startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Using latest cywin, downloaded/installed 07/13/2004.

Can reproduce an XP blue screen, by starting a cygwin shell, and typing
'startx'.


Scenario 1:  New terminal appears.  after a little bit of time, the machine
will blue screen/reboot.

Scenario 2:  after startx brings up window, use ssh -X -l username
to.some.linux.box; run startkde, and blue screen/reboot occurs.

Can reproduce this behavior.

Have the latest drivers for my video card.

Not sure how to start debugging/narrowing down what might be causing this.
Any suggestions?  Any known issues relating to this that I'm missing?
Searched archives, but haven't seen anything specific to my situation (at
least not yet!).

Thanks,
Steve
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

[This may be a duplicate; submitted the question before the subscription
request; if it is, I apologize]

I'm using latest cywin, downloaded/installed 07/13/2004.

I can reproduce an XP blue screen, by starting a cygwin shell, and typing
'startx'.


Scenario 1:  New terminal appears.  after a little bit of time, the machine
will blue screen/reboot.

Scenario 2:  after startx brings up window, use ssh -X -l username
to.some.linux.box; run startkde, and blue screen/reboot occurs.

Can reproduce this behavior.

Have the latest drivers for my video card.

Not sure how to start debugging/narrowing down what might be causing this.
Any suggestions?  Any known issues relating to this that I'm missing?
Searched archives, but haven't seen anything specific to my situation (at
least not yet!).

Thanks,
Steve
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Daniel,

Will have to check on the brand of the video card; it's a laptop, and since
I didn't piece it together, I can't remember off the top of my head.  It's a
GeForce 5600 go blah blah something-or-other (i.e. I'm at work, and can't
look it up :) ).

Wasn't aware of current ATI problems, but then again, I haven't bought an
ATI in a long time...

Now, as for whether the driver is provided by Microsoft or the vendor, I
can't say.  I'd assume that I can look that up in Control Panel -> System,
and once I look up the specific vendor, maybe downloading the vendor's
driver (if different from the one loaded) will help.

I appreciate the suggestion of vendor vs. MS drivers, though.  I looked up
the version of the driver on my system, and then looked up the version on
the HP (it's an HP Pavilion zd7000 laptop).  The driver on my machine is
newer than the driver on the HP Support site, but I have to admit that I
didn't notice the source of the driver.  A little homework and research is
in order.  If I'm lucky, updating the driver will fix the problem.  Driver
issues were what I was thinking might be wrong, too , but who knows.

Thanks,
Steve

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Armbrust, Daniel C.
Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 2:28 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?


 Two questions - is it an ATI video card?

And when you say newest drivers - is that the newest drivers from Microsoft,
or the newest drivers direct from your vendor?  Or maybe media center
edition doesn't let you install any drivers unless they are Microsoft
approved?

In my experience, windows provided drivers are quite outdated - and in the
case of ATI - their drivers in the past have not been worth 2 cents.  I was
happy when they finally released a build of the drivers that didn't
bluescreen my machine once a day  

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

> Alexander,
> 
> 
>  
> >>This is the first report of a blue screen since a long time. 
>  
> Leave it to me to find a way to blue-screen Windows :)
> 
> 
> 
> >>maybe the network driver is the cause.
> 
> Not sure, but to be honest, I wasn't thinking in that direction, so I
> appreciate the suggestion.  I can check on that this evening...
> 
> 
> 
> >>you can change the way how XWin draws to the screen.  try 
> >>startx -- -engine 1
> >>startx -- -engine 2
> >>startx -- -engine 4
> >>startx -- -engine 8
> 
> >>does any of these modes work?
> 
> Will give these a try tonight (it's my home PC, not work), and report back
> tomorrow.
> 
> Thanks for taking the time to give me suggestions.  I appreciate it.
> 
> Steve

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Alexander & Daniel,

This is a response to both of your suggestions and questions (about the
engine being used, and video card information).

NVIDIA GeForce FX Go5600
Driver Provider:  NVIDIA
Driver Date:  2/3/2004
Version:  5.4.0.1
Note:  This version provided via Windows Update via IE, though it says the
driver was
provided by NVIDIA.

Test "Script":
  - start cygwin shell
  - startx
  - ssh -X -l user a.linux.box
  - startkde


Result of test with above parameters:  blue screen during KDE splash screen.

Result of above test with above parameters, using various engines:
  - startx -- -engine 1
  - startx -- -engine 2
  - startx -- -engine 4
  - startx -- -engine 8

  All blue screens, during various phases of the KDE "splash" screen.

Next, I loaded the drivers from nvidia.com; interestingly, the version
provided is:
  
  6/24/2003
  4.4.8.2

  Results:  The same.  blue screen

Next, I tried drivers at the hp site (it's a zd7000 notebook).

  11/18/2003
  4.5.1.1

  Results:  The same.  blue screen

  12/10/2003
  4.7.1.2

  Results:  The same.  blue screen


Next, I took a guess that my screen resolution might be an issue, at
1440x900. So, I tried
1024x768.  Same results.  Blue Screen.


So, no luck yet.

Any suggestions for further debugging and/or logging?  If there's a readme
for that, could you point me in the right direction?

Other ideas:
  - Daniel (I think) suggested checking network card drivers; haven't done
that yet.
  - another post suggests possible ZoneAlarm issues.  I am running that, but
haven't tested turning it off.
  - others?

Stumped!

Steve

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Nope, the network card is built-in; no pcmcia.  I didn't check the chipset,
but I can say that a previous version of cygwin worked just fine with X.
The only reason why I upgraded cygwin was because I had to
reformat/reinstall XP because Roxio Media Creator wreaked havoc.  But that's
another story, and I didn't reinstall the Roxio software.

So, I am not sure what could be causing the issue.  Are there any debuggin
suggestions?  Somehow turn on logging to see at what point a failure occurs?
Or, do some kind of XP debugging (though the event viewer log doesn't give
me any information that helped...).

Still trying,
Steve

>>On Thu, 15 Jul 2004, Listopad, Steve wrote:

> Alexander & Daniel,
 
> This is a response to both of your suggestions and questions (about the
> engine being used, and video card information).
> 
> NVIDIA GeForce FX Go5600
> Driver Provider:  NVIDIA
> Driver Date:  2/3/2004>
> Version:  5.4.0.1
> Note:  This version provided via Windows Update via IE, though it says the
> driver was
> provided by NVIDIA.
> 
> Test "Script":
>   - start cygwin shell
>   - startx
>   - ssh -X -l user a.linux.box
>   - startkde

>>Does the notebook have a pcmcia network card? Maybe you can try XWin
without 
>>having the network drivers active. some wlan drivers (esp rtl chipset) are
>>known to be very unstable.

>>bye

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

>A bluescreen is an error inside the windows kernel. Either the base system
it
>self or some drivers (i suspect the second). Software can only trigger
this.
>But there have been only minor changes in Cygwin/X and I doubt they could
>lead to a bluescreen since no hardware access has changed.

Well, I've tried upgrading the video drivers as well as the network drivers.
Still get the blue screens.  So, suspecting my wired network card drivers, i
then used my wireless network card.  Same.  Blue Screen.

The only other thing that I can think of was brought up in other posts - I
have Zone Alarm 5 and Norton Antivirus 2004 Pro running.  Anybody else out
there getting XP blue screens with cygwin when running ZAP and/or NAV?

>I believe the difference with your system is some driver which was updated
>before and which is not current yet.

I suspected as much, too, except that I've exahusted (I think) those
possibilities.  I'm fully updated as far as Windows Update is concerned;
and, I pulled down the latest video & network drivers from the respective
companies.

>You could build XWin with debugging output. This prints received windows
>messages, some work in windows specific functions is traced but not the
>network layer.

>The low level unix calls (for network code) can be trace with strace.

>But this will not produce useful output if the kernel goes wild and prints
the
>bluescreen right after the data was written to the screen. Maybe writing
the
>data to harddisk may help but I think the bluescreen will leave disk
buffers
>unwritten and you'll get a logfile which truncated a long time before the
>actual crash happens.

All of this is unfortunate; even if, technically, it's Windows that has the
problem, the net result is that I can't use cygwin, unless I can figure out
what is causing the problem, and take action to correct it

Steve

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Forgot to mention that before the bluescreens, I saw (but couldn't capture
accurately) errors of the form:

x error bad window invalid window parameter (and alternately 3 and 5 on the
end of these types of messages).

Not sure if that is relevant, but I did see them.

Steve

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Listopad, Steve
Sent: Monday, July 19, 2004 1:39 PM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?



>A bluescreen is an error inside the windows kernel. Either the base system
it
>self or some drivers (i suspect the second). Software can only trigger
this.
>But there have been only minor changes in Cygwin/X and I doubt they could
>lead to a bluescreen since no hardware access has changed.

Well, I've tried upgrading the video drivers as well as the network drivers.
Still get the blue screens.  So, suspecting my wired network card drivers, i
then used my wireless network card.  Same.  Blue Screen.

The only other thing that I can think of was brought up in other posts - I
have Zone Alarm 5 and Norton Antivirus 2004 Pro running.  Anybody else out
there getting XP blue screens with cygwin when running ZAP and/or NAV?

>I believe the difference with your system is some driver which was updated
>before and which is not current yet.

I suspected as much, too, except that I've exahusted (I think) those
possibilities.  I'm fully updated as far as Windows Update is concerned;
and, I pulled down the latest video & network drivers from the respective
companies.

>You could build XWin with debugging output. This prints received windows
>messages, some work in windows specific functions is traced but not the
>network layer.

>The low level unix calls (for network code) can be trace with strace.

>But this will not produce useful output if the kernel goes wild and prints
the
>bluescreen right after the data was written to the screen. Maybe writing
the
>data to harddisk may help but I think the bluescreen will leave disk
buffers
>unwritten and you'll get a logfile which truncated a long time before the
>actual crash happens.

All of this is unfortunate; even if, technically, it's Windows that has the
problem, the net result is that I can't use cygwin, unless I can figure out
what is causing the problem, and take action to correct it

Steve

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Igor,

>> See
.


Had already seen & tried it; still got blue screens.  Thanks, though.

Steve

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Igor,

Yea, I figured that those messages had nothing to do with my BSODs, but it
can't help to mention little details like that.  Could eventually lead to a
solution.

As for the last part of the BSOD stuff, I can appreciate the technicality
that it isn't cygwin causing the BSOD.  But the practicality is that cygwin
is the only (well, for now, anyway) software for me that can consistently
produce the BSOD, and this renders the software unusable for me.  As a
developer, I understand the situation.  As a user, I'm trying to get ideas
on what might be causing the problem.  Hoping that someone else has seen
something similar, and has suggestions.  'It's not cygwin's fault' just
doesn't help.  Anyone who's been on the wrong side of a BSOD understands :)

Thanks for the recommendation about ssh -Y...


Steve

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Igor Pechtchanski
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2004 8:56 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?


On Tue, 20 Jul 2004, Listopad, Steve wrote:

> Igor,
>
> >> See
<http://x.cygwin.com/docs/faq/cygwin-x-faq.html#q-ssh-no-x11forwarding>.
>
> Had already seen & tried it; still got blue screens.  Thanks, though.
> Steve

Steve,

That link had nothing to do with the BSODs.  It was for your "bad window"
error messages, which I doubt are related to the BSODs.  FWIW, read the
last part of <http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#BSOD>. ;-)
Igor
-- 
http://cs.nyu.edu/~pechtcha/
  |\  _,,,---,,_[EMAIL PROTECTED]
ZZZzz /,`.-'`'-.  ;-;;,_[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'   Igor Pechtchanski, Ph.D.
'---''(_/--'  `-'\_) fL a.k.a JaguaR-R-R-r-r-r-.-.-.  Meow!

"I have since come to realize that being between your mentor and his route
to the bathroom is a major career booster."  -- Patrick Naughton

RE: Looking for help

[Listopad, Steve]

on cygwin machine, try:

- start bash shell
- ssh -X -l username remote.machine (though look at the posts about ssh
-Y...)
- on remote machine, once logged in via ssh, do something like:
-  startkde


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ronald Clark
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Looking for help


Hello all, 

I am looking for a doc that will hopefully explain how to setup Cygwin
to allow me to SSH to a system and run startx and have the X Window
environment be routed through the tunnel. Is there such a document?

Right now, I have Cygwin loaded with SSH and when I log into my remote
system and type SSH, I see the X server start on the remote machine, and
no X Windows in my Cygwin session. I assume this is a common issue and
any help would be appreciated. 

Thanks, 
Ron Clark





CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE:



The information contained in this ELECTRONIC MAIL transmission
is confidential.  It may also be privileged work product or proprietary
information. This information is intended for the exclusive use of the
addressee(s).  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby
notified that any use, disclosure, dissemination, distribution [other
than to the addressee(s)], copying or taking of any action because
of this information is strictly prohibited.

RE: Looking for help

[Listopad, Steve]

revision.

- start bash shell
- startx
- ssh -X -l username remote.machine (though look at the posts about ssh
-Y...)
- on remote machine, once logged in via ssh, do something like:
-  startkde


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Listopad, Steve
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2004 9:51 AM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: RE: Looking for help


on cygwin machine, try:

- start bash shell
- ssh -X -l username remote.machine (though look at the posts about ssh
-Y...)
- on remote machine, once logged in via ssh, do something like:
-  startkde


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ronald Clark
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2004 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Looking for help


Hello all, 

I am looking for a doc that will hopefully explain how to setup Cygwin
to allow me to SSH to a system and run startx and have the X Window
environment be routed through the tunnel. Is there such a document?

Right now, I have Cygwin loaded with SSH and when I log into my remote
system and type SSH, I see the X server start on the remote machine, and
no X Windows in my Cygwin session. I assume this is a common issue and
any help would be appreciated. 

Thanks, 
Ron Clark





CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE:



The information contained in this ELECTRONIC MAIL transmission
is confidential.  It may also be privileged work product or proprietary
information. This information is intended for the exclusive use of the
addressee(s).  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby
notified that any use, disclosure, dissemination, distribution [other
than to the addressee(s)], copying or taking of any action because
of this information is strictly prohibited.

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Well, as a last attempt at trying to figure out why startx/ssh was
blue-screening my XP box, I tried something that was mentioned on this list,
for different reasons:  I uninstalled Zone Alarm Pro 5.  Bingo.  No blue
screen.  Everything works fine.  Have not installed Zone Alarm v4.x yet, to
see if it is specific to version 5, but I can say that I have successfully
used cygwin while running ZAP 4.x.

So, something's up with version 5.x of Zonealarm...  Just thought I'd post
these findings, in case others might be having similar problems.

Steve

RE: startx causing XP (Media Center Edition) blue screen?

[Listopad, Steve]

Update:

Using ZAP 4.5x works fine with cygwin; no blue screens.  ZAP 5.x causes blue
screens for me.

Steve

RE: X server hangs on startup

[Listopad, Steve]

Link for installing previous versions of ZoneAlarm:

http://www.zonelabs.com/store/content/support/zap/zapMain.jsp

Click on the General FAQs link; interesting info there about problems, along
with links to install 4.5 & 4.5 Pro.

Steve

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Edwin
Sent: Saturday, August 07, 2004 4:57 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: X server hangs on startup


Ken Dibble  alltel.net> writes:

> 
> http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin-xfree/2004-07/msg00192.html
> 
> http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin-xfree/2004-07/msg00181.html
> 
> http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin-xfree/2004-07/msg00161.html
> 
> http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin-xfree/2004-07/msg00158.html
> 
> http://sources.redhat.com/ml/cygwin-xfree/2004-07/msg00150.html
> 
> Edwin Goei wrote:
> 
> > When I run xinit.exe, the X server starts but hangs.  I saw a thread 
> > that attributed this to Zonealarm which I am also using (version 
> > 5.1.011.000).  I never saw a resolution to the problem.  Is the 
> > workaround to use a different firewall program?  If so, what firewall 
> > should I use?

Thanks for the refs.  I'm using ZoneAlarm Pro 5 now, anyone know how to get
the
older version 4.5?  I can't find it on the zonelabs.com site.  I also want
to be
protected by a personal firewall.

BTW, is anyone working on a workaround/fix?  Apparently other firewalls like
Norton also cause problems with the X server.

-Edwin