Re: Release Saddam now
-- On 19 Dec 2003 at 15:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If there is no one with legitimate jurisdiction to try Saddam, then he should be released. You are making De Sade's argument against natural law, to which his prosecutors rightly made the riposte, that if no one had the right to condemn him for torturing a maid, then no one had the right to condemn them for imprisoning De Sade. --digsig James A. Donald 6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG jkBw+1ppB608HDF/i3TGAf3V3tn86/2Zx81Bzzgl 41d/b0S3hcKy4vACibaBmS0tL0LXFt64XwXRKkQ4G
Re: Release Saddam now
On 19 Dec, James A. Donald wrote: -- On 19 Dec 2003 at 15:59, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If there is no one with legitimate jurisdiction to try Saddam, then he should be released. You are making De Sade's argument against natural law, to which his prosecutors rightly made the riposte, that if no one had the right to condemn him for torturing a maid, then no one had the right to condemn them for imprisoning De Sade. Interesting, did De Sade concur? ;-} Regards, proclus http://www.gnu-darwin.org/ -- Visit proclus realm! http://proclus.tripod.com/ -BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK- Version: 3.1 GMU/S d+@ s: a+ C UBULI$ P+ L+++() E--- W++ N- !o K- w--- !O M++@ V-- PS+++ PE Y+ PGP-- t+++(+) 5+++ X+ R tv-(--)@ b !DI D- G e h--- r+++ y --END GEEK CODE BLOCK-- [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/pgp-signature]
Release Saddam now
Saddam is being wrongly held by illegal invaders and occupiers. He should be immediately released or turned over to legitimate authorities, such as the international courts. Advocate for the release of Saddam Hussein, and the withdrawal of the USurpers. Pass the word. Regards, proclus http://www.gnu-darwin.org/ -- Visit proclus realm! http://proclus.tripod.com/ -BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK- Version: 3.1 GMU/S d+@ s: a+ C UBOULI$ P+ L+++() E--- W++ N- !o K- w--- !O M++@ V-- PS+++ PE Y+ PGP-- t+++(+) 5+++ X+ R tv-(--)@ b !DI D- G e h--- r+++ y --END GEEK CODE BLOCK-- [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/pgp-signature]
Re: Release Saddam now
On 19 Dec, Anatoly Vorobey wrote: And here I thought the fuckwits couldn't get any dumber. Ahh yes, and such a clever riposts as well. Regards, proclus http://www.gnu-darwin.org/ -- Visit proclus realm! http://proclus.tripod.com/ -BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK- Version: 3.1 GMU/S d+@ s: a+ C UBULI$ P+ L+++() E--- W++ N- !o K- w--- !O M++@ V-- PS+++ PE Y+ PGP-- t+++(+) 5+++ X+ R tv-(--)@ b !DI D- G e h--- r+++ y --END GEEK CODE BLOCK-- [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/pgp-signature]
Re: Release Saddam now
On Fri, Dec 19, 2003 at 01:17:28PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Saddam is being wrongly held by illegal invaders and occupiers. He should be immediately released or turned over to legitimate authorities, such as the international courts. Advocate for the release of Saddam Hussein, and the withdrawal of the USurpers. Pass the word. And here I thought the fuckwits couldn't get any dumber. Boy oh boy. -- avva
Re: Release Saddam now
On 19 Dec, James A. Donald wrote: -- On 19 Dec 2003 at 13:17, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Saddam is being wrongly held by illegal invaders and occupiers. He should be immediately released or turned over to legitimate authorities, such as the international courts. To judge by its current woeful performance in the Serbian war crimes trials, the Hague would acquit Saddam and convict Carter. If there is no one with legitimate jurisdiction to try Saddam, then he should be released. Regards, proclus http://www.gnu-darwin.org/ -- Visit proclus realm! http://proclus.tripod.com/ -BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK- Version: 3.1 GMU/S d+@ s: a+ C UBULI$ P+ L+++() E--- W++ N- !o K- w--- !O M++@ V-- PS+++ PE Y+ PGP-- t+++(+) 5+++ X+ R tv-(--)@ b !DI D- G e h--- r+++ y --END GEEK CODE BLOCK-- [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/pgp-signature]
Re: Release Saddam now
-- On 19 Dec 2003 at 13:17, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Saddam is being wrongly held by illegal invaders and occupiers. He should be immediately released or turned over to legitimate authorities, such as the international courts. To judge by its current woeful performance in the Serbian war crimes trials, the Hague would acquit Saddam and convict Carter. --digsig James A. Donald 6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG Ga9C18O27qHMYLen4874q63qGOwoEIBltLGk1rpk 48Vn4yKSHVY79B6oGsC+HdHn879C2BBXjKu204wKw
Re: Release Saddam now
On 19 Dec, Anatoly Vorobey wrote: But Saddam's regime itself stemmed from illegal takeover of a previous regime -- doesn't that make all of his regime illegitimate and his authority void? No, by this argument nearly all the regimes of the world would be illegitimate. Saddam ruled a terrible regime, but he also overthrew a terrible regime. Anyway, Saddam enjoyed the authority of democratic acquiescence, which is the accepted standard. Even if Saddam's regime were illegitimate, which it was not, the aggresive acts of the US were still illegal. No authority can be derived from an aggressive and illegal invasion. By extension, the US puppet government in Iraq also has no plausible claim to authority. Why not? By definition, a puppet government rules by the leave of the military power, the US, which has no claim in this case to any legitimacy in Iraq. Thus, the puppet government can have no claim to legitimacy either. Regards, proclus http://www.gnu-darwin.org/ -- Visit proclus realm! http://proclus.tripod.com/ -BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK- Version: 3.1 GMU/S d+@ s: a+ C UBULI$ P+ L+++() E--- W++ N- !o K- w--- !O M++@ V-- PS+++ PE Y+ PGP-- t+++(+) 5+++ X+ R tv-(--)@ b !DI D- G e h--- r+++ y --END GEEK CODE BLOCK-- [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/pgp-signature]
Re: Release Saddam now
[taken from private exchange back to the list with mutual agreement] Why? If there is no one with legitimate authority to try Saddam, then they cannot rightly hold him, and he must be released. What was different about Saddam's regime from the current US-installed regime, that made Saddam's regime legitimate authority and this one not a legitimate authority? Care to take this back to the list? I'm answering a parallel thread there. Clearly Saddam has more authority than the US to rule Iraq, because he was a sitting head of state, and the US aggressed in an illegal invasion. But Saddam's regime itself stemmed from illegal takeover of a previous regime -- doesn't that make all of his regime illegitimate and his authority void? Thus, Saddam has a plausible claim to authority, but the US does not. The only reason Saddam has a plausible claim to authority is because he has taken gotten it by force. By the same reasoning, US or US-installed regime, which is being put into power by the use of force, has a plausible claim to authority as well. By extension, the US puppet government in Iraq also has no plausible claim to authority. Why not? -- avva
