Bug#933609: How hard it is to find the Date of a package
在 2019-08-02五的 02:24 +0800，積丹尼 Dan Jacobson写道： > Let's look at a typical "Download" page, > https://www.apkmirror.com/apk/couchsurfing-inc/couchsurfing-travel-app/couchsurfing-travel-app-4-26-0-release/#downloads > as we see dates are of utmost importance. > > Wherever we see a version number, we see a date. > > In fact I'm sure you would be hard pressed to find any website that > doesn't (except https://www.google.com/earth/versions/#download-pro ). > > So I'm saying that the Debian website should "cough up the date", > yes, "even if it is not the right date", just some date, any date, and > put it more clearly on the trail of what the user sees after Googling a > package. > > I mean there are the MD5 sums, etc. down to the exact byte count, etc. > but no indication of if the package was updated last year, or before the > NASA moon voyages. > > Those apt tools are great, but let's have the website cough up some > dates better too. Personally I'm not against adding dates at all. The fact is that the development of packages.debian.org website (not tracker.debian.org) is long stalled and it needs some more manpower. It would be great if any kind of patches could emerge. Thanks, Boyuan Yang signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Bug#933609: How hard it is to find the Date of a package
Let's look at a typical "Download" page, https://www.apkmirror.com/apk/couchsurfing-inc/couchsurfing-travel-app/couchsurfing-travel-app-4-26-0-release/#downloads as we see dates are of utmost importance. Wherever we see a version number, we see a date. In fact I'm sure you would be hard pressed to find any website that doesn't (except https://www.google.com/earth/versions/#download-pro ). So I'm saying that the Debian website should "cough up the date", yes, "even if it is not the right date", just some date, any date, and put it more clearly on the trail of what the user sees after Googling a package. I mean there are the MD5 sums, etc. down to the exact byte count, etc. but no indication of if the package was updated last year, or before the NASA moon voyages. Those apt tools are great, but let's have the website cough up some dates better too.
Bug#933609: How hard it is to find the Date of a package
Hi! I don't think there's any bug here, TBH. And if there was this would be the wrong package to assign to. On Thu, 2019-08-01 at 09:22:29 +0800, 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson wrote: > Package: www.debian.org > Let's examine how extremely hard it is for a user to squeeze update date > of a package he is thinking of installing out of the Debian system. The date does not seem relevant at all for the case you list below. > Now we must turn to the web. Not really, but see below. > Case in point: > > "Should we install webext-ublock-origin, or get it from the Chrome web > store. I know, let's see which is newer!" #933608 > > https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpalhdlnbpafiamejdnhcphjbkeiagm > says says "Updated July 25, 2019" You should be looking at the versions, the date is not really an indicator of whether one is newer than the other, it just reflects when these versions got uploaded to these different repositories. If Debian uploaded an older version later than the version in the Chrome web store, you'd get the wrong result. Version on the Chrome web store: 1.21.6 > OK, let's turn to Debian. $ apt-cache show webext-ublock-origin/sid | grep Version: Version: 1.19.0+dfsg-2 That pretty unambiguously states that the version in Debian is older. But if today there was a new Debian revision (say 1.19.0+dfsg-3) you'd have reached the wrong conclusion that the version in Debian is newer. > So we must shorten the link: > > http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/u/ublock-origin/ > > Then click Last Modified (twice), then look for the file we want... This is all the wrong way around really. But, in case you want to see the date of the last change, which also has nothing to do with when this got uploaded, or built (which can all be different times), then a simple: $ apt changelog webext-ublock-origin/sid would do. Thanks, Guillem
Bug#933609: How hard it is to find the Date of a package
> "YW(" == Yao Wei (魏銘廷) writes:
YW(> A probably known easier way is to see the standardized changelog of the
package. There should be a date in each version.
OK, so smart users know that the Date is hiding in the
$ w3m -dump https://packages.debian.org/sid/web/webext-ublock-origin | grep
Change
• Debian Changelog
link.
Bug#933609: How hard it is to find the Date of a package
A probably known easier way is to see the standardized changelog of the package. There should be a date in each version. Yao Wei (This email is sent from a phone; sorry for HTML email if it happens.) > On Aug 1, 2019, at 09:27, 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson wrote: > > Package: www.debian.org > > Let's examine how extremely hard it is for a user to squeeze update date > of a package he is thinking of installing out of the Debian system. > > First of all update dates are not part of any Package* file. So forget > apt, etc. > > Now we must turn to the web. > > Case in point: > > "Should we install webext-ublock-origin, or get it from the Chrome web > store. I know, let's see which is newer!" #933608 > > https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpalhdlnbpafiamejdnhcphjbkeiagm > says says "Updated July 25, 2019" > > That was simple. > > OK, let's turn to Debian. > > https://www.google.com/search?q=webext-ublock-origin leads to > https://packages.debian.org/sid/web/webext-ublock-origin > from where we must know to click on "all", > https://packages.debian.org/sid/all/webext-ublock-origin/download > > There we see > More information on webext-ublock-origin_1.19.0+dfsg-2_all.deb: > Exact Size1617728 Byte (1.5 MByte) > MD5 checksum190c7c66089925f72489624d700c34a0 > SHA1 checksumNot Available > SHA256 checksum > bf50b4180ba0daddd720b5ce1702a315ed7743cc749ebb3cc131fe60dcc648c9 > > but Date is still not included. > > So we must copy a link, and run HEAD on it, > > $ HEAD > http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/u/ublock-origin/webext-ublock-origin_1.19.0+dfsg-2_all.deb > 200 OK > Connection: close > Date: Thu, 01 Aug 2019 01:17:03 GMT > Accept-Ranges: bytes > ETag: "5d22808b-18af40" > Server: nginx/1.13.6 > Content-Length: 1617728 > Content-Type: application/octet-stream > Last-Modified: Sun, 07 Jul 2019 23:30:19 GMT > > > Ah, finally! > > But let's say we are not as smart. > > So we must shorten the link: > > http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/u/ublock-origin/ > > Then click Last Modified (twice), then look for the file we want... >
Bug#933609: How hard it is to find the Date of a package
Package: www.debian.org Let's examine how extremely hard it is for a user to squeeze update date of a package he is thinking of installing out of the Debian system. First of all update dates are not part of any Package* file. So forget apt, etc. Now we must turn to the web. Case in point: "Should we install webext-ublock-origin, or get it from the Chrome web store. I know, let's see which is newer!" #933608 https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ublock-origin/cjpalhdlnbpafiamejdnhcphjbkeiagm says says "Updated July 25, 2019" That was simple. OK, let's turn to Debian. https://www.google.com/search?q=webext-ublock-origin leads to https://packages.debian.org/sid/web/webext-ublock-origin from where we must know to click on "all", https://packages.debian.org/sid/all/webext-ublock-origin/download There we see More information on webext-ublock-origin_1.19.0+dfsg-2_all.deb: Exact Size1617728 Byte (1.5 MByte) MD5 checksum 190c7c66089925f72489624d700c34a0 SHA1 checksum Not Available SHA256 checksum bf50b4180ba0daddd720b5ce1702a315ed7743cc749ebb3cc131fe60dcc648c9 but Date is still not included. So we must copy a link, and run HEAD on it, $ HEAD http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/u/ublock-origin/webext-ublock-origin_1.19.0+dfsg-2_all.deb 200 OK Connection: close Date: Thu, 01 Aug 2019 01:17:03 GMT Accept-Ranges: bytes ETag: "5d22808b-18af40" Server: nginx/1.13.6 Content-Length: 1617728 Content-Type: application/octet-stream Last-Modified: Sun, 07 Jul 2019 23:30:19 GMT Ah, finally! But let's say we are not as smart. So we must shorten the link: http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/main/u/ublock-origin/ Then click Last Modified (twice), then look for the file we want...
