Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Mon, May 15, 2006 at 05:28:08PM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: > On Monday 15 May 2006 16:28, Sven Luther wrote: > > You probably can, adb keyboards are only used on oldworld machines, and > > those are easily enough to detect from /proc/cpuinfo. We even do so to > > get the oldworld subarch (pmac_oldworld even). > > Huh? The machine I tested on was a Powerbook G4 laptop. That's not > oldworld, right? The attachment in [1] was taken from that machine... Indeed not. I don't remember, but it is well possible that at least some newworld laptops still used adb keyboard internally, while desktop systems all moved to usb ones. It should be possible to detect the right thing via some /proc/device-tree parsing. Once we know exactly the situation, i would voluntarily provide the code for that, as we did already for the airport detecting back in the days ... Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Mon, May 15, 2006 at 06:38:12PM +0200, Michel Dänzer wrote: > On Mon, 2006-05-15 at 07:27 +0200, Frans Pop wrote: > > > > The current daily images now show the AT keymap list. I've tested this on > > Frank Lichtenheld's Powerbook G4 laptop, and all keys are mapped OK for > > the German keyboard. > > > > The only change from the USB-MAC keymaps is that the apple key no longer > > works as the modifier key. Instead these can be accessed using Fn-Alt, > > which can probably be explained as that is probably equivalent to the > > right-Alt key on "regular" AT keyboards on i386. > > > > AFAICT the options are: > > - should the AT keymaps be made to support the apple key as modifier key > > or > > - should we go back to using the USB-MAC keymaps for powerpc > > This may still be necessary, as some Apple keyboards tend to have > different layouts from 'standard' PC keyboards. Just as one example, the > Swiss German Apple keyboard has the @ symbol on the G key. AFAIK in some > other countries the layout can be completely different. I believe in every country except pure-US, the layout is different, we had loads of problems with this with regard to X keyboard mappings. Friendly, Sven Luther
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On 5/15/06, Eddy Petrişor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Every reference to the „Option key" here, was in fact inteneded to be reference to the „Command key". Sorry for the wrong information. I personally use the Option key (or Apple as some might call it) as an AltGr key. The Fn+Alt is used for right click emulation while Fn+Option is for middle click. I need all of the keys as they are in order to be able to use diacritics and be able to use applications in a fast and confortable manner. So please keep this in mind when you decide what to do. > P.S. Eddy: a test by you too would be very welcome, especially if you can > do a full installation and check the full range of characters on the > installed system. Ok, there is a partition on which I can do test installations; btw, two linux installations on a new world powerpc machine imposes a problem: all kernels should be placed on the same partition due to a limitation in yaboot. How does d-i deal with this when Debian is installed on a system on which there is already installed another linux system? -- Regards, EddyP = "Imagination is more important than knowledge" A.Einstein -- Regards, EddyP = "Imagination is more important than knowledge" A.Einstein
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Mon, 2006-05-15 at 07:27 +0200, Frans Pop wrote: > > The current daily images now show the AT keymap list. I've tested this on > Frank Lichtenheld's Powerbook G4 laptop, and all keys are mapped OK for > the German keyboard. > > The only change from the USB-MAC keymaps is that the apple key no longer > works as the modifier key. Instead these can be accessed using Fn-Alt, > which can probably be explained as that is probably equivalent to the > right-Alt key on "regular" AT keyboards on i386. > > AFAICT the options are: > - should the AT keymaps be made to support the apple key as modifier key > or > - should we go back to using the USB-MAC keymaps for powerpc This may still be necessary, as some Apple keyboards tend to have different layouts from 'standard' PC keyboards. Just as one example, the Swiss German Apple keyboard has the @ symbol on the G key. AFAIK in some other countries the layout can be completely different. > - should powerpc users learn to use Fn-Alt instead of the apple key Not sure if the fact that newer Apple laptops treat the fn key differently matters for this, but at any rate the whole fn concept seems to be rather unintuitive and/or inconvenient for people, at least initially. > Going back to USB-MAC keymaps is possibly not the prefered option because > as I understand it the input layer of the 2.6 kernel translates > everything to "AT", so in principle all architectures should now use AT > keymaps. I'm not very familiar with all the issues involved, but I suspect you may be mixing up keycodes (and/or keysyms?) and keymaps here. -- Earthling Michel Dänzer | http://tungstengraphics.com Libre software enthusiast | Debian, X and DRI developer
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Monday 15 May 2006 16:28, Sven Luther wrote: > You probably can, adb keyboards are only used on oldworld machines, and > those are easily enough to detect from /proc/cpuinfo. We even do so to > get the oldworld subarch (pmac_oldworld even). Huh? The machine I tested on was a Powerbook G4 laptop. That's not oldworld, right? The attachment in [1] was taken from that machine... [1] http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=367149;msg=5 pgpcVaJVw7jGz.pgp Description: PGP signature
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Mon, May 15, 2006 at 03:26:40PM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: > On Monday 15 May 2006 14:36, Sven Luther wrote: > > I am not 100% sure, bvut i remember that the 2.6 kernels translate all > > kind of mac keyboards to the same thing. As such, there is no ADB > > keyboard needed anymore, as the kernel exports it as a normal keyboard > > to the userland (or something such, i am no expert in this, CCing > > debian-powerpc). > > Agree, but you still need some kind of way (in the current kbd-chooser > structure anyway) to detect that there _is_ a keyboard and that currently > does not happen for ADB keyboards. This breaks the general structure of > kbd-chooser. Ah, indeed. I will try later today or tomorrow to boot my oldworld box, and see what kind of information i can get about the keyboard. I doubt that oldworld adb keyboards will become udev friendly anytime soon though. > And if you'd like to select a special keymap, you'd also need to identify > its type, unless you can do the distinction by (sub)arch. You probably can, adb keyboards are only used on oldworld machines, and those are easily enough to detect from /proc/cpuinfo. We even do so to get the oldworld subarch (pmac_oldworld even). Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Monday 15 May 2006 14:36, Sven Luther wrote: > I am not 100% sure, bvut i remember that the 2.6 kernels translate all > kind of mac keyboards to the same thing. As such, there is no ADB > keyboard needed anymore, as the kernel exports it as a normal keyboard > to the userland (or something such, i am no expert in this, CCing > debian-powerpc). Agree, but you still need some kind of way (in the current kbd-chooser structure anyway) to detect that there _is_ a keyboard and that currently does not happen for ADB keyboards. This breaks the general structure of kbd-chooser. And if you'd like to select a special keymap, you'd also need to identify its type, unless you can do the distinction by (sub)arch. pgpKiAaKcDFLs.pgp Description: PGP signature
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Sun, May 14, 2006 at 07:22:56AM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: > Package: kbd-chooser > Version: 1.26 > > It appears that kbd-chooser does not actually detect ADB keyboards as used > for example on Powerbook G4 laptops. > Until Beta 2 keyboard selection only worked because of the default mac-usb > keyboard added in usb-kbd.c, but that's absolutely not optimal. > > After a short look at Frank Lichtenhelds laptop, it seems that the > keyboard can be detected from the /proc/bus/input/devices file (see > attachment). > > It's currently unsure if the keyboard will work correctly with AT keymaps > as well as USB-MAC. I'll test that over the next days. I am not 100% sure, bvut i remember that the 2.6 kernels translate all kind of mac keyboards to the same thing. As such, there is no ADB keyboard needed anymore, as the kernel exports it as a normal keyboard to the userland (or something such, i am no expert in this, CCing debian-powerpc). There is maybe still some need for some specialized layout though. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On 5/15/06, Frans Pop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Sunday 14 May 2006 07:22, Frans Pop wrote: > It's currently unsure if the keyboard will work correctly with AT > keymaps as well as USB-MAC. I'll test that over the next days. The current daily images now show the AT keymap list. I've tested this on Frank Lichtenheld's Powerbook G4 laptop, and all keys are mapped OK for the German keyboard. The only change from the USB-MAC keymaps is that the apple key no longer works as the modifier key. Instead these can be accessed using Fn-Alt, which can probably be explained as that is probably equivalent to the right-Alt key on "regular" AT keyboards on i386. AFAICT the options are: - should the AT keymaps be made to support the apple key as modifier key or - should we go back to using the USB-MAC keymaps for powerpc or - should powerpc users learn to use Fn-Alt instead of the apple key Going back to USB-MAC keymaps is possibly not the prefered option because as I understand it the input layer of the 2.6 kernel translates everything to "AT", so in principle all architectures should now use AT keymaps. I personally use the Option key (or Apple as some might call it) as an AltGr key. The Fn+Alt is used for right click emulation while Fn+Option is for middle click. I need all of the keys as they are in order to be able to use diacritics and be able to use applications in a fast and confortable manner. So please keep this in mind when you decide what to do. P.S. Eddy: a test by you too would be very welcome, especially if you can do a full installation and check the full range of characters on the installed system. Ok, there is a partition on which I can do test installations; btw, two linux installations on a new world powerpc machine imposes a problem: all kernels should be placed on the same partition due to a limitation in yaboot. How does d-i deal with this when Debian is installed on a system on which there is already installed another linux system? -- Regards, EddyP = "Imagination is more important than knowledge" A.Einstein
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On Sunday 14 May 2006 07:22, Frans Pop wrote: > It's currently unsure if the keyboard will work correctly with AT > keymaps as well as USB-MAC. I'll test that over the next days. The current daily images now show the AT keymap list. I've tested this on Frank Lichtenheld's Powerbook G4 laptop, and all keys are mapped OK for the German keyboard. The only change from the USB-MAC keymaps is that the apple key no longer works as the modifier key. Instead these can be accessed using Fn-Alt, which can probably be explained as that is probably equivalent to the right-Alt key on "regular" AT keyboards on i386. AFAICT the options are: - should the AT keymaps be made to support the apple key as modifier key or - should we go back to using the USB-MAC keymaps for powerpc or - should powerpc users learn to use Fn-Alt instead of the apple key Going back to USB-MAC keymaps is possibly not the prefered option because as I understand it the input layer of the 2.6 kernel translates everything to "AT", so in principle all architectures should now use AT keymaps. Advice and comments very welcome. Cheers, FJP P.S. Eddy: a test by you too would be very welcome, especially if you can do a full installation and check the full range of characters on the installed system. pgpXiXplZdp3V.pgp Description: PGP signature
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
On 5/14/06, Frans Pop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Package: kbd-chooser Version: 1.26 It appears that kbd-chooser does not actually detect ADB keyboards as used for example on Powerbook G4 laptops. Until Beta 2 keyboard selection only worked because of the default mac-usb keyboard added in usb-kbd.c, but that's absolutely not optimal. After a short look at Frank Lichtenhelds laptop, it seems that the keyboard can be detected from the /proc/bus/input/devices file (see attachment). It's currently unsure if the keyboard will work correctly with AT keymaps as well as USB-MAC. I'll test that over the next days. I can test this when is ready. (An explamation for way to infirm/confirm that the keyboard was detected correctly would be nice to have before doing this, 'though). PowerBook 5,2 here. -- Regards, EddyP = "Imagination is more important than knowledge" A.Einstein
Bug#367149: kbd-chooser: [powerpc] does not detect ADB keyboards
Package: kbd-chooser Version: 1.26 It appears that kbd-chooser does not actually detect ADB keyboards as used for example on Powerbook G4 laptops. Until Beta 2 keyboard selection only worked because of the default mac-usb keyboard added in usb-kbd.c, but that's absolutely not optimal. After a short look at Frank Lichtenhelds laptop, it seems that the keyboard can be detected from the /proc/bus/input/devices file (see attachment). It's currently unsure if the keyboard will work correctly with AT keymaps as well as USB-MAC. I'll test that over the next days. I: Bus=0017 Vendor=0001 Product=0001 Version=0100 N: Name="Macintosh mouse button emulation" P: Phys= S: Sysfs=/class/input/input0 H: Handlers=mouse0 event0 ts0 B: EV=7 B: KEY=7 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 B: REL=3 I: Bus=0017 Vendor=0001 Product=22c4 Version=0200 N: Name="ADB keyboard" P: Phys=adb2:2.c4/input S: Sysfs=/class/input/input1 H: Handlers=kbd event1 B: EV=120003 B: KEY=feb0ffdf 3cf fffe B: LED=7 I: Bus=0017 Vendor=0001 Product=771f Version=0100 N: Name="ADB Powerbook buttons" P: Phys=adb7:7.1f/input S: Sysfs=/class/input/input2 H: Handlers=kbd event2 B: EV=13 B: KEY=7b 0 2 0 e 0 0 0 I: Bus=0017 Vendor=0001 Product=3301 Version=0100 N: Name="ADB mouse" P: Phys=adb3:3.01/input S: Sysfs=/class/input/input3 H: Handlers=mouse1 event3 ts1 B: EV=7 B: KEY=7 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 B: REL=3 I: Bus=0017 Vendor=001f Product=0001 Version=0100 N: Name="PowerMac Beep" P: Phys=powermac/beep S: Sysfs=/class/input/input4 H: Handlers=kbd event4 B: EV=40001 B: SND=6 pgppbB9gazFzY.pgp Description: PGP signature
