Re: A 'Funky A.T.M.' Lets You Pay for Purchases Made Online

2003-07-26 Thread Nomen Nescio
One point being overlooked here is digital versus physical anonymity.

The funky ATM (what, does it smell or something?) will allow you to
(among other things) stick in some cash and let someone else withdraw it
using a password which you have sent him out of band (according to the
patent - which I've actually read, more than anyone else here can say).
This will allow for digital anonymity in the sense that there is no
account information associated with the transaction.

Now, it's true that ATMs take pictures of people, so you don't have
full physical anonymity.  But given the limited reliability of facial
recognition systems, especially if you take simple precautions like
wearing a hat and tilting your head down, you can have de facto very
strong anonymity putting money into or taking it out of an ATM.  The mere
fact that it takes your picture doesn't mean that much.

It's also true that the amount of cash that could be practically
transfered in this way is limited to a few thousand dollars at most, given
that the machines will probably only accept and dispense twenty dollar
bills or equivalent.  Nevertheless such payments would be a good start.
The ability to pay or receive a few thousand dollars, untraceably, would
enable a number of interesting applications involving freedom of speech
and action.  Writing custom software or providing sensitive information
could be funded at these levels.

The point which has been mostly overlooked is that this article was
nothing but vapor, based on the issuance of a patent.  There's a huge
barrier between the idea and the implementation.  A cash-transfer ATM
would be a true boon to cypherpunk goals, but it is doubtful whether
such a system will be allowed to exist in today's world.



Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool

2003-07-08 Thread Nomen Nescio
Tyler Durden leaves the fight club and writes:
 Do you have a reference? I don't remember reading that SACD was encrypted. 
 What I DO remember is that the reason there's no standard SACD or DVD-A 
 digital interface is because the Industry wants that digital interface to be 
 encrypted.

The detailed technical specs are apparently secret, but an overview
of the multi-layered SACD copy protection is at
http://www.sacd.philips.com/b2b/downloads/content_protection.pdf.  If
you don't like PDFs, most of the same information is at
http://www.disctronics.co.uk/technology/dvdaudio/dvdaud_sacd.htm.

Alan Clueless writes:

 Furthermore, people have come to expect that they should be able to play 
 whatever disc shaped media in their computer.  At some point there will 
 need to be a software based player.

Both of the documents above specifically deny that software based players
will be allowed.  I get the impression that the decryption will always be
done in hardware, and if a PC is ever able to play one of these gadgets,
it will be a Palladium system or something similar that can be locked
down.

Steve Shear writes:

 If you believe the article Myths and Misconceptions about Hardware 
 Hacking, 
 http://www.cptwg.org/Assets/Presentations/ARDG/ARDGHardware_hack05-28-03.pdf 
 , recently posted to the Content Protection Technical Working Group, access 
 to affordable commercial technology for reverse engineering has given 
 hardware hackers the upper hand.

That's mostly about how hardware hackers can use modern chips and custom
PC boards without spending more than a few hundred dollars.  Fine,
but it's a long way from that to being able to pull an algorithm and/or
device key out of a chip which has been designed to make that difficult.



Re: Idea: The ultimate CD/DVD auditing tool

2003-07-07 Thread Nomen Nescio
Thomas Shaddup writes:
 As a welcomed side effect, not only we'd get a device for circumvention of
 just about any contemporary (and possibly a good deal of the future ones)
 optical media protections

This is only for the minimal forms of protection which are designed to
work with existing CD/DVD players.   If you look at the new audio formats
like SACD, they use encrypted data.  All your lasers won't do you any
good unless you can pry a key (and the algorithm!) out of a consumer
player, which won't be easy assuming it is in a tamper-resistant unit.
And you can bet the industry won't make the mistake again of allowing
software-based players, as they did with the DeCSS affair.

In short, you're fighting yesterday's war.  Try looking ahead a bit to
see where the battlegrounds of the future will be contested.