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'Taxi! Fly Me To Cleveland'

[R. A. Hettinga]

Geodesic Air Travel is here.

I flew out of Albuquerque last week with one of the guys from Eclipse
Aviation. Okay. We were on the same plane. I was in steerage. He wasn't.
:-).

Cheers,
RAH
---



The Wall Street Journal


 May 19, 2004

 THE MIDDLE SEAT
 By SCOTT MCCARTNEY




'Taxi! Fly Me
 To Cleveland'
New Four-Passenger Jets Spur
 Plans for Cab-Like Air Service;
 Memories of People Express
May 19, 2004

Perhaps as soon as next year, travelers will have a new alternative to
flying commercial airlines or buying their own jet.

Using a new generation of small jets that are currently in flight testing,
several entrepreneurs are trying to launch "air taxi" services. The goal is
to let corporate travelers bypass crowded airports and fly into smaller,
local airports, at half of the current cost of chartering a jet.

The most advanced air-taxi effort is coming from the man who brought the
bus to air travel. Donald C. Burr -- founder of People Express Airlines
back in the 1980s -- plans to launch iFly Air Taxi Inc. service next year.
He has teamed up with son, Cameron, as well as his onetime nemesis, Robert
L. Crandall. The former chief executive of AMR Corp. and its American
Airlines, Mr. Crandall once helped run Mr. Burr's People Express out of
business. Venture capitalists and aircraft manufacturers say other groups
are also developing plans for air-taxi service, but none has come forward
publicly yet or has had to make a Securities and Exchange Commission filing
as iFly did March 29.

Air taxis are also envisioned as a growing part of the nation's
air-transport system in a futuristic blueprint being developed by a
government task force that will report to the White House later this year.


One reason for optimism that now is the right time for air taxis: The
arrival of a new generation of four-passenger "micro jets" that can operate
more cheaply than conventional jets. These aircraft typically are much
lighter than conventional private jets, and are powered by a new generation
of small, fuel-efficient engines. None of the planes are in service yet.
Manufacturers are accepting advance orders, which so far are being placed
by a mixture of private individuals and hopeful air-taxi operators.

The new planes have the potential to revolutionize transportation.
Currently, chartering private jets is extremely expensive, costing $7,000
or more for a 500-mile hop, round-trip. Fractional ownership (where you buy
a "share" of an aircraft that entitles you to use it periodically) is no
bargain either. Corporate-owned jets, while sometimes economical for
shuttling groups of executives, are often viewed as overly expensive perks.

Air-taxi service would be different, in theory at least. Mr. Burr says he
can provide rides for $3 to $4 a mile, on average -- which works out to be
a bit more expensive than most first-class tickets. A trip to Cleveland
from Teterboro, N.J., for example, might cost $1,000 to $1,400 on average.
By comparison, an unrestricted first class ticket on Continental Airlines
from Newark, N.J., to Cleveland costs $1,338.

iFly is expected to announce an order for Adam Aircraft jets soon. The Adam
A700, which at $2 million is half of the price of the cheapest Cessna
Citation jet right now, began flight tests in July 2003.

The Adam jet is one of a half-dozen new aircraft like this in development.
Honda Motor Co. has been conducting test flights of its HondaJet in North
Carolina; Toyota Motor Corp. is also working on a jet. Eclipse Aviation
Corp., run by a former software executive with considerable financial
backing, says it has orders for more than 2,000 jets.

Other heavy hitters are working on the most important aspect, the engines.
General Electric Co. is working on the Honda jet; Pratt & Whitney, a unit
of United Technologies Corp., is testing a new engine that will power the
Eclipse jet; and Williams International is shrinking an engine currently
used on Citation jets for the micro-jet class. It powers the Adam Aircraft
jet.

Corporate aviation has a solid safety record, with an accident rate per
flight-hour about on par with commuter airlines, according to National
Transportation Safety Board figures. Air-taxi operations also claim to
offer convenience, since travelers would arrive and depart at small
airports, park just a short walk from the plane, and could choose their own
departure times. And taking a taxi would avoid security lines and reduce
the chances of lost luggage. "It's a highly simplified charter operation,"
Mr. Crandall says. "We hope to run it like a limousine service."

Much like airline tickets, iFly will be priced so that peak periods are
more expensive than off-peak times. In addition the third and fourth seats
on a "taxi" flight will be a lot cheaper than the first or second seats
sold.

This time, he says he intends to grow slowly. The lack of technology and
aggressive growth ultimately cratered People E

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Take a breather

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We are glad to confirm that your application is accepted and you can
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Out of Office AutoReply: Re: Thanks!

[Emma . Bright]

Title: Out of Office AutoReply: Re: Thanks!





Thank you for your email. I will be out of this office for three months on a secondment.  Please contact Glenis Bray on 9264 5088 or [EMAIL PROTECTED] until my replacement is known.  I may be contacted on 9324 6824 if the matter is urgent.   

Yours sincerely
Emma Bright
Senior Policy Officer 
Strategic Human Resources 
Department of Education and Training
EAST PERTH WA 6004 
 

Re: al-qaeda.net node downtime

[Adam]

On Tue, 18 May 2004 05:18:06 -0400
"Riad S. Wahby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I'm moving from Massachusetts to Texas, and unfortunately that means
> that my machine's connectivity will be in a state of flux for a while.
> Unless someone has a machine with a (fast, static) connection on which
> they want to let me host the node temporarily, al-qaeda.net will be
> down
> for some (unspecified, but hopefully not too long) time while I move.
> 
> If you do have a place to put the node (I believe [EMAIL PROTECTED] once
> offered such a machine, but perhaps things have changed), let me know
> within the next day or two and I'll move everything over before I
> leave.
> 
> -- 
> Riad Wahby
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> MIT VI-2 M.Eng

How ironic, I moved from Texas to Massachusetts .. You must be insane to
go to TX

-- 
Adam

"satyam, shivam, sundaram"

The best Software offer around 4866

[Alisha Maffett]

Page (690ed7de7f7) loading...
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Dis(f2893bad292)con(5136241fb01)tinue
E4nN7.D3mAV.puXRZ.PM0xc/XlUkq032AjY.
Art is the path of the creator to his work.What I have to say is far more important than how long my eyelashes are.Before we blame we should first see whether we cannot excuse.Is your Christianity ancient history--or current events?Human beliefs, like all other natural growths, elude the barrier of systems.If we are to judge of love by its consequences, it more nearly resembles hatred than friendship.
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hey

[Madeline Evans]

My name is Jen and I'm new to this dating thing. I've checked out 
your profile you put up and it's interesting. =) I just want to get to 
know you a little better if you don't mind, come check my profile out at:

www.livejen.com/chat.html

I also got a webcam so we can make it interesting, anyways hope you get 
back to me. 

bye :)



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2

Re: Diffie-Hellman question

[Peter Fairbrother]

Thomas Shaddack wrote:

> 
> I have a standard implementation of OpenSSL, with Diffie-Hellman prime in
> the SSL certificate. The DH cipher suite is enabled.
> 
> Is it safe to keep one prime there forever, or should I rather
> periodically regenerate it? Why? If yes, what's some sane period to do so:
> day, week, month?

No need. 

Kinda.

The best known discreet logarithm attacks are such that if they succeed in
the attack then they can easily apply their solution to anything encrypted
with the same prime. A shared prime attracts attacks. Widely used primes can
become a big target.

These attacks are generally supposed to be beyond capability for the next X
zillion years though. Or perhaps for ten years.

This might seem garubonsendese in the naive ""it's safe' or 'it's not safe""
crypto paradigm. However, that isn't how crypto works.

Cryptanalysis (the revealing of plaintext against the wishes of the
encryptor) is an economic activity. No-one will bother putting in enough
resources to break your 2k-bit modexp-based crypto unless they think it
worthwhile.

But if your prime is shared with several other people who are sending
nuclear secrets, then your prime might become subject to attack.

> If the adversary has a log of a passively intercepted DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA
> secured SSL communication, presuming the ephemeral key was correctly
> generated and disposed of after the transaction, will the eventual
> physical retrieval of the DH prime (and the rest of the certificate) allow
> him to decode the captured log?

The prime is public - anyone can know it  - so it's retrieval won't affect
anything. 

The question I think you are asking is "if the secret key is retrieved, will
I lose forward security", to which the answer is "yes".

For long-term forward secrecy you need to change the public key every every
day or so. Use a long-term key to sign the daily keys. PGP does this.

Once you have deleted the day's public key, you are OK (but see belaw!).

The ephemeral keys cannot (or should not) be retrive(able)d.




(below!) Or perhaps the question you were asking was "if finding DL's mod
_this prime_ becomes possible, will I lose forward security?", in which case
the answer is "yer fukked" - as are we all - if one prime gets broken, they
all will, sooner or later.



-- 
Peter Fairbrother
(Who is right now composing a talk about the uses of modexp in crypto, for
those far more knowledgeable than I)

Re: 3. Proof-of-work analysis

[Adam Back]

Here's a forward of parts of an email I sent to Richard with comments on
his and Ben's paper (sent me a pre-print off-list a couple of weeks ago):


One obvious comment is that the calculations do not take account of
the CAMRAM approach of charging for introductions only.  You mention
this in the final para of conclusions as another possible.


My presumption tho don't have hard stats to measure the effect is that
much of email is to-and-fro between existing correspondents.  So if I
were only to incur the cost of creating a stamp at time of sending to
a new recipient, I could bear a higher cost without running into
limits.

However the types of levels of cost envisaged are aesthetically
unpleasing; I'd say 15 seconds is not very noticeable 15 mins is
noticeable and 1.5 hrs is definately noticeable.


Of course your other point that we don't know how spammers will adapt
is valid.  My presumption is that spam would continue apace, the best
you could hope for would be that it is more targetted, that there are
financial incentives in place to make it worth while buying
demographics data.  (After all when you consider the cost of sending
junk paper mail is way higher, printing plus postage, and yet we still
receive plenty of that).

Also as you observe if the cost of spamming goes up, perhaps they'll
just charge more.  We don't know how elastic the demand curve is.
Profitability, success rates etc are one part of it.  There is an
interplay also: if quantity goes down, perhaps the success rate on the
remaining goes up.  Another theory is that a sizeable chunk of spam is
just a ponzi scheme: the person paying does not make money, but a lot
of dummy's keep paying for it anyway.




Another potential problem with proof-of-work on introductions only, is
that if the introduction is fully automated without recipient opt-in,
spammers could also benefit from this amortized cost.  So I would say
something like the sender sent a proof-of-work, and the recipient took
some positive action, like replying, filing otherwise than junk or
such should be the minimum to get white-listed.




On the ebiz web site problem, I think these guys present a problem for
the whole approach.  An ebiz site will want to send lots of mail to
apparent new recipients (no introductions only saving), a popular ebiz
site may need to send lots of mail.


Well it is ebiz so perhaps they just pass the cost on to the consumer
and buy some more servers.




Another possibility is the user has to opt-in by pre-white-listing
them, however the integration to achieve this is currently missing and
would seem a difficult piece of automation to retrofit.




One of the distinguishing characteristics of a spammer is the
imbalance between mail sent and mail received.  Unfortunately I do not
see a convenient way to penalize people who fall into this category.




Also because of network effect concerns my current hashcash deployment
is to use it as a way to reduce false positives, rather than directly
requiring hashcash.  Well over time this could come to the same thing,
but it gives it a gentle start, so we'll see how long it is before the
1st genuine spam with hashcash attached.

CAMRAM's approach is distinct and is literally going straight for the
objective of bouncing mail without some kind of proof (hashcash or
reverse-turing, or short term ability to reply to email
challenge-response).

Adam

Richard Clayton wrote:
> [...] Ben Laurie) and I have recently
> been doing some sums on proof-of-work / client puzzles / hashcash
> methods of imposing economic constraints upon the sending of spam...
> 
> Ben wanted to know how big a proof was needed for a practical scheme
> he was considering -- and I told him it wasn't going to work. We then
> carefully worked through all the calculations, using the best data
> that we could obtain -- and we did indeed come to the conclusion that
> proof-of-work is not a viable proposal :(

> Paper:
> 
>  http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rnc1/proofwork.pdf

hi

[Ivy Ochoa]

My name is Jen and I'm new to this dating thing. I've checked out 
your profile you put up and it's interesting. =) I just want to get to 
know you a little better if you don't mind, come check my profile out at:

www.livejen.com/chat.html

I also got a webcam so we can make it interesting, anyways hope you get 
back to me. 

bye :)



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2

hi, long time no see....

[Merlin Tillman]

My name is Jen and I'm new to this dating thing. I've checked out 
your profile you put up and it's interesting. =) I just want to get to 
know you a little better if you don't mind, come check my profile out at:

www.livejen.com/chat.html

I also got a webcam so we can make it interesting, anyways hope you get 
back to me. 

bye :)



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IRS May Help DOD Find Reservists

[R. A. Hettinga]

Military Insider Newsletter


 IRS May Help DOD Find Reservists
  Fort Worth Star-Telegram
  May 18, 2004



  FORT WORTH, Texas - The Defense Department, strapped for troops for
missions in Iraq and Afghanistan, has proposed to Congress that it tap the
Internal Revenue Service to locate out-of-touch reservists.

 The unusual measure, which the Pentagon said has been examined by lawyers,
would allow the IRS to pass on addresses for tens of thousands of former
military members who still face recall into the active duty.

 The proposal has largely escaped attention amid all the other crises of
government, and it is likely to face opposition from privacy rights
activists who see information held by the IRS as inviolate.

 For it to become practice, Congress and President Bush would have to
approve the proposal, which would involve amending the tax code.

 Ari Schwartz, an associate director of the Center for Democracy and
Technology in Washington, said granting access to any IRS data would open
the door to more requests from other arms of the government.

 Just a few years ago, Congress strengthened the privacy provisions of the
tax code, he said.

 "There are other ways to solve the problem they have, without putting the
tax information at risk," Schwartz said. "We would hope that those members
who worked only four or five years ago on strengthening tax-privacy laws
would stand up and say this is a bad idea."

 Lt. Col. Bob Stone, a spokesman for the assistant defense secretary for
reserve affairs, said the proposal was developed several years ago and is
unconnected to the Army's current shortage of troops.

 Part or all of nine of the Army's 10 active-duty divisions are deployed to
Iraq or Afghanistan, and 167,000 members of the reserves or National Guard
are on active duty, with thousands more on alert for mobilization.

 Unknown to most Americans, though, is the existence of the Individual
Ready Reserve, which has more than 280,000 members.

 The IRR is a distinctly different animal than the drilling reserves or
National Guard.

 Those in the IRR are people who have completed their active-duty tours but
are subject to involuntary recall for a certain number of years. For
example, a soldier who serves four years on active duty remains in the IRR
for another four years.

 During that time, however, they receive no pay, do not drill with a unit
and are otherwise completely civilian.

 The problem for the Pentagon is that the whereabouts of 50,200 of those
veterans are unknown to the Army, Navy, Marine Corps and Air Force. The
largest number - 40,700 - are former Army GIs.

 Because Texas sends more people into the service than almost any other
state, it's a good bet many are in the Lone Star State.

 "While the military today is comprised of an all-volunteer force, every
individual who volunteers for service in the armed forces voluntarily
accepts an eight-year military service obligation," Stone said.

 The troops are required to keep the services' updated on their residences,
but many do not. Thirty-four percent of former Army soldiers cannot be
tracked. The unknowns in the other services are in the single digit
percentages.

 "One of the difficulties that the military services confront is keeping
addresses current," Stone said.

 The Defense Department has called on members of the IRR before. About
7,000 people have been recalled since 9-11, Stone said. Approximately
30,000 were recalled for service during the buildup for the Persian Gulf
War in 1990 and 1991, he said.


-- 
-
R. A. Hettinga 
The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

RE: EU seeks quantum cryptography response to Echelon

[Tyler Durden]

Boondoggle. A solution in search of a problem:
"Monyk believes there will be a global market of several million users once
a workable solution has been developed. A political decision will have to
be taken as to who those users will be in order to prevent terrorists and
criminals from taking advantage of the completely secure communication
network, he said."
Silliness itself, at this point. Practical quantum cryptography at this 
point is limited to transmission. The moment it goes O/E, it's as vulnerable 
as any other data. And terrorists aren't going to bother splicing fiber.

Of course, primitive quantum storage (with error correcting codes!) is 
possible and done in laboratories, but we're talking tens of bits here. 
It'll be a decade before quantum storage is practical, and that's only IF 
someone can find a convincing reason to start developing it.

-TD

From: "R. A. Hettinga" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: EU seeks quantum cryptography response to Echelon
Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 14:32:34 -0400

Network World Fusion
EU seeks quantum cryptography response to Echelon
By Philip Willan
IDG News Service, 05/17/04
The European Union is to invest ¤11 million ($13 million) over the next
four years to develop a secure communication system based on quantum
cryptography, using physical laws governing the universe on the smallest
scale to create and distribute unbreakable encryption keys, project
coordinators said Monday.
 If successful, the project would produce the cryptographer's holy grail 
--
absolutely unbreakable code -- and thwart the eavesdropping efforts of
espionage systems such as Echelon, which intercepts electronic messages on
behalf of the intelligence services of the U.S., the U.K., Canada, New
Zealand and Australia.

 "The aim is to produce a communication system that cannot be intercepted
by anyone, and that includes Echelon," said Sergio Cova, a professor from
the electronics department of Milan Polytechnic and one of the project's
coordinators. "We are talking about a system that requires significant
technological innovations. We have to prove that it is workable, which is
not the case at the moment." Major improvements in geographic range and
speed of data transmission will be required before the system becomes a
commercial reality, Cova said.
 "The report of the European Parliament on Echelon recommends using 
quantum
cryptography as a solution to electronic eavesdropping. This is an effort
to cope with Echelon," said Christian Monyk, the director of quantum
technologies at the Austrian company ARC Seibersdorf Research and overall
coordinator of the project. Economic espionage has caused serious harm to
European companies in the past, Monyk said. "With this project we will be
making an essential contribution to the economic independence of Europe."

 Quantum cryptography takes advantage of the physical properties of light
particles, known as photons, to create and transmit binary messages. The
angle of vibration of a photon as it travels through space -- its
polarization -- can be used to represent a zero or a one under a system
first devised by scientists Charles Bennett and Gilles Brassard in 1984. It
has the advantage that any attempt to intercept the photons is liable to
interfere with their polarization and can therefore be detected by those
operating the system, the project coordinators said. An intercepted key
would therefore be discarded and a new one created for use in its place.
 The new system, known as SECOQC (Secure Communication based on Quantum
Cryptography), is intended for use by the secure generation and exchange of
encryption keys, rather than for the actual exchange of data, Monyk said.
 "The encrypted data would then be transmitted by normal methods," he 
said.
Messages encrypted using quantum mechanics can currently be transmitted
over optical fibers for tens of kilometers. The European project intends to
extend that range by combining quantum physics with other technologies,
Monyk said. "The important thing about this project is that it is not based
solely on quantum cryptography but on a combination with all the other
components that are necessary to achieve an economic application," he said.
"We are taking a really broad approach to quantum cryptography, which other
countries haven't done."

 Experts in quantum physics, cryptography, software and network 
development
from universities, research institutes and private companies in Austria,
Belgium, Britain, Canada, the Czech Republic, Denmark, France, Germany,
Italy, Russia, Sweden and Switzerland will be contributing to the project,
Monyk said.

 In 18 months project participants will assess progress on a number of
alternative solutions and decide which technologies are the most promising
and merit further development, project coordinators said. SECOQC aims to
have a workable technology ready in four years, but will probably re

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Re: Reusable hashcash for spam prevention

[R. A. Hettinga]

--- begin forwarded text


Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 14:41:16 +0100
To: "R. A. Hettinga" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Fearghas McKay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Reusable hashcash for spam prevention
Cc: Richard Clayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

This was posted on the ASRG list - the IRTF Anti Spam Research Group list,
which at first reading indicates that the future for Hashcash/Camram may be
limited.

Eric  Johansson the camram developer has some different numbers which he
has just run that I will dig out and forward.

f

--- begin forwarded text


To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Richard Clayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Asrg] 3. Proof-of-work analysis
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
List-Unsubscribe: ,

List-Id: Anti-Spam Research Group - IRTF 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: ,

List-Archive: 
Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 23:15:46 +0100

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

I hope this is useful:

I'm in the Security Group of the Computer Laboratory at the University
of Cambridge. Ben Laurie (yes, that Ben Laurie) and I have recently
been doing some sums on proof-of-work / client puzzles / hashcash
methods of imposing economic constraints upon the sending of spam...

Ben wanted to know how big a proof was needed for a practical scheme
he was considering -- and I told him it wasn't going to work. We then
carefully worked through all the calculations, using the best data
that we could obtain -- and we did indeed come to the conclusion that
proof-of-work is not a viable proposal :(

The paper we wrote about this was presented last week in Minneapolis
at the (academic, peer-reviewed) "Third Annual Workshop on Economics
and Information Security" (WEAS04)

We've doubtless duplicated the figures on the back of many an
envelope, but it is clearly useful to have the analysis in the formal
literature where our assumptions and figures can be considered and
possibly even improved upon by others.

Paper:

 http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rnc1/proofwork.pdf

Slides from talk:

 http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rnc1/talks/040514-ProofWork.pdf

Abstract:

 A frequently proposed method of reducing unsolicited bulk email
 ("spam") is for senders to pay for each email they send. Proof-
 of-work schemes avoid charging real money by requiring senders to
 demonstrate that they have expended processing time in solving a
 cryptographic puzzle. We attempt to determine how difficult that
 puzzle should be so as to be effective in preventing spam. We
 analyse this both from an economic perspective, "how can we stop
 it being cost-effective to send spam", and from a security
 perspective, "spammers can access insecure end-user machines and
 will steal processing cycles to solve puzzles". Both analyses
 lead to similar values of puzzle difficulty. Unfortunately, real-
 world data from a large ISP shows that these difficulty levels
 would mean that significant numbers of senders of legitimate
 email would be unable to continue their current levels of
 activity. We conclude that proof-of-work will not be a solution
 to the problem of spam.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

For the avoidance of doubt, the type of scheme we believe we have
shown is not viable is one where all email (except "mailing list"
email) carries a "proof-of-work" along with it.

It may be that it is still sensible to consider composite schemes
where puzzles are only solved per sending host or where receivers use
puzzles to admit senders into whitelists...

... however, we would consider it incumbent on any proposer of such a
scheme to do similar calculations to ours before putting it forward.

 [ off-topic for here, but we also suspect that a number of proof-
 of-work schemes in peer-to-peer networks would fall to our type
 of real-world analysis :( people tend to use client puzzles as a
 kind of "magic fairy dust" to scatter over systems when they get
 stuck in their design :( ]

- --
richard  Richard Clayton

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin

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Version: PGPsdk version 1.7.1

iQA/AwUBQKk5khfnRQV/feRLEQIcyACcCrGw1ZZIHV+qP7AZy9M8XJU4920AnjcW
M35kvXsj8cv/ujtY9xpf79av
=wEUV
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

___
Asrg mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg

--- end forwarded text

--- end forwarded text


-- 
-
R. A. Hettinga 
The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation 

Re: Reusable hashcash for spam prevention

[R. A. Hettinga]

--- begin forwarded text


Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 14:41:31 +0100
To: "R. A. Hettinga" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: Fearghas McKay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Reusable hashcash for spam prevention
Cc: Richard Clayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

and the data that Eric S. Johansson got:

-=-=- forwarded text -=-=-

this is frustrating.  I have run through the exact same calculations and
come up with a very different answer.  The answers I came up with the
show that at worst case, spammers with zombies would almost have enough
horsepower to generate enough stamps.  one of the difficult aspects of
this is that I have not been able to get hard numbers on the number of
zombies (it varies by an order of magnitude at least depending on the
source)

as I said at my MIT anti-spam conference talk, I do agree that proof of
work stamps are not a panacea but they are an important component in the
"drug cocktail" used to attack spam.  that's why I tried very hard to
build camram to be able to incorporate other anti-stamp techniques or
work in conjunction with them.

Another impression of a shortcoming is that they mix and match economic
models.  I need to go through in greater detail to find out if they have
found something I missed.  I do know that the cost of a PC and its
operation are insignificant to the rate limiting effect of stamp
generation.  they also did not seem to account for different degrees of
cost of doing business.  Proof of work stamps will take out the low-end
spammers first allowing us to concentrate efforts on higher end, better
financed spammers.  Fewer targets, easier to hit.

They did not account for automatic inflation of postage rates when
stamped Spam appears or the addition of a second tier of stamps (i.e.
signatures for familiar entities/mailing lists.

the problem with impact on low-end machines is important if you always
generate stamps.  However, for extreme low-end machines (PalmPilot and
cellphones) you can always defer the computational load to a for fee
service such as the ISP handling your e-mail for the device.  With the
rest of the low-end machines, stamped generation just takes longer, and
background and once you have white listed the entity, you never need to
send them a stamp again.

on eco damage caused by stamp generation, again, the transition between
stamps and white lists based on stamp activity illuminate that problem.
  It's only commercial entities who want to send you advertising
unsolicited that would incur such damage.  On the other hand, kill a
couple of SUVs and you can generate many more stamps without worry.  ;-)

on zombies: I think it might be useful if the anti-spam folks spent some
time developing zombie hunters and worked with various service providers
to identify and shut off those machines.  Additionally, ISPs should send
Microsoft an invoice for every machine found and repaired.  Get enough
people together, you could have a substantial lawsuit.  After all, the
real culprit in the zombie problem is not the owner of the PC.  Yes they
were stupid, yes they ran something they shouldn't have, but the system
should not have failed quite so easily!

so am I discouraged?  A little bit.  I'm going to continue but it's one
more naysayer I'm going to have to build arguments against.

-=-=- end forwarded text -=-=-

--- end forwarded text


-- 
-
R. A. Hettinga 
The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

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>Rain before seven, fine before eleven 
>He who laughs last laughs longest
>Better to have loved and lost, than never have loved at all 
>Lean liberty is better than fat slavery
>Rats desert a sinking ship
>From the sweetest wine the tartest vinegar
>Worry often gives a small thing a big shadow 
>Man who wants pretty nurse, must be patient
>He who wants to do good, knocks at the gate, he who loves finds the gates open
>What boots up must come down.
>When distrust enters in at the foregate, love goes out at the postern 
>Too many chiefs and not enough indians
>A gossip betrays a confidence, but a trustworthy man keeps a secret.
>The geek shall inherit the earth.
>It takes one day to destroy a house but to build a new one will take months, perhaps 
>years 
>A penny saved makes Jack a dull boy.
>How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their 
>scorning, and fools hate knowledge?
>Any fool can criticise, condemn and complain and most fools do
>All the world loves a lover

Re: Diffie-Hellman question

[Sarad AV]

If your
> prime is 2000 bits,
> then that should be safe for the foreseeable future,
> unless quantum
> computers turn out to be practical for breaking
> moduli of this size.

Discrete Logarithms in GF(2^607)have been calculated
over polynomial basis.

http://listserv.nodak.edu/scripts/wa.exe?A2=ind0202&L=nmbrthry&F=&S=&P=2568


Sarath.







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al-qaeda.net node downtime

[Riad S. Wahby]

I'm moving from Massachusetts to Texas, and unfortunately that means
that my machine's connectivity will be in a state of flux for a while.
Unless someone has a machine with a (fast, static) connection on which
they want to let me host the node temporarily, al-qaeda.net will be down
for some (unspecified, but hopefully not too long) time while I move.

If you do have a place to put the node (I believe [EMAIL PROTECTED] once
offered such a machine, but perhaps things have changed), let me know
within the next day or two and I'll move everything over before I leave.

-- 
Riad Wahby
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
MIT VI-2 M.Eng

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