Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
Le Wed, Aug 07, 2013 at 08:30:43AM +0100, Matthew Johnson a écrit : > On Tue Aug 06 13:38, Eugene Zhukov wrote: > > Can it simply be "except if it is a .jar file" in parenthesis instead of > > vague "in the sense that it is meant to be uncompressed with..."? > > We want to write policy to be general and not have 100s of special > exceptions. In this case what is special is not that it's a jar file, but > that the user isn't meant to interact with it using standard compressed file > tools. This is not a state unique to jar files. Even if there aren't any > other known cases now, we want to write policy in a way that can apply to > them in the futuer. Hi all, I agree that the recommendations should be generic. I used "unzip" instead "ungzip" in the example because I simply pasted the text from Bill's comment (676784#49). Before committing, I wondered if I should replace "unzip" by "ungzip", I concluded that "unzip" was probably intended since this is the underlying format of the JAR files, and that we exactly wanted to make the point that in normal operations one is not expected to run "unzip" on them. But if people find it confusing, I can correct by switching to "unzip", or by adding "or unarchived" after "uncompressed". Have a nice day, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
On Tue Aug 06 13:38, Eugene Zhukov wrote: > Can it simply be "except if it is a .jar file" in parenthesis instead > of vague "in the sense that it is meant to be uncompressed with..."? We want to write policy to be general and not have 100s of special exceptions. In this case what is special is not that it's a jar file, but that the user isn't meant to interact with it using standard compressed file tools. This is not a state unique to jar files. Even if there aren't any other known cases now, we want to write policy in a way that can apply to them in the futuer. Matt signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
On Sun, Aug 4, 2013 at 10:05 AM, Wouter Verhelst wrote: > On 03-08-13 08:40, Charles Plessy wrote: >> tag 676784 pending >> thanks >> >> Le Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:13:37PM +0900, Charles Plessy a écrit : >>> >>> Unless there is objection, I will add the note in parenthesis as a >>> non-normative change, and then mark the bug pending. >> >> Hello everybody, >> >> here is what I pushed. >> >> diff --git a/debian/changelog b/debian/changelog >> index fe4a858..bc23f5c 100644 >> --- a/debian/changelog >> +++ b/debian/changelog >> @@ -51,6 +51,7 @@ debian-policy (3.9.5.0) UNRELEASED; urgency=low >> Closes: #704657. Thanks, Philipp Hahn. >>* Replaced non-standard names of dpkg states by normalised ones. >> Closes: #705403 >> + * Clarify what is meant by "compressed" in section 10.5. (Closes: #676784) >> >> -- Russ Allbery Sat, 03 Nov 2012 15:32:46 -0700 >> >> diff --git a/policy.sgml b/policy.sgml >> index 953d5d2..cb1093f 100644 >> --- a/policy.sgml >> +++ b/policy.sgml >> @@ -8853,7 +8853,9 @@ ln -fs ../sbin/sendmail debian/tmp/usr/bin/runq >> >> >> >> - A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file should always >> + A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file (in the sense >> + that it is meant to be uncompressed with unzip > > This should be "gunzip", not just "unzip". The latter unpacks the ".zip" > format, not the ".gz" one, which is significantly different. Can it simply be "except if it is a .jar file" in parenthesis instead of vague "in the sense that it is meant to be uncompressed with..."? Regards, Eugene -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
On 03-08-13 08:40, Charles Plessy wrote: > tag 676784 pending > thanks > > Le Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:13:37PM +0900, Charles Plessy a écrit : >> >> Unless there is objection, I will add the note in parenthesis as a >> non-normative change, and then mark the bug pending. > > Hello everybody, > > here is what I pushed. > > diff --git a/debian/changelog b/debian/changelog > index fe4a858..bc23f5c 100644 > --- a/debian/changelog > +++ b/debian/changelog > @@ -51,6 +51,7 @@ debian-policy (3.9.5.0) UNRELEASED; urgency=low > Closes: #704657. Thanks, Philipp Hahn. >* Replaced non-standard names of dpkg states by normalised ones. > Closes: #705403 > + * Clarify what is meant by "compressed" in section 10.5. (Closes: #676784) > > -- Russ Allbery Sat, 03 Nov 2012 15:32:46 -0700 > > diff --git a/policy.sgml b/policy.sgml > index 953d5d2..cb1093f 100644 > --- a/policy.sgml > +++ b/policy.sgml > @@ -8853,7 +8853,9 @@ ln -fs ../sbin/sendmail debian/tmp/usr/bin/runq > > > > - A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file should always > + A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file (in the sense > + that it is meant to be uncompressed with unzip This should be "gunzip", not just "unzip". The latter unpacks the ".zip" format, not the ".gz" one, which is significantly different. > + or zless etc.) should always > have the same file extension as the referenced file. (For > example, if a file foo.gz is referenced by a > symbolic link, the filename of the link has to end with > > > Cheers, > -- This end should point toward the ground if you want to go to space. If it starts pointing toward space you are having a bad problem and you will not go to space today. -- http://xkcd.com/1133/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
tag 676784 pending thanks Le Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 10:13:37PM +0900, Charles Plessy a écrit : > > Unless there is objection, I will add the note in parenthesis as a > non-normative change, and then mark the bug pending. Hello everybody, here is what I pushed. diff --git a/debian/changelog b/debian/changelog index fe4a858..bc23f5c 100644 --- a/debian/changelog +++ b/debian/changelog @@ -51,6 +51,7 @@ debian-policy (3.9.5.0) UNRELEASED; urgency=low Closes: #704657. Thanks, Philipp Hahn. * Replaced non-standard names of dpkg states by normalised ones. Closes: #705403 + * Clarify what is meant by "compressed" in section 10.5. (Closes: #676784) -- Russ Allbery Sat, 03 Nov 2012 15:32:46 -0700 diff --git a/policy.sgml b/policy.sgml index 953d5d2..cb1093f 100644 --- a/policy.sgml +++ b/policy.sgml @@ -8853,7 +8853,9 @@ ln -fs ../sbin/sendmail debian/tmp/usr/bin/runq - A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file should always + A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file (in the sense + that it is meant to be uncompressed with unzip + or zless etc.) should always have the same file extension as the referenced file. (For example, if a file foo.gz is referenced by a symbolic link, the filename of the link has to end with Cheers, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
Le Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 08:50:42AM +0300, Eugene Zhukov a écrit : > On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:12 AM, Charles Plessy wrote: > > Le Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 06:57:35AM +0900, Charles Plessy a écrit : > >> Le Thu, Jul 25, 2013 at 12:13:12AM +0200, Bill Allombert a écrit : > >> > > >> > A .jar file is not a compressed file in the sense it is not meant to be > >> > uncompressed > >> > with unzip or zless etc. > >> > >> I agree. Shall we close that bug ? Or add the above as a footnote if it > >> is > >> felt necessary ? > > > > Hi all, > > > > if there is no futher input within a few days, I am going to close this > > bug, as > > it is based on a clearly erroneous interpretation of the Policy. > > > > If a clearification is necessary, how about adding "in "sense it is meant > > to be > > uncompressed with unzip or zless etc." either in parenthesis of as a > > footnote. > > IMO a note in parenthesis or a footnote would help a lot. Then I guess > it can be closed, since there is another #539315, which can be closed > only after fixing lintian. Thanks for the prompt feedback. Unless there is objection, I will add the note in parenthesis as a non-normative change, and then mark the bug pending. Cheers, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:12 AM, Charles Plessy wrote: > Le Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 06:57:35AM +0900, Charles Plessy a écrit : >> Le Thu, Jul 25, 2013 at 12:13:12AM +0200, Bill Allombert a écrit : >> > >> > A .jar file is not a compressed file in the sense it is not meant to be >> > uncompressed >> > with unzip or zless etc. >> >> I agree. Shall we close that bug ? Or add the above as a footnote if it is >> felt necessary ? > > Hi all, > > if there is no futher input within a few days, I am going to close this bug, > as > it is based on a clearly erroneous interpretation of the Policy. > > If a clearification is necessary, how about adding "in "sense it is meant to > be > uncompressed with unzip or zless etc." either in parenthesis of as a footnote. IMO a note in parenthesis or a footnote would help a lot. Then I guess it can be closed, since there is another #539315, which can be closed only after fixing lintian. Please, correct me if I'm wrong. Cheers, Eugene -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
Le Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 06:57:35AM +0900, Charles Plessy a écrit : > Le Thu, Jul 25, 2013 at 12:13:12AM +0200, Bill Allombert a écrit : > > > > A .jar file is not a compressed file in the sense it is not meant to be > > uncompressed > > with unzip or zless etc. > > I agree. Shall we close that bug ? Or add the above as a footnote if it is > felt necessary ? Hi all, if there is no futher input within a few days, I am going to close this bug, as it is based on a clearly erroneous interpretation of the Policy. If a clearification is necessary, how about adding "in "sense it is meant to be uncompressed with unzip or zless etc." either in parenthesis of as a footnote. Have a nice day, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
Le Thu, Jul 25, 2013 at 12:13:12AM +0200, Bill Allombert a écrit : > > A .jar file is not a compressed file in the sense it is not meant to be > uncompressed > with unzip or zless etc. I agree. Shall we close that bug ? Or add the above as a footnote if it is felt necessary ? Have a nice week-end, -- Charles -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 05:06:50PM +0300, Eugene Zhukov wrote: > On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 4:41 PM, Charles Plessy wrote: > > Le Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 03:55:38PM +0300, Eugene Zhukov a écrit : > >> > >> I encountered a Lintian warning executable-not-elf-or-script with one > >> of my packages and then I learned about outstanding > >> Lintian<->debian-policy bug #539315. > >> > >> How about fixing the policy by adding an exception for .jar files? > > > > Dear Eugene, > > > > I do not see where the Policy forbids JAR files to be executable when they > > are > > intended to be executed. In line with others, I think that the > > interpretation > > of section 10.5 on symbolic links in #539315 is overly restrictive, as > > executable JAR files are not just compressed files, but entire archives. > > > > Altogether, I think that we should close #676784 (the clone of #539315), or > > clarify what is the intent of section 10.5, and what is meant by > > "compressed" > > there. > > The problem with section 10.5 is in the clause "A symbolic link > pointing to a compressed file should always have the same file > extension as the referenced file". > So, if I have /usr/share/java/foo.jar, then I want to have executable > foo in /usr/bin through link foo -> ../share/java/foo.jar. Which is > now, as I see it, against the policy. No really: a compressed file is expected to have an extension like .gz, .bz2, .xz or .zip etc. The policy is helpful because various tools will not uncompress such files if they do not have the right extensions. A .jar file is not a compressed file in the sense it is not meant to be uncompressed with unzip or zless etc. Cheers, -- Bill. Imagine a large red swirl here. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 4:41 PM, Charles Plessy wrote: > Le Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 03:55:38PM +0300, Eugene Zhukov a écrit : >> >> I encountered a Lintian warning executable-not-elf-or-script with one >> of my packages and then I learned about outstanding >> Lintian<->debian-policy bug #539315. >> >> How about fixing the policy by adding an exception for .jar files? > > Dear Eugene, > > I do not see where the Policy forbids JAR files to be executable when they are > intended to be executed. In line with others, I think that the interpretation > of section 10.5 on symbolic links in #539315 is overly restrictive, as > executable JAR files are not just compressed files, but entire archives. > > Altogether, I think that we should close #676784 (the clone of #539315), or > clarify what is the intent of section 10.5, and what is meant by "compressed" > there. The problem with section 10.5 is in the clause "A symbolic link pointing to a compressed file should always have the same file extension as the referenced file". So, if I have /usr/share/java/foo.jar, then I want to have executable foo in /usr/bin through link foo -> ../share/java/foo.jar. Which is now, as I see it, against the policy. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#676784: Policy §10.5 and .jar file noticeable exception
Le Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 03:55:38PM +0300, Eugene Zhukov a écrit : > > I encountered a Lintian warning executable-not-elf-or-script with one > of my packages and then I learned about outstanding > Lintian<->debian-policy bug #539315. > > How about fixing the policy by adding an exception for .jar files? Dear Eugene, I do not see where the Policy forbids JAR files to be executable when they are intended to be executed. In line with others, I think that the interpretation of section 10.5 on symbolic links in #539315 is overly restrictive, as executable JAR files are not just compressed files, but entire archives. Altogether, I think that we should close #676784 (the clone of #539315), or clarify what is the intent of section 10.5, and what is meant by "compressed" there. Have a nice day, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
