Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Tue, Jan 24, 2006 at 03:49:54AM +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: and I never messed with an initrd. My understanding is that the purpose of an initrd is to provide an image of a RAMdisk containing the modules the kernel needs to access the root file system; but if the hardware and filesystem support needed is compiled into the kernel, why even bother with an initrd? Indeed, you're not required to use an initrd. Compile in the stuff you need to boot and off you go. The advantage is more significant for prebuilt images which want to include all the drivers without statically compiling them all in. Hamish -- Hamish Moffatt VK3SB [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Mon, Jan 23, 2006 at 05:46:48PM -0500, Robert Isaac wrote: You could even save yourself some effort and install Yaird from backports.org :) It wasn't there when I did it. :) Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Tue, Jan 24, 2006 at 03:49:54AM +, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, I have a dumbass question: why is yaird necessary at all? Or more accurately, why is an initrd necessary at all? Is it something about 2.6.x kernels? Back when I built 2.4.x kernels for my Athlon XP machine, I follwed the script of http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/system/kernel-pkg.html and I never messed with an initrd. My understanding is that the purpose of an initrd is to provide an image of a RAMdisk containing the modules the kernel needs to access the root file system; but if the hardware and filesystem support needed is compiled into the kernel, why even bother with an initrd? For systems running root on raid or lvm or something, and initrd is necesary to prepare the device for root before mounting it. It is also helpful for making more general purpose kernels that will be optimal on a wide range of hardware, hence the debian kernels use it. I use it for any kernel I build myself too for the same reason. I like being able to change my hardware without having to rebuild the kernel because I left something out. Monolithic builds are just such a pain to deal with. With modules I control the load order. With built in, I have very little control over things. Certainly the kernel developers seem to believe modular is the way to go. Some driver options don't even appear to be possible to adjust if you build it in. So yaird/initramfstools is needed to create the initrd image for setting up the right drivers for the system the kernel is being installed on. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Sun, Jan 22, 2006 at 09:09:23AM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It worked beautifully. A day or two ago, the URL seems to have changed. http://tinyplanet.ca/~lsorense/amd64/ works now. I didn't know port 81 had ever worked on that machine. It is run by one of my friends. I now have an AMD64 running the 2.6.12 kernel. But: (1) unless I am mistaken, the 2.6.12 kernel isn't there as an installed package recognised bu aptitude. If you use the installer above, it is installed as a regular package. The package may have been renamed to linux-image-* instead of kernel-image-*. -- I usually have a GPG digital signature included as an attachment. See http://www.gnupg.org/ for info about these digital signatures. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Tue, Jan 24, 2006 at 12:21:10PM -0600, Ken Bloom wrote: The package may have been renamed to linux-image-* instead of kernel-image-*. It certainly would have been. :) Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On 1/22/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Jan 15, 2006 at 09:49:41PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Jan 15, 2006 at 10:50:22PM +, Jo Shields wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I haven't accepted the new AMD-64 box the computer store has built for me, because I can't get it to run in 64-bit mode.I provided the sarge net-install CD's for both AMD-64 and the older 386 architectures. The netinstall for AMD64 went fine up to a point (except it was 30 times as slow as the i386 install which he performed later), but when it came time to boot into the installed system, the boot stopped after it had identified the USB ports.Repeating entire process with the i386 netinstall, it installed nicely (30 time faster), and booted up properly.But he never got it to use the two hard disks in DMA mode.(Oh yes -- he installed a cheap Realtek ethernet card because netinstall would not recognise the Ethernet on the motherboard.But that's not a big problem for me.)He did all this this at the shop, and then called me to tell me the problems.I went there on the weekend, and managed to install the sarge AMD-64 kernel on the i386-based system, and it had the same problem as the original AND-64 install -- crash during boot.Using aptitude, I tried to fetch a more recent kernel, but so far have not succeeded.Just sticking in etch into my apt-sources file does not seem to be enough.What do I need to do to get aptitude to see a more recent kernel? Or maybe it has moved, and I should ask -- what deb line should I use to find the current amd64 repository?Sorry not the have the details about motherboard identity and the like -- the machine is currently at the shop and I'm not.I'm not accepting it by taking it home before it works.The tech is planning to try out Ubuntu or Knoppix next in order to show me the machine really does work in Linux in 64-bit mode, but I'd prefer Debian.He uses Ubuntu on his AMD-64 at home.-- hendrik If in doubt (or it's nforce4), try Len's 2.6.12 installer, at http://tinyplanet.ca:81/~lsorense/amd64/ Thanks.Now downloading.Will try it tomorrow.It worked beautifully.A day or two ago, the URL seems to have changed.http://tinyplanet.ca/~lsorense/amd64/ works now.I now have an AMD64 running the 2.6.12 kernel.But:(1)unless I am mistaken, the 2.6.12 kernel isn't there as an installedpackage recognised bu aptitude.(2) I don't have the 2.6.12 headers I'm going to need to compile nvidiadrivers.Where can I find them?(3) Or should I upgrade to 2.6.13? Looking around on the net, thereseem to be 2.6.11 and 2.6.13 kernels, but I haven't yet founda 2.6.12 kernel with headers.The 2.6.13 kernel I found seems tohave enough modifiers in its name that I'm hesitant about using it.Will I have to declare my system to be etch or unstable to getaptitude to recognise them? -- hendrikIf you want to use the 2.6.12 kernel you'll want to make sure your using the testing distro of debian. That's where kernel 2.6.12 currently is. it also makes it alot easier to install the kernel packages, beings you can just install them with aptitude or apt-get. update your sources list accordingly, it should read something like thisdeb ftp://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main non-free contribdeb http://security.debian.org/ testing/updates main non-free contribonce your using testing just run apt-cache search linux-headers-2.6.12 and then apt-get install the package you want to install. Or you can use aptitude as well. -Andy
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Sun, Jan 22, 2006 at 09:09:23AM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It worked beautifully. A day or two ago, the URL seems to have changed. http://tinyplanet.ca/~lsorense/amd64/ works now. I didn't know port 81 had ever worked on that machine. It is run by one of my friends. I now have an AMD64 running the 2.6.12 kernel. But: (1) unless I am mistaken, the 2.6.12 kernel isn't there as an installed package recognised bu aptitude. If you use the installer above, it is installed as a regular package. (2) I don't have the 2.6.12 headers I'm going to need to compile nvidia drivers. Where can I find them? The header package is on the cd image too unless I screwed up. I am pretty sure I put it there since it seemed like it could be useful to keep. (3) Or should I upgrade to 2.6.13? Looking around on the net, there seem to be 2.6.11 and 2.6.13 kernels, but I haven't yet found a 2.6.12 kernel with headers. The 2.6.13 kernel I found seems to have enough modifiers in its name that I'm hesitant about using it. Will I have to declare my system to be etch or unstable to get aptitude to recognise them? Upgrading past 2.6.12 requires getting yaird or initramfstools installed on sarge somehow. It can be done however. Yaird is not too hard to backport. If I have some time I may update the image to have 2.6.15 + yaird on it soon. It will take some work though. I would probably make an i386 version at the same time if get the time. The newer kernel is very nice, so it is probably worth the trouble. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
Upgrading past 2.6.12 requires getting yaird or initramfstools installed on sarge somehow. It can be done however. Yaird is not too hard to backport. You could even save yourself some effort and install Yaird from backports.org :)
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
Robert Isaac wrote: Upgrading past 2.6.12 requires getting yaird or initramfstools installed on sarge somehow. It can be done however. Yaird is not too hard to backport. You could even save yourself some effort and install Yaird from backports.org :) OK, I have a dumbass question: why is yaird necessary at all? Or more accurately, why is an initrd necessary at all? Is it something about 2.6.x kernels? Back when I built 2.4.x kernels for my Athlon XP machine, I follwed the script of http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/system/kernel-pkg.html and I never messed with an initrd. My understanding is that the purpose of an initrd is to provide an image of a RAMdisk containing the modules the kernel needs to access the root file system; but if the hardware and filesystem support needed is compiled into the kernel, why even bother with an initrd? -c -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Sun, Jan 15, 2006 at 09:49:41PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Jan 15, 2006 at 10:50:22PM +, Jo Shields wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I haven't accepted the new AMD-64 box the computer store has built for me, because I can't get it to run in 64-bit mode. I provided the sarge net-install CD's for both AMD-64 and the older 386 architectures. The netinstall for AMD64 went fine up to a point (except it was 30 times as slow as the i386 install which he performed later), but when it came time to boot into the installed system, the boot stopped after it had identified the USB ports. Repeating entire process with the i386 netinstall, it installed nicely (30 time faster), and booted up properly. But he never got it to use the two hard disks in DMA mode. (Oh yes -- he installed a cheap Realtek ethernet card because netinstall would not recognise the Ethernet on the motherboard. But that's not a big problem for me.) He did all this this at the shop, and then called me to tell me the problems. I went there on the weekend, and managed to install the sarge AMD-64 kernel on the i386-based system, and it had the same problem as the original AND-64 install -- crash during boot. Using aptitude, I tried to fetch a more recent kernel, but so far have not succeeded. Just sticking in etch into my apt-sources file does not seem to be enough. What do I need to do to get aptitude to see a more recent kernel? Or maybe it has moved, and I should ask -- what deb line should I use to find the current amd64 repository? Sorry not the have the details about motherboard identity and the like -- the machine is currently at the shop and I'm not. I'm not accepting it by taking it home before it works. The tech is planning to try out Ubuntu or Knoppix next in order to show me the machine really does work in Linux in 64-bit mode, but I'd prefer Debian. He uses Ubuntu on his AMD-64 at home. -- hendrik If in doubt (or it's nforce4), try Len's 2.6.12 installer, at http://tinyplanet.ca:81/~lsorense/amd64/ Thanks. Now downloading. Will try it tomorrow. It worked beautifully. A day or two ago, the URL seems to have changed. http://tinyplanet.ca/~lsorense/amd64/ works now. I now have an AMD64 running the 2.6.12 kernel. But: (1) unless I am mistaken, the 2.6.12 kernel isn't there as an installed package recognised bu aptitude. (2) I don't have the 2.6.12 headers I'm going to need to compile nvidia drivers. Where can I find them? (3) Or should I upgrade to 2.6.13? Looking around on the net, there seem to be 2.6.11 and 2.6.13 kernels, but I haven't yet found a 2.6.12 kernel with headers. The 2.6.13 kernel I found seems to have enough modifiers in its name that I'm hesitant about using it. Will I have to declare my system to be etch or unstable to get aptitude to recognise them? -- hendrik -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Sun, Jan 15, 2006 at 09:55:15PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry to sound terminally stupid, but I don't know how to translate a URL like http://debian.csail.mit.edu/debian-amd64/debian-amd64/pool/main/ into a deb line for /etc/apt/sources.list And how does aptitude figure out which packages are from sarge and which from etch or sid? deb http://debian.csail.mit.edu/debian-amd64/debian-amd64 sarge main The /pool/main is not meant for that. That part is handled by the filenames in Packages.gz You might also want: deb http://debian.csail.mit.edu/debian-amd64/debian-amd64 sarge-unsupported main For things that required patches to build, which were not accepted by debian main for various reasons. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I haven't accepted the new AMD-64 box the computer store has built for me, because I can't get it to run in 64-bit mode. I provided the sarge net-install CD's for both AMD-64 and the older 386 architectures. The netinstall for AMD64 went fine up to a point (except it was 30 times as slow as the i386 install which he performed later), but when it came time to boot into the installed system, the boot stopped after it had identified the USB ports. Repeating entire process with the i386 netinstall, it installed nicely (30 time faster), and booted up properly. But he never got it to use the two hard disks in DMA mode. (Oh yes -- he installed a cheap Realtek ethernet card because netinstall would not recognise the Ethernet on the motherboard. But that's not a big problem for me.) He did all this this at the shop, and then called me to tell me the problems. I went there on the weekend, and managed to install the sarge AMD-64 kernel on the i386-based system, and it had the same problem as the original AND-64 install -- crash during boot. Using aptitude, I tried to fetch a more recent kernel, but so far have not succeeded. Just sticking in etch into my apt-sources file does not seem to be enough. What do I need to do to get aptitude to see a more recent kernel? Or maybe it has moved, and I should ask -- what deb line should I use to find the current amd64 repository? Sorry not the have the details about motherboard identity and the like -- the machine is currently at the shop and I'm not. I'm not accepting it by taking it home before it works. The tech is planning to try out Ubuntu or Knoppix next in order to show me the machine really does work in Linux in 64-bit mode, but I'd prefer Debian. He uses Ubuntu on his AMD-64 at home. -- hendrik If in doubt (or it's nforce4), try Len's 2.6.12 installer, at http://tinyplanet.ca:81/~lsorense/amd64/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge AMD64 installation won't boot
On Sun, Jan 15, 2006 at 01:52:19PM -0900, Greg Madden wrote: I use debian.csail.mit.edu. Sorry to sound terminally stupid, but I don't know how to translate a URL like http://debian.csail.mit.edu/debian-amd64/debian-amd64/pool/main/ into a deb line for /etc/apt/sources.list And how does aptitude figure out which packages are from sarge and which from etch or sid? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
