RE: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion
This just caught my attention this morning, don't know if it has been a continuing discussion of not but let me contribute the following: a: Someone (close by to cfg) demonstrates that the bug/problem/issue appears on his machine I have many annoying problems ( erroneous thread activation from scripts seems to be common ) and I have debuggers available. I could attach a stuck cygwin window and send stacks or dumps to anyone interested. If I chose this route who should I send the stuff to? Please respond to me ( and optionally the whole list ) since our spam filter is less likely to delete it and I've been ignoring most of the cygwin list posts. Thanks. -Original Message- From: Volker Bandke [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 10, 2005 3:54 AM To: Cygwin Subject: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 I really want that hyperthreading problem with Cygwin resolved. Does the following suggestion make any sense: (I assume cfg is in the US, if not, make the necessary changes) a: Someone (close by to cfg) demonstrates that the bug/problem/issue appears on his machine b: This someone determines what an identical replacement machine would cost now c: CFG (or the someone from a) sets up a paypal account for HT Machine Donations d: When the required amount is reached, the Someone from a: sends his machine to CFG and buys a replacement out of the paypal account I am willing to pay 100 USD into that account. Knowing that my machine has cost about Euro 1000 I believe it should take a real short time to provide cfg with a machine to test / debug the hyperthreading issue . Any comments are welcome With kind Regards|\ _,,,---,,_ ZZZzz /,`.-'`'-. ;-;;, Volker Bandke |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' (BSP GmbH)'---''(_/--' `-'\_) Life's a bitch and then you die. (Another Wisdom from my fortune cookie jar) -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: PGP Personal Security 7.0.3 iQA/AwUBQeJCoh5trGyhAF0wEQKktACeN15g4FyLBC30ziZSo8UH+m56zSMAnRh8 yj/KMcCi16U6uxV3+07giini =t5s5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
RE: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion
Hello all, I have tried lots of different machines to reproduce the bug (hyperthreaded workstations and dual-processor servers). I was able to reproduce the problem on *every* Windows XP (XP Pro, XP Home and 2003 Server) machines I tried, but *not* on Windows 2000 (Pro and Server) machines. To demonstrate the bug, just run simultaneously 2 or 3 instances of the ksh script I posted in my previous message, and you will get shortly one of the following problems: 1) the shell script stops because `pwd` returned the empty string 2) the shell crashes with the 'erroneous thread activation' error. Regards, Stephane Donze -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mike Marchywka Sent: lundi 10 janvier 2005 12:42 To: Volker Bandke; Cygwin Subject: RE: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion This just caught my attention this morning, don't know if it has been a continuing discussion of not but let me contribute the following: a: Someone (close by to cfg) demonstrates that the bug/problem/issue appears on his machine I have many annoying problems (erroneous thread activation from scripts seems to be common ) and I have debuggers available. I could attach a stuck cygwin window and send stacks or dumps to anyone interested. If I chose this route who should I send the stuff to? Please respond to me ( and optionally the whole list ) since our spam filter is less likely to delete it and I've been ignoring most of the cygwin list posts. Thanks. -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
RE: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion
I've been on XP for a while but IIRC I was seeing it with hyperthread on 2000. -Original Message- From: Stéphane Donzé [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 10, 2005 8:41 AM To: Mike Marchywka; Volker Bandke; Cygwin Subject: RE: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion Hello all, I have tried lots of different machines to reproduce the bug (hyperthreaded workstations and dual-processor servers). I was able to reproduce the problem on *every* Windows XP (XP Pro, XP Home and 2003 Server) machines I tried, but *not* on Windows 2000 (Pro and Server) machines. To demonstrate the bug, just run simultaneously 2 or 3 instances of the ksh script I posted in my previous message, and you will get shortly one of the following problems: 1) the shell script stops because `pwd` returned the empty string 2) the shell crashes with the 'erroneous thread activation' error. Regards, Stephane Donze -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mike Marchywka Sent: lundi 10 janvier 2005 12:42 To: Volker Bandke; Cygwin Subject: RE: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion This just caught my attention this morning, don't know if it has been a continuing discussion of not but let me contribute the following: a: Someone (close by to cfg) demonstrates that the bug/problem/issue appears on his machine I have many annoying problems (erroneous thread activation from scripts seems to be common ) and I have debuggers available. I could attach a stuck cygwin window and send stacks or dumps to anyone interested. If I chose this route who should I send the stuff to? Please respond to me ( and optionally the whole list ) since our spam filter is less likely to delete it and I've been ignoring most of the cygwin list posts. Thanks. -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion
On Mon, Jan 10, 2005 at 09:53:55AM +0100, Volker Bandke wrote: I really want that hyperthreading problem with Cygwin resolved. Does the following suggestion make any sense: (I assume cfg is in the US, if not, make the necessary changes) a: Someone (close by to cfg) demonstrates that the bug/problem/issue appears on his machine b: This someone determines what an identical replacement machine would cost now c: CFG (or the someone from a) sets up a paypal account for HT Machine Donations d: When the required amount is reached, the Someone from a: sends his machine to CFG and buys a replacement out of the paypal account I am willing to pay 100 USD into that account. Knowing that my machine has cost about Euro 1000 I believe it should take a real short time to provide cfg with a machine to test / debug the hyperthreading issue . http://www.cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2004-09/msg00084.html I was going to say that this was YA repeat observation, in keeping with the need for people to send the same observations about hyperthreaded behavior here. The repeated observations are as follows: 1) I just got a hang by doing X (where X is some variation of previously reported problems)! 2) I just got this problem as reported in the mailing list thread here: *show a URL where someone is reporting hyperthread problems* (bonus points for showing URL with an entry from me talking about how I can't duplicate the problem) 3) I can provide a system over the internet for use in debugging. 4) I just noticed a hang on Windows 95! This must mean that hyperthreading is not the problem! Let me try to state this very clearly. The last time I tried to duplicate the problem, I ran a test for three days, tying up a machine that I use for other purposes. I'd previously tried other variations as well. The system is an SMP system so there should have been a good chance of duplicating the bug. I'm not going to try every variation of this problem when it shows up on the list. Fixing this problem will be difficult. Dealing with race conditions like this always is difficult. I don't want to do this over the internet. It would be too painful and there is no guarantee that I could even do it at all. It could involve machine reboots (I just had to do one of these yesterday while debugging a non-thread race condition). No one has said that cygwin is bug free. So, there is undoubtedly more than one way to make it hang. A hang that shows up on Windows 95 does not necessarily translate to the same problem that people on hyperthreading machines are seeing. It may, but since the only Windows 9x type system that I have available for extended use is a vmware emulation, it isn't likely that I'll be able to duplicate the problem in Windows 9x. I have seven machines in my office right now and don't really need another one (I never thought I'd hear myself say that) but I will somehow make room if I can get another hyperthreaded machine here. If I do, I will dedicate it to cygwin and cygwin testing and try to make sure that this problem never crops up again. Someone else has previously raised the issue of a paypal account and the thread in the quoted URL above shows how to make donations. However, I am heartened to see that Volker is thinking like a scientist and has noted a problem with the get a new hyperthreaded system to cgf problem. There is no guarantee that any *new* machine that I get will evidence the problem. Rather than do some complicated swap game on systems, however, I'd be willing to chance that a system which is sufficiently similar to a problem system will show the problem. If/when I get enough money to purchase one, I will check such a system out. If I can't duplicate the problem on that system, I'll be glad to then swap with someone else. cgf -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion
On Mon, 2005-01-10 at 12:20 -0500, Christopher Faylor wrote: The last time I tried to duplicate the problem, I ran a test for three days, tying up a machine that I use for other purposes. I'd previously tried other variations as well. The system is an SMP system so there should have been a good chance of duplicating the bug. I'm not going to try every variation of this problem when it shows up on the list. Just a quick observation and a question. Hyperthreading exposed a race condition in an NT driver of mine that had run for a long time on an SMP system. The timing is different. Is there anybody out there who has Windows XP and hyperthreading and _can't_ reproduce the problem? This is making me nervous about a project I'm planning, as most of the target machines will be P4s with hyperthreading running XP. -- Adrian Cox [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
Re: Hyperthreading Problem - suggestion
On Mon, Jan 10, 2005 at 12:20:23PM -0500, Christopher Faylor wrote: On Mon, Jan 10, 2005 at 09:53:55AM +0100, Volker Bandke wrote: I really want that hyperthreading problem with Cygwin resolved. Does the following suggestion make any sense: (I assume cfg is in the US, if not, make the necessary changes) a: Someone (close by to cfg) demonstrates that the bug/problem/issue appears on his machine b: This someone determines what an identical replacement machine would cost now c: CFG (or the someone from a) sets up a paypal account for HT Machine Donations d: When the required amount is reached, the Someone from a: sends his machine to CFG and buys a replacement out of the paypal account I am willing to pay 100 USD into that account. Knowing that my machine has cost about Euro 1000 I believe it should take a real short time to provide cfg with a machine to test / debug the hyperthreading issue . http://www.cygwin.com/ml/cygwin/2004-09/msg00084.html I have, with some misgivings, set up a donations page: http://cygwin.com/donations.html This is something that I've wanted to do for a while and, IIRC, I've even previously gotten buy-in from other developers and package maintainers. If other package maintainers want to add their links, please send me private email with the appropriate info and I'll do so post-haste. cgf -- Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/
