Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Mon, May 05, 2008 at 07:41:52PM +0100, Simon Huggins wrote: > On Mon, May 05, 2008 at 11:30:45AM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: > > When we see spam getting through to the lists, we already adjust the > > spam filters. If you think you can do a better job, the spamassassin > > rules are all publicly available, and we gladly accept patches. > I can't find the bit in there that stops you sending the contentless > bounce message? Can you point me at it so I can send a patch to include > how close to the threshold I am and also patch it so that DDs can > disable it? Seconded. I don't really mind that I'm dropping mail from the lists (since I don't seem to be getting any false positives) and I'm not particularly worried about the quality of the filtering on lists - I find the notification messages *much* more annoying than the spam itself. -- "You grabbed my hand and we fell into it, like a daydream - or a fever." -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Mon, May 05, 2008 at 11:30:45AM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: > On Mon, 05 May 2008, Simon Huggins wrote: > > Perhaps instead of sending these content-free notes that we're going to > > be unsubscribed some time, after some undisclosed number of bounces, > > listmasters could consider these messages as hints with which to adjust > > the spam filter used. > When we see spam getting through to the lists, we already adjust the > spam filters. If you think you can do a better job, the spamassassin > rules are all publicly available, and we gladly accept patches. I can't find the bit in there that stops you sending the contentless bounce message? Can you point me at it so I can send a patch to include how close to the threshold I am and also patch it so that DDs can disable it? Thanks, Simon. -- [ "No, the radio works. You don't" - Basil, Fawlty Towers ] signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Mon, 05 May 2008, Simon Huggins wrote: > Perhaps instead of sending these content-free notes that we're going to > be unsubscribed some time, after some undisclosed number of bounces, > listmasters could consider these messages as hints with which to adjust > the spam filter used. When we see spam getting through to the lists, we already adjust the spam filters. If you think you can do a better job, the spamassassin rules are all publicly available, and we gladly accept patches. Don Armstrong -- "There's no problem so large it can't be solved by killing the user off, deleting their files, closing their account and reporting their REAL earnings to the IRS." -- The B.O.F.H.. http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Sun, May 04, 2008 at 11:05:31AM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote:
> On Sun, 04 May 2008, Santiago Vila wrote:
> > Executive summary: master.debian.org, where I receive debian email,
> > has stronger spam filtering than lists.debian.org, as master seems
> > to use some kind of "content filtering". As a result, some spam
> > messages distributed by lists.debian.org are rejected by
> > master.debian.org.
> The problem is that the filtering is differential; master.debian.org
> should be reconfigured to either just accept these messages from
> lists, or discard them.
> As listmaster has nothing to do with the mail configuration on master,
> there's not much listmaster can do about it.
I'm not convinced that's really true.
You obviously have some system that generates the messages based on
bounces and that records which message bounced. If many subscribers
bounce the same mail that's a good indication that it's spam.
Perhaps instead of sending these content-free notes that we're going to
be unsubscribed some time, after some undisclosed number of bounces,
listmasters could consider these messages as hints with which to adjust
the spam filter used.
--
--("Do you have a girl coming over?" - Scully)--
Simon ("What's a girl?" - Mulder ) Nomis
Htag.pl 0.0.22
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Description: Digital signature
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Sun, May 04, 2008 at 04:57:10PM -0500, Adam Majer wrote: > Colin Watson wrote: > > Yes, I've been seeing the same thing. It's usually just an irritation, > > but I guess some day I'll hit a threshold and get unsubscribed from a > > bunch of lists. > > Wouldn't it be possible to configure the mail server to filter the mail > based on the header content? That is, > > * Is it spam? => Yes => Now do the following: In this case, master should simply trust lists.debian.org to have done spam checking and not repeat it. After all they're in the same administrative domain. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Sun, May 04, 2008 at 04:57:10PM -0500, Adam Majer wrote: > Colin Watson wrote: > > Yes, I've been seeing the same thing. It's usually just an irritation, > > but I guess some day I'll hit a threshold and get unsubscribed from a > > bunch of lists. > > Wouldn't it be possible to configure the mail server to filter the mail > based on the header content? That is, > > * Is it spam? => Yes => Now do the following: > >1. If mail from a mailing list or precedence Bulk or has List-Id in > headers, discard it >2. Reject with 5xx - Spam Shouldn't this be in the default config of SA in Debian? -- 1KB // Microsoft corollary to Hanlon's razor: // Never attribute to stupidity what can be // adequately explained by malice. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
Colin Watson wrote: > Yes, I've been seeing the same thing. It's usually just an irritation, > but I guess some day I'll hit a threshold and get unsubscribed from a > bunch of lists. Wouldn't it be possible to configure the mail server to filter the mail based on the header content? That is, * Is it spam? => Yes => Now do the following: 1. If mail from a mailing list or precedence Bulk or has List-Id in headers, discard it 2. Reject with 5xx - Spam This is kind of what I have setup postfix to do except I filter based on source IP - could be easier to setup in master's case. If mail is from a known mailing list server (eg. debian, sourceforge), it gets accepted and processed in a post queue filter with spam being dropped. If mail is not from a known mailing list server, it goes to default configuration which does pre-queue filtering where spam is rejected with 5xx SMTP level message. I'm sure it would be possible to set it up based on the existence of Priority: Bulk or List-Id: headers. The only side effect is sometimes the number of connections are more than the server can filter, but that is not generally a significant problem. It just means the connection is delayed for a few minutes. - Adam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Sun, May 04, 2008 at 02:00:45PM +0200, Santiago Vila wrote: > I tried to contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] about this without success, > so this time I will Cc: debian-devel, as it would be extremely strange > that I'm the only person with this problem. > > Executive summary: master.debian.org, where I receive debian email, > has stronger spam filtering than lists.debian.org, as master seems to > use some kind of "content filtering". As a result, some spam messages > distributed by lists.debian.org are rejected by master.debian.org. Yes, I've been seeing the same thing. It's usually just an irritation, but I guess some day I'll hit a threshold and get unsubscribed from a bunch of lists. > From: Debian Listmaster Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [...] > If those bounces pass a certain threshold, our bounce-detection will > forcibly remove your subscription. It would be nice if the mail indicated what that threshold is, so that we know whether this is an immediate cause for concern. The FAQ merely says "it depends" (with some details, but not enough to do an accurate check), so perhaps the program that generates the mail is in a better position to say. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
On Sun, 04 May 2008, Santiago Vila wrote: > Executive summary: master.debian.org, where I receive debian email, > has stronger spam filtering than lists.debian.org, as master seems > to use some kind of "content filtering". As a result, some spam > messages distributed by lists.debian.org are rejected by > master.debian.org. The problem is that the filtering is differential; master.debian.org should be reconfigured to either just accept these messages from lists, or discard them. As listmaster has nothing to do with the mail configuration on master, there's not much listmaster can do about it. Our spam rules are publicly available here: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-listmaster/trunk/spamassassin_config/ Don Armstrong -- If everything seems to be going well, you have obviously overlooked something. -- Steven Wright http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Is master unsuitable to receive mail from lists.debian.org?
Hello. I tried to contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] about this without success, so this time I will Cc: debian-devel, as it would be extremely strange that I'm the only person with this problem. Executive summary: master.debian.org, where I receive debian email, has stronger spam filtering than lists.debian.org, as master seems to use some kind of "content filtering". As a result, some spam messages distributed by lists.debian.org are rejected by master.debian.org. This is insane! Please do agree on a set of filtering rules for master and lists.debian.org which do not make lists.debian.org to send messages to master that master will then reject. Thanks. -- Forwarded message -- From: Debian Listmaster Team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 4 May 2008 01:45:34 + (UTC) Subject: lists.debian.org has received bounces from you Dear subscriber, We've encountered some problems while sending listmail to your emailaddress [EMAIL PROTECTED] In the last seven days we've seen bounces for the following list: * debian-devel (http://lists.debian.org/bounces/R72HthGDh7nED58rcbJBHw) (The link above points to a copy of the latest bounce and will be valid for seven days.) If those bounces pass a certain threshold, our bounce-detection will forcibly remove your subscription. If you are using 'Before-Queue Content filtering' and you think that this mail is wrong, you should whitelist liszt.debian.org from Content filtering. For more information see http://wiki.debian.org/Teams/ListMaster/FAQ You are welcome to contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you think this message was sent in error. Sincerely, The Listmaster Team -- http://lists.debian.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
