Re: Decline of the Cypherpunks list...Part 19
Hello, I am 23 years old and I am quite proud to be on cpunks. I have been on and off cpunks since i was sixteen, but I have never been active. I run a mixminion remailer, get excited at key signings, and I was extremely excited when I read about the recent development with mental poker that was mentioned on boingboing. I do not have a bald head, tattoos or piercings. I am decidely not libertarian, I did not realize that was a requirement for being a cpunk:) Libertarians do not have a monopoly on the belief in autonomous individuals and or civil liberties. I think that the supposed downfall of cpunks has to do with two big issues, none of which have to do with something radically different about my generation. No offense, Mr. May but you sound like a stodgy old man complaining about the kids these days. You are not the first and not the last person that has reached middle age and decided that the kids these days are different. I think that cpunks has dropped in popularity because of two things: 1. There is not a lot to come here for. A quick perusal of the messages that I have archived since Oct 12, 2002 does not yeild a great number of goodies. Despite what you think mailing lists are still very popular with us crazy linux kidz (debian-devel is quite busy and informative) these days. A large amount of my internet time is spent reading personal diaries but an equal if not greater time is spent reading mailing lists. I have found that the blogs are good for announcements where as the mailing lists are for discussion. I think that a lot of the old cpunks content has moved to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and the various p2p lists. I think that a lot of the social talk has moved elsewhere because it appears to be a more hospitable environment, see #2. 2. This is not a friendly/fun place. I don't mind RTFM but I have seen a number of responses on this list that made me feel like the new middle class italian guy at the rich WASPy old boys golf club. With all due respect your post about not forwarding the initial message to other list was telling (and in all caps). Why not forward a good cpunks message to other places? I thought we were meant to share? I do not think cpunks is dead, I agree that the number of forwards here that are merely reprints from other lists or daily blogs is obnoxious. However, I thought that you had a lot of good points in your reply about the lessig/declan argument (which has continued on lessig's blog if you care) and it is posts like your lessig post that I am still subscribed. In light of that it seems crazy to limit who gets to see that message. Instead of keeping it in the secret clubhouse it seems that it would be beneficial for cpunks to let others know that good discussions still happen here. Filters coming in is a great idea, but filtering what leaves here sounds moronic. Thank you for your time. I hope that I have not offended you, I have respected you for some time now. As I said I am 23 so take the following discussion about YaF with a grain of salt. On Sun, 2003-12-07 at 22:55, Tim May wrote: On Dec 7, 2003, at 7:15 PM, James A. Donald wrote: And, as many have noted, very few of the kids today are libertarians (either small L or large L). When you were a teenager, everyone thought that Ho Chi Minh was the greatest, had a picture of Che Guevera on their wall, and thought the Soviet Union was going to win. Nonsense. Everyone did not think this. Far from it. YAF was going strong back then. I have never read or heard that Young Americans for Freedom, or the John Birchers were strong during the sixties. From what I have read and heard there were definitely some right wing activist groups but they were not strong compared to the leftist groups. The existence of a strong right wing activist camp seems to go directly against the notion of the silent majority and contradicts the commonly held belief that there was a strong politicization of the population during the 60s. -- --dfc Douglas F. Calvert http://anize.org/dfc/ GPG Key: 0xC9541FB2 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Type III Anonymous message
On Sun, 2003-12-07 at 16:25, Eugen Leitl wrote:
Not that there is much discussion, the cyherpunk meme doesn't seem
to draw fresh blood too effectively. I'm seeing similiar trends
across virtually all my mailing lists, so I presume it's the medium
itself that it's in decline.
The following lists thrive:
debian-devel, NANOG, Python-users, linux-kernel, obsd-misc, full-disclosure
The cypherpunk meme seems to be alive in well but split up across:
cpunks,[EMAIL PROTECTED], gnupg-{users,devel},mix{master,minion}
There are a lot of good mailing lists currently. I think the decline
that you are seeing is a fall of the big boys and an increase in B-list
mailing lists. There seems to be a good deal of specialization going on
among the mailing lists. Maybe the politics of cpunks turned some people
to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and the tech sent some people to god only knows
where you can discuss politics in a decent manner on the net.
Both IRC and IM are of course even worse content killers than email.
WTF? Whenever new forms of technology come out established groups always
complain about the mass amateurization of publishing and downfall of
intelligence/literary skills/etc. It has happened from gutenberg up to
the blogs and I have never seen a good defense of it. Does dinner table
conversation kill content? I do not understand why a decrease in
transaction costs is a bad thing...
--
--dfc
Douglas F. Calvert
http://anize.org/dfc/
GPG Key: 0xC9541FB2
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Decline of the Cypherpunks list...Part 19
Hello, I am 23 years old and I am quite proud to be on cpunks. I have been on and off cpunks since i was sixteen, but I have never been active. I run a mixminion remailer, get excited at key signings, and I was extremely excited when I read about the recent development with mental poker that was mentioned on boingboing. I do not have a bald head, tattoos or piercings. I am decidely not libertarian, I did not realize that was a requirement for being a cpunk:) Libertarians do not have a monopoly on the belief in autonomous individuals and or civil liberties. I think that the supposed downfall of cpunks has to do with two big issues, none of which have to do with something radically different about my generation. No offense, Mr. May but you sound like a stodgy old man complaining about the kids these days. You are not the first and not the last person that has reached middle age and decided that the kids these days are different. I think that cpunks has dropped in popularity because of two things: 1. There is not a lot to come here for. A quick perusal of the messages that I have archived since Oct 12, 2002 does not yeild a great number of goodies. Despite what you think mailing lists are still very popular with us crazy linux kidz (debian-devel is quite busy and informative) these days. A large amount of my internet time is spent reading personal diaries but an equal if not greater time is spent reading mailing lists. I have found that the blogs are good for announcements where as the mailing lists are for discussion. I think that a lot of the old cpunks content has moved to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and the various p2p lists. I think that a lot of the social talk has moved elsewhere because it appears to be a more hospitable environment, see #2. 2. This is not a friendly/fun place. I don't mind RTFM but I have seen a number of responses on this list that made me feel like the new middle class italian guy at the rich WASPy old boys golf club. With all due respect your post about not forwarding the initial message to other list was telling (and in all caps). Why not forward a good cpunks message to other places? I thought we were meant to share? I do not think cpunks is dead, I agree that the number of forwards here that are merely reprints from other lists or daily blogs is obnoxious. However, I thought that you had a lot of good points in your reply about the lessig/declan argument (which has continued on lessig's blog if you care) and it is posts like your lessig post that I am still subscribed. In light of that it seems crazy to limit who gets to see that message. Instead of keeping it in the secret clubhouse it seems that it would be beneficial for cpunks to let others know that good discussions still happen here. Filters coming in is a great idea, but filtering what leaves here sounds moronic. Thank you for your time. I hope that I have not offended you, I have respected you for some time now. As I said I am 23 so take the following discussion about YaF with a grain of salt. On Sun, 2003-12-07 at 22:55, Tim May wrote: On Dec 7, 2003, at 7:15 PM, James A. Donald wrote: And, as many have noted, very few of the kids today are libertarians (either small L or large L). When you were a teenager, everyone thought that Ho Chi Minh was the greatest, had a picture of Che Guevera on their wall, and thought the Soviet Union was going to win. Nonsense. Everyone did not think this. Far from it. YAF was going strong back then. I have never read or heard that Young Americans for Freedom, or the John Birchers were strong during the sixties. From what I have read and heard there were definitely some right wing activist groups but they were not strong compared to the leftist groups. The existence of a strong right wing activist camp seems to go directly against the notion of the silent majority and contradicts the commonly held belief that there was a strong politicization of the population during the 60s. -- --dfc Douglas F. Calvert http://anize.org/dfc/ GPG Key: 0xC9541FB2 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Type III Anonymous message
On Sun, 2003-12-07 at 16:25, Eugen Leitl wrote:
Not that there is much discussion, the cyherpunk meme doesn't seem
to draw fresh blood too effectively. I'm seeing similiar trends
across virtually all my mailing lists, so I presume it's the medium
itself that it's in decline.
The following lists thrive:
debian-devel, NANOG, Python-users, linux-kernel, obsd-misc, full-disclosure
The cypherpunk meme seems to be alive in well but split up across:
cpunks,[EMAIL PROTECTED], gnupg-{users,devel},mix{master,minion}
There are a lot of good mailing lists currently. I think the decline
that you are seeing is a fall of the big boys and an increase in B-list
mailing lists. There seems to be a good deal of specialization going on
among the mailing lists. Maybe the politics of cpunks turned some people
to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and the tech sent some people to god only knows
where you can discuss politics in a decent manner on the net.
Both IRC and IM are of course even worse content killers than email.
WTF? Whenever new forms of technology come out established groups always
complain about the mass amateurization of publishing and downfall of
intelligence/literary skills/etc. It has happened from gutenberg up to
the blogs and I have never seen a good defense of it. Does dinner table
conversation kill content? I do not understand why a decrease in
transaction costs is a bad thing...
--
--dfc
Douglas F. Calvert
http://anize.org/dfc/
GPG Key: 0xC9541FB2
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: sources on steganography
On Thu, 2002-05-30 at 09:41, Hector Rosario wrote: Why would I be interested in fool[ing] [you]. All I asked was for some help with sources. If you cannot be of help, at least don't be a hindrance. Besides, don't claim to speak for others. If envy is what drives you, then I suggest that you work on that. Dude relax. He was making a joke. If you don't get the joke there are definitely going to be some problems with you writing a dissertation on stego. Here is a suggestion for you, don't bite the hand that feeds you. -- + Douglas Calvert [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://anize.org/dfc + |Key Id 0xC9541FB2 http://anize.org/dfc-keys.asc| | http://imissjerry.org http://whoownsthisidea.org | +-| 0817 30D4 82B6 BB8D 5E66 06F6 B796 073D C954 1FB2 |-+ [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature which had a name of signature.asc]
