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Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
At 03:03 PM 5/21/2002 -0700, Meyer Wolfsheim wrote: NAI is now taking steps to remove the remaining copies of PGP from the Internet, not long after announcing that the company will not release its fully completed Mac OS X and Windows XP versions, and will no longer sell any copies of its PGP software. Wonder is this will affect pgpi.com? steve
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RE: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
Perhaps there is a conflict of interest issue as well? NAI Labs is comprised of more than 100 dedicated scientific and academic professionals in four locations in the Unites States, and is entirely funded by government agencies such as: the Department of Defense's (DoD) Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the National Security Agency (NSA), and the United States Army. From http://www.nai.com/naicommon/aboutnai/aboutnai.asp --- Lucky Green [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... LOL. Nothing new here. NAI has been dutifully sending cease-and-desist letters to the well-known PGP mirror site for years. The mirror sites just as dutifully have tossed said notices into the trash can upon receipt. This has been going on for over 5 years. ... --Lucky LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com
Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
Disk encryption can always be augmented by physical security, however communication encryption is dependent on available encryption tools and legal rights. If quality tools are not available, then individuals and businesses will not use them. As long as communication encryption is not widespread, crypto rights will be vulnerable to attack as a special interest issue vs public safety. Of course privacy and other pillars of democracy seem to be special interest issues as well. --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -- On 21 May 2002 at 15:03, Meyer Wolfsheim wrote: NAI is now taking steps to remove the remaining copies of PGP from the Internet, not long after announcing that the company will not release its fully completed Mac OS X and Windows XP versions? Not a problem -- we have too many communication encryption programs already. Still a bit weak on disk encryption programs, and of course, we have no transaction software. We may suspect that someone is leaning on the big boys not to provide encryption to the masses, but if so, it is a bit late. --digsig James A. Donald 6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG X6j99VDvTvGmFGh1D3CQg9dK9SHeYpD48/ZPZgHz 4BH3f/B8/u/XrQuUz6UmSd7Vb0Xyl7FKwywwFfFdN = End. LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com
Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
On Wed, May 22, 2002 at 01:00:54AM -0700, Lucky Green wrote: | Most likely, this Peter Beruk is new at his job, has not yet figured out | that C-level management at NAI wants copies of PGP floating about the | Net, but needs to of course protect their trademarks and copyrights by | dutifully sending letters which then in turn will be ignored. So while | this Beruk guy is supposed to send out those letters, he isn't actually | supposed to do anything that takes down the sites. Again, I suspect he | is just new at his job. He'll figure it out in due time. Which is too bad. If NAI-PGP went away completely, then compatability problems would be reduced. I also expect that the German goverment group currently funding GPG would be more willing to fund UI work for windows. Adam -- It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. -Hume
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RE: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
Meyer Wolfsheim wrote: NAI is now taking steps to remove the remaining copies of PGP from the Internet, not long after announcing that the company will not release its fully completed Mac OS X and Windows XP versions, and will no longer sell any copies of its PGP software. Do we still believe this was a pure cost-cutting measure? From: http://crypto.radiusnet.net/archive/pgp/index.html Date: Thu, 9 May 2002 13:01:40 -0500 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Network Associates, Inc. DMCA Notice [ The following text is in the iso-8859-1 character set. ] [ Your display is set for the US-ASCII character set. ] [ Some characters may be displayed incorrectly. ] DMCA NOTICE OF INFRINGING MATERIAL LOL. Nothing new here. NAI has been dutifully sending cease-and-desist letters to the well-known PGP mirror site for years. The mirror sites just as dutifully have tossed said notices into the trash can upon receipt. This has been going on for over 5 years. Most likely, this Peter Beruk is new at his job, has not yet figured out that C-level management at NAI wants copies of PGP floating about the Net, but needs to of course protect their trademarks and copyrights by dutifully sending letters which then in turn will be ignored. So while this Beruk guy is supposed to send out those letters, he isn't actually supposed to do anything that takes down the sites. Again, I suspect he is just new at his job. He'll figure it out in due time. --Lucky
Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- At 11:49 PM -0400 on 5/21/02, Luis Villa wrote, on FoRK: Well, yes, but you seem to be implying some sinister motive that not all of us are reading between the lines clearly enough to see :) I mean, otherwise, this just seems like a fairly garden-variety silly use of the DMCA by a large software company. What am I missing? Not much. A professor at Mizzou once taught us that there were three theories of history: the conspiracy theory, where people conspire to control events, succeed, and write history to hide the conspiracy; the fuck-up theory, where people fuck up, fix it, and write history to hide the fuck-up, and, the inevitable Hegelian synthesis (this was the Swinging Socialist '70's after all), the fucked-up conspiracy, where people conspire, fuck up, and then conspire to write history to hide them both -- and usually fuck that up too. So, no, I don't think that someone gave NAI The Briefing, and then they got fascist religion or something, compounded by the deaths of thousands of martyrs at the World Trade Center. Though, frankly, given how the libertarians were squeezed out by the statists at NAI (for good marketing reasons, nobody really cares, market wise, about privacy, much less strong cryptography for anything but their credit card numbers at the moment), I'm sure the only people left standing at the bar when they had last call for crypto at NAI were the people who, before NAI, relied on the Federales for a material, if not significant, portion of their profit margin. I just see this as the anti-climax to a giant fucked-up conspiracy to control crypto, and, in turn, it's the fuck-up that actually *makes* history, in the form of some poor copyright compliance schmuck, deep in the bowels of a cubicle-farm somewhere... Cheers, RAH -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: PGP 7.5 iQEVAwUBPOshr8UCGwxmWcHhAQHbIgf8DIiLX3yWK/iDLqCRv8gPCeggV9inoWYD 3K9uZkr/CwYzdgiIkWnJLlM0rdi5T/bKGPyZbZFh73Rjm0TAMlHyIfDoa8RLogsY Pv6z1pY5C6uVvZ7NKtgt8zCcM8mga3d4lLoR5Pz3FyuRspNXb7nJjOXCbjl4QUNX EJQsA192OHfMcGTXbQIZnyEXOEohzSG8Cp1i2LrFJzXLahNGSj9m1Ay5RoAb4mDf oAsg6LrheIB5vRl2Ky2yVi4psOe3i1ezRTXuIE5bC/9/P6IixAu/W4UmEQ9rx+It h+VM6kRAPvJiYvLi2Op1DiapCcTso8eANhggd7j4ph+tWZhRPZRENA== =XZOu -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- - R. A. Hettinga mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/ 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA ... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience. -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
At 03:03 PM 5/21/2002 -0700, Meyer Wolfsheim wrote: NAI is now taking steps to remove the remaining copies of PGP from the Internet, not long after announcing that the company will not release its fully completed Mac OS X and Windows XP versions, and will no longer sell any copies of its PGP software. Wonder is this will affect pgpi.com? steve
Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
At 11:33 PM 5/21/02, you wrote: At 5:41 PM -0700 on 5/21/02, Joseph S. Barrera III wrote on FoRK: So what are they trying to do? I've totally not been following PGP, so I don't understand what they're doing. O, I don't kno It looks, to *me* at least, like they're trying to stamp out unauthorized copies of PGP on the net by threatening to send people to jail. What does it look like to *you*? Yes, using the DMCA hammer can attack unlicensed distribution, but like most things, it is not without other consequences. Whether or not those other consequences are more desired by NAI than simple protection of intellectual property is unknown. Potentially among those other consequences would be reduction of availability to novices of PGP (with slick GUI). Absence of new versions, as the MS Win OS moves older apps into incompatibility, essentially trends toward removing PGP from new systems as operated by the mass market. We are told that NAI wanted to sell the PGP entities but could not find an adequate buyer. I have seen no doc on how hard they tried, or what bids might have been in discussion. Others have said that NAI bought PGP from the gitgo to kill it. It appears that whatever NAI's motiviations, PGP, as packaged for the mass market novices, is being killed. While other versions are abundant, without a slick GUI and seamless integration into the mass email clients, they will not be abundantly adopted in the mass market. Stamping out the distribution of software that is no longer available for sale is of dubious immediate financial benefit to the copyright holder, thus they must be doing it either for future hopes for PGP (sale or re-marketing; not likely in my opinion), or for other, undisclosed reasons (liklihood unknown). Some say the State surveillance ops would prefer to have a smaller haystack in which to search for whatever needles them. Less encrypted traffic would appear to shrink the number and size of those haystacks. It could be accidental that NAI's business operations just happen to coincide with what benefits those ops. For those prefering conspiracy theories, NAI announced essentially the shutdown of PGP on March 5, 2002, and the company announced shortly thereafter On March 26, 2002, the Company announced that it was informed that the Staff of the SEC had commenced a Formal Order of Private Investigation into the Company's accounting practices during the 2000 fiscal year. Such notifications follow non-formal hints that the Formal Order will soon be announced. That appears to be a potential jail-time hammer, if one was needed. But it could simply be a protection of intellectual property rights for whatever business opportunity may unfold in the future. Or the accounting hammer. Or We are currently engaged in several research and development contracts with agencies of the U.S. government. The willingness of these government agencies to enter into future contracts with us depends in part on our continued ability to meet their expectations. Minimum fee awards for companies entering into government contracts are generally between 3% and 7% of the costs incurred by them in performing their duties under the related contract. However, these fee awards may be as low as 1% of the contract costs. Furthermore, these contracts are subject to cancellation at the convenience of the government agencies. Although we have been awarded contract fees of more than 1% of the contract costs in the past, minimum fee awards or cancellations may occur in the future. Reductions or delays in federal funds available for projects we are performing could also have an adverse impact on our government business. Contracts involving the U.S. government are also subject to the risks of disallowance of costs upon audit, changes in government procurement policies, required competitive bidding and, with respect to contracts involving prime contractors or government-designated subcontractors, the inability of those parties to perform under their contracts. Pick none, one or a few.
RE: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
Perhaps there is a conflict of interest issue as well? NAI Labs is comprised of more than 100 dedicated scientific and academic professionals in four locations in the Unites States, and is entirely funded by government agencies such as: the Department of Defense's (DoD) Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), the National Security Agency (NSA), and the United States Army. From http://www.nai.com/naicommon/aboutnai/aboutnai.asp --- Lucky Green [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... LOL. Nothing new here. NAI has been dutifully sending cease-and-desist letters to the well-known PGP mirror site for years. The mirror sites just as dutifully have tossed said notices into the trash can upon receipt. This has been going on for over 5 years. ... --Lucky LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com
Re: NAI pulls out the DMCA stick
Disk encryption can always be augmented by physical security, however communication encryption is dependent on available encryption tools and legal rights. If quality tools are not available, then individuals and businesses will not use them. As long as communication encryption is not widespread, crypto rights will be vulnerable to attack as a special interest issue vs public safety. Of course privacy and other pillars of democracy seem to be special interest issues as well. --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -- On 21 May 2002 at 15:03, Meyer Wolfsheim wrote: NAI is now taking steps to remove the remaining copies of PGP from the Internet, not long after announcing that the company will not release its fully completed Mac OS X and Windows XP versions? Not a problem -- we have too many communication encryption programs already. Still a bit weak on disk encryption programs, and of course, we have no transaction software. We may suspect that someone is leaning on the big boys not to provide encryption to the masses, but if so, it is a bit late. --digsig James A. Donald 6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG X6j99VDvTvGmFGh1D3CQg9dK9SHeYpD48/ZPZgHz 4BH3f/B8/u/XrQuUz6UmSd7Vb0Xyl7FKwywwFfFdN = End. LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com
lne.com dead ?
Unable to deliver message to the following address(es). [EMAIL PROTECTED]: 209.157.152.14 does not like recipient. Remote host said: 550 5.1.1 [EMAIL PROTECTED]... User unknown Giving up on 209.157.152.14. --- Original message follows. Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] May 2002 11:43:03 PDT Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 11:43:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Morlock Elloi [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Expected spanish inquisition To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] All they need is get rid of that pesky cash thingie ... http://www.heise.de/tp/english/inhalt/te/12574/1.html Spain therefore wants the European Member States to consider a 'set of harmonised regulatory requirements' for identifying users of prepaid card technology which help to 'eliminate anonymity reconcilable with commercial operators' protection of their customers' personal data'. = end (of original message) Y-a*h*o-o (yes, they scan for this) spam follows: __ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com
