CS: Field-Cats the worst killers
From: Jonathan Spencer, [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Incorrect. It is because a dog is *property* whereas a cat is not. > >What? - So who does my cat belong to then? Not you, although you might belong to the cat. :-) As I understand it, the cat is not considered to be property, it is not owned by you or anyone. In contrast, I do own my dog. I'm open to correction of course. --Jonathan Spencer, firearms examiner "Justice is open to everybody in the same way as the Ritz Hotel." Judge Sturgess, 22 July 1928 Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Proliferation of Small Arms
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] STOP SPREAD OF WEAPONS, URGES COOK 131054 FEB 10 By PA News Reporter The Foreign Secretary today called for an international fund to be set up to help stop the spread of weapons around the world. Robin Cook said it was needed to stop small arms being used by criminals and illegitimate groups. The fund was one of a series of initiatives proposed by Mr Cook to delegates around the world at a London conference called Combating Small Arms and Light Weapons. Mr Cook said: "For too many children in the world today, the first encounter with the technology of the 21st century is not the screen of a personal computer but up the barrel of a gun. "The click of the safety catch is more familiar than the click of the mouse. "The proliferation of small arms contributes to conflict on every inhabited continent. "Ready access to small arms provides the means and the temptation to start conflicts and it fuels the tensions and suspicion which sustain conflict." The conference is being hosted by the Government as a precursor to the UN conference on weapons in New York in July. Delegates from over 30 countries gathered at Lancaster House for the start of the two-day conference. It is hoped the proposals worked out will be considered and adopted by the UN later in the year. It is also part of the international efforts to stop small arms falling into the wrong hands. Three million people have been killed around the world by such weapons in the last 10 years. Mr Cook said work had been done to limit the risk of weapons of mass destruction such as nuclear missiles but the spread of small arms remained. "Mao's famous dictum that political power comes from the barrel of a gun remains a bitter truth for societies around the world. "That is why Britain intends to propose an international arms surrender fund as a further instrument to help the world win the fight against the proliferation of small arms. "The fund would not need to adopt a prescriptive approach to small arms but could tailor its operations to fit the circumstances of different regions." Mr Cook said he would like to see the fund set up short ly after the UN conference. He also said that countries needed to do more to stem the flow of small arms by regulating the legal trade. Although the damage and devastation caused by weapons was mainly in the developing world, the guns were often manufactured in the industrial world. Mr Cook called for a better marking system on guns that showed their country of origin so they could be traced. He said it would make the illegal trade of guns more transparent. And the Foreign Secretary also called for weapons to be destroyed when recovered to stop them falling back into criminal hands. Chris Mullin, a junior international development minister, said: "We all have a collective responsibility to combat small arms proliferation." I feel safer already Kenneth Pantling Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Fishing
From: "Frazer, John", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Needless to say the anglers are going about it all wrong. Arguing that fish don't feel pain isn't going to cut it with anyone. If that were the standard then it would be OK by PETA to shoot a deer with a tranquilizer dart, then give it a lethal injection, field-dress it, and throw it on the barbecue. The only way to beat these people is by ridiculing them and exposing them as actually preferring animals' lives over people. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Misc-Cutlasses in Norway
From: nick royall, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yes they were, it was the last time they were used in anger although they were issued on other ships during WW2. Apparently only one german soldier resisted when facing cold steel, the loss of his hand with his pistol still in it persuaded the others that the cutlass was still something to be reckoned with. The tactical and psychological effects must have been quite good. Nick Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-The march in March
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I didn't intend to start a debate on the pros and cons of fox-hunting when I happened to mention that I'm not going to the Countryside Alliance march, but since one started up anyway, I suppose I owe some of you a reply. I would have replied before, but I've had almost no spare time lately, as I've been doing both a full-time day job and an evening job (plus extra hours at weekends plus evening classes). I can't reply to everyone individually, so I'll have to do it all in one go. First, I am aware that foxes are a vermin species and that their numbers have to be controlled. But I also believe that it should be done in the most humane way possible, and I don't think chasing them across the countryside qualifies. I can believe that once the dogs actually catch the fox, it'll be finished off quickly, but the chase itself has to be extremely stressful. Cage traps don't strike me as any better either, possibly worse. Shooting seems to me to be the most humane method. Someone said that once hunting with hounds has gone, there will be an outbreak of poor marksmen hunting foxes with unsuitable weapons, causing terrible injuries. That's possible I suppose, but it doesn't seem to happen with other quarry species. A couple of people also asked if I'd ever ridden with a hunt. No I haven't, and I'm not sure what I could learn if I did - what would I see, galloping on horseback and looking at the backsides of a bunch of hounds? Most likely, I'd learn what it feels like to fall off my horse and break an arm or something. I'm an urban dweller, I'm not comfortable with any form of transportation that doesn't have a set of wheels and a seatbelt. Second, I also realise that there will be some very unfortunate effects in the short term, such as all or most of the fox hounds having to be put down, and people in support services being put out of work. None of this is good news, but it's only a short-term problem. People who made their living from fox hunting one way or another will find new employment. People are very adaptable. You have to balance that against the long-term benefit of reducing cruelty. It's an imperfect world, it's almost impossible to do anything without there being no harmful side effects. Third, the shooting associations and magazines have been saying that the march isn't just about fox hunting. Maybe not, but that's the issue that's going to attract press coverage and that's how the general public will see it. It's not a march to get the pistol ban repealed, and the participation of a few thousand shooters won't change that. If the march does affect government policy it'll be to put the fox hunting ban on the back burner - it won't scare them into laying off persecuting shooters. So I don't see how it's worth my time and probable loss of earnings to go down to London to support it, and I'm sure a lot of other shooters will feel the same way. I'm sure you could get more shooters to support a march purely in favour of shooting than to support this unfocused march which will be generally perceived as just a front for the fox hunters' lobby. That's what I think, anyway. I could be wrong (it does happen occasionally), but I have to do what I think is right, even if everyone else seems to disagree(including people who I respect). If anyone would like to post any counter-arguments I'll read them, though I can't guarantee a reply, for the reasons already stated - though I can guarantee to consider any sensible argument. But unless you can persuade me I'm wrong, the position at the moment is that I'll be spending 18th March in Manchester, same as usual. Stuart Heal Quiet loner with an arsenal of weapons. http://olympia.fortunecity.com/naseem/170/ -- The reasons I'm going are: (a) this clearly is more than about fox hunting, we see already arguments for banning other things on the back of it; (b) I can think of other more humane ways of controlling foxes too, but there won't be any foxes left to control if hunting them is banned simply because there is no profit in maintaining their habitats otherwise, not to mention that if the other methods are more humane and efficient, foxes will be decimated; (c) Hmm, it's not _supposed_ to be a march about the handgun ban, but I cannot think of a better forum or a more sympathetic audience, can you? Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Fishing next
From: "Mike Burns", [EMAIL PROTECTED] If they _really_ care about animal welfare and animal rights they'll go after Halal butchers, since that is a thouroughly unnecessary and generally nasty procedure that causes phenominal suffering to many animals daily in the name of "freedom of religious expression". If it's a mainly political thing, they won't, since they don't want to be chastised by the PC brigade and lose Government support mike "A seemingly one-man crusade against political correctness " Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Field-Fishing next
From: Kenneth Wyatt, [EMAIL PROTECTED] I would have thought that a concerted attack on fishing would drive many more supporters into our camp. Governments usually like to divide before they seek to conquer so perhaps they'll just go for carp fishermen initially :-( Ken Still think it's cruel to worms -- Possibly PETA thinks fishing is a better target because fishers aren't as well organised as field shooters. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Admin-problems with certain ISPs
I've been having a problem with mail bouncing from mcmail.com accounts. I have no idea why, either they're useless or they have a filter that thinks Cybershooters is spam, like bigfoot.com Anyway, if you are subscribed under an mcmail.com account do not be surprised if you miss some messages. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-March 18th 2001 - Mark That Day
From: "John Hurst.", [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >(a usually reliable source) > >March 18th 2001 - Mark That Day > >So are you going on the Countryside March on March 18th? Are you quite >certain you are? One of the 150,000 already registered, perhaps? Well it >must be all right then. > >But wait! Not everyone wants the match to go ahead, dear me no. For one >thing, those opposed to hunting certainly do not want it to do so. They are >losing the argument, you see. Lots of chaps who would be seen dead putting >on the pink have realise that you need a better reason to criminalise >anything up to three quarters of a million people, including the Prince of >Wales, just because you don't like what you wrongly perceive to be the cut >glass crystal tones of those attending. > >The last thing people like that want is an orderly demonstration of decent >men and women claiming no other privilege than the right to continue to >maintain their lives and traditions in a peaceable way. > >And there is one particular person who does want the march to go ahead >either and that is the Prime Minister. On the evening of the last march, >there was a touching scene in a video conference room deep in the heart of >Westminster where the Prime Minister ands his then inseparable chum 'Mandy' >Mandelson looked at the security videos together. > >"He can't possibly vote Tory," shouts our Leader, "He's got a ferret in that >Barbour." This then for our leader was the horrible moment of truth. Many of >those on the March did indeed not vote Tory last time, but they will next. >What is worse, the very last thing our hero needs as May 3rd approaches is >anything up to 1,000,000 people parading through London and, as it were, >into every drawing room in the land, proclaiming by their presence that the >Prime Minister is not so much a 'pretty regular guy,' but really rather a >scrub. > >What is to be done? Ah! what indeed and that is why a certain froideur has >crept into relations between the PM and Jack Straw this past week. It is >being reliably reported, as they say, that the PM has been asking the Home >Secretary 'whether the letter has arrived.' > >"What letter?" says our Jack. > >"The one from the Metropolitan Police Commissioner asking you to withdraw >permission for the march because of the high level of violence and >intimidation that the marchers offer, " replies Tony. > >"But there hasn't been any such letter," says Jack. > >"Then ask for it, and quickly." retorts the PM. > >That at least in broad line is what is afoot and even by the standards of >this Prime Minister it is a pretty shabby business. > >There is of course no threat of violence from the March as both the previous >rally and march show. Indeed the only threat of violence is of an altogether >more domestic sort if Blair does not 'persuade' the Police to advise the >government etc. Now how might that be? > >Well consider. IFAW and PAL bankrolled the Labour Party in opposition for >£1.1 million. That was how the pledge to legislate against hunting was >extracted from the government. > >And is there anyone in PAL who might have the ear of Tony? Well what about >Cherie Blair's sister who works as a senior executive for PAL. Yes, I think >that should do nicely. Yes - Mr. Blairs sister in law ! > >So there you have it and does it not almost make you weep? Here we have a >government, which sells party policy for £1,000,000 to Bernie Ecclestone. > >We have a former Northern Ireland Secretary who bases his defence on the >proposition that suborning a junior minister to procure a passport is an >event of so little consequence that he simply cannot remember whether on >this occasion he did. > >We have the Minister for Europe who believes that public office should be >milked for private profit like a stall in a souk. > >And floating on this pool of slurry we have a Prime Minister who believes >that only the techniques of dispersal separate the principles governing the >removal of protesters from Tianamin Square and Trafalgar Square. > >I think I'll go back to the pigs. And why not? > >After all, if the polls are right the country's going back to the dogs. > >Tomas Tompion Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Misc-50 cal.
From: andrew, [EMAIL PROTECTED] For those who think a couple of grand is a bit costly for a rifle check this out. A kit for building a .50 bmg rifle for just 28 usd! http://www.serveroptions.com/ubb/Forum4/HTML/000152.html Got this from the humour forum of the accurate reloading site. -- Actually going to the site it is from is worth a laugh: http://www.birdman.org Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-.50
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Alex, you seem to want to misconstrue nearly everything I write. I'll have one more go then give up... For clarity's sake I will preface quotes from your posting between ~ ~ marks. > ~Ferocious looking characters, unshaven, unwashed, wearing camouflage > uniforms, pot bellied with knives sticking out of their boots ... > get the picture?~ No, I don't get the picture. In nearly 30 years I have never shot with characters like you describe. You must mix with some rum types. > > > ~But you are not fighting the government, are you! You are fighting me > and people like me! ~ I partially agree with you, I am fighting the misrule of the present government and I am fighting for all shooting sports. If that means I am against people who would sacrifice one person's sport to save their own, and you seem to be one of those, yes I am fighting you too. > TR, but if anybody asks > what 50 cal shooting is that is terrible! Why?~ Pardon? As Harold Macmillan said of one of Khruschev's outbursts in the UN - could I have a translation of that please. > > ~When did it start!? Well over 2,000 years ago in Athens.~ Oh! You mean democracy. Well, that finished in this country a few years back when elective dictatorship took over. Maybe you haven't noticed yet. > > ~In terms of publicly perceived danger 50 calibre is somewhat above any > other discipline that I can think of.~ > > I responded: You must be joking here, 90% of the population have never > heard of it. > > You responded ~But the government has heard of it.~ Sorry Alex but you quite clearly wrote ~ publicly perceived ~ you've just moved the goal posts. > > Alex, it was you who said: ~your remarks are well and truly out of place~ > about me. > So when you answer: > ~Why? Are they? Can you be more specific (although I would rather you > were not).~ I find it a bit difficult to understand what you are getting at. > > ~But had I called him a Luddite, told him that he did not > know what he was taking about (even though he didn't) bashed myself in > the chest and demanded my rights, I am sure he would have walked away > convinced that the pistol ban was the best thing since sliced bread!~ As Steve says you have stereotyped me as an unthinking boor. Your remarks are not well taken. > > ~You keep your dislikes to yourself and if you do not see any point in > fighting to save Bisley, don't!~ Plainly you have not read what I wrote: referring to TR I said: I wouldn't miss the Bisley type of full bore rifle shooting if it ceased to exist tomorrow. However, I am prepared to do everything in my power to make sure it doesn't because any type of shooting sport is worth preserving. How you manage to get from that to ~if you do not see any point in fighting to save Bisley, don't~ leaves me gasping. I visit Bisley 2 or 3 times a year and love going there, however I don't consider Bisley worth saving if it means I have to play the turncoat and sacrifice other shooters. > > ~I genuinely have never seen a 50 cal rifle and did not know the courses of > fire nor anything about it, other than its military origins.~ Perhaps one of the 50 cal owners might like to comment on that but I think the civilian 50 cal shooters predated the military. However, if you want an example of shooting with military origins try TR. As I understand it, it really got its boost from the 19th Century Volunteer Movement and isn't there something about defence of the realm in the NRA's constitution? I would hasten to add, I see nothing wrong in that but you seem to have a problem with it. Incidentally the only 50 cal rifle I have ever seen was at Bisley. It was for sale, not being shot. Alex, all I am saying is that I support all shooting sports and I now publicly undertake not to try to sacrifice another person's shooting to save mine. All I ask is that you do the same. Kenneth Pantling -- Given that 7.62mm is no longer the standard military calibre, I could make just as strong an argument for banning it as the argument for banning .50. Who needs to be able to shoot a 7.62mm at 1,000 yards? The arguments for banning it are exactly the same as for banning .50BMG. The differences between banning handguns v. banning TR and banning 50 v. banning TR are quite large, but any TR shooter arguing for a ban on .50BMG (or rather, saying they don't care if it is banned) is being truly naive, IMO. I think perhaps the .50 shooters could help themselves out by inviting along some TR shooters for a look-see though. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. htt
CS: Pol-.50
From: "Richard Loweth", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ferocious looking characters, unshaven, unwashed, wearing camouflage uniforms, pot bellied with knives sticking out of their boots ... get the picture? If they were playing violins I would consider banning music! What? Do you mean like Nigel Kennedy? Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Target-.50
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > As for myself, I like all forms of shooting, but available time does not > allow me to participate in everything and I genuinely have never seen a > 50 cal rifle and did not know the courses of fire nor anything about it, > other than its military origins. I know little about .50 cal rifle shooting but I do know that it DOESN'T have military origins. .50 cal rifle shooting is entirely a civilian development only adopted by the military about 20 yrs after the civilians started it. -- Well, the difference is that you're shooting a bigger calibre than 7.62mm, that's about it! Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Field-Cats the worst killers
From: "Brian Toller", [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Incorrect. It is because a dog is *property* whereas a cat is not. >What? - So who does my cat belong to then? Wrong way round. You own a dog but feed a cat. If your lucky it deigns to live in your house. Brian T Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Emigrate!
From: "Derek Bernard", [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Well Switzerland apparently is going to have a referendum on >joining the EU sometime this year. >Steve. Already held! Charlotte, my wife, is Swiss and returned her referendum "No" last month. Derek Bernard -- Do you know the result? Steve. --- Not yet. Will post it when we hear (if my wife remembers to tell me!). Derek Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Crime-"the fashion for firearms"
From: "Earl W", [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/static/in_depth/uk/2001/life_of_crime/police.stm It is a neighbourhood with a reputation for drugs and violence; a place where gang rivalry has led to shootings. The police officers patrolling these streets have loaded guns in their holsters; armed units are ready to provide back up. Is this a scene from the ghettos of the United States? No, this is Nottingham in the heart of England, a country with a long tradition of unarmed police officers who walk the beat with only a truncheon for protection. The decision to introduce armed patrols on some inner-city housing estates in Nottingham has raised eyebrows. The days of Dixon of Dock Green may be long gone, but is this a symbolic moment in Britain's drift towards gun crime? The police in Nottingham have played down suggestions that it is the start of a process that will end with all street patrols being routinely armed. The move has been targeted at specific areas, with the intention of reassuring the public and sending a strong message to young criminals not to use guns. Putting more armed officers on the streets is a very sensitive issue for chief constables, who are well aware of the public's unease. An opinion poll carried out for BBC News Online reinforces that message. Only 34% of those questioned want to see the police routinely carrying guns, while the majority - 59% - want to retain a service that is largely unarmed. Getting the police to discuss these issues is difficult. We approached 10 police forces, but none wanted to talk about their own policy on firearms, referring us instead to the Association of Chief Police Officers. The fashion for firearms Paul Acres is Chief Constable of the Hertfordshire force, and spoke to us as chairman of ACPO's firearms committee. He insists that the decision to issue guns to officers in some parts of Nottingham does not amount to routine arming. "I think the British public cherish the image of a police officer who is very much part of the community and is very close to them, and we recognise that firearms create a bit of distance," he says. "We are very happy to try to keep that image, but for people to know that the officers who are armed are supported by a very swift and effective response, and that there is no profit in taking a firearm onto the streets or certainly challenging our officers." Senior police officers point to the spread of firearms in cities like Manchester, Liverpool and Birmingham. And others share a concern that for some young criminals, guns have become part of their image. "To carry a gun is hip," says former armed robber Danny Thomas. "They are carrying a gun with their Reebok trainers, with their Moschino jeans, with their Gucci tops. It's a fashion accessory now." The deployment of armed police officers seems to have been given a cautious welcome by residents in neighbourhoods that have suffered from an increase in gun-related incidents. But there are fears that instead of halting the spiral of violence, increasing the number of armed officers on the streets could encourage more criminals to carry guns. Many British policemen and women worry that it could be the first step on a slippery slope. After a number of officers were killed in the mid-90s, the Police Federation of England and Wales carried out a ballot of its members. A survey (1995) of police attitudes to armed patrols found: a.. 79% of police officers said they were not in favour of being routinely armed a.. But 40% said more officers should be trained to use firearms a.. 42% felt their life had been in serious danger as a result of personal threat in the previous two years a.. 39% had been threatened with firearm, knife or other weapon in the previous two years a.. In the event of a decision to arm all officers 43% said they would be prepared to carry firearms on duty or all of the time a.. 6% said they would resign from the police service if they were ordered to wear a firearm Source: Police Federation "A significant majority did not want to be permanently armed," says Federation chairman Fred Broughton. "But they did want proper risk assessments. They specifically wanted back up, and they wanted mobile armed-response vehicles. They also wanted better training and they wanted better management of armed situations. "Many of us want to see the unarmed service and the traditions of British policing maintained. But for how long we can maintain them is the question." There is an uneasy feeling by those with long experience in the law enforcement business that Britain may be moving gradually towards an armed police service. John Alderson, the former Chief Constable of Devon and Cornwall, says such a development would require the consent of the public."At the end of the day this will be a political d
CS: Pol-Fishing next
From: "Brian Toller", [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Radio 4 just before 7 this morning had a feature on >cruelty to fish from hooks and the problems of line etc >tangling with birds and oyther wildlife. Even better on Radio 5 PETA (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals), which I assume is a British off shoot of the American organisation, had some wally on. Pain and distress caused to fish etc. The hooks and lines, were merely a secondary point. Apparently they are about to release a poster with a dog dangling at the end of a fishing line which is why they'd got some air time. Did anyone seriously think that all the LACS and Hunt Saboteurs etc would retire and take up gardening if hunting with hounds was banned. Taken to it's only slightly illogical extreme they would have use all walking naked brushing the ground before us lest we squash some unsuspecting bug in the manner of certain Indian holy men. Brian T -- LACS has always been against shooting for as long as I can remember. Like I said before they ran a big ad campaign in 1988 to get shooting banned altogether. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Fishing
From: "Earl W", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Animal activists set sights on angling 1:03pm Monday, 12th February 2001 Animal rights activists are launching a nationwide advertising campaign as part of a push for angling to be outlawed. Leisure fishing is a bloodsport, as bad as fox hunting and should be outlawed, says campaign group Peta - People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. Advertisements, likely to feature a dog dangling from a line with a hook through its mouth, will be placed in newspapers, magazines and on billboards. But anglers have reacted furiously, saying they are being victimised by activists and there is no evidence the sport causes fish to suffer. Andrew Butler, Peta's UK co-ordinator, said: "Angling is nothing more than hunting on water. Fish feel pain and distress like other animals. They have all the chemical processes and pain receptors that other creatures do." The campaign, which is not due to be launched for at least another two months, was sparked by an anguished letter from a former angler who wrote to Peta saying he had taken his dog on a fishing trip and his first catch of the day was a fish with a hook stuck in its cheek. Mr Butler said: "He looked at the fish, then looked at the dog and realised that if you wouldn't rip open the cheek of a dog, why would you do it to a fish? "So we took that as the starting point. We are looking at using a computer-generated image of a dog with a hook through it and asking the same question." But Kevin Stephenson, secretary of the National Association of Specialist Anglers, says there is concern that action against the sport will escalate if the Bill to ban fox hunting goes through Parliament. "We are confident that there is no suffering involved and that we are in the right about this," he said. "But the worry is that Peta are very well organised and funded, and now that hunting is on its knees they are looking around to see what's next." -- PETA - People Eating Tasty Animals. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Target-Practical Shotgun in Berks/Hants ?
From: "Peter Sarony", [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yes, the London Practical Shooting Club operates a 40 acre woodland site at Misholt Copse, Popham, Hants. This site is approved by Hants contabulary for practical target shooting. We did not request nor therefore do we permit the use there of Section 1 ammo, but all Section 2 is fine. Those who are interested please make contact directly. Peter Sarony - Chairman LPSC - Tel: 020 7262 1882 - Fax 020 7402 0959, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Goldilocks and the three gun bans
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] hello all steve wrote I work with a couple of squaddies, both re-trained, one was smashed up in bosnia, funny they both feel the same way, and both cannot wait to gain enough experience to go back to Germany. Do you think the politicians are listening yet? I don't think so! roger hardley Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Field-Fishing next
From: Pete Ansbro, [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Radio 4 just before 7 this morning had a feature on > cruelty to fish from hooks and the problems of line etc > tangling with birds and oyther wildlife. That would be the Today programme? The same programme around 7.30 was running a story on domestic cats and their nocturnal propensity to hunt in the form of mice, frogs etc. The feature was padded out with night vision scopes, radar tracking collars and Simon King (yes he of "Big Cat Diary" and other "wildlife in Africa" type programmes). Despite, or because of one broadcaster's comment about "the poor mouse", I had hoped this was a tongue in cheek Monday morning filler. Maybe not, however. Let's see... Tuesday morning..."Spiders - are they cruel to flies?", followed on Wednesday by "Primary school teacher dismissed for putting frog spawn in class fish tank", and on Thursday, "Police find schoolboy in possession of quantity of wild tree seed - is this the end for conkers? We ask the newly appointed Government spokesperson for all things wooden, Deputy Prime Messmaster, Johnny "Two Jags" Prescot." Finally, on Friday, "Government spokesperson for all things ugly, Robin Cook, will consider a private member's bill to prevent the wealthy land-owning classes (farmers and gardeners to you and me) from taking part in the annual ritualized slaughter of millions of unsuspecting slugs and snails." [Sorry, I couldn't resist that one:-)] Pete Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Emigrate!
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] hello all, I may have missed it, has anyone had any of the listening to britain thingys through their letter box? I have o what fun, needess to say if you don't give the right answers they will throw them away, the tories aren't listening just as the everso regal, (he wishes) tony isn't. None of them give a toss, all they care about their own power nothing else. oh and one thing the public get the politicians they deserve, the politicians, then procede to screw things up and treat the people like idiots, the public turn into idiots and then people like IG complain about the public being idiots, so it seems we are in a downward spiral. so who is going to change things? The politicians? not on your life it would ruin their gravy train. The public? Nah, we're stupid idiots and don't know whats good for us, thats why they always hand out that useless drivel about what ever you approach them about The media? the media don't give a shit so long as they can sell newsspace or air time, don't forget pictures of murdered kids or raped women sell more so why would they want things changed! In short the system is making things worse not better and it's about time that those in the system relearned one startling fact. It is there to help those 'idiots' not to feed off of them and control them, how do you do that? stop treating them like idiots, but that would be far too risky they might even figure out what the system and those in it have been taking them for. Emigrating what a loverly idea! roger hardley Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
