Re: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:43:43 +0100, Loïc Minier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 

>  I don't see why the Debian menu would be so special that it would
>  require me to maintain menu entries in parallel to the .desktop
>  files.

Because as a Debian maintainer of gnome programs that work
 even when you are not using gnome, you are not just supporting people
 who use gnome, you are supporting _all_ Debian users.

Not all of us are using window managers that grok .desktop
 entries.  Indeed, I would think that instead of having gnome menus,
 kde menus, and Debian menus, we should dump the first two before we
 dump the latter, since the Debian menu is something that we control,
 and is something that benefits _all_ Debian users, not just a subset.

manoj
-- 
What is now proved was once only imagin'd. William Blake
Manoj Srivastava <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
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Re: localisation in system wide daemons

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:15:50 +0100, Michelle Konzack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 

> Am 2007-01-12 07:16:12, schrieb Christian Perrier:
>> > I do not like to see Debian doing the same thing...
>> 
>> 
>> You mean doing what's needed to be by default accessible to people
>> who don't speak English if they did choose to install in another
>> language than English?
>> 
>> Could you explain us your perception of the harm caused by this?

> This peoples will ask you for help and send all the logfiles maybe
> in arabic, hindu or africaan.

Hindu is an adjective that describes someone whose faith is
 hinduism. It is not a language.

manoj
-- 
Drop that pickle!
Manoj Srivastava <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
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Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Rafael Laboissiere]

* Steinar H. Gunderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-01-17 14:37]:

> On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 11:07:51AM +0100, Gürkan Sengün wrote:
> >  This provides a unified and easy to use interface to modern PDF sets. It 
> >  is designed to work not only with individual PDF sets but also with the 
> > more recent multiple "error" sets.
> 
> Could you please explain what a PDF is in this context? I assumed it had to
> do with the Portable Document Format (.pdf), but after reading the
> description it looks more like something used for statistics...

It means "Parton Distribution Function", a concept used in High Energy
Physics.  This definition must appear in the package description, otherwise
users will get confused.
 
-- 
Rafael


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Andreas Tille]

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007, Jeff Carr wrote:


You've hit the nail on the head. That whole thing came about from
earlier times. I wish you every luck in purging it from existence.


Uhm - sometimes things from earlier times are not that bad.  I hope
that you will not send an assassin to the menu maintainer (and those
who adopt menu in case you really do). ;-)

Kind regards

Andreas.

--
http://fam-tille.de


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Re: xpm menu icon requirement. Was: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Drew Parsons]

Josselin Mouette wrote:
> Le mardi 16 janvier 2007 à 02:46 +0100, Luca Capello a écrit :
> >Is there a practical reason for requesting xpm icons?  No need to
> >explain if an answer already exists, but I cannot find it.
> 
> This is because some menu systems don't understand other formats.


Can you identify who these other menu systems or window managers are? 

I've never been successful at locating one that 
a) does use menu icons, and
b) cannot use non-xpm formats.

We have window managers whose menu does not use any icons, but of the
ones that do use icons, they all appear to support png as well as xpm.

As far as I can tell the xpm policy requirement comes from a previous
era when the new formats (png or otherwise) did not yet exist.  I don't
believe the constraint is needed anymore in 2007.

I would love to have my enlightenment increased.

Drew

Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[David Nusinow]

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 09:47:16AM +, Ross Burton wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 00:42 -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> > Supposedly a gnome program will run under KDE.  Right?
> > 
> > How will a KDE user find it, if not through the Debian menu system?
> 
> GNOME and KDE use the same menu system, so unless a desktop file is
> marked OnlyShowIn=GNOME, it will appear in the KDE menus.

Are they still using the same categories to fill their menus? Last time I
checked, I had to use two different categories in the .desktop to make sure
my app's menu entry actually wound up in both KDE and Gnome's menus at all.
It's been a few years since I did this, but if it's the same situation,
it's still a problem.

 - David Nusinow


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Bug#407380: ITP: xfce4-eyes-plugin -- eyes plugin for Xfce panel

[Yves-Alexis Perez]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Debian Xfce Maintainers 


* Package name: xfce4-eyes-plugin
  Version : 4.4.0
  Upstream Authors: Benedikt Meurer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Danny Milosavljevic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Nick Schermer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

* URL : http://goodies.xfce.org
* License : GPLv2
  Programming Lang: C
  Description : eyes plugin for Xfce panel

 eyes is a xfce4 panel plugin that adds eyes which watch your every
 step.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: 4.0
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (500, 'testing'), (500, 'stable'), (1, 
'experimental')
Architecture: powerpc (ppc)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.19.1
Locale: LANG=fr_FR.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=fr_FR.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)


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Re: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Jeff Carr]

On 01/16/07 20:22, Steve Langasek wrote:

> Thus their goal is to help win market share, 

That's an important goal.

Have you heard this before: the fear is that not gaining significant
market share will allow Microsoft to effectively render free software
unusable by the average user.

> not to help make users more productive, 

Also an important goal.

> and should be shunned as 

One could send better ideas to the marketing people...

> the near-sighted marketing 

Trying to win market share from Microsoft takes far-forward thinking.

crap they really are.

Let's hope some gems show up in the rough.


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Jon Dowland]

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 02:08:52PM -0800, Jeff Carr wrote:
> On 01/17/07 00:22, Lo?c Minier wrote:
> 
> > The Debian menu system is completely useless to me, and
> > I expect to most GNOME and KDE users.
> 
> You've hit the nail on the head. That whole thing came
> about from earlier times. I wish you every luck in purging
> it from existence.

There are non-KDE and non-GNOME users to cater for. A
unified menu scheme across all menu-carrying applications
(and not the lip-service which is paid to it atm with the
Debian sub-menus in KDE and GNOME) is a worthy goal.


-- 
Jon Dowland


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Jeff Carr]

On 01/17/07 00:22, Loïc Minier wrote:

> The Debian menu system is completely useless to me, and I expect to
> most GNOME and KDE users.

You've hit the nail on the head. That whole thing came about from
earlier times. I wish you every luck in purging it from existence.


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Michael Biebl]

Ross Burton wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 00:42 -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
>> Supposedly a gnome program will run under KDE.  Right?
>>
>> How will a KDE user find it, if not through the Debian menu system?
> 
> GNOME and KDE use the same menu system, so unless a desktop file is
> marked OnlyShowIn=GNOME, it will appear in the KDE menus.

Not only Gnome and KDE, but any fd.o compliant [1] desktop environment.
Which ttbomk is at least Gnome,KDE and Xfce these days.

Michael

[1] http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/latest/


-- 
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universe are pointed away from Earth?



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Bug#407346: ITP: magicor -- puzzle game in the spirit of solomon's key

[Xavier Oswald]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Xavier Oswald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: magicor
  Version : 1.0
  Upstream Author : peter gebauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://magicor.sf.net/
* License : Public domain 
  Description : puzzle game in the spirit of solomon's key

 Magicor is a small puzzle game similar to the old NES classic
 solomon's key. You control tux the penguin and create ice blocks
 to extinguish all fires on each map.
 
 Homepage: http://magicor.sf.net/

-- System Information:
Debian Release: 3.1
Architecture: powerpc (ppc)
Kernel: Linux 2.6.8-powerpc
Locale: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] (charmap=ISO-8859-15)


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Re: X-Debbugs- headers (was Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface)

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007, Luis Rodrigo Gallardo Cruz wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 10:37:13AM -0800, Don Armstrong wrote:
> > You can use any of the X-Debbugs-... headers in the psuedoheaders,
> > but they must be prefixed with X-Debbugs-. The converse is not true.
> 
> Sorry, I got lost here. Is the converse 'non-prefixed non-x-debbugs
> headers cannot be used' ?

The converse is that you cannot put psuedoheaders in the real headers.
[Although, your converse is correct.]
 

Don Armstrong

-- 
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity. 
 -- Robert Heinlein

http://www.donarmstrong.com  http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Re: X-Debbugs- headers (was Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface)

[Luis Rodrigo Gallardo Cruz]

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 10:37:13AM -0800, Don Armstrong wrote:
> You can use any of the X-Debbugs-... headers in the psuedoheaders,
> but they must be prefixed with X-Debbugs-. The converse is not true.

Sorry, I got lost here. Is the converse 'non-prefixed non-x-debbugs
headers cannot be used' ?

-- 
Rodrigo Gallardo
GPG-Fingerprint: 7C81 E60C 442E 8FBC D975  2F49 0199 8318 ADC9 BC28
Zenophobia: the irrational fear of convergent sequences.


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Re: Rebirth of Status of Maintainer's packages and bugs and more

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007, Yaroslav Halchenko wrote:
> So, now my silly question follows, isn't there any way to get
> read-only access to at least BTS on some lower level (eg direct
> access to DB) to implement more efficient querying of the data?

There is a soap interface which enables you to access some of the
information which is available on the BTS. You can also easily get
acess to the raw data using rsync from merkel.

See #377520 et al.


Don Armstrong

-- 
Identical parts aren't.
 -- Beach's Law

http://www.donarmstrong.com  http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Re: X-Debbugs- headers (was Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface)

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007, Luca Capello wrote:
> Never tested, but FWIU in the page I linked [1], you can use the
> pseudo-headers [2]. So, again, never tested, something like the
> following should do the work:
> =
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: ITP foo -- a bar viewer
> 
> Package: wnpp
> Severity: wishlist
> CC: debian-devel@lists.debian.org

This is incorrect. You need to use

X-Debbugs-Cc: debian-devel@lists.debian.org

You can use any of the X-Debbugs-... headers in the psuedoheaders,
but they must be prefixed with X-Debbugs-. The converse is not true.


Don Armstrong

-- 
I'd never hurt another living thing.
But if I did...
It would be you.
 -- Chris Bishop  http://www.chrisbishop.com/her/archives/her69.html

http://www.donarmstrong.com  http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Re: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Greg Folkert]

On Tue, 2007-01-16 at 20:22 -0800, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 16, 2007 at 05:55:53PM +0100, Michael Banck wrote:
> > On Tue, Jan 16, 2007 at 05:22:51PM +0100, Tim Dijkstra wrote:
> > > On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:03:15 +0100
> > > Loïc Minier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > >  Just FYI, I *personally* would prefer an evince entry in the menu as
> > > >  well, but I prefer keeping close to the usability policy defined by
> > > >  upstream.
> 
> > > Well we shouldn't keep ourselves hostage of stupid upstream behaviour,
> > > should we?
> 
> > Contrary to us, GNOME (in this case RedHat) actually employs usability
> > experts.  Who are we to think we know better?
> 
> Real users with brains, instead of the idealized "ooh I'm afraid of
> computers eek a mouse kill it kill it!!!" novice idiots who are the
> exclusive target of all modern usability testing?

How dare you spake badly of the glorious teachings of the exalted Havoc
Pennington. SANE DEFAULTS!

> All computer usability studies I've seen in the past 4 or so years have
> focused entirely on how a user who has never seen the interface before is
> able to accomplish tasks, with no consideration given to the long-term
> efficiency of the interfaces that happen to have the lowest initial learning
> curve.  Thus their goal is to help win market share, not to help make users
> more productive, and should be shunned as the near-sighted marketing crap
> they really are.

Praise $YOUR_DEITY! There is another that feels this way. It is also
evident others do as well, because of much the customization stuff that
used to be in Gnome 1.4, is being brought back using all these new
add-ons, being window managers and effects adders, coloring styles
controls, window placement based on what they do... etc.

> Cheers :),

Indeed. Cheers!
-- 
greg, [EMAIL PROTECTED]

The technology that is
Stronger, better, faster:  Linux


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Thomas Bushnell BSG]

On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 10:37 +0100, Loïc Minier wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 17, 2007, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> > Unless I'm confused, this is what makefiles are for.  How much trouble
> > is it to set it up, which must only be done once?
> 
>  Why convert it at build time?  Can't update-menus do it only when it's
>  needed (i.e. the menu display only supports XPM)?  And even if it's
>  done at build time, I see no reason each individual maintainer would
>  reinvent the same .desktop -> .menu snippet, and why hundreds of
>  packages would maintain a different snippet or a copy of the same
>  snippet.

I have no objection to update-menu doing it, but it doesn't right now,
and we are supposed to implement policy as it is, not as we dream it
would be if it were better.

As for the second part, yes, this is what debhelper is for.  A snippet
could presumably be put together without much trouble.

Thomas



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Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Adam D. Barratt]

Hendrik Sattler wrote:
> Am Mittwoch 17 Januar 2007 12:34 schrieb Luca Capello:
>> Please the next time use the X-Debbugs-CC: header [1] instead of
[...]
> Will b.d.o accept those headers in the first lines of a mail body?

Yes (at least, it should).

See #179340 against debbugs, currently flagged as pending (which generally
means it's deployed on bugs.d.o but isn't in a released debbugs package).

Adam


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Re: Problema no Debian 3.1

[Santiago Vila]

Douglas Costa wrote:

> Estou com um probleminha no meu Debian 3.1, quando vou tentar mudar
> as preferência do plano de fundo da a seguinte mensagem de erro. ( O
> programa "gnome-background-properties" terminou inesperadamente.
> Você pode informar aos desenvolvedores sobre o que aconteceu para
> ajudá-los a corrigir isso. Ou você pode reiniciar o programa agora
> mesmo.) Portando quando reinicio o programa e tento novamente da
> mesma mensagem novamente.

Please do *all* of the following things:

* Disable HTML email.
* Try [EMAIL PROTECTED]
* Don't spam us. You have sent your message to 6 addresses, no less!
  Please don't do that. Most of them will be unable to help you.

Thanks.

ITP: vdr-plugin-subtitles -- provides DVB subtitles display for VDR (was Re: Bug#407319: ITP: 1 -- VDR plugin to download and display weather maps and forecasts)

[Timo Aaltonen]

ok, something weird happened in my head, here's a corrected version:


Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Debian VDR Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

* Package name: vdr-plugin-subtitles
  Version : 0.4.0
  Upstream Author : Pekka Virtanen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://virtanen.org/vdr/subtitles/
* License : GPL
  Description : provides DVB subtitles display for VDR

vdr-subtitles is a plugin for VDR which will display DVB subtitles on
either live TV or recorded programmes.


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Bug#407330: ITP: vdr-plugin-weatherng -- VDR plugin to download and display weather maps and forecasts

[Timo Aaltonen]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Debian VDR Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: vdr-plugin-weatherng
  Version : 0.0.7pre2
  Upstream Author : Sascha Bajonczak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.glaserei-franz.de/VDR/Moronimo2/vdrplugins.htm
* License : GPL
  Description : VDR plugin to download and display weather maps and 
forecasts

This plugin can download weather maps and forecast from the Internet and
display them on VDR's OSD.


-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers dapper-updates
  APT policy: (500, 'dapper-updates'), (500, 'dapper-security'), (500, 
'dapper-backports'), (500, 'dapper')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.15-27-686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=fi_FI.ISO8859-1 (charmap=ISO-8859-1)


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Problema no Debian 3.1

[Douglas Costa]

Boa tarde à todos.

Estou com um probleminha no meu Debian 3.1, quando vou tentar mudar as 
preferência do plano de fundo da a seguinte mensagem de erro. ( O programa 
"gnome-background-properties" terminou inesperadamente. 
Você pode informar aos desenvolvedores sobre o que aconteceu para ajudá-los a 
corrigir isso. Ou você pode reiniciar o programa agora mesmo.) Portando 
quando reinicio o programa e tento novamente da mesma mensagem novamente.

Se alguém puder por gentileza me dar uma dica para solucionar esse problema.

Desde de agradeço atenção.

Obrigado!

Tenha uma Boa Tarde!


-- 
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Humanist Sistemas Ltda
Tel.: (12) 3928-5000
Fax.: (12) 3928-5001
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Bug#407327: ITP: vdr-plugin-lcdproc -- Plugin for vdr that connects to lcdproc

[Timo Aaltonen]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Debian VDR Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: vdr-plugin-lcdproc
  Version : 0.0.10
  Upstream Author : Martin Hammerschmid <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://home.pages.at/linux/dvb.html
* License : GPL
  Description : Plugin for vdr that connects to lcdproc

This plugin for VDR allows it to connect to lcdproc and output
information on supported devices.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers dapper-updates
  APT policy: (500, 'dapper-updates'), (500, 'dapper-security'), (500, 
'dapper-backports'), (500, 'dapper')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.15-27-686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=fi_FI.ISO8859-1 (charmap=ISO-8859-1)


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Bug#407323: ITP: vdr-plugin-ttxtsubs -- Teletext subtitle plugin for VDR

[Timo Aaltonen]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Debian VDR Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: vdr-plugin-ttxtsubs
  Version : 0.0.5
  Upstream Author : Ragnar Sundblad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.nada.kth.se/~ragge/vdr/ttxtsubs/
* License : GPL
  Description : Teletext subtitle plugin for VDR

This plugin implements displaying, recording and replaying teletext
based subtitles using the on screen display.


-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers dapper-updates
  APT policy: (500, 'dapper-updates'), (500, 'dapper-security'), (500, 
'dapper-backports'), (500, 'dapper')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.15-27-686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=fi_FI.ISO8859-1 (charmap=ISO-8859-1)


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Bug#407319: ITP: 1 -- VDR plugin to download and display weather maps and forecasts

[Timo Aaltonen]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Debian VDR Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: vdr-plugin-subtitles
  Version : 0.4.0
  Upstream Author : Pekka Virtanen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://virtanen.org/vdr/subtitles/
* License : GPL
  Description : VDR plugin to download and display weather maps and 
forecasts

vdr-subtitles is a plugin for vdr which will display DVB subtitles on
either live TV or recorded programmes.



-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers dapper-updates
  APT policy: (500, 'dapper-updates'), (500, 'dapper-security'), (500, 
'dapper-backports'), (500, 'dapper')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.15-27-686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=fi_FI.ISO8859-1 (charmap=ISO-8859-1)


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Quick Question

[info]

My name is Raven and I run http://www.myairshoes.com/ which is a website
with fashion & sneaker info on it. I was browsing online and I somehow
stumbled upon this page of your website:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2003/09/msg01009.html . I was quite
impressed with your website and would like to add it to my links page.

Some website owners do not like when other sites link to them so I thought I
might ask first. I think the information on your website could be useful to
my visitors; and unlike many other websites online your site was quite
appealing to me. Please get back to me when you have a chance. Thanks.

Raven 

Re: Rebirth of Status of Maintainer's packages and bugs and more

[Yaroslav Halchenko]

Hi Everyone,

I really liked the karma page
http://io.debian.net/~tar/bugstats/?filter

and was upset to see that it is not updated regularly. So bothered
Gürkan to discover that the main reason seems to be the necessity to
fetch thousands of pages from debian BTS system and others, which places
a lot of burden on the network and local resources to temporarily store
the results for processing.

So, now my silly question follows, isn't there any way to get read-only
access to at least BTS on some lower level (eg direct access to
DB) to implement more efficient querying of the data?

On Tue, 25 Apr 2006, Gürkan Sengün wrote:

> Hello

> I was missing Edds' karma page [1] when it wasn't updated anymore.
> But many months later also Kitames' [2] package status page [3] disappeared.
> That was too much for my heart and I made my own combining the two things,
> trowing in homepage URL, IRC nickname and cute photos of your Debian
> Maintainer people. There's alot of more space left for more statistics
> and information on the page, I am open to suggestions (and their 
> implementations).
> Thanks to Aurelien Jarno for allowing me to run/host this on his Debian
> GNU/kFreeBSD porter machine[5].

> You can grep for emails using a link like 
> http://io.debian.net/~tar/bugstats/?filter

> As DD you can add your nickname/photo by putting your nickname to
> http://db.debian.org/ and /msg tarzeau your email address (on freenode).
> As non-DD just /msg me your email address with the usual nickname.

> To add photos as DD it's probably the easiest to login to the
> Debian GNU/kFreeBSD porter machine [6] and put a 128x128 photo of you
> in your $HOME named [EMAIL PROTECTED], for non-DD it's probably best
> to send me an URL to the ready made photo by IRC.

> I've thought of fields like, last activity seen (by days), or bug
> statistics showing total bugs open/archived and changes per day/week,
> any takers?

> [1] http://www.linuks.mine.nu/karma.txt
> [2] http://lists.debian.org/debian-www/2006/02/msg00087.html
> [3] 
> http://web.archive.org/web/20050307102945/http://www.debian.gr.jp/~kitame/maint.cgi
> [4] http://io.debian.net/~tar/bugstats/
> [5] http://io.debian.net/
> [6] http://io.debian.net/ssh.html

> Yours,
> Gürkan

> Please Cc: me.
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Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Steinar H. Gunderson]

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007 at 11:07:51AM +0100, Gürkan Sengün wrote:
>  This provides a unified and easy to use interface to modern PDF sets. It 
>  is designed to work not only with individual PDF sets but also with the 
> more recent multiple "error" sets.

Could you please explain what a PDF is in this context? I assumed it had to
do with the Portable Document Format (.pdf), but after reading the
description it looks more like something used for statistics...

/* Steinar */
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X-Debbugs- headers (was Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface)

[Luca Capello]

Hello!

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:24:53 +0100, Martin Wuertele wrote:
> * Hendrik Sattler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-01-17 13:17]:
>
>> Will b.d.o accept those headers in the first lines of a mail body?
>> E.g. reportbug and kmail do not really work together (one of them
>> must get smarter) and I didn't find a way to add custom headers for
>> the _current_ mail only in kmail, yet.
>  
> http://email.about.com/cs/kmailtips/qt/et032904.htm - one of the
> first hits with google...

Never tested, but FWIU in the page I linked [1], you can use the
pseudo-headers [2].  So, again, never tested, something like the
following should do the work:
=
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: ITP foo -- a bar viewer

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
CC: debian-devel@lists.debian.org
=

If this is not correct, I think the above linked page should be
corrected, at least when referring to the general X-Debbugs- headers.

Thx, bye,
Gismo / Luca

Footnotes: 
[1] http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting#miscpseudoheaders
[2] http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting#pseudoheader


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Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Hendrik Sattler]

Am Mittwoch 17 Januar 2007 13:24 schrieb Martin Wuertele:
> * Hendrik Sattler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-01-17 13:17]:
> > Will b.d.o accept those headers in the first lines of a mail body?
> > E.g. reportbug and kmail do not really work together (one of them must
> > get smarter) and I didn't find a way to add custom headers for the
> > _current_ mail only in kmail, yet.
>
> http://email.about.com/cs/kmailtips/qt/et032904.htm - one of the first
> hits with google...

That's for _all_ messages that I send and the reason why I 
underlined "current" in my last message ;)

HS


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Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Martin Wuertele]

* Hendrik Sattler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-01-17 13:17]:

> Will b.d.o accept those headers in the first lines of a mail body?
> E.g. reportbug and kmail do not really work together (one of them must get 
> smarter) and I didn't find a way to add custom headers for the _current_ mail 
> only in kmail, yet.
 
http://email.about.com/cs/kmailtips/qt/et032904.htm - one of the first
hits with google...

yours Martin
-- 
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 wenn ich openoffice installiere, dann sind meine briefe auch 
noch nicht geschrieben.


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Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Hendrik Sattler]

Am Mittwoch 17 Januar 2007 12:34 schrieb Luca Capello:
> Please the next time use the X-Debbugs-CC: header [1] instead of
> directly writing to d-d so the ITP will be sent to debian-devel only
> after a number has been assigned to the bug (and if any one wants to
> answer to the bug, he doesn't need to search for the correct bug
> number).

Will b.d.o accept those headers in the first lines of a mail body?
E.g. reportbug and kmail do not really work together (one of them must get 
smarter) and I didn't find a way to add custom headers for the _current_ mail 
only in kmail, yet.

HS


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Re: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Sebastian Heinlein]

Quoting Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:


On Tue, Jan 16, 2007 at 05:55:53PM +0100, Michael Banck wrote:

On Tue, Jan 16, 2007 at 05:22:51PM +0100, Tim Dijkstra wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:03:15 +0100
> Loïc Minier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >  Just FYI, I *personally* would prefer an evince entry in the menu as
> >  well, but I prefer keeping close to the usability policy defined by
> >  upstream.



> Well we shouldn't keep ourselves hostage of stupid upstream behaviour,
> should we?



Contrary to us, GNOME (in this case RedHat) actually employs usability
experts.  Who are we to think we know better?


Real users with brains, instead of the idealized "ooh I'm afraid of
computers eek a mouse kill it kill it!!!" novice idiots who are the
exclusive target of all modern usability testing?

All computer usability studies I've seen in the past 4 or so years have
focused entirely on how a user who has never seen the interface before is
able to accomplish tasks, with no consideration given to the long-term
efficiency of the interfaces that happen to have the lowest inital learning
curve.  Thus their goal is to help win market share, not to help make users
more productive, and should be shunned as the near-sighted marketing crap
they really are.


You have also to take a look how efficient a way is. Finding a menu entry in a
long list is quite ineffcient (Fitts' law). Compare the two menus in
Debian and
Ubuntu.

Even the long term user has to scan the complete menu to find a special entry
every time. So it also makes sense to reduce it to the real important entries.
Why should I always see the perhaps never used Esd barometer when I want to
launch a multimedia related app?

Furthermore it would be nice if you speak about other people and their
work more
respectfully.

Cheers,

Sebastian


This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.

Re: ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Luca Capello]

Hello!

Please the next time use the X-Debbugs-CC: header [1] instead of
directly writing to d-d so the ITP will be sent to debian-devel only
after a number has been assigned to the bug (and if any one wants to
answer to the bug, he doesn't need to search for the correct bug
number).

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:07:51 +0100, Gürkan Sengün wrote:
> * Package name: lhapdf
[...]
> * URL : http://projects.hepforge.org/lhapdf/

There's a problem with the upstream URL, tested on two machines with
different Internet connections:
=
Forbidden

You don't have permission to access /lhapdf on this server.

Additionally, a 403 Forbidden error was encountered while trying to
use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.
=

Thx, bye,
Gismo / Luca

Footnotes: 
[1] http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting, section "Sending copies of
bug reports to other addresses"


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Re: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Tim Dijkstra]

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:28:06 +0100
Josselin Mouette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Having eog and evince in the menu serves the "I want to look at a file I
> know I have on my disk" case. But you can open the file in the same
> number of clicks but with a better interface, by launching a nautilus
> window. You can get it even faster if it's still in the "recently used"
> menu.

I would say lots of people are used to think in the following way:

I want to open file `foo'.
Start program that handles file `foo'.
Open file `foo'

This works with files that you can edit (abiword files) and those you
can't (pdf). A distinction between the two is IMHO artificial.

Why not facilitate people that work like this and have one more entry
in the menu?

I would say there is even a better case for having evince in the menu
then for eog. eog opens files you can edit with programs like gimp,
while for evince there is no alternative `editor'.

grts Tim


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ITP: lhapdf -- Les Houches Accord PDF Interface

[Gürkan Sengün]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: lhapdf
 Version : 5.2.3
 Upstream Authors : Mike Whalley, W. Giele, and D. Bourilkov and C. Group
* URL : http://projects.hepforge.org/lhapdf/
* License : GNU GPL 2
 Description : Les Houches Accord PDF Interface
 This provides a unified and easy to use interface to modern PDF sets. It is 
designed to work not only with individual PDF sets but also with the more recent 
multiple "error" sets. It can be viewed as the successor to PDFLIB, incorporating 
many of the older sets found in the latter, including pion and photon PDFs. In 
LHAPDF the computer code and input parameters/grids are separated thus allowing 
more easy updating and no limit to the expansion possibilities. The code and data 
sets can be downloaded together or inidivually as desired. From version 4.1 
onwards a configuration script facilitates the installation of LHAPDF.


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Ross Burton]

On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 00:42 -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Supposedly a gnome program will run under KDE.  Right?
> 
> How will a KDE user find it, if not through the Debian menu system?

GNOME and KDE use the same menu system, so unless a desktop file is
marked OnlyShowIn=GNOME, it will appear in the KDE menus.

Ross
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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Loïc Minier]

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Unless I'm confused, this is what makefiles are for.  How much trouble
> is it to set it up, which must only be done once?

 Why convert it at build time?  Can't update-menus do it only when it's
 needed (i.e. the menu display only supports XPM)?  And even if it's
 done at build time, I see no reason each individual maintainer would
 reinvent the same .desktop -> .menu snippet, and why hundreds of
 packages would maintain a different snippet or a copy of the same
 snippet.

 But yeah, this is what Makefiles are for.

> This does not excuse you, as a Debian maintainer, from conforming to the
> Debian menu policy, which is designed for more than just GNOME.

 I never said it would excuse me, I sometimes add menu entries, I often
 update them, and I also fix them (check the evince upload I just did).
 I never said I won't conform with the policy, I said I considered it
 painful and stupid work for a useless (to me) result.

 I'm also taking patches.

>refuse to do
> anything more.

 Where did I refuse to do anything more?  I said this was low priority.

> >  No, but in some use cases they are mutually exclusive.  The Debian menu
> >  system is completely useless to me, and I expect to most GNOME and KDE
> >  users.  I'm not saying we should drop it since I can't claim it's
> >  useless for everybody.  I am saying that the fact it is useless to me
> >  and to most of the users of the GNOME packages I maintain doesn't call
> >  for a good maintenance of the menu entries of these packages; and I am
> >  proposing technical ways to solve this.
> Supposedly a gnome program will run under KDE.  Right?
> How will a KDE user find it, if not through the Debian menu system?

 This is a wholy different story, by default .desktop entries are
 included in both.  In fact, .desktop file support is more advanced than
 Debian menu on the matter since we even have mechanisms to remove GNOME
 programs from the KDE menu.

-- 
Loïc Minier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


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Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Thomas Bushnell BSG]

On Wed, 2007-01-17 at 09:22 +0100, Loïc Minier wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 17, 2007, Charles Plessy wrote:
> > am I wrong or one can have foo.png in foo.desktop, and foo.xpm in
> > foo.menu? If upstream does not provide an xpm icon, the "convert"
> > command of the imagemagick package can easily create one at build time.
> 
>  My point is that I shouldn't have to maintain both, or to run convert
>  each time this is necessary.

Unless I'm confused, this is what makefiles are for.  How much trouble
is it to set it up, which must only be done once?

>  "Reinventing the wheel" was perhaps not the best way to describe the
>  problem; I wanted to point out that the Debian meny system has
>  antediluvian requirements and duplicates the functionality of the GNOME
>  menu for me.  I suggested the Debian menu system would handle or import
>  the data from the .desktop files instead of requiring me to do it
>  manually.

This does not excuse you, as a Debian maintainer, from conforming to the
Debian menu policy, which is designed for more than just GNOME.  I agree
completely that something better could be found to integrate them, but
that's not at all the same question.  A Debian maintainer's job is *not*
just to package things the way upstream normally does, and refuse to do
anything more.

>  No, but in some use cases they are mutually exclusive.  The Debian menu
>  system is completely useless to me, and I expect to most GNOME and KDE
>  users.  I'm not saying we should drop it since I can't claim it's
>  useless for everybody.  I am saying that the fact it is useless to me
>  and to most of the users of the GNOME packages I maintain doesn't call
>  for a good maintenance of the menu entries of these packages; and I am
>  proposing technical ways to solve this.

Supposedly a gnome program will run under KDE.  Right?

How will a KDE user find it, if not through the Debian menu system?

Thomas



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Re: Bugs in default GNOME etch?

[Josselin Mouette]

Le mardi 16 janvier 2007 à 20:22 -0800, Steve Langasek a écrit :
> Real users with brains, instead of the idealized "ooh I'm afraid of
> computers eek a mouse kill it kill it!!!" novice idiots who are the
> exclusive target of all modern usability testing?
> 
> All computer usability studies I've seen in the past 4 or so years have
> focused entirely on how a user who has never seen the interface before is
> able to accomplish tasks, with no consideration given to the long-term
> efficiency of the interfaces that happen to have the lowest inital learning
> curve.  Thus their goal is to help win market share, not to help make users
> more productive, and should be shunned as the near-sighted marketing crap
> they really are.

Instead of wondering who is a usability expert and who is not, which
won't lead anywhere, the real question is: what use case does this or
that feature solve, and how to improve this use case, for both novice
and expert users?

Having eog and evince in the menu serves the "I want to look at a file I
know I have on my disk" case. But you can open the file in the same
number of clicks but with a better interface, by launching a nautilus
window. You can get it even faster if it's still in the "recently used"
menu.

In all cases, the most important problem here is that eog is in the menu
while evince is not. Inconsistency is the worst usability problem, and
it is also easily fixed.
-- 
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: :' :  We are debian.org. Lower your prices, surrender your code.
`. `'   We will add your hardware and software distinctiveness to
  `-our own. Resistance is futile.

Re: Icons and instructions for the FreeDesktop menu.

[Loïc Minier]

On Wed, Jan 17, 2007, Charles Plessy wrote:
> am I wrong or one can have foo.png in foo.desktop, and foo.xpm in
> foo.menu? If upstream does not provide an xpm icon, the "convert"
> command of the imagemagick package can easily create one at build time.

 My point is that I shouldn't have to maintain both, or to run convert
 each time this is necessary.

> Also, I have the impression that the Debian menu system is not a
> reinvented wheel, but an old wheel kept in the car in case it is needed.

 "Reinventing the wheel" was perhaps not the best way to describe the
 problem; I wanted to point out that the Debian meny system has
 antediluvian requirements and duplicates the functionality of the GNOME
 menu for me.  I suggested the Debian menu system would handle or import
 the data from the .desktop files instead of requiring me to do it
 manually.

> Both systems are not in competition in my opinion.

 No, but in some use cases they are mutually exclusive.  The Debian menu
 system is completely useless to me, and I expect to most GNOME and KDE
 users.  I'm not saying we should drop it since I can't claim it's
 useless for everybody.  I am saying that the fact it is useless to me
 and to most of the users of the GNOME packages I maintain doesn't call
 for a good maintenance of the menu entries of these packages; and I am
 proposing technical ways to solve this.

> Lastly, as a maintainer of packages wich are not part of a
> FreeDesktop-compatible suite, I would welcome instructions about where
> and when registering an application in the FreeDesktop menu. Or even
> better, a policy.

 There are specs on the .desktop file format on the freedesktop.org
 website.  I don't think we need to have a policy in Debian to map it
 one to one, nor should we impose all packages to ship .desktop files:
 it would cause the exact same problem I'm complaining about.

 Beside, if I understand the point of the menu-xdg package, it will do
 the job of exposing your menu entries (I suppose with approximations
 and ugly icons) to FreeDesktop compliant desktop environments.

> Not being a user of this menu, I have a hard time guessing what users
> expect.

 This probably means that you understand my position on Debian menu. :)

-- 
Loïc Minier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


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