CS: Crime-School claims to have foiled 'Columbine-style attack'
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ananova, 07/02/01 Authorities in Kansas say three teenagers were planning a Columbine-style attack on their school. The boys allegedly had guns, ammunition and explosive recipes at their home along with plans of the school. They have been charged with conspiracy to commit aggravated arson at their school in Hoyt. Chief Detective Steven Rupert of the Jackson County sheriff's office said: "I would guess it would be nothing short of what happened at Columbine." Police also found three trench coats, similar to those worn by the students responsible for the Columbine massacre. The school has now banned trench coats, The Star newspaper in Kansas City reports. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Crime-White House gunman wrote suicide note
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ananova, 09/02/01 A suicide note has been found in the car of a man who fired a gun outside the White House. Robert Pickett was shot in the knee by secret service officers outside a White House fence on Wednesday. He is recovering in a Washington hospital as authorities are preparing to charge Pickett, from Evansville, in Indiana. Police say Pickett's vehicle was found at a commuter rail station near the capital with the suicide note inside. Pickett had described himself as a mental patient in several court filings against former employer, the Internal Revenue. He waved his gun at police from outside the wrought-iron fence at the White House and apparently fired two shots before a uniformed officer shot him. Pickett bought the gun from an Evansville pawn shop a year ago after passing an instant criminal background check, shop manager David Sisson said. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Crime-More stupidity in England
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The police quite rightly responded, searched the man's home and he went to court and got a small fine. That's what the police are supposed to do. That the kids were committing a criminal act doesn't justify a different criminal act. Isn't that the rub? If a gang was kicking in a car, your car, would you like to ask them to stop? Or would you shout at them from a distance, and hope they didn't kick you to death? Or perhaps call the police, who will turn up well after the fact? Or, use the safest course of action, and threaten them with lethal force sufficient to overcome all of them, so that they won't attack you, nor continue with the criminal act? Personally, I think the man did everything he could, indeed the only thing he could, given the situation. The only other thing he could have done is nothing, and the crime would have continued. The gang are, after all, not about to stop at a polite word. I think we should bring back the term "outlaw" for situations like this. If you choose to break the law, be it criminal damage or burglary, you have chosen to step outside the law. Whilst you are committing that act, you should not be allowed to pick and choose, and, having decided that the laws you are breaking don't apply to you, then rely on using another law to defend you should some good Samaritan try to stop you, whether, in this case, with words, or with actions, or some combination of the two. Two wrongs do not make a right. That is not what I am saying, but if good men are bound by the law to stand by while evil and mischief are done, what kind of society are we living in? Nigel Nigel Tolley www.rubbertreeplant.co.uk He was sticking to his guns, alright, but they were empty.. -- Well I disagree with you. Use of lethal force to prevent a property crime is not justifiable IMO. People seem to be reading all kinds of things into that article that are not there. Nowhere in the article did it say the kids tried to attack him or threaten him in any way. Nowhere in the article did it say that the kids had any reason to doubt the threat was genuine. There are few places in the world where a threat of lethal force to stop a property crime is legal. There are many other things he could have done given the situation and I think we all know that. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Crime-Ex-employee kills four and commits suicide
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ananova, 06/02/01 A disgruntled ex-employee has killed four people and then turned the gun on himself at an engine factory near Chicago. The man who was fired from the factory after he got caught stealing from his employer forced his way into the building and opened fire one day before he was to report to prison. William Baker, 66, showed up at the plant in suburban Chicago with an arsenal of weapons in a golf bag and made his way through the building, blasting away with an AK-47 assault rifle. Employees scattered in terror during the rampage that lasted about 10 to 15 minutes at the plant, run by Navistar International, a major lorry and engine maker. Baker shot seven people, three of them fatally, in an engineering area, then went into an office, where he killed one more person and then shot himself, police said. He had been scheduled to surrender on Tuesday to serve a five-month sentence for conspiracy to commit theft. He pleaded guilty last June, six years after he was fired. Martin Reutimann, a 24-year-old engineer, was sitting at his desk when he heard gunfire. "I heard somebody yell, 'There's a guy in the centre aisle with a gun!' " Mr Reutimann said. He said he saw people running past him, then fled and called the police. -- Another gun control success story. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Crime-Animal rights activist jailed for six months
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ananova, 31/01/01 An animal rights activist who sent "chilling" letters to employees of a drug testing firm is beginning a six-month prison sentence. Charlotte Lewis, 28, of Thornton Heath, Surrey, was sentenced at Peterborough Crown Court. She admitted four charges of harassment against current and former employees of the research firm Huntingdon Life Sciences in Huntingdon, Cambridgeshire. Lewis was arrested after forensic scientists matched her DNA to saliva on the back of stamps she had placed on envelopes. In mitigation, David Heraghgy, for Lewis, said the animal rights campaigner did not have "a violent bone in her body" and had no intention of carrying out threats she made in two letters sent to three different addresses. But Judge Pollard said Lewis's crimes were so serious and the letters had such an effect on the recipients that a jail sentence was necessary. He said Lewis would serve three months in prison and then be released on licence. The judge also imposed a restraining order banning Lewis from harassing workers at HLS. Lewis, a member of a group called Stop Animal Rights Cruelty, was jailed as HLS began to rebuild its business after being brought to the verge of bankruptcy by a year of sustained campaigning against its activities. Earlier this month the jobs of HLS's 1,000 workers were saved when the company received new backing from American financiers after the Royal Bank of Scotland had threatened to call in a 20 million loan. - I know this is off the topic of shooting somewhat, but I think it is interesting nevertheless as we are seeing a lot of terrorism from animal activists recently, and while it may be true that this woman "had no intention of carrying out threats she made" it's clear that most activists don't share the same scruples. We should all be on our guard. Kate -- Remember that LACS ran ads in the national papers which said: "Ban all shooting!" after Hungerford. I wrote them a letter about it and got back some inane response to the effect that if target shooters didn't support LACS that target shooting would be banned by default. Logic is not their strong suit. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Crime-Bomb goes off at charity shop
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ananova, 31/01/01 A bomb has exploded at a charity shop in Cumbria in what is believed to be the latest attack carried out by animal rights extremists. The device went off at the British Heart Foundation shop in Market Square, King Street, Penrith. A female member of staff opened the package which then exploded. No one was injured. A spokesman for Cumbria Police said: "It was opened by a woman at the shop. Fortunately she was not injured but very shocked by the incident. "We are now liaising with other police forces which had similar attacks." This is the tenth device which has been sent to a variety of premises in northern England and Wales since December. No one has claimed responsibility for the attacks but North Yorkshire Police, which is heading the investigation, believe an animal rights group is to blame. Yesterday the Army defused two nail bombs sent to an agricultural supply company in Sheffield and a Cancer Research Campaign shop in Lytham St Annes, Lancashire. Last month a six-year-old girl was injured when she opened a package sent to her father's pest control business in Congleton, Cheshire. In another incident earlier this month a woman was hurt when a device was sent to an estate agents in Patrington, east Yorkshire. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Misc-Nail gun suicide attempt fails
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ananova, 25/01/01 A man who accidentally cut off his hand tried to end his agony by blasting himself in the head with a nail gun. But William Bartron survived despite his injuries and is being treated at a Pennsylvania hospital. The 25-year-old is believed to have severed his hand with a power saw. Mr Bartron was found on the cellar floor with 12 one-and-a-half-inch nails sticking out of his scalp, according to the Lehigh Valley News. Police officer Cheryl Ruth said she was told Mr Bartron had shot several nails into his head with a pneumatic nail gun "because he could not stand the pain from the amputation" . Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Pol-Placards and Banners at Countryside March
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] What's the likelihood of a riot anyway? WE're all peaceable, lawfully demonstrating people concerned in no small way not to jeopardize our shotgun and firearms licenses. Indeed. I find this all very sad. The whole idea of a march or protest is essentially to ask for trouble. Before anyone jumps down my throat I'm not talking about inciting a riot or anything sinister, but the march is taking place so we can draw attention to ourselves and the fact that we think we're getting a raw deal. Correct? The way the discussions on this topic are going it sounds very much like lots of people are going to turn up to this demo, march peacefully and without placards (eh?), make no noise, and go home again. Will it get reported? No. Will anyone be any the wiser as to our plight? No. Will the march have achieved anything? No. We're not perceived as a threat because we're not even remotely threatening (and again, I don't mean threatening in any kind of sinister way). Therefore nobody is going to bow to our will, no matter how many of us turn out, because we're not going to chain ourselves to railings until we're listened to, or cry on national television about our cause, or do any of the emotive and ultimately very effective things that the antis - and other successful protesters - do. This isn't an argument that can be won by common sense, reasoned debate and logic alone. That's why we're having a protest. I can hear us now: - What do we want? - The enforcement of existing laws rather than the imposition of new ones! - When do we want it? - Well, we don't really know, it's just a mantra. We don't really believe it'll do anything. And, actually, we're not too happy with the existing laws either but we're too polite to say what we really think. Sheer numbers alone will not raise the profile of the issue, I can promise you that. As for the slogans posted the other day, many of them hinge on the concept of firearms ownership for self defence and are therefore useless. We need to think for ourselves rather than try to borrow from the States on this one. It's a completely different issue. Why don't we try to think up great banner slogans instead of worrying about whether placards are going to get us arrested or not? I spoke to my club chairman last night about the march. He told me he 'doesn't do marches'. I said, 'So you'd let them take your guns because you don't do marches?' He started to defend himself, saying he was more concerned about his career and that some people higher up in his company might 'have an opinion' about it. He doesn't tell people that he shoots and he told me he reckons he does his bit by continuing to come to the club when so many others have left. I'm dismayed and depressed by his attitude and also the attitude that going on one piddling demo might affect your chances of getting your FAC renewed or get you on some kind of blacklist. Are we really so unbelievably paranoid that we think the police are going to go matching up pictures of demonstrators with their FAC photos? Or that in a company that employs hundreds of thousands of people, anyone is really going to care whether one of them goes on a demo? It is legal to demonstrate. The police are more concerned that you keep on the roads and off the pavements during a demo than whether your FAC is due for renewal. It's the wierdos with body jewellery, green hair and the rest of it they ought to be keeping their eye on. I know this is unrelated to the rest of what I've written, but I'd love to know what you mean by this comment. I hope it's just a flippant remark. Kate -- My experience is that clever criminals attempt to look as normal as possible so as not to attract attention. Never assume. Anyway, my placard is going to say on the front: "Pistol shooters refuse to be forgotten." And on the back it's going to say: "Give us back our sport!" I've decided to make it simple. Steve. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] T O P I C A -- Learn More. Surf Less. Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Topics You Choose. http://www.topica.com/partner/tag01
CS: Misc-Police Corruption
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] IG, Look what I dug up... The mysterious missing page! This is ancient history, though no-one else got it all. I can't send it you on my revoked FAC because as you know, they aren't returned to the previous owner, and besides, I don't have your address. --- Turf Fraud Scandal or Trial of the Detectives This notorious corruption scandal in 1877 resulted in the reorganisation of the Detective Branch into the C.I.D. A rich Parisian woman, Madame de Goncourt, became the victim of two English confidence tricksters, Harry Benson and William Kurr, who persuaded her to part with รบ30,000. Scotland Yard were called in, and Superintendent Adolphus Williamson employed a bright multi-lingual Chief Inspector, Nathaniel Druscovich, to bring Benson back from Amsterdam where he had been arrested. Druscovich seemed to find the job surprisingly difficult. Sergeant John Littlechild and two others were sent to catch Kurr, and were repeatedly foiled by his moving on just as they expected to arrest him. Eventually they caught up with him in Edinburgh, and he stood trial and was convicted. Scotland Yard began to wonder why the arrests had been so difficult, and Benson and Kurr began to explain. Inspector John Meiklejohn, a deeply corrupt character, had been in Kurr's pay since 1873, accepting large sums of money to tip him off when his crimes were about to lead to his arrest. Meiklejohn had offered Druscovich the opportunity to borrow money from Kurr to repay his brother's debts, and thus Druscovich was also implicated, as was Chief Inspector Palmer, who appears to have been duped into going along with his colleagues. The Trial in Progress at the Old Bailey The three were sentenced to two years in prison, and the scandal nearly wrecked Williamson's career. Although his integrity was unquestioned, his supervision of subordinates seemed wanting, and following the Committee of Inquiry, Howard Vincent was given the opportunity to reshape the Detective Branch. Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
CS: Misc-Emperor's New Clothes
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] So the answer to your question is yes, I'd be "happy" for this guy to own guns, if I was secure in the knowledge that he was hugely outnumbered by ordinary - but armed - citizens, a situation that used to obtain in this country pre-WW1 but which is now reversed, since while it appears easy for thugs to buy an off-ticket machine gun the rest of us are approaching complete disarmament. You might be happy. I personally wouldn't be. - Time to get into this debate. IG, I used to hold an FAC. At that time, I went shooting with my university at a range called Castlelaw, up near Edinburgh, about 7 miles out. Now, the police used to regularly turn up there, on a pathetic pretext, just to make their presence felt. Generally, they turned up at end of shooting, just roll into the carpark and loiter, then drive off before anyone could actually reach them. One day I did, and they came out with a lame excuse about a report of people on mountain bikes (On a cyclepath past the back of a range halfway up a mountain? really? An ARV for that?). I then told them that they had missed their friends, the three coppers who turned out most weeks to practice with us.. Strangely, the patrol never came back after that. Obviously a good use of resources... Now, I used to talk to the other students, but rarely to the 3 firearms squad police. However, one day, I did. I told them my view on what was wrong with the current system. I will share this with the group. I told them of my vision. It is of a place where everyone was civil, polite and well-behaved. Everyone had a gun if they wanted it, and if they didn't fine. This could be reduced to a thought experiment that goes like this: I would rather live in a place where anyone could kill anyone, just by wanting it to happen, but they choose not to, than to live in a place where everyone was trying to kill everyone else, but was prevented from doing so only by lack of opportunity. This latter place I likened to our current society, where everything is banned or regulated, yet many laws are still broken. These three policemen laughed, and said that was stupid, and that you couldn't do that. The line was basically, you all do what the law says, or we arrest you. That is how it works. I then pointed out that we were standing in that very place. We were, of course, standing on a rifle range, where every person has a rifle and ammo. The three policemen, of course, would stand no chance in a fight. To reach the radio for backup, they would have had to get nearly 300 yards, and they were outnumbered 10 to 1. So how was law and order mantained? and what about when they weren't there? I think they eventually got my point. They stopped coming to the range. Perhaps these conversations are why I _used_ to hold an FAC? Would you judge me to be of suitable character? After all, I am a gun nut, I shoot almost every day, often driving miles to do so, sometimes a 50+ mile round trip for five rounds. Yet I am a member in good standing at my two clubs, and still often return to my uni club for competitions, shooting from one end of the country to the other. I have various medals and trophies. I am deemed fit and able by many people to have and hold firearms, yet the police set me up on a technical charge, and took my licence away. Of course, the stupidity of the system is that I am often in total control of various calibre firearms, with ammunition, totally legally. Oh, and I work for a defence contractor, in a top security area. If I really wanted to, I could get access to pretty potent toys from them. Not to mention the things I learnt in the cadets, (where I taught over 100 other kids to shoot straight and safely.) Let's not even mention all my reloading kit, and the drill press in the garage... So, would you still judge me to be (un)suitable? Or, to look at it another way, would you judge me any more dangerous if I _really_ wanted to shoot someone, if I had an FAC? Nigel Cybershooters website: http://www.cybershooters.org List admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ T O P I C A http://www.topica.com/t/17 Newsletters, Tips and Discussions on Your Favorite Topics
