rain began to fall a little bit harder. At the far end of the long, thin alley, a man emerged. He was wearing a Michael Meyers mask, made famous from the series of slasher Halloween films that have been produced over the last generation. The man was holding a large knife in his hand. Now the tolling of the church bells stopped. It was a quarter past the witching hour. My mind filled with the theme music from those Halloween movies as I continued to walk towards "Michael Mey
