Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
Corinna Vinschen wrote: On Apr 17 10:46, Charles Wilson wrote: Corinna Vinschen wrote: Yes, sure, but in that case, why not use the native ping? AFAIK the ICMP API doesn't provide all the data you need to emulate the usual UNIX ping output anyway. AFAIK, the native (e.g. the shipped-with-windows) ping doesn't use the ICMP dll either. That's why I installed FPing. However, FPing (or even shipped-with-windows ping) are native, not cygwin progs. I don't like using native progs at all, ever, if I can help it. They always lead to surprises: pty issues in terminals, issues with pathnames, difficulties in complex commands (pipes |), etc. But it was just an idle thought. No, it's not idle, it's a valid argument. The problem is, ping isn't useful as is for non-Admin users, and the package is orphaned. That's why I think we should drop it from the distro. If somebody takes over maintainance and comes up with a patch which makes ping work for non-Admin users again, there's nothing to say against a Cygwin ping. In the current state it just leads to confusion, though. Corinna First, Corrina, thanks for the info. Because of my other ACL problems I was totally confused as to what was going on. I have, I think fixed these with a combination of tools. Second, my user ID is part of the Administrator group, but you must specifically 'run as' Cygwin to gain true Administrator privilege even from an Administrators group ID in order for /bin/ping to work in my tests. I'm sure you knew this Corinna, but others may not have. Third, I've changed the ping in my profile to use MS ping, and it works fine. The parameters are specified differently, but the exit codes work fine. I tried 'fping', but its too noisy about having to use the ICMP.dll, and the -i option (use the ICMP.dll as a first choice rather than raw sockets) seems not to work. Now, I understand why 'ping' was missing for so long from Cygwin, and why 'traceroute' has never been a part of it. (Yes, I know about MS 'tracert'.) Thank you, again, Corinna. -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
On Apr 17 10:46, Charles Wilson wrote: > Corinna Vinschen wrote: > > > Yes, sure, but in that case, why not use the native ping? AFAIK the > > ICMP API doesn't provide all the data you need to emulate the usual > > UNIX ping output anyway. > > AFAIK, the native (e.g. the shipped-with-windows) ping doesn't use the > ICMP dll either. That's why I installed FPing. However, FPing (or even > shipped-with-windows ping) are native, not cygwin progs. I don't like > using native progs at all, ever, if I can help it. They always lead to > surprises: pty issues in terminals, issues with pathnames, difficulties > in complex commands (pipes |), etc. > > But it was just an idle thought. No, it's not idle, it's a valid argument. The problem is, ping isn't useful as is for non-Admin users, and the package is orphaned. That's why I think we should drop it from the distro. If somebody takes over maintainance and comes up with a patch which makes ping work for non-Admin users again, there's nothing to say against a Cygwin ping. In the current state it just leads to confusion, though. Corinna -- Corinna Vinschen Please, send mails regarding Cygwin to Cygwin Project Co-Leader cygwin AT cygwin DOT com Red Hat -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
Corinna Vinschen wrote: > Yes, sure, but in that case, why not use the native ping? AFAIK the > ICMP API doesn't provide all the data you need to emulate the usual > UNIX ping output anyway. AFAIK, the native (e.g. the shipped-with-windows) ping doesn't use the ICMP dll either. That's why I installed FPing. However, FPing (or even shipped-with-windows ping) are native, not cygwin progs. I don't like using native progs at all, ever, if I can help it. They always lead to surprises: pty issues in terminals, issues with pathnames, difficulties in complex commands (pipes |), etc. But it was just an idle thought. -- Chuck -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
Lee D. Rothstein wrote: > * I also continue to have problems installing 'gcc' and 'tetex', > both keep reinstalling. Could this be related to ACLs? No, this is a known issue (at least for GCC) and harmless. cheers, DaveK -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
On Apr 17 05:54, Charles Wilson wrote: > Corinna Vinschen wrote: > > > Cygwin's ping uses raw sockets. Using raw sockets is only allowed > > to administrative users since Windows XP or so. So Cygwin's ping > > is not very useful for a long time. When you're running under UAC, > > you don't have admin privs, unless you start the shell with "run as > > administrator". > > > > I still think we should remove ping from the distro. In its current > > form it's not very helpful. > > I wonder if it's worth trying to rework some of the ping internals to > use the ICMP dll. If you do that, you can ping without Admin privs > (this is the way FPing does it). Yes, sure, but in that case, why not use the native ping? AFAIK the ICMP API doesn't provide all the data you need to emulate the usual UNIX ping output anyway. Corinna -- Corinna Vinschen Please, send mails regarding Cygwin to Cygwin Project Co-Leader cygwin AT cygwin DOT com Red Hat -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
Corinna Vinschen wrote: > Cygwin's ping uses raw sockets. Using raw sockets is only allowed > to administrative users since Windows XP or so. So Cygwin's ping > is not very useful for a long time. When you're running under UAC, > you don't have admin privs, unless you start the shell with "run as > administrator". > > I still think we should remove ping from the distro. In its current > form it's not very helpful. I wonder if it's worth trying to rework some of the ping internals to use the ICMP dll. If you do that, you can ping without Admin privs (this is the way FPing does it). -- Chuck -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: 1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
On Apr 16 14:17, Lee D. Rothstein wrote: > I do a 'ping' in my profile of an Internet server to see if the > network is up when I bring up the first terminal session/login. > > I'm getting the following error: > >ping: socket: Operation not permitted Cygwin's ping uses raw sockets. Using raw sockets is only allowed to administrative users since Windows XP or so. So Cygwin's ping is not very useful for a long time. When you're running under UAC, you don't have admin privs, unless you start the shell with "run as administrator". I still think we should remove ping from the distro. In its current form it's not very helpful. Corinna -- Corinna Vinschen Please, send mails regarding Cygwin to Cygwin Project Co-Leader cygwin AT cygwin DOT com Red Hat -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
1.7: Problem with Vista64b ACLs and sockets
I do a 'ping' in my profile of an Internet server to see if the network is up when I bring up the first terminal session/login. I'm getting the following error: ping: socket: Operation not permitted It doesn't matter what pingable node I try. They all fail. 'type' reveals that this is '/bin/ping'. This problem started after I turned on UAC and rebooted. I'd had it off for the initial install of 1.7 and all updates prior to this point. I have tried updating the ACLs for ALL key directories (using Start / Run ... / explorer, and then Properties / Security / / Advanced ...), subdirectories and files to allow everything for my user ID. The changes have all stuck, but the problem remains. Note, also that using 'cmd.exe' and: C:\Windows\System32>.\ping node.domain.tld does work. Note that my 'ssh' sessions to a Linux server (terminal and smtp) work fine. I'm out of ideas. * How do I fix this? * I need 'ping' to work, no matter what, but is there a more basic way way to determine if the WAN is "up"? * Do I need some other ACL magic beans? ;-) * I also continue to have problems installing 'gcc' and 'tetex', both keep reinstalling. Could this be related to ACLs? Lee -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
