Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Johannes Schauer Marin Rodrigues]

Quoting Simon McVittie (2021-04-04 13:55:21)
> On Sun, 04 Apr 2021 at 13:23:14 +0200, Joerg Jaspert wrote:
> > On 16093 March 1977, Dominik George wrote:
> > > That surprised me. If a package is free software, in ful laccordance
> > > with the DFSG, why is it put into contrib?
> > 
> > There is, as usual, no clear answer.
> > 
> > The policy for main is clear on that it needs to be self contained. So
> > software in main must not require something outside to work and do its job.
> > Contrib is the area where that is allowed. License wise its the same as
> > main, but it allows to depend on something not available for building or
> > working.
> 
> There was some discussion relevant to this on debian-devel-games earlier
> this year: the subthread starts at
> .
> 
> I don't think the rule can be as simple as "must not require something
> outside to work and do its job", because we have Free clients for non-Free
> network services (like all the instant messaging services that used to
> exist), and those were always in main. Similarly, it would be absurd to
> kick out email clients into contrib just because they are primarily used
> to read non-Free email messages like this one! :-)
> 
> As I mentioned on d-d-games, one of the major things I tend to ask myself
> when thinking about the borderline between main and contrib is: if the
> content that this package downloads was somehow in the Debian archive,
> would the downloader have a Depends or Recommends on it, or would it be
> a Suggests or no dependency at all?
> 
> Another factor in choosing main or contrib, for me, is whether the
> downloader is specifically hard-coded to work with particular content,
> or whether it generically works with any content in a particular
> format. game-data-packager and quakespasm are both close to the main/contrib
> borderline, and this factor is why I think they are in the correct archive
> areas: g-d-p downloads and repackages specific non-Free games, so it's
> in contrib, whereas quakespasm can play any Free or non-Free set of
> Quake-compatible levels, so it's in main.
> 
> I think winetricks is *probably* correctly in contrib, because it has
> hard-coded knowledge of how to best to download and install specific
> non-Free Windows DLLs? Like game-data-packager, it's quite close to the
> line between main and contrib, but I think it does make sense to consider
> it to be on the contrib side of that line (although I'm sure I could be
> convinced otherwise).
> 
> As Joerg says, this is all fairly subjective and unclear, but I think we
> do have an approximately coherent policy for what can and can't be in main,
> and that's realistically the best thing we are going to get.

another way to answer the question is to find some software similar to the one
that you want to package and see if that software is in Debian main or in
contrib. If it is in main, then at least one DD and FTP master already agreed
that packages of that nature are fit for main.

Maybe the comparison to winetricks is not very fitting because I think
winetricks can *only* download non-free software while lutris can also download
games that their developers distribute under a DFSG license?

Let me show you a package of mine that is still in Debian main even though it
is a "downloader [that is] specifically hard-coded to work with particular
[non-free] content" and thus fails Simon's test from above:

https://packages.debian.org/source/unstable/rss-bridge

I guess most people will use that package to access non-free services like
Facebook, Instagram or YouTube. After all, rss-bridge was specifically written
to work around the limitations of these non-free services:

https://github.com/RSS-Bridge/rss-bridge/#rant

Should anybody ever file an RC bug against the package I will point out that it
is also able to work with DFSG free software like Mediawiki. Maybe you can do
the same?

Thanks!

cheers, josch

signature.asc
Description: signature

Re: About lintian

[Norbert Preining]

Hi Felix

thanks for the message and the web site. I have immediately tried it out
with a few packages of mine, as well as all of my packages. Indeed, that
took quite some time ;-)

Looks nice, but I am not sure how useful it will be for me, as I said, I
usually run lintian before uploading, so these tests and availability is
a bit too late for this purpose.

But OTOH, it helps working on lintian issues when doing new packages.

Thanks

Norbert

--
PREINING Norbert  https://www.preining.info
Fujitsu + IFMGA Guide + TU Wien + TeX Live + Debian Dev
GPG: 0x860CDC13   fp: F7D8 A928 26E3 16A1 9FA0 ACF0 6CAC A448 860C DC13

Accepted highwayhash 0~git20200803.9490b14-2 (source) into unstable

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Changed-By: Mo Zhou 
Closes: 986273
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Accepted zfs-linux 2.0.3-6 (source) into unstable

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Changed-By: Mo Zhou 
Closes: 986374 986380
Changes:
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 .
   [ наб ]
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Accepted slurm-wlm 20.11.5-1 (source) into unstable

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Accepted python-vttlib 0.10.0+dfsg-1 (source) into unstable

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Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[John Darrah]

Suppression of the discussion just makes it worse. It should be
discussed on every Debian list as the entire community has feelings in
this subject. Debian wouldn't exist without the entire community so why
would they not be part of the discussion.

Cheers.

-- jhd

On Sun, 2021-04-04 at 14:40 -0700, Jean-Philippe MENGUAL wrote:
> Hi guys,
> 
> Please stop replying. That is a troll, will be banned quickly, dont 
> maintain it alive. Just ignore, listmaster and bts will do what is 
> needed. Keep power for other more interesting things.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Le 04/04/2021 à 23:18, crazy.mo...@lavache.com a écrit :
> > 
> > If you don't want these ego-maniacs to use your name in their
> > vendettas 
> > you can resign from Debian.  This is the choice.  How many people
> > will 
> > resign if Debian votes to attack Stallman?  Please tell us before
> > the 
> > vote finishes so we call can know this now.
> > 
> > No matter the outcome of this vote.  Having the vote at all
> > suggests 
> > that people are expendable.  Volunteers can be hung over the side
> > of the 
> > ship while people have an email argument about what to do next.
> > 
> > Why don't you understand how toxic this is?
> > 
> > There are so many years of defamation in Debian now.  Delete it
> > all 
> > now.  Delete the negative options from the vote now.  Please stop
> > or we 
> > stop you.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > From: Stephan Lachnit 
> > > To: crazy.mo...@lavache.com
> > > Subject: Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is
> > > ***
> > > Date: 04/04/2021 22:38:20 Europe/Paris
> > > Cc: 986...@bugs.debian.org;
> > >debian-devel@lists.debian.org
> > > 
> > > > Why does the toxic woman want to destroy reputations?
> > > 
> > > If you refer to Jonathan Carter, that isn't even the person that
> > > started the vote, nor an original author of the open letter. Do
> > > your
> > > research, tbh to me it seems like you are a complete outsider.
> > > 
> > > > Destroy nobody - Or destroy everybody! You can't have it both
> > > > ways.
> > > 
> > > First of all, nobody wants to "destroy" RMS. Calling someone to
> > > resign
> > > isn't destroying them, especially if they were just (secretly)
> > > elected.
> > > 
> > > Secondly, why are you so toxic and want to "destroy" everybody?
> > > There
> > > is really no point, all you do is make the FLOSS community weaker
> > > and
> > > more divided. And since you seem to care about RMS and his ideas,
> > > I
> > > don't think that is something you would like.
> > > 
> > > > If Debian is a vehicle for defamation, every one of you faces
> > > > full 
> > > consequences.
> > > 
> > > Debian is a democracy. Assume one person votes in favor of RMS
> > > (which
> > > as you can see some people will do), why do you want them to face
> > > your
> > > alleged consequences? That doesn't make sense. They have no power
> > > to
> > > do the things you ask for. In fact, nobody in Debian has. Again,
> > > I
> > > don't think you understand the Debian project at all.
> > > 
> > > > Your jobs are the targets. Your families are targets.
> > > 
> > > I can understand that you are angry even if I don't agree with
> > > your
> > > views, but I don't think anyone here wants to harm RMS. Everyone
> > > here
> > > just wants the best for the FLOSS community. Why do you want to
> > > harm
> > > them so badly?
> > > 
> > > Opinions on how what's the best for the community may differ, but
> > > that's fine. Discussions are healthy, as long as they stay
> > > friendly
> > > (btw your mails aren't). I have learned a lot from discussions,
> > > and
> > > yes sometimes people (me included) get unfriendly or say things
> > > that
> > > turn out to be false. But as long as we apologize for mistakes,
> > > we can
> > > grow from it.
> > > 
> > > > No volunteer should have to suffer you toxic people
> > > 
> > > Don't you think, just maybe, that we shouldn't suffer from your
> > > toxicity as well? Especially since we will suffer much more than
> > > you
> > > can ever suffer from this. I mean, what's the worst that can
> > > happen
> > > from your point of view? RMS resigns again? Then everything would
> > > be
> > > just like a month ago.
> > > 
> > > Regards,
> > > Stephan
> 
> 

Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[Paul Sutton]

On 04/04/2021 22:38, Jean-Philippe MENGUAL wrote:

Hi guys,

Please stop replying. That is a troll, will be banned quickly, dont 
maintain it alive. Just ignore, listmaster and bts will do what is 
needed. Keep power for other more interesting things.


Regards



+1 to this,

I am on the free software foundation lists and have been involved in 
various conversations around code of conduct and related ideas to make 
sure that environments are free of abuse.


I have also worked in a school, and was subjected abuse, at the hands of 
children,  which was fobbed off by teachers.  So I am all for creating 
safe, non toxic environments to work in.


I support RMS, simply because he is a spokesperson for the free software 
and is passionate about that.  RMS is one person, one of thousands who 
write, develop and support free software.


It would be nice if we could just work together, regardless of which 
side we are on.   focus on what is important,  building free software 
and the best OS in the world, Debian of course, and building safe 
inclusive communities for all. :)


Regards

Paul


Le 04/04/2021 à 23:18, crazy.mo...@lavache.com a écrit :



If you don't want these ego-maniacs to use your name in their 
vendettas you can resign from Debian.  This is the choice.  How many 
people will resign if Debian votes to attack Stallman?  Please tell us 
before the vote finishes so we call can know this now.


No matter the outcome of this vote.  Having the vote at all suggests 
that people are expendable.  Volunteers can be hung over the side 
of 

the ship while people have an email argument about what to do next.

Why don't you understand how toxic this is?

There are so many years of defamation in Debian now.  Delete it all 
now.  Delete the negative options from the vote now.  Please 
stop or 

we stop you.




From: Stephan Lachnit 
To: crazy.mo...@lavache.com
Subject: Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is 
***

Date: 04/04/2021 22:38:20 Europe/Paris
Cc: 986...@bugs.debian.org;
   debian-devel@lists.debian.org

> Why does the toxic woman want to destroy reputations?

If you refer to Jonathan Carter, that isn't even the person that
started the vote, nor an original author of the open letter. Do your
research, tbh to me it seems like you are a complete outsider.

> Destroy nobody - Or destroy everybody! You can't have it both ways.

First of all, nobody wants to "destroy" RMS. Calling someone to resign
isn't destroying them, especially if they were just (secretly)
elected.

Secondly, why are you so toxic and want to "destroy" everybody? There
is really no point, all you do is make the FLOSS community weaker and
more divided. And since you seem to care about RMS and his ideas, I
don't think that is something you would like.

> If Debian is a vehicle for defamation, every one of you faces full 
consequences.


Debian is a democracy. Assume one person votes in favor of RMS (which
as you can see some people will do), why do you want them to face your
alleged consequences? That doesn't make sense. They have no power to
do the things you ask for. In fact, nobody in Debian has. Again, I
don't think you understand the Debian project at all.

> Your jobs are the targets. Your families are targets.

I can understand that you are angry even if I don't agree with your
views, but I don't think anyone here wants to harm RMS. Everyone here
just wants the best for the FLOSS community. Why do you want to harm
them so badly?

Opinions on how what's the best for the community may differ, but
that's fine. Discussions are healthy, as long as they stay friendly
(btw your mails aren't). I have learned a lot from discussions, and
yes sometimes people (me included) get unfriendly or say things that
turn out to be false. But as long as we apologize for mistakes, we can
grow from it.

> No volunteer should have to suffer you toxic people

Don't you think, just maybe, that we shouldn't suffer from your
toxicity as well? Especially since we will suffer much more than you
can ever suffer from this. I mean, what's the worst that can happen
from your point of view? RMS resigns again? Then everything would be
just like a month ago.

Regards,
Stephan




--
Paul Sutton, Cert Cont Sci (Open)
https://personaljournal.ca/paulsutton/
OpenPGP : 4350 91C4 C8FB 681B 23A6 7944 8EA9 1B51 E27E 3D99

Pronoun : him/his/he


OpenPGP_0x8EA91B51E27E3D99.asc
Description: OpenPGP public key


OpenPGP_signature
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[Jean-Philippe MENGUAL]

Hi guys,

Please stop replying. That is a troll, will be banned quickly, dont 
maintain it alive. Just ignore, listmaster and bts will do what is 
needed. Keep power for other more interesting things.


Regards

Le 04/04/2021 à 23:18, crazy.mo...@lavache.com a écrit :



If you don't want these ego-maniacs to use your name in their vendettas 
you can resign from Debian.  This is the choice.  How many people will 
resign if Debian votes to attack Stallman?  Please tell us before the 
vote finishes so we call can know this now.


No matter the outcome of this vote.  Having the vote at all suggests 
that people are expendable.  Volunteers can be hung over the side of the 
ship while people have an email argument about what to do next.


Why don't you understand how toxic this is?

There are so many years of defamation in Debian now.  Delete it all 
now.  Delete the negative options from the vote now.  Please stop or we 
stop you.





From: Stephan Lachnit 
To: crazy.mo...@lavache.com
Subject: Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is ***
Date: 04/04/2021 22:38:20 Europe/Paris
Cc: 986...@bugs.debian.org;
   debian-devel@lists.debian.org

> Why does the toxic woman want to destroy reputations?

If you refer to Jonathan Carter, that isn't even the person that
started the vote, nor an original author of the open letter. Do your
research, tbh to me it seems like you are a complete outsider.

> Destroy nobody - Or destroy everybody! You can't have it both ways.

First of all, nobody wants to "destroy" RMS. Calling someone to resign
isn't destroying them, especially if they were just (secretly)
elected.

Secondly, why are you so toxic and want to "destroy" everybody? There
is really no point, all you do is make the FLOSS community weaker and
more divided. And since you seem to care about RMS and his ideas, I
don't think that is something you would like.

> If Debian is a vehicle for defamation, every one of you faces full 
consequences.


Debian is a democracy. Assume one person votes in favor of RMS (which
as you can see some people will do), why do you want them to face your
alleged consequences? That doesn't make sense. They have no power to
do the things you ask for. In fact, nobody in Debian has. Again, I
don't think you understand the Debian project at all.

> Your jobs are the targets. Your families are targets.

I can understand that you are angry even if I don't agree with your
views, but I don't think anyone here wants to harm RMS. Everyone here
just wants the best for the FLOSS community. Why do you want to harm
them so badly?

Opinions on how what's the best for the community may differ, but
that's fine. Discussions are healthy, as long as they stay friendly
(btw your mails aren't). I have learned a lot from discussions, and
yes sometimes people (me included) get unfriendly or say things that
turn out to be false. But as long as we apologize for mistakes, we can
grow from it.

> No volunteer should have to suffer you toxic people

Don't you think, just maybe, that we shouldn't suffer from your
toxicity as well? Especially since we will suffer much more than you
can ever suffer from this. I mean, what's the worst that can happen
from your point of view? RMS resigns again? Then everything would be
just like a month ago.

Regards,
Stephan

Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[crazy . molly]

If you don't want these ego-maniacs to use your name in their vendettas you can 
resign from Debian.  This is the choice.  How many people will resign if Debian 
votes to attack Stallman?  Please tell us before the vote finishes so we call 
can know this now.



No matter the outcome of this vote.  Having the vote at all suggests that 
people are expendable.  Volunteers can be hung over the side of the ship while 
people have an email argument about what to do next.



Why don't you understand how toxic this is?



There are so many years of defamation in Debian now.  Delete it all now.  
Delete the negative options from the vote now.  Please stop or we stop you.






From: Stephan Lachnit 
To: crazy.mo...@lavache.com
Subject: Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is ***
Date: 04/04/2021 22:38:20 Europe/Paris
Cc: 986...@bugs.debian.org;
   debian-devel@lists.debian.org

> Why does the toxic woman want to destroy reputations?

If you refer to Jonathan Carter, that isn't even the person that
started the vote, nor an original author of the open letter. Do your
research, tbh to me it seems like you are a complete outsider.

> Destroy nobody - Or destroy everybody! You can't have it both ways.

First of all, nobody wants to "destroy" RMS. Calling someone to resign
isn't destroying them, especially if they were just (secretly)
elected.

Secondly, why are you so toxic and want to "destroy" everybody? There
is really no point, all you do is make the FLOSS community weaker and
more divided. And since you seem to care about RMS and his ideas, I
don't think that is something you would like.

> If Debian is a vehicle for defamation, every one of you faces full 
> consequences.

Debian is a democracy. Assume one person votes in favor of RMS (which
as you can see some people will do), why do you want them to face your
alleged consequences? That doesn't make sense. They have no power to
do the things you ask for. In fact, nobody in Debian has. Again, I
don't think you understand the Debian project at all.

> Your jobs are the targets. Your families are targets.

I can understand that you are angry even if I don't agree with your
views, but I don't think anyone here wants to harm RMS. Everyone here
just wants the best for the FLOSS community. Why do you want to harm
them so badly?

Opinions on how what's the best for the community may differ, but
that's fine. Discussions are healthy, as long as they stay friendly
(btw your mails aren't). I have learned a lot from discussions, and
yes sometimes people (me included) get unfriendly or say things that
turn out to be false. But as long as we apologize for mistakes, we can
grow from it.

> No volunteer should have to suffer you toxic people

Don't you think, just maybe, that we shouldn't suffer from your
toxicity as well? Especially since we will suffer much more than you
can ever suffer from this. I mean, what's the worst that can happen
from your point of view? RMS resigns again? Then everything would be
just like a month ago.

Regards,
Stephan

Accepted dahdi-linux 1:2.11.1.0.20170917~dfsg-7.3 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Maintainer: Debian VoIP Team 
Changed-By: Chris Hofstaedtler 
Changes:
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Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[Stephan Lachnit]

> Why does the toxic woman want to destroy reputations?

If you refer to Jonathan Carter, that isn't even the person that
started the vote, nor an original author of the open letter. Do your
research, tbh to me it seems like you are a complete outsider.

> Destroy nobody - Or destroy everybody!  You can't have it both ways.

First of all, nobody wants to "destroy" RMS. Calling someone to resign
isn't destroying them, especially if they were just (secretly)
elected.

Secondly, why are you so toxic and want to "destroy" everybody? There
is really no point, all you do is make the FLOSS community weaker and
more divided. And since you seem to care about RMS and his ideas, I
don't think that is something you would like.

> If Debian is a vehicle for defamation, every one of you faces full 
> consequences.

Debian is a democracy. Assume one person votes in favor of RMS (which
as you can see some people will do), why do you want them to face your
alleged consequences? That doesn't make sense. They have no power to
do the things you ask for. In fact, nobody in Debian has. Again, I
don't think you understand the Debian project at all.

> Your jobs are the targets.  Your families are targets.

I can understand that you are angry even if I don't agree with your
views, but I don't think anyone here wants to harm RMS. Everyone here
just wants the best for the FLOSS community. Why do you want to harm
them so badly?

Opinions on how what's the best for the community may differ, but
that's fine. Discussions are healthy, as long as they stay friendly
(btw your mails aren't). I have learned a lot from discussions, and
yes sometimes people (me included) get unfriendly or say things that
turn out to be false. But as long as we apologize for mistakes, we can
grow from it.

> No volunteer should have to suffer you toxic people

Don't you think, just maybe, that we shouldn't suffer from your
toxicity as well? Especially since we will suffer much more than you
can ever suffer from this. I mean, what's the worst that can happen
from your point of view? RMS resigns again? Then everything would be
just like a month ago.

Regards,
Stephan

Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Stephan Verbücheln]

On Sun, 2021-04-04 at 11:30 +0200, Stephan Lachnit wrote:
> For winetricks it is a bit more tricky as it can download non-free
> dlls afaik.

How does this compare for instance to Firefox, which can/will download
non-free binaries for DRM?

Regards

Accepted pristine-lfs 20210404.0-1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Changes:
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Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[crazy . molly]

> If you were, why do you try to destroy it with this attempt?


Why does the toxic woman want to destroy reputations?

Destroy nobody - Or destroy everybody!  You can't have it both ways.

If Debian is a vehicle for defamation, every one of you faces full consequences.

Your jobs are the targets.  Your families are targets.

No volunteer should have to suffer you toxic people

Molly is the toxic icing on the toxic cake

Accepted python3.9 3.9.4-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is *******

[Stephan Lachnit]

> We are contributors to Debian
>
> The contribution of every one of us makes the name Debian respectable

If you were, why do you try to destroy it with this attempt?

> Please stop!  Delete all fascism and defamation about any volunteer that has 
> been instigated from Debian in any form whatsoever.  Delete it from the vote, 
> web pages, search engines.
>
> Please stop!  Delete all negative options from the RMS vote.  We only want 
> positive options or nothing.  We will not tolerate any outcome that is 
> negative for a volunteer
>
> If the mob does not respect our request, we are making a data dump of all the 
> DebConf personal data.

Wtf please relax. The vote isn't even finished. And let's assume the
project would vote against it, why do you want everything to be
deleted? That's just stupid.

Also, let's suppose you are a contributor to Debian (which I doubt),
why do you contribute to a project which rules you don't respect? Why
do you try to hurt everyone, even those who might vote in favor of
supporting RMS?

Regards,
Stephan

PS: if you reply to this, please don't share the alleged last digits
to the passport number.

Accepted buildlog-consultant 0.0.7-1 (source all) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Jelmer Vernooij 
Changed-By: Jelmer Vernooij 
Description:
 python3-buildlog-consultant - build log parser and analyser
Changes:
 buildlog-consultant (0.0.7-1) unstable; urgency=low
 .
   * New upstream release.
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Accepted nageru 2.0.1-3 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Steinar H. Gunderson 
Changed-By: Steinar H. Gunderson 
Changes:
 nageru (2.0.1-3) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * Reenable the SRT support, as the srt package was fixed again.
   * fix-ffmpeg-height-calculation.diff: New patch from upstream git,
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Re: Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is ****909

[Adam Borowski]

On Sun, Apr 04, 2021 at 09:22:16PM +0200, crazy.mo...@lavache.com wrote:
> We are contributors to Debian
> 
> The contribution of every one of us makes the name Debian respectable

> We can't allow a crazy woman who slept with a past project leader to hijack

Go away, FakeMikee.  We know what your purposes are.


Meow!
-- 
⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀ We domesticated dogs 36000 years ago; together we chased
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ animals, hung out and licked or scratched our private parts.
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ Cats domesticated us 9500 years ago, and immediately we got
⠈⠳⣄ agriculture, towns then cities. -- whitroth on /.

Accepted gnumach 2:1.8+git20210404-1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Version: 2:1.8+git20210404-1
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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: GNU Hurd Maintainers 
Changed-By: Samuel Thibault 
Changes:
 gnumach (2:1.8+git20210404-1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * New upstream snapshot.
 - patches/git-cwd_default: Upstreamed.
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Bug#986382: DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is ****909

[crazy . molly]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
X-Debbugs-CC: 
debian-proj...@lists.debian.org,debian-v...@lists.debian.org,debian-devel@lists.debian.org


We are contributors to Debian

The contribution of every one of us makes the name Debian respectable

We can't allow a crazy woman who slept with a past project leader to hijack the 
name of the project and use it to scar volunteers.  This happened to many 
times.  It stops now.

Please stop!  Delete all fascism and defamation about any volunteer that has 
been instigated from Debian in any form whatsoever.  Delete it from the vote, 
web pages, search engines.

Please stop!  Delete all negative options from the RMS vote.  We only want 
positive options or nothing.  We will not tolerate any outcome that is negative 
for a volunteer

If the mob does not respect our request, we are making a data dump of all the 
DebConf personal data.  DPL Jonathan Carter's passport number is 909.

Privacy for everybody or privacy for nobody

Accepted openblas 0.3.14+ds-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Science Team 

Changed-By: Sébastien Villemot 
Changes:
 openblas (0.3.14+ds-1) experimental; urgency=medium
 .
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   * d/watch: update following GitHub URL renaming
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Accepted openrc 0.42-2.1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: OpenRC Debian Maintainers 
Changed-By: Mark Hindley 
Closes: 985509
Changes:
 openrc (0.42-2.1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * Non-maintainer upload.
   * Make -dev package symlinks in /usr/lib target shared libraries in
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Re: About lintian

[Pierre-Elliott Bécue]

Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 19:31:30-0700, Felix Lechner a écrit :
> Dear Norbert,
> 
> On Sun, Jan 17, 2021 at 5:02 AM Norbert Preining  
> wrote:
> >
> > you said you have plans to set up a test version of the Lintian web
> > application on non-Debian infrastructure. How is that going, Felix?
> 
> A beta version of Lintian's new service is now live at
> lintian.debian.*net*. [1] The Node-based web app is backed by 90 GB of
> PostgreSQL data. I used connection pools, but the site will load
> slowly until I get more memory. Please be patient—I hope it is worth
> your while. The pages are superior to what we had previously because
> they show your override comments. The code base can also be expanded
> more easily.
> 
> For any issues or suggestions please find instructions in the page
> footers. I am still adding features, however, and only replied because
> of the upcoming release. Please star(*) our repository [2] on Salsa if
> you like it. Thanks!
> 
> Please have a good weekend!
> 
> Kind regards

This looks neat!

Thanks for your work.

Bests,

-- 
Pierre-Elliott Bécue
GPG: 9AE0 4D98 6400 E3B6 7528  F493 0D44 2664 1949 74E2
It's far easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.


signature.asc
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Accepted libguestfs 1:1.44.1-1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Version: 1:1.44.1-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Libvirt Maintainers 

Changed-By: Hilko Bengen 
Changes:
 libguestfs (1:1.44.1-1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * New upstream version 1.44.1
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Accepted libnbd 1.6.3-1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 17:01:22 +0200
Source: libnbd
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Version: 1.6.3-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Hilko Bengen 
Changed-By: Hilko Bengen 
Changes:
 libnbd (1.6.3-1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * New upstream version 1.6.3
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Accepted chromium 89.0.4389.114-1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 00:34:12 +
Source: chromium
Architecture: source
Version: 89.0.4389.114-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Chromium Team 
Changed-By: Michael Gilbert 
Closes: 986335
Changes:
 chromium (89.0.4389.114-1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * New upstream security release (closes: #986335).
 - CVE-2021-21194: Use after free in screen capture. Reported by Leecraso
   and Guang Gong
 - CVE-2021-21195: Use after free in V8. Reported by Liu and Liang
 - CVE-2021-21196: Heap buffer overflow in TabStrip. Reported by Khalil
   Zhani
 - CVE-2021-21197: Heap buffer overflow in TabStrip. Reported by Abdulrahman
   Alqabandi
 - CVE-2021-21198: Out of bounds read in IPC. Reported by Mark Brand
 - CVE-2021-21199: Use Use after free in Aura. Reported by Weipeng Jiang
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Accepted espeakup 1:0.80-20 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 14:33:26 +0200
Source: espeakup
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Version: 1:0.80-20
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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Accessibility Team 
Changed-By: Samuel Thibault 
Changes:
 espeakup (1:0.80-20) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * espeakup-udeb.finish-install: Carry over the alsa mixer levels into the
 installed system.
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Accepted dahdi-linux 1:2.11.1.0.20170917~dfsg-7.2 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 12:57:27 +
Source: dahdi-linux
Architecture: source
Version: 1:2.11.1.0.20170917~dfsg-7.2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian VoIP Team 
Changed-By: Chris Hofstaedtler 
Changes:
 dahdi-linux (1:2.11.1.0.20170917~dfsg-7.2) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * Non-maintainer upload.
   * Add autopkgtest covering just the module build, which can be done
 on Debian CI. Should be enough to tell us if the modules are broken
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Accepted horizon 3:18.6.2-3 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Format: 1.8
Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 14:13:10 +0200
Source: horizon
Architecture: source
Version: 3:18.6.2-3
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian OpenStack 
Changed-By: Thomas Goirand 
Closes: 983853
Changes:
 horizon (3:18.6.2-3) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * Revert previous fix, which is in fact a problem in the fonts-font-awesome
 package and should be handled there: see bug #986220. (Closes: #983853).
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Accepted netgen 6.2.2006+really6.2.1905+dfsg-2.1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Version: 6.2.2006+really6.2.1905+dfsg-2.1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Science Maintainers 

Changed-By: Gianfranco Costamagna 
Closes: 984439
Changes:
 netgen (6.2.2006+really6.2.1905+dfsg-2.1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * Non-maintainer upload.
   * debian/patches/4fad6e0631718a4bb574d67505e0ebfef1f171ce.patch:
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Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Jonas Smedegaard]

Quoting Andrey Rahmatullin (2021-04-04 12:42:47)
> On Sun, Apr 04, 2021 at 11:17:01AM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
> > Which one do we. as a community, prefer? 
> The project usually seems to prefer "free software" over "our users".

No, the project prefer what is both free software and serves our users.

Reason is that we prioritize free software *and* our users (not free 
software *or* our users).

Concretely, our main priority is to maintain "main", "contrib" available 
as well but maintained at a lower priority.


 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

signature.asc
Description: signature

Accepted gcc-11 11-20210404-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian GCC Maintainers 
Changed-By: Matthias Klose 
Changes:
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Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Simon McVittie]

On Sun, 04 Apr 2021 at 13:23:14 +0200, Joerg Jaspert wrote:
> On 16093 March 1977, Dominik George wrote:
> > That surprised me. If a package is free software, in ful laccordance
> > with the DFSG, why is it put into contrib?
> 
> There is, as usual, no clear answer.
> 
> The policy for main is clear on that it needs to be self contained. So
> software in main must not require something outside to work and do its job.
> Contrib is the area where that is allowed. License wise its the same as
> main, but it allows to depend on something not available for building or
> working.

There was some discussion relevant to this on debian-devel-games earlier
this year: the subthread starts at
.

I don't think the rule can be as simple as "must not require something
outside to work and do its job", because we have Free clients for non-Free
network services (like all the instant messaging services that used to
exist), and those were always in main. Similarly, it would be absurd to
kick out email clients into contrib just because they are primarily used
to read non-Free email messages like this one! :-)

As I mentioned on d-d-games, one of the major things I tend to ask myself
when thinking about the borderline between main and contrib is: if the
content that this package downloads was somehow in the Debian archive,
would the downloader have a Depends or Recommends on it, or would it be
a Suggests or no dependency at all?

Another factor in choosing main or contrib, for me, is whether the
downloader is specifically hard-coded to work with particular content,
or whether it generically works with any content in a particular
format. game-data-packager and quakespasm are both close to the main/contrib
borderline, and this factor is why I think they are in the correct archive
areas: g-d-p downloads and repackages specific non-Free games, so it's
in contrib, whereas quakespasm can play any Free or non-Free set of
Quake-compatible levels, so it's in main.

I think winetricks is *probably* correctly in contrib, because it has
hard-coded knowledge of how to best to download and install specific
non-Free Windows DLLs? Like game-data-packager, it's quite close to the
line between main and contrib, but I think it does make sense to consider
it to be on the contrib side of that line (although I'm sure I could be
convinced otherwise).

As Joerg says, this is all fairly subjective and unclear, but I think we
do have an approximately coherent policy for what can and can't be in main,
and that's realistically the best thing we are going to get.

smcv

Re: File moved from one package to another - use Conflicts/Replaces or Breaks/Replaces?

[Andreas Metzler]

On 2021-04-03 Otto Kekäläinen  wrote:
> Hello!

> In MariaDB we have over the years moved files around. A file that was first
> in e.g. mariadb-server-10.3 might have been moved to
> mariadb-server-core-10.3 and some years later to mariadb-client-core-10.5.
> The result is a massive debian/control file with a lot of
> Conflicts/Breaks/Replaces [1]

> While trying to clean up and simplify I started wondering, when should one
> use Conflicts/Replaces and when Breaks/Replaces?
[...]

The rough guideline is to use Breaks together with an earlier than (<<,
<=) condition. Which seems to be what mariadb does.

I do not think there is a lot to improve here. Did you you see David's
recent message, <20210331164012.gevwmagm63q2yc54@crossbow>?

| For me, this whole situation seems wrong though. Why do you have
| versioned package names (mariadb-server-*) when they are all mutually
| exclusive with one another due to all shipping the same binary?
| 
| Either embrace versioned names like e.g. gcc/clang do or drop the
| pretense and ship an unversioned mariadb-server. Most packages aren't
| packaged versioned after all and that is (mostly) fine (same for client
| and co which only makes this more complicated and worse).
| 
| Mixing the two causes your users to experience the worst of both worlds:
| The packages can not be co-installed forcing them through the change in
| one sitting and they are an upgrade nightmare as there will always be
| one more situation in which apt (or another resolver, or even a human)
| decides that (part of) an upgrade is not worth the perceived cost.

cu Andreas
-- 
`What a good friend you are to him, Dr. Maturin. His other friends are
so grateful to you.'
`I sew his ears on from time to time, sure'

Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Joerg Jaspert]

On 16093 March 1977, Dominik George wrote:


That surprised me. If a package is free software, in ful laccordance
with the DFSG, why is it put into contrib? I can see where this note
comes from — the package maintainer does not want to help people
install non-free software, a point of view that is famous with the FSF
and a reason for them to discourage a distribution.



I want to open this for discussion, as I can fully understand both
points of view. While I could discuss this with the winetricks and
lutris maintainers alone, I think it is an important discussion and
decision for the project as a whole.


There is, as usual, no clear answer.

The policy for main is clear on that it needs to be self contained. So 
software in main must not require something outside to work and do its 
job. Contrib is the area where that is allowed. License wise its the 
same as main, but it allows to depend on something not available for 
building or working.


And I think that is why you find those packages over in contrib. Their 
main point is using something that's not in Debian. Yes, it may be 
entirely free software in itself, but that is not all that counts for 
main.


Now, if you can (and do) package a whole bunch of games that lutris 
supports, and the ability to load *more* from elsewhere is there, but 
not neccessary for its core functionality, it would be fine to go to 
main. (Assuming one can "fix" the winetricks dependency in a similar 
way, which I doubt, but thats another point).



--
bye, Joerg

Accepted gubbins 2.4.1-4 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Med Packaging Team 

Changed-By: Nilesh Patra 
Closes: 986238
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 .
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Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Andrey Rahmatullin]

On Sun, Apr 04, 2021 at 11:17:01AM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
>  a) They try Debian, and find out they have to learn how the different
> package areas work, reconfigure their package sources
(they would need that anyway as they need firmware and, very probable,
nvidia-driver)

> Which one do we. as a community, prefer? 
The project usually seems to prefer "free software" over "our users".
On the other hand, are you asking how should we interpret our founding
documents, or what should we put in them?

-- 
WBR, wRAR


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Description: PGP signature

Re: Realtek RTL8723DE, RTL8821CE, RTL8822BE and RTL8822CE chipsets

[Devops PK Carlisle LLC]

This is interesting.

First, I must ask... Are either Ralink or Atheros more quickly adopted
into Linux support before Realtek? Are they more stable, etc.? (In my
original post, I noted that I pulled a Realtek based 5ghz dongle from an
extreme end user system, in no small part due to stability/reliability)?

Second, I must note that perhaps you *were* lucky or whatever, as I have
never found anything other than a Realtek chipset on offer. Even if
Atheros or Ralink are more stable, I don't know if I could actually
*find* one. I am well aware that the Chinese company's dongle made in
People's Dongle Factory Thirteen will have folded before the container
ship hits the States, but the Realtek chipset is the key...it is finally
why I know that can work with it.

On 4/4/21 5:27 AM, Andrej Shadura wrote:
> 
> On Sun, 4 Apr 2021, at 11:25, Andrej Shadura wrote:
>> On Thu, 1 Apr 2021, at 21:22, Devops PK Carlisle LLC wrote:
>>> Something I did not mention before, to answer your question the chip
>>> reads as rtl8821cu (so yes, a Realtek).
>>>
>>> In fairness I do not recall ever having run across a wifi dongle that
>>> did not have a Realtek chip (although they may be out there). It was
>>> because I could at least confirm a Realtek chip in an otherwise cheap
>>> Chinese dongle, that I was willing to even try it.
>>
>> I may be lucky or picky or whatever, but all except just one of my 
>> external USB dongles have Atheros chips.
> 
> Oh, and another one has a Ralink chip.
> 

Accepted python3.9 3.9.3-2 (source) into experimental

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 d404adabb309d7eb0bc6d9f20da515b0 214296 python optional 
python3.9_3.9.3-2.debian.tar.xz
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Accepted filezilla 3.53.1-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Hash: SHA256

Format: 1.8
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 22:18:20 +
Source: filezilla
Architecture: source
Version: 3.53.1-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Adrien Cunin 
Changed-By: Phil Wyett 
Changes:
 filezilla (3.53.1-1) experimental; urgency=medium
 .
   * Team upload
   * New upstream version 3.53.1
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filezilla_3.53.1-1.debian.tar.xz
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filezilla_3.53.1-1_source.buildinfo
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filezilla_3.53.1.orig.tar.bz2
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filezilla_3.53.1-1.debian.tar.xz
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filezilla_3.53.1-1_source.buildinfo

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Accepted kicad-symbols 5.99.0~20210401-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Format: 1.8
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2021 17:11:50 +0200
Source: kicad-symbols
Architecture: source
Version: 5.99.0~20210401-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Electronics Team 

Changed-By: Carsten Schoenert 
Changes:
 kicad-symbols (5.99.0~20210401-1) experimental; urgency=medium
 .
   * [7d4b542] d/gbp.conf: Adjust to debian/experimental
   * [2b910a7] New upstream version 5.99.0~20210401
 + Use a snapshot version from 2021-04-01 as upstream version.
   * [989c304] d/copyright: update years on contributors
   * [7a89df6] d/control: Increase required kicad version >= 5.99.0~
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kicad-symbols_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-symbols_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo
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kicad-symbols_5.99.0~20210401-1.dsc
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kicad-symbols_5.99.0~20210401.orig.tar.xz
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kicad-symbols_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-symbols_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo

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Accepted kicad-packages3d 5.99.0~20210401-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Format: 1.8
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2021 09:46:25 +0200
Source: kicad-packages3d
Architecture: source
Version: 5.99.0~20210401-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Electronics Team 

Changed-By: Carsten Schoenert 
Changes:
 kicad-packages3d (5.99.0~20210401-1) experimental; urgency=medium
 .
   * [10e5aaf] d/watch: update watch file to capture GitLab source
 + The upstream VCS has moved to GitLab, this requires an update to the
   watch file.
   * [49e20b2] d/control: increase Standards-Version to 4.5.1
 + No further changes needed.
   * [a5f949e] d/gbp.conf: Adjust to debian/experimental
   * [4f78825] New upstream version 5.99.0~20210401
 + Use a snapshot version from 2021-04-01 as upstream version.
   * [b19d7db] d/copyright: Update years on contributors
   * [a422bfd] d/control: Increase required kicad version >= 5.99.0~
   * [6106510] d/k-p.install: Adjust install folder
 + The target folder for the 3d models has changed, this needs a
   modification of the sequencer for installing data into the package.
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo
Files:
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401-1.dsc
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401.orig.tar.xz
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-packages3d_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo

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Accepted kicad-footprints 5.99.0~20210401-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Format: 1.8
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2021 16:53:54 +0200
Source: kicad-footprints
Architecture: source
Version: 5.99.0~20210401-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Electronics Team 

Changed-By: Carsten Schoenert 
Changes:
 kicad-footprints (5.99.0~20210401-1) experimental; urgency=medium
 .
   * [1eaf635] d/watch: update watch file to capture GitLab source
 + The upstream VCS has moved to GitLab, this requires an update to the
   watch file.
   * [fe386ef] d/control: increase Standards-Version to 4.5.1
 + No further changes needed.
   * [13ad595] d/gbp.conf: Adjust to debian/experimental
   * [b426f2a] New upstream version 5.99.0~20210401
 + Use a snapshot version from 2021-04-01 as upstream version.
   * [c6eec3b] d/copyright: Update years on contributors
   * [1ff7741] d/control: Increase required kicad version >= 5.99.0~
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401-1.dsc
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401.orig.tar.xz
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401-1.debian.tar.xz
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kicad-footprints_5.99.0~20210401-1_amd64.buildinfo

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Accepted kicad 5.99.0~20210403.2b89511+dfsg1-1 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Format: 1.8
Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2021 19:02:47 +0200
Source: kicad
Architecture: source
Version: 5.99.0~20210403.2b89511+dfsg1-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Electronics Team 

Changed-By: Carsten Schoenert 
Changes:
 kicad (5.99.0~20210403.2b89511+dfsg1-1) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * [618900e] d/gbp.conf: remove component i18n
 + The UI localization for KiCad was handled previously as a dedicated
   component tarball. Starting with version 5.99.0 the i18n stuff is now
   included within the main tarball, thus we don't need to work with a
   component tarball any more.
   * [c80a3cb] New upstream version 5.99.0~20210403.2b89511+dfsg1
 + Use a snapshot version from 2021-04-03 as upstream version.
   * [db089df] rebuild patch queue from patch-queue branch
 + modified patches:
   fixes/Appdata-Add-missing-desktop-entry.patch
 + modified and renamed patch:
   fixes/Modifing-the-Exec-cmd-in-the-desktop-files.patch -->
   fixes/Modifying-the-Exec-cmd-in-the-desktop-files.patch
 + removed patch:
   fixes/spelling-fix-allows-to-allows-one-to.patch
   * [5e9e042] d/rules: Remove CMake option for GitHub Plugin
 + The integration of managing GitHub repositories as symbols or
   footprints has been removed. So removing the old cmake config option
   accordingly.
   * [7733be4] d/rules: Set build of i18n and demos explicitly on
 + Even if this option is set default to on, this can change due decisions
   by upstream. We always want to build and install the i18n things, so
   being better explicit on this.v
   * [2bfe7e7] d/rules: Install i18n files into useful folder
 + The cmake configuration doesn't set the FHS conform installation folder
   for the compiled 18n message catalog so we need to set this option.
   * [6d425e1] d/rules: Be more explicit while modify the version string
 + We want to use the Debian version within the version information instead
   of a upstream combined version string. The configuration variable to
   inject the version into the UI has been modified so we need to adjust
   our version replacement.
   * [8333e91] d/rules: Remove old i18n build and install stuff
 + Due the now included i18n stuff inside the source of KiCad we can drop
   all previously dedicated added build instructions inside debian/rules.
   * [e152dd6] d/control: Adding new required packages for the build
 + The build requires now the packages 'libgtk-3-dev' and
   'libpython3-all-dev' to be around.
   * [9a7e66f] d/control: Increase required kicad version >= 5.99.0~
 + Increase the depending and suggested version for kicad and additional
   kicad-* packages to at least 5.99.0~, will get increased once again when
   the first RC of 6.0.0 will be released.
   * [c801820] d/kicad-demos.install: Adjust files to install
 + Reflect the new added demo project 'stickhub' and changed file extension
   for project files in the kicad-demos package.
   * [e52de85] d/kicad.install.in: Adding new additional folder to install
 + All used icons within the UI are taken now from a file 'images.tar.gz',
   adding the installation folder for that file.
   * [359d1b1] d/rules: Remove any *.md files from installed demos folder
   * [7725079] d/copyright: update due updated upstream modifications
 + Updating the copyright information as the source structure has been
  changed for various parts of the source code and contributors.
   * [213a499] d/kicad.lintian-overrides: Remove entries not needed any more
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Accepted dlt-viewer 2.21.2+dfsg-2 (source) into unstable

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2021 11:22:20 +0200
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Version: 2.21.2+dfsg-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Stefan Potyra 
Changed-By: Gianfranco Costamagna 
Changes:
 dlt-viewer (2.21.2+dfsg-2) unstable; urgency=medium
 .
   * Revert compat level bump to let package migrate to testing.
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Re: Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Stephan Lachnit]

Hi Doinik,

I'm the Lutris Maintainer for Debian, and I completely agree with you.
However, at least for Lutris, there is no choice since we recommend
winetricks. Thus, I simply copied the copyright comment from
winetricks.

For winetricks it is a bit more tricky as it can download non-free
dlls afaik. On the other hand, Lutris downloads tons of files as part
of the runtime, and there might be non-free files in there (I'm aware
of at least one icon that has an unknown origin). In both cases,
nothing is installed system-wide, so one could argue it's more like
automatically wget-ing files to your home directory.

There was a larger discussion about this on debian-devel-games [1],
you might be interested in that.

Regards,
Stephan

[1] https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-games/2021/01/msg00013.html

Accepted kicad-templates 5.99.0~20210329-1 (source) into experimental

[Debian FTP Masters]

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Source: kicad-templates
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Version: 5.99.0~20210329-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Electronics Team 

Changed-By: Carsten Schoenert 
Changes:
 kicad-templates (5.99.0~20210329-1) experimental; urgency=medium
 .
   * [5d3769f] d/watch: update watch file to capture GitLab source
 + The upstream VCS has moved to GitLab, this requires an update to the
   watch file.
   * [c82c186] d/control: increase Standards-Version to 4.5.1
 + No further changes needed.
   * [f5cf6c3] d/gbp.conf: Adjust to debian/experimental
   * [9768b77] New upstream version 5.99.0~20210329
 + Use a snapshot version from 2021-03-29 as upstream version.
   * [013389b] d/copyright: Update years on contributors
   * [fb2055c] d/control: Increase required kicad version >= 5.99.0~
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Packages in contrib solely because they allow using non-free software

[Dominik George]

Hi,

I have stumbled across this note, in the d/copyright file of the
lutris package:

> Comment: lutris is not part of the Debian distribution, but is in the contrib
>  archive area instead, because while lutris itself is free software, its main
>  purpose is to download and install mainly non-free software. Further, lutris
>  recommends winetricks, which itself is free software as well, but is also in
>  contrib for the same reason.

That surprised me. If a package is free software, in ful laccordance
with the DFSG, why is it put into contrib? I can see where this note
comes from — the package maintainer does not want to help people
install non-free software, a point of view that is famous with the FSF
and a reason for them to discourage a distribution.

But it is new to me that Debian falls for this. According to Debian
Poilcy 2.2.2, "wrapper packages or other sorts of free accessories for
non-free programs" are examples of packages that can go into contrib
as well. But neither winetricks nor lutris are wrapper packages for
non-free programs — while they do allow installing and using non-free
software as well, they can be used for any kidn of game or program,
including free software. Lutris actually has explicit support for quite a few
games that are in Debian main.

I consider it a bad idea to hide free software tools from average
users, which putting it into contrib technically does (contrib is not
enabled on vanilla installs of Debian). Packages of Lutris play a huge
role in fostering free software, even though this is not too obvious
as they do ease the use of non-free software. Example:

A gamer who uses, let's say, Windows, considers moving to Debian.
However, they do not want to drop the games the yare playing. The
two scenarios are:

 a) They try Debian, and find out they have to learn how the different
package areas work, reconfigure their package sources, and find
confirmation that Linux is not fit for the desktop or for gaming,
or at least over-complicated. They stay with Windows.

 b) They try Debian, and find that it lets them run a huge amount of
their games out of the box, with a nice frontend and game library.

Which one do we. as a community, prefer? I strongly advocate for
option b).

I want to open this for discussion, as I can fully understand both
points of view. While I could discuss this with the winetricks and
lutris maintainers alone, I think it is an important discussion and
decision for the project as a whole.

Cheers,
Nik


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature

Re: Precisando de um sponsor.

[Sergio Durigan Junior]

On Saturday, April 03 2021, Leandro Cunha wrote:

> Só uma questão que eu gostaria de saber qual a recomendação para este
> problema,
> é comum achar pacotes antigos com anonscm como VCS que gera este Lintian
> https://lintian.debian.org/tags/vcs-obsolete-in-debian-infrastructure.html.
> Seria mais adequado subir pro grupo do Debian ou a pessoa subir pro pessoal
> dela no Salsa?
> Neste caso ficaria um repositório na conta pessoal. Para o grupo do Debian
> vai precisar de
> um DD para criar o repositório.

Dado que:

- É relativamente simples pedir a criação de repositórios sob o
  namespace "debian" no salsa, e;

- Colocar o repositório sob seu usuário sugere que o pacote foi adotado
  por você, o que, pelo que entendi da sua pergunta, nem sempre vai ser
  o caso (e mesmo que fosse, não justificaria), e;

- Colocar o repositório sob seu usuário dificulta o processo de
  manutenção dele (NMUs, co-mantenedores, etc.),

é bastante recomendado colocar o repositório sob o namespace "debian".

-- 
Sergio
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