Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-30 Thread Richard Foulk
 Why when I'm asking about this probably new feature of cygwin sshd, all
 list become silent? :) Nobody remembers what changes were in cygwin sshd
 since 01.03.2005? :) Or this information is about to be secret and I
 have to understand it from sources only?
 
 It's much simpler than that:  We just don't like you.
 
 cgf
 
 

This would be funny if this list wasn't so surly at times.



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Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-30 Thread Larry Hall (Cygwin)

Richard Foulk wrote:

Why when I'm asking about this probably new feature of cygwin sshd, all
list become silent? :) Nobody remembers what changes were in cygwin sshd
since 01.03.2005? :) Or this information is about to be secret and I
have to understand it from sources only?

It's much simpler than that:  We just don't like you.

cgf




This would be funny if this list wasn't so surly at times.




Don't call me Shirley.

(Am I dating myself with this reference? ;-) )


--
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RFK Partners, Inc.  (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
216 Dalton Rd.  (508) 893-9889 - FAX
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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
Why when I'm asking about this probably new feature of cygwin sshd, all
list become silent? :) Nobody remembers what changes were in cygwin sshd
since 01.03.2005? :) Or this information is about to be secret and I
have to understand it from sources only?

Pavel Ivanov


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pavel Ivanoff
 Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 5:10 PM
 To: cygwin@cygwin.com
 Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
 
  I'm afraid so.  It's unclear why Windows imposes this 
  restriction, but if
  your sshd is running as a non-SYSTEM user, it can't 
 interact with the
  desktop.  I was going to suggest using cygstart, but even that
  apparently doesn't work as-is.  It probably can be patched up 
  to obtain
  the current window station and ask the shell to execute the 
  program there,
  but http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#SHTDI.
 
 But in combination cygwin of 01.03.2005 + Windows 2000 this feature
 works as intended. What is it: new security prohibition of 
 Windows XP or
 new feature of last version of cygwin?
 I know that there are many security features added in new sshd (that I
 had to recognize when reinstalled cygwin). This is another one that
 can't be solved to work as it was?
  
 Pavel Ivanov
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Igor Peshansky
  Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 4:59 PM
  To: Pavel Ivanoff
  Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
  
  Ugh, top-posting...  Reformatted.
  
  On Wed, 27 Sep 2006, Pavel Ivanoff wrote:
  
-Original Message-
From: Igor Peshansky
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 4:27 PM
To: Pavel Ivanoff
Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
   
You weren't clear on exactly what you want to happen.  If 
  you wish to
see the window pop up on the remote machine's desktop, 
  you need to add
the Allow service to interact with desktop checkmark 
 in the sshd
service description (or, alternatively, install it with the '-i'
cygrunsrv flag).
   
If you want the window to be forwarded over to the local machine
(i.e., the one you're ssh'ing from), that is not 
  currently possible
with Windows.  One thing you can try is use a tool like 
  VNC (which you
can forward over ssh, too).
  
   As I understand Allow service to interact with desktop is 
  exactly what
   I want. But this checkbox is active only when service los 
  on as SYSTEM
   but my sshd logs on as me. And installing the service with 
  '-i' option
   said to me the same: cygrunsrv: --interactive not allowed 
  with --user.
   Is there any solution to this problem? Or I must run 
  service as SYSTEM
   to have this functions usable?
  
  I'm afraid so.  It's unclear why Windows imposes this 
  restriction, but if
  your sshd is running as a non-SYSTEM user, it can't 
 interact with the
  desktop.  I was going to suggest using cygstart, but even that
  apparently doesn't work as-is.  It probably can be patched up 
  to obtain
  the current window station and ask the shell to execute the 
  program there,
  but http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#SHTDI.
  Igor
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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Thorsten Kampe
* Pavel Ivanoff (Fri, 29 Sep 2006 10:09:31 +0400)
 Why when I'm asking about this probably new feature of cygwin sshd, all
 list become silent? :) Nobody remembers what changes were in cygwin sshd
 since 01.03.2005? :) Or this information is about to be secret and I
 have to understand it from sources only?

There is absolutely new about this: Interact with desktop works only 
with the LocalSystem account since Windows NT 4 (~ 1996). And if you 
use privilege separation then sshd switches to another user. Both 
things are not related to Cywin.

Thorsten


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RE: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Thorsten Kampe
* Pavel Ivanoff (Fri, 29 Sep 2006 18:17:04 +0400)
 But why with privilege separation (or even without it when sshd launched
 by me manually) in cygwin of 01.03.2005 in Windows 2000 sshd CAN
 interact with desktop, and in cygwin of 01.07.2006 in Windows XP it
 CANNOT?

It depends under which user the service (or process is running). I 
think you really haven't provided sufficient information so the best 
thing is to start here...

... http://cygwin.com/problems.html

Thorsten


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RE: RE: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
 * Pavel Ivanoff (Fri, 29 Sep 2006 18:17:04 +0400)
  But why with privilege separation (or even without it when 
 sshd launched
  by me manually) in cygwin of 01.03.2005 in Windows 2000 sshd CAN
  interact with desktop, and in cygwin of 01.07.2006 in Windows XP it
  CANNOT?
 
 It depends under which user the service (or process is running). I 
 think you really haven't provided sufficient information so the best 
 thing is to start here...

OK.
The sshd service is running under my account. I go to Linux (via ssh).
Then run ssh there, login onto my computer under my account, try to run
any desktop program and it doesn't show any windows.
My friend on another computer does all the same but with his account and
his computer and desktop program shows all windows as expected.
The differrence between our configurations:
my - Windows XP, cygwin of 01.07.2006 (all standard packages)
his - Windows 2000, cygwin of 01.03.2005 (all standard packages for that
version)

Why the behaviour is different?

Pavel Ivanov

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Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread mwoehlke

Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

The sshd service is running under my account. I go to Linux (via ssh).
Then run ssh there, login onto my computer under my account, try to run
any desktop program and it doesn't show any windows.
My friend on another computer does all the same but with his account and
his computer and desktop program shows all windows as expected.
The differrence between our configurations:
my - Windows XP, cygwin of 01.07.2006 (all standard packages)
his - Windows 2000, cygwin of 01.03.2005 (all standard packages for that
version)

Why the behaviour is different?


 my - Windows *XP*
 his - Windows *2000*
Have you considered this MAJOR difference?

--
Matthew
My preferred shell is Christian. It's Bourne Again.


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RE: Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
 Pavel Ivanoff wrote:
  The sshd service is running under my account. I go to Linux 
 (via ssh).
  Then run ssh there, login onto my computer under my 
 account, try to run
  any desktop program and it doesn't show any windows.
  My friend on another computer does all the same but with 
 his account and
  his computer and desktop program shows all windows as expected.
  The differrence between our configurations:
  my - Windows XP, cygwin of 01.07.2006 (all standard packages)
  his - Windows 2000, cygwin of 01.03.2005 (all standard 
 packages for that
  version)
  
  Why the behaviour is different?
 
   my - Windows *XP*
   his - Windows *2000*
 Have you considered this MAJOR difference?

Yes, I considered it. But my friend don't want to try to upgrade his
cygwin to new because he already tried it and after upgrade sshd was
unable to work. I also met this problem of unworkable sshd (the same
problem though another OS). After some experiments I realized that sshd
from new cygwin requires to grant 3 Local Policies to user under which
it runs. These policies are
Generate security audits
Replace process level token
Create process token
Without them new sshd doesn't work. My friend is not local
administrator, so he can't grant to himself this policies and can't
install new sshd.

So my question is: this disabling of accessing to desktop is also new
feature of new sshd? And can I allow him to access desktop somehow?
Or I have to install on my computer the old sshd to become sure that old
sshd will work on my OS too?

Pavel Ivanov

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Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Larry Hall (Cygwin)

mwoehlke wrote:

Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

The sshd service is running under my account. I go to Linux (via ssh).
Then run ssh there, login onto my computer under my account, try to run
any desktop program and it doesn't show any windows.
My friend on another computer does all the same but with his account and
his computer and desktop program shows all windows as expected.
The differrence between our configurations:
my - Windows XP, cygwin of 01.07.2006 (all standard packages)
his - Windows 2000, cygwin of 01.03.2005 (all standard packages for that
version)

Why the behaviour is different?


  my - Windows *XP*
  his - Windows *2000*
Have you considered this MAJOR difference?



Or even:

 my - Windows XP, cygwin of ***01.07.2006*** (all standard packages)
 his - Windows 2000, cygwin of ***01.03.2005***

I think tracking down these two outstanding differences should provide you
with allot of insight and it won't even require you to futilely ping the
list! ;-)

--
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RFK Partners, Inc.  (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office
216 Dalton Rd.  (508) 893-9889 - FAX
Holliston, MA 01746

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Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread mwoehlke

Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

Pavel Ivanoff wrote:
The sshd service is running under my account. I go to Linux 

(via ssh).
Then run ssh there, login onto my computer under my 

account, try to run

any desktop program and it doesn't show any windows.
My friend on another computer does all the same but with 

his account and

his computer and desktop program shows all windows as expected.
The differrence between our configurations:
my - Windows XP, cygwin of 01.07.2006 (all standard packages)
his - Windows 2000, cygwin of 01.03.2005 (all standard 

packages for that

version)

Why the behaviour is different?

  my - Windows *XP*
  his - Windows *2000*
Have you considered this MAJOR difference?


Yes, I considered it. [snip]


Actually, your answer indicates you did not. Look again at the emphasis 
I added; it isn't pointing at the Cygwin versions.



So my question is: this disabling of accessing to desktop is also new
feature of new sshd? And can I allow him to access desktop somehow?
Or I have to install on my computer the old sshd to become sure that old
sshd will work on my OS too?


You haven't clarified how you know that this is not caused by changes 
in how the OS treats the SYSTEM account, or service, or etc. between 
2000 and XP.



What is it: new security prohibition of Windows XP or
new feature of last version of cygwin?


My guess is new security prohibition of Windows XP. Have you 
eliminated that?


Unless you have evidence that this is not the case (meaning, one working 
and one non-working install /on the exact same OS/), why are you 
insisting that Cygwin and/or sshd is at fault?


--
Matthew
My preferred shell is Christian. It's Bourne Again.


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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Dave Korn
On 29 September 2006 19:11, mwoehlke wrote:

 Pavel Ivanoff wrote:
 Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

 Why the behaviour is different?
   my - Windows *XP*
   his - Windows *2000*
 Have you considered this MAJOR difference?
 
 Yes, I considered it. [snip]
 
 Actually, your answer indicates you did not. Look again at the emphasis
 I added; it isn't pointing at the Cygwin versions.

 What is it: new security prohibition of Windows XP or
 new feature of last version of cygwin?
 
 My guess is new security prohibition of Windows XP. Have you
 eliminated that?

  Hang on.  Trouble interacting with the desktop - and the main difference
between XP and 2k in this regard is the presence of fast user switching and
terminal services, both of which move the previously global desktop into the
per-user local namespace.

  Maybe switching off those two services in control panel - Administrative
Tools - services (a.k.a 'services.msc') will let it work?


cheers,
  DaveK
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Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-29 Thread Christopher Faylor
On Fri, Sep 29, 2006 at 10:09:31AM +0400, Pavel Ivanoff wrote:
Why when I'm asking about this probably new feature of cygwin sshd, all
list become silent? :) Nobody remembers what changes were in cygwin sshd
since 01.03.2005? :) Or this information is about to be secret and I
have to understand it from sources only?

It's much simpler than that:  We just don't like you.

cgf

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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-27 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
As I understand Allow service to interact with desktop is exactly what
I want. But this checkbox is active only when service los on as SYSTEM
but my sshd logs on as me. And installing the service with '-i' option
said to me the same: cygrunsrv: --interactive not allowed with --user.
Is there any solution to this problem? Or I must run service as SYSTEM
to have this functions usable?

Pavel Ivanov

 -Original Message-
 From: Igor Peshansky
 Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 4:27 PM
 To: Pavel Ivanoff
 Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
 
 You weren't clear on exactly what you want to happen.  If you 
 wish to see
 the window pop up on the remote machine's desktop, you need to add the
 Allow service to interact with desktop checkmark in the sshd service
 description (or, alternatively, install it with the '-i' 
 cygrunsrv flag).
 
 If you want the window to be forwarded over to the local 
 machine (i.e.,
 the one you're ssh'ing from), that is not currently possible 
 with Windows.
 One thing you can try is use a tool like VNC (which you can 
 forward over
 ssh, too).
 HTH,
   Igor

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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-27 Thread Igor Peshansky
Ugh, top-posting...  Reformatted.

On Wed, 27 Sep 2006, Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

  -Original Message-
  From: Igor Peshansky
  Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 4:27 PM
  To: Pavel Ivanoff
  Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
 
  You weren't clear on exactly what you want to happen.  If you wish to
  see the window pop up on the remote machine's desktop, you need to add
  the Allow service to interact with desktop checkmark in the sshd
  service description (or, alternatively, install it with the '-i'
  cygrunsrv flag).
 
  If you want the window to be forwarded over to the local machine
  (i.e., the one you're ssh'ing from), that is not currently possible
  with Windows.  One thing you can try is use a tool like VNC (which you
  can forward over ssh, too).

 As I understand Allow service to interact with desktop is exactly what
 I want. But this checkbox is active only when service los on as SYSTEM
 but my sshd logs on as me. And installing the service with '-i' option
 said to me the same: cygrunsrv: --interactive not allowed with --user.
 Is there any solution to this problem? Or I must run service as SYSTEM
 to have this functions usable?

I'm afraid so.  It's unclear why Windows imposes this restriction, but if
your sshd is running as a non-SYSTEM user, it can't interact with the
desktop.  I was going to suggest using cygstart, but even that
apparently doesn't work as-is.  It probably can be patched up to obtain
the current window station and ask the shell to execute the program there,
but http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#SHTDI.
Igor
-- 
http://cs.nyu.edu/~pechtcha/
  |\  _,,,---,,_[EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ZZZzz /,`.-'`'-.  ;-;;,_Igor Peshansky, Ph.D. (name changed!)
 |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'   old name: Igor Pechtchanski
'---''(_/--'  `-'\_) fL a.k.a JaguaR-R-R-r-r-r-.-.-.  Meow!

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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-27 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
 I'm afraid so.  It's unclear why Windows imposes this 
 restriction, but if
 your sshd is running as a non-SYSTEM user, it can't interact with the
 desktop.  I was going to suggest using cygstart, but even that
 apparently doesn't work as-is.  It probably can be patched up 
 to obtain
 the current window station and ask the shell to execute the 
 program there,
 but http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#SHTDI.

But in combination cygwin of 01.03.2005 + Windows 2000 this feature
works as intended. What is it: new security prohibition of Windows XP or
new feature of last version of cygwin?
I know that there are many security features added in new sshd (that I
had to recognize when reinstalled cygwin). This is another one that
can't be solved to work as it was?
 
Pavel Ivanov


 -Original Message-
 From: Igor Peshansky
 Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 4:59 PM
 To: Pavel Ivanoff
 Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
 
 Ugh, top-posting...  Reformatted.
 
 On Wed, 27 Sep 2006, Pavel Ivanoff wrote:
 
   -Original Message-
   From: Igor Peshansky
   Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 4:27 PM
   To: Pavel Ivanoff
   Subject: RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh
  
   You weren't clear on exactly what you want to happen.  If 
 you wish to
   see the window pop up on the remote machine's desktop, 
 you need to add
   the Allow service to interact with desktop checkmark in the sshd
   service description (or, alternatively, install it with the '-i'
   cygrunsrv flag).
  
   If you want the window to be forwarded over to the local machine
   (i.e., the one you're ssh'ing from), that is not 
 currently possible
   with Windows.  One thing you can try is use a tool like 
 VNC (which you
   can forward over ssh, too).
 
  As I understand Allow service to interact with desktop is 
 exactly what
  I want. But this checkbox is active only when service los 
 on as SYSTEM
  but my sshd logs on as me. And installing the service with 
 '-i' option
  said to me the same: cygrunsrv: --interactive not allowed 
 with --user.
  Is there any solution to this problem? Or I must run 
 service as SYSTEM
  to have this functions usable?
 
 I'm afraid so.  It's unclear why Windows imposes this 
 restriction, but if
 your sshd is running as a non-SYSTEM user, it can't interact with the
 desktop.  I was going to suggest using cygstart, but even that
 apparently doesn't work as-is.  It probably can be patched up 
 to obtain
 the current window station and ask the shell to execute the 
 program there,
 but http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#SHTDI.
   Igor
 -- 

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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-26 Thread Igor Peshansky
Ugh, top-posting...  Reformatted.

On Tue, 26 Sep 2006, Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pavel Ivanoff
  Sent: Friday, September 22, 2006 4:57 PM
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#PCYMTNQREAIYR.  Thanks.

  Subject: New windows from cygwin in ssh
 
  Hi, all!
 
  Tell me please were there any changes to cygwin that made such
  behaviour: when launch from cygwin bash shell any windows program like
  notepad, for example, it normally opens its window and I can work with
  it. But when I enter to cygwin via ssh from Linux-machine or even from
  local cygwin bash, launching notepad hangs and doesn't seem to open
  any windows or to do any other work. I can terminate this hanging by
  Ctrl+C, of cause, but problem is that I can't invoke any
  windows-program from cygwin via ssh. In cygwin release of March 01,
  2005 this launching works as I expect it, but in release of January
  20, 2006 it doesn't. Were there some changes that did block this
  functionality for some reason?

 Can anybody help me with this problem? There is some guess that this
 happens due to some Local Security Policy on Windows XP (I know that in
 last versions of cygwin sshd requires several settings in Local Security
 Policy to work correctly). But I can't understand what policy prohibits
 to make desktop windows over ssh...

You weren't clear on exactly what you want to happen.  If you wish to see
the window pop up on the remote machine's desktop, you need to add the
Allow service to interact with desktop checkmark in the sshd service
description (or, alternatively, install it with the '-i' cygrunsrv flag).

If you want the window to be forwarded over to the local machine (i.e.,
the one you're ssh'ing from), that is not currently possible with Windows.
One thing you can try is use a tool like VNC (which you can forward over
ssh, too).
HTH,
Igor
-- 
http://cs.nyu.edu/~pechtcha/
  |\  _,,,---,,_[EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ZZZzz /,`.-'`'-.  ;-;;,_Igor Peshansky, Ph.D. (name changed!)
 |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'   old name: Igor Pechtchanski
'---''(_/--'  `-'\_) fL a.k.a JaguaR-R-R-r-r-r-.-.-.  Meow!

Las! je suis sot... -Mais non, tu ne l'es pas, puisque tu t'en rends compte.
But no -- you are no fool; you call yourself a fool, there's proof enough in
that! -- Rostand, Cyrano de Bergerac

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RE: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-26 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
Can anybody help me with this problem? There is some guess that this
happens due to some Local Security Policy on Windows XP (I know that in
last versions of cygwin sshd requires several settings in Local Security
Policy to work correctly). But I can't understand what policy prohibits
to make desktop windows over ssh...

Thanks in advance.
Pavel Ivanov


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pavel Ivanoff
 Sent: Friday, September 22, 2006 4:57 PM
 To: cygwin@cygwin.com
 Subject: New windows from cygwin in ssh
 
 Hi, all!
 
 Tell me please were there any changes to cygwin that made such
 behaviour: when launch from cygwin bash shell any windows program like
 notepad, for example, it normally opens its window and I can work with
 it. But when I enter to cygwin via ssh from Linux-machine or even from
 local cygwin bash, launching notepad hangs and doesn't seem 
 to open any
 windows or to do any other work. I can terminate this hanging 
 by Ctrl+C,
 of cause, but problem is that I can't invoke any windows-program from
 cygwin via ssh.
 In cygwin release of March 01, 2005 this launching works as I 
 expect it,
 but in release of January 20, 2006 it doesn't. Were there some changes
 that did block this functionality for some reason?
 
 Best regards.
 Pavel Ivanov
 
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Re: New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-26 Thread Chris Taylor

Pavel Ivanoff wrote:

Can anybody help me with this problem? There is some guess that this
happens due to some Local Security Policy on Windows XP (I know that in
last versions of cygwin sshd requires several settings in Local Security
Policy to work correctly). But I can't understand what policy prohibits
to make desktop windows over ssh...

Thanks in advance.
Pavel Ivanov




How are you authenticating with ssh? Password (keyboard-interactive) or 
keypair?


If you are authenticating via keypair, it isn't really running as you, 
iirc. The SYSTEM user doesn't normally create desktop windows, so it's 
possible that this process isn't allowed to as a result..


Chris

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New windows from cygwin in ssh

2006-09-22 Thread Pavel Ivanoff
Hi, all!

Tell me please were there any changes to cygwin that made such
behaviour: when launch from cygwin bash shell any windows program like
notepad, for example, it normally opens its window and I can work with
it. But when I enter to cygwin via ssh from Linux-machine or even from
local cygwin bash, launching notepad hangs and doesn't seem to open any
windows or to do any other work. I can terminate this hanging by Ctrl+C,
of cause, but problem is that I can't invoke any windows-program from
cygwin via ssh.
In cygwin release of March 01, 2005 this launching works as I expect it,
but in release of January 20, 2006 it doesn't. Were there some changes
that did block this functionality for some reason?

Best regards.
Pavel Ivanov

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