Bug#469099: xscreensaver: Package split leaves non-working screensavers in KDE configuration
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 3:12 AM, Frans Pop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After upgrading to this version of xscreensaver I noticed that the KDE controlcenter module used to configure the screensaver now lists a number of screensavers that no longer work. Apparently the list of available screensavers does not get updated. The reason seems to be that the following file is still installed: /usr/share/applnk/System/ScreenSavers/phosphor.desktop This file is installed by the package kscreensaver-xsavers. Thanks for your report. Several hacks have been moved to the xscreensaver-data-extra (and xscreensaver-gl-extra) package. Just install that package and the broken kscreensaver will work fine again. Evidently the package split should have been coordinated with packages depending on xscreensaver. We don't expect any major problems. All the files are practically the same, just in two packages. We could choose to drag in both packages during the upgrade, but chose to do user education instead, to make the future better. Sorry, personally I know nothing about kscreensaver-xsavers. I will be pleased to work together with you to make it work properly. Believe me, the reason for the package split is exactly to make things easier for third-party screensaver infrastructures (like gnome-screensaver and kscreensaver), so that they can use xscreensaver hacks without the user having xscreensaver installed. The split in -extra is currently the only way to split between safe, recommended hacks and those who often can cause problems. From this point of view the package split can be said to break existing installations, which is a release critical issue. This BR is necessary to prevent the new xscreensaver to migrate to testing until the required coordination has taken place and depending packages have been updated. Apparantly, the package split exposes a weakness in the kscreensaver package. Does it have a list of screensaver hacks hardcoded? Your mentioning of its /usr/share/applnk/System/ScreenSavers/phosphor.desktop file sounds a bit like this. It should be made to dynamically deal with the available screensavers in /usr/share/applications/screensavers. Also other packages might drop .desktop files in there if they have something suitable as a screensaver. IMO, only the package shipping a hack should also ship a .desktop for it, whether in /usr/share/applnk/System/ScreenSavers or /usr/share/applications/screensavers. Anyway, the .desktop files should have a TryExec entry to check for the existence of the hack binary. Maybe you just need to update the relevant .desktop files. Without knowing kscreensaver much, I think the best solution would be to stop kscreensaver from shipping .desktop files and rather let it look for the desktop files installed by other packages. On the short term, just let kscreensaver depend on xscreensaver-data-extra, but remove the dependency later once kscreensaver is fixed properly. Cheers, Tormod -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#469099: xscreensaver: Package split leaves non-working screensavers in KDE configuration
On Monday 03 March 2008, Tormod Volden wrote: Thanks for your report. Several hacks have been moved to the xscreensaver-data-extra (and xscreensaver-gl-extra) package. Just install that package and the broken kscreensaver will work fine again. Yes, I understand that, but it is not the point of my report. Evidently the package split should have been coordinated with packages depending on xscreensaver. We don't expect any major problems. All the files are practically the same, just in two packages. We could choose to drag in both packages during the upgrade, but chose to do user education instead, to make the future better. Sorry, personally I know nothing about kscreensaver-xsavers. I will be pleased to work together with you to make it work properly. Which is _exactly_ why you should have coordinated with the maintainers of packages depending on your package before making a major change such as this split. Believe me, the reason for the package split is exactly to make things easier for third-party screensaver infrastructures (like gnome-screensaver and kscreensaver), so that they can use xscreensaver hacks without the user having xscreensaver installed. The split in -extra is currently the only way to split between safe, recommended hacks and those who often can cause problems. Fine, but implementing it without discussing the change with those maintainers seems to be causing breakage. Apparantly, the package split exposes a weakness in the kscreensaver package. It's not a weakness in kscreensaver. It's something that has been a fact for probably a long time. A fact that the split did not take into account and thus is causing breakage. IMO, only the package shipping a hack should also ship a .desktop for it, whether in /usr/share/applnk/System/ScreenSavers or /usr/share/applications/screensavers. Anyway, the .desktop files should have a TryExec entry to check for the existence of the hack binary. Maybe you just need to update the relevant .desktop files. I really don't care about any of that. The fact remains that you implemented a change which is causing breakage in another package. That is a release critical bug. Without knowing kscreensaver much, I think the best solution would be to stop kscreensaver from shipping .desktop files and rather let it look for the desktop files installed by other packages. On the short term, just let kscreensaver depend on xscreensaver-data-extra, but remove the dependency later once kscreensaver is fixed properly. Great. I suggest that you contact the maintainers of kscreensaver ASAP and discuss the details with them. It _is_ your responsibility as maintainer of a package to coordinate with maintainers of packages that have reverse dependencies on your package when making changes that could affect them. Cheers, FJP signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Bug#469099: xscreensaver: Package split leaves non-working screensavers in KDE configuration
On Mar 3, 2008, at 2:19 AM, Tormod Volden wrote: Believe me, the reason for the package split is exactly to make things easier for third-party screensaver infrastructures (like gnome-screensaver and kscreensaver), so that they can use xscreensaver hacks without the user having xscreensaver installed I don't understand why you're wasting your time on this. The xscreensaver executable is only 200kb. A good principle is don't fix what ain't broke. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#469099: xscreensaver: Package split leaves non-working screensavers in KDE configuration
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Frans Pop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, I understand that, but it is not the point of my report. For a moment I thought you were the misgruntled kscreensaver maintainer, that's why I explained everything so carefully :) Which is _exactly_ why you should have coordinated with the maintainers of packages depending on your package before making a major change such as this split. Yeah, I missed the reverse dependency on kscreensaver-savers. It's not a weakness in kscreensaver. It's something that has been a fact for probably a long time. A fact that the split did not take into account and thus is causing breakage. It's poor design in kscreensaver, but we'll fix it instead of arguing... I really don't care about any of that. The fact remains that you implemented a change which is causing breakage in another package. That is a release critical bug. I didn't say that it shouldn't be fixed. I'll keep the bug open here until it's fixed in kscreensaver-xsavers. Great. I suggest that you contact the maintainers of kscreensaver ASAP and discuss the details with them. It _is_ your responsibility as maintainer of a package to coordinate with maintainers of packages that have reverse dependencies on your package when making changes that could affect them. Sure! I think I got that point now ;) Cheers, FJP Thanks, Tormod -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#469099: xscreensaver: Package split leaves non-working screensavers in KDE configuration
On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 8:55 PM, Jamie Zawinski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't understand why you're wasting your time on this. The xscreensaver executable is only 200kb. A good principle is don't fix what ain't broke. Jamie, I like to see it as progress :) I understand your feelings on this, but I have another perspective. It's not to save 200kB, but to avoid any conflicts between different backends and setups. I see upstream xscreensaver as a provider of 1) a nice screensaver backend that some people need or prefer to use 2) a wonderful collection of hacks that can be shared by other backends and what not. Of course, we are now making (2) easier and cleaner, but we also try to satisfy (1) better. For instance, people can install the xscreensaver package in their GNOME and it will work in all its glory without any crippling that would have been introduced for (2). It can seem unfair to the xscreensaver heritage, but we now have something like xscreensaver, gnome-screensaver and kscreensaver being equal, independent choices for backend, all three sharing the goodness of xscreensaver-data. Thanks for all your great work, Tormod -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#469099: xscreensaver: Package split leaves non-working screensavers in KDE configuration
Package: xscreensaver Version: 5.04-4 Severity: serious After upgrading to this version of xscreensaver I noticed that the KDE controlcenter module used to configure the screensaver now lists a number of screensavers that no longer work. Apparently the list of available screensavers does not get updated. The reason seems to be that the following file is still installed: /usr/share/applnk/System/ScreenSavers/phosphor.desktop This file is installed by the package kscreensaver-xsavers. Evidently the package split should have been coordinated with packages depending on xscreensaver. From this point of view the package split can be said to break existing installations, which is a release critical issue. This BR is necessary to prevent the new xscreensaver to migrate to testing until the required coordination has taken place and depending packages have been updated. -- System Information: Debian Release: lenny/sid APT prefers unstable APT policy: (500, 'unstable') Architecture: amd64 (x86_64) Kernel: Linux 2.6.25-rc3 (SMP w/2 CPU cores) Locale: LANG=en_US.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash Versions of packages xscreensaver depends on: ii libatk1.0-01.20.0-1 The ATK accessibility toolkit ii libc6 2.7-9 GNU C Library: Shared libraries ii libcairo2 1.4.14-1 The Cairo 2D vector graphics libra ii libglade2-01:2.6.2-1 library to load .glade files at ru ii libglib2.0-0 2.14.6-1 The GLib library of C routines ii libgtk2.0-02.12.8-1 The GTK+ graphical user interface ii libice62:1.0.4-1 X11 Inter-Client Exchange library ii libpam0g 0.99.7.1-5Pluggable Authentication Modules l ii libpango1.0-0 1.18.4-1 Layout and rendering of internatio ii libsm6 2:1.0.3-1+b1 X11 Session Management library ii libx11-6 2:1.0.3-7 X11 client-side library ii libxext6 2:1.0.4-1 X11 miscellaneous extension librar ii libxinerama1 1:1.0.2-1 X11 Xinerama extension library ii libxml22.6.31.dfsg-1 GNOME XML library ii libxmu62:1.0.4-1 X11 miscellaneous utility library ii libxpm41:3.5.7-1 X11 pixmap library ii libxrandr2 2:1.2.2-1 X11 RandR extension library ii libxrender11:0.9.4-1 X Rendering Extension client libra ii libxt6 1:1.0.5-3 X11 toolkit intrinsics library ii libxxf86misc1 1:1.0.1-2 X11 XFree86 miscellaneous extensio ii libxxf86vm11:1.0.1-2 X11 XFree86 video mode extension l ii xscreensaver-data 5.04-4data files to be shared among scre Versions of packages xscreensaver recommends: ii libjpeg-progs 6b-14 Programs for manipulating JPEG fil ii perl [perl5] 5.8.8-12 Larry Wall's Practical Extraction ii wamerican [wordlist] 6-2.1 American English dictionary words ii xli1.17.0+20061110-2 command line tool for viewing imag -- no debconf information -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
