Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
Le mar 08/07/2003 à 01:15, Matt Zimmerman a écrit : All that's missing is an automatic debconf notice entry for each NEWS item. That wud be well c00l. As I recall, part of the idea of NEWS.Debian was to prevent having this kind of information end up as debconf notes. But some people like to have this information in debconf notes. Having the choice between displaying them and reading them in NEWS.Debian would be neat. (However, the existence of apt-listchanges makes all of this a bit redundant.) -- .''`. Josselin Mouette/\./\ : :' : [EMAIL PROTECTED] `. `'[EMAIL PROTECTED] `- Debian GNU/Linux -- The power of freedom signature.asc Description: Ceci est une partie de message =?ISO-8859-1?Q?num=E9riquement?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?_sign=E9e?=
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:46:47AM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote: Le mar 08/07/2003 ? 01:15, Matt Zimmerman a ?crit : All that's missing is an automatic debconf notice entry for each NEWS item. That wud be well c00l. As I recall, part of the idea of NEWS.Debian was to prevent having this kind of information end up as debconf notes. But some people like to have this information in debconf notes. Having the choice between displaying them and reading them in NEWS.Debian would be neat. He was JOKING... wasn't he? -- Nick Phillips -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tonight you will pay the wages of sin; Don't forget to leave a tip.
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:48:48PM +1200, Nick Phillips wrote: On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:46:47AM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote: Le mar 08/07/2003 ? 01:15, Matt Zimmerman a ?crit : All that's missing is an automatic debconf notice entry for each NEWS item. That wud be well c00l. As I recall, part of the idea of NEWS.Debian was to prevent having this kind of information end up as debconf notes. But some people like to have this information in debconf notes. Having the choice between displaying them and reading them in NEWS.Debian would be neat. He was JOKING... wasn't he? Who can tell? Let's kill him anyway. -- .''`. ** Debian GNU/Linux ** | Andrew Suffield : :' : http://www.debian.org/ | Dept. of Computing, `. `' | Imperial College, `- -- | London, UK pgpJIIkQk5PiN.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
I demand that Branden Robinson may or may not have written... On Fri, Jul 04, 2003 at 01:01:14AM -0400, Joey Hess wrote: Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the regular changelog entries, and Matt plans to later let it be configured to only display news, if the user wants (more useful for stable users). Kick ASS. What has that poor donkey done to you to deserve such a kicking? ;-) -- | Darren Salt | linux (or ds) at | nr. Ashington, | woody, sarge, | youmustbejoking | Northumberland | RISC OS | demon co uk | Toon Army | I don't ask for much, just untold riches... You will experience a strong urge to do good, but it will pass.
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Sun, 6 Jul 2003, Matt Zimmerman wrote: One nice thing about using standard changelog format is that if someone wants to they could add another format, specialised for news information, and another parser in /usr/lib/dpkg/parsechangelog/. Of course apt-listchanges does its own parsing, so anyone who does that would probably be well served by redesigning the parser interface to something that apt-listchanges can use. Anyway, it's nice to keep that option open. I filed a wishlist bug about this quite a long time ago (#95579), but got no response. Hmm, maybe a library(perl) that gives all this information would be useful. Modifying the text output of dpkg-parsechangelog is difficult, as several programs parse it's output.
dpkg-parsechangelog (Re: NEWS.Debian support is here)
On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 01:11:46PM -0500, Adam Heath wrote: On Sun, 6 Jul 2003, Matt Zimmerman wrote: I filed a wishlist bug about this quite a long time ago (#95579), but got no response. Hmm, maybe a library(perl) that gives all this information would be useful. Modifying the text output of dpkg-parsechangelog is difficult, as several programs parse it's output. This change wouldn't break the format or anything; it would only add some additional text to the Changes: field. Surely no programs depend on the _content_ of that field, do they? -- - mdz
Re: Bug#95579: dpkg-parsechangelog (Re: NEWS.Debian support is here)
On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Matt Zimmerman wrote: On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 01:11:46PM -0500, Adam Heath wrote: On Sun, 6 Jul 2003, Matt Zimmerman wrote: I filed a wishlist bug about this quite a long time ago (#95579), but got no response. Hmm, maybe a library(perl) that gives all this information would be useful. Modifying the text output of dpkg-parsechangelog is difficult, as several programs parse it's output. This change wouldn't break the format or anything; it would only add some additional text to the Changes: field. Surely no programs depend on the _content_ of that field, do they? Well, that still doesn't help, as then you'd have to parse the output of the Changes: field.
Re: Bug#95579: dpkg-parsechangelog (Re: NEWS.Debian support is here)
On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 01:46:49PM -0500, Adam Heath wrote: On Tue, 8 Jul 2003, Matt Zimmerman wrote: This change wouldn't break the format or anything; it would only add some additional text to the Changes: field. Surely no programs depend on the _content_ of that field, do they? Well, that still doesn't help, as then you'd have to parse the output of the Changes: field. I wouldn't need to parse it, just display it. All of the information that apt-listchanges actually needs is already parsed out by dpkg-parsechangelog. It's just that it eats all of the lines containing the email address and date of the uploads. For the most recent upload, this could be reconstructed from the information in the header, but that's pretty ugly, and the information from previous uploads (selected with -v) is lost forever. -- - mdz
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 22:48:48 +1200 Nick Phillips [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Jul 08, 2003 at 10:46:47AM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote: Le mar 08/07/2003 ? 01:15, Matt Zimmerman a ?crit : All that's missing is an automatic debconf notice entry for each NEWS item. That wud be well c00l. As I recall, part of the idea of NEWS.Debian was to prevent having this kind of information end up as debconf notes. But some people like to have this information in debconf notes. Having the choice between displaying them and reading them in NEWS.Debian would be neat. He was JOKING... wasn't he? I doubt it. Some people have few enough packages installed that a nice pretty interface like that is reasonable. Keep in mind that debconf notes weren't implemented to piss people off - they were implemented because they can be used well. They're overused and overabused, but they're a valid presentation mechanism ... under the right circumstances :) pgpKKZh9syZb2.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Fri, Jul 04, 2003 at 01:01:14AM -0400, Joey Hess wrote: Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the regular changelog entries, and Matt plans to later let it be configured to only display news, if the user wants (more useful for stable users). All that's missing is an automatic debconf notice entry for each NEWS item. That wud be well c00l. -- Paul
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Mon, Jul 07, 2003 at 11:30:27PM +0100, Paul Hedderly wrote: On Fri, Jul 04, 2003 at 01:01:14AM -0400, Joey Hess wrote: Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the regular changelog entries, and Matt plans to later let it be configured to only display news, if the user wants (more useful for stable users). All that's missing is an automatic debconf notice entry for each NEWS item. That wud be well c00l. As I recall, part of the idea of NEWS.Debian was to prevent having this kind of information end up as debconf notes. -- - mdz
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Fri, 2003-07-04 at 06:01, Joey Hess wrote: The file format is the same as a debian changelog file, but we leave off the asterisks generally, and use bigger paragraphs explaining news items when necessary. It might be a good idea to run your file through dpkg-parsechangelog to check its formatting as it will not be automatically checked during build as the changelog is. I expect there will be a lintian check eventually. Here's a real life example of a NEWS.Debian file: libinline-perl (0.43-5) unstable; urgency=low Is there any particular reason to keep the unstable; urgency=low there? It's duplication of information in the changelog, and nearly every developer will probably forget to change the information in NEWS.Debian when they change the urgency or distribution in changelog. Would this work just as well? libinline-perl (0.43-5) Note that when you upgrade from perl 5.6 to 5.8, binaries built with libinline (this may include compiled objects cached in .Inline/_Inline directories) will fail to work with the new version of perl. This is because perl's ABI for binaries changed between perl 5.6 and 5.8. The solution is the delete and regenerate any such binaries you might have. I have not tried to automate this in the Debian package. -- Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed, 11 Sep 2002 21:37:56 -0400 ? Scott -- Who would forget every time :-) signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Sun, Jul 06, 2003 at 07:13:23PM +0100, Scott James Remnant wrote: On Fri, 2003-07-04 at 06:01, Joey Hess wrote: The file format is the same as a debian changelog file, but we leave off the asterisks generally, and use bigger paragraphs explaining news items when necessary. It might be a good idea to run your file through dpkg-parsechangelog to check its formatting as it will not be automatically checked during build as the changelog is. I expect there will be a lintian check eventually. Here's a real life example of a NEWS.Debian file: libinline-perl (0.43-5) unstable; urgency=low Is there any particular reason to keep the unstable; urgency=low there? It's duplication of information in the changelog, and nearly every developer will probably forget to change the information in NEWS.Debian when they change the urgency or distribution in changelog. Would this work just as well? [example without distribution and urgency] It would work just as well. The changelog format was used unmodified for purposes of simplicity. Tools already know how to parse it, and its format is already reasonably specified in the documentation. Scott -- Who would forget every time :-) You don't type changelog headers by hand, do you? -- - mdz
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Sun, Jul 06, 2003 at 04:31:22PM -0400, Matt Zimmerman wrote: On Sun, Jul 06, 2003 at 07:13:23PM +0100, Scott James Remnant wrote: Would this work just as well? [example without distribution and urgency] It would work just as well. The changelog format was used unmodified for purposes of simplicity. Tools already know how to parse it, and its format is already reasonably specified in the documentation. To clarify, I meant that such a format would meet the need of NEWS.Debian. However, the existing tools would not understand it. I do not see the extra unused information as a problem, and it lets us use existing tools for creating and editing NEWS.Debian (debchange, dpkg-dev-el, etc.) -- - mdz
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Sun Jul 06, 04:58pm -0400, Matt Zimmerman wrote: On Sun, Jul 06, 2003 at 04:31:22PM -0400, Matt Zimmerman wrote: On Sun, Jul 06, 2003 at 07:13:23PM +0100, Scott James Remnant wrote: Would this work just as well? [example without distribution and urgency] It would work just as well. The changelog format was used unmodified for purposes of simplicity. Tools already know how to parse it, and its format is already reasonably specified in the documentation. To clarify, I meant that such a format would meet the need of NEWS.Debian. However, the existing tools would not understand it. I do not see the extra unused information as a problem, and it lets us use existing tools for creating and editing NEWS.Debian (debchange, dpkg-dev-el, etc.) If you can make apt-listchanges understand the pared-down format, perhaps the others will support it eventually too. I don't care a whole lot about it myself, but it *does* look a lot nicer :)
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
Scott James Remnant wrote: Is there any particular reason to keep the unstable; urgency=low there? It's duplication of information in the changelog, and nearly every developer will probably forget to change the information in NEWS.Debian when they change the urgency or distribution in changelog. It may be that apt-listchanges could use the info in the future to sort news items. It doesn't have to match the value in the changelog. One nice thing about using standard changelog format is that if someone wants to they could add another format, specialised for news information, and another parser in /usr/lib/dpkg/parsechangelog/. Of course apt-listchanges does its own parsing, so anyone who does that would probably be well served by redesigning the parser interface to something that apt-listchanges can use. Anyway, it's nice to keep that option open. -- see shy jo pgpn3oMnK1I7e.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Sun, Jul 06, 2003 at 08:01:38PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote: Scott James Remnant wrote: Is there any particular reason to keep the unstable; urgency=low there? It's duplication of information in the changelog, and nearly every developer will probably forget to change the information in NEWS.Debian when they change the urgency or distribution in changelog. It may be that apt-listchanges could use the info in the future to sort news items. It doesn't have to match the value in the changelog. When merging Joe Drew's patch, I started to add support for sorting the news items by urgency. That much, at least, would be useful. The distribution is pretty unimportant in the NEWS context, though. One nice thing about using standard changelog format is that if someone wants to they could add another format, specialised for news information, and another parser in /usr/lib/dpkg/parsechangelog/. Of course apt-listchanges does its own parsing, so anyone who does that would probably be well served by redesigning the parser interface to something that apt-listchanges can use. Anyway, it's nice to keep that option open. I filed a wishlist bug about this quite a long time ago (#95579), but got no response. -- - mdz
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Fri, Jul 04, 2003 at 01:01:14AM -0400, Joey Hess wrote: Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the regular changelog entries, and Matt plans to later let it be configured to only display news, if the user wants (more useful for stable users). Kick ASS. Thanks, guys. -- G. Branden Robinson| Debian GNU/Linux |Yeah, that's what Jesus would do. [EMAIL PROTECTED] |Jesus would bomb Afghanistan. Yeah. http://people.debian.org/~branden/ | pgpqmvGIj3teO.pgp Description: PGP signature
NEWS.Debian support is here
Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the regular changelog entries, and Matt plans to later let it be configured to only display news, if the user wants (more useful for stable users). The NEWS.Debian file is installed as /usr/share/doc/package/NEWS.Debian.gz. Always compressed, always with that name even in native packages. If you use debhelper, upgrade to 4.1.51 and dh_installchangelogs will install debian/NEWS files for you[1]. The file format is the same as a debian changelog file, but we leave off the asterisks generally, and use bigger paragraphs explaining news items when necessary. It might be a good idea to run your file through dpkg-parsechangelog to check its formatting as it will not be automatically checked during build as the changelog is. I expect there will be a lintian check eventually. Here's a real life example of a NEWS.Debian file: libinline-perl (0.43-5) unstable; urgency=low Note that when you upgrade from perl 5.6 to 5.8, binaries built with libinline (this may include compiled objects cached in .Inline/_Inline directories) will fail to work with the new version of perl. This is because perl's ABI for binaries changed between perl 5.6 and 5.8. The solution is the delete and regenerate any such binaries you might have. I have not tried to automate this in the Debian package. -- Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wed, 11 Sep 2002 21:37:56 -0400 Unlike changelog files, you don't update NEWS.Debian files with every release. Only update them if you have something particularly newsworthy that user should know about. I'm putting off getting this into policy until enough stuff uses it that we can tell it works well. But as of today it's a valid way to communicate important changes to the users of your package. -- see shy jo [1] Actually, debhelper has supported this for a long time already, but it got the file name wrong for native packages. pgpPaUnCEZSPx.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Fri, Jul 04, 2003 at 01:01:14AM -0400, Joey Hess wrote: Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the regular changelog entries, and Matt plans to later let it be configured to only display news, if the user wants (more useful for stable users). Is it reasonable to think about some sort of localizzation support for NEWS file? Changes documented there might be worthy of translation. The NEWS.Debian file is installed as /usr/share/doc/package/NEWS.Debian.gz. Always compressed, always with that name even in native packages. If you use debhelper, upgrade to 4.1.51 and dh_installchangelogs will install debian/NEWS files for you[1]. Just curious: why not NEWS.gz for native packages? ciao, -- Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis | Elegant or ugly code as well aliases: Luca ^De [A-Z][A-Za-z\-]*[iy]'\?s$ | as fine or rude sentences have Luca, a wannabe ``Good guy''. | something in common: they local LANG=[EMAIL PROTECTED] | don't depend on the language. pgpTIeR1qCp3R.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
Thanks a lot, this is great! On Friday 04 July 2003 10:02, Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis wrote: Is it reasonable to think about some sort of localizzation support for NEWS file? Changes documented there might be worthy of translation. Not about i18n, really, but please at least specify from the beginning that NEWS.Debian.gz should be utf-8 encoded, then there shouldn't be any big discussion later on. cheers -- vbi -- featured product: the GNU Compiler Collection - http://gcc.gnu.org pgphIq7RdEuaI.pgp Description: signature
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Fri, 04 Jul 2003, Joey Hess wrote: Thanks to Matt Zimmerman and Joe Drew, apt-listchanges will now display NEWS.Debian entries for upgraded packages. They're displayed before the THANK YOU guys! I will add NEWS support to my packages (and backport apt-listchanges to stable, see people.debian.org/~hmh/ if you want the backport) ASAP. That was a great (although unintended, I'm sure) birthday gift. Thanks ;-) -- One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond where the shadows lie. -- The Silicon Valley Tarot Henrique Holschuh
Re: NEWS.Debian support is here
On Friday, July 4, 2003, at 04:02 AM, Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis wrote: Just curious: why not NEWS.gz for native packages? It's prohibitively difficult to detect whether any given file is in debian changelog format. NEWS[.gz] exists in many packages already, and is of no particular format in general, apt-listchanges doesn't know what to do with it (and will in fact display the entire file every time). Since we can't rely on the existence of NEWS.Debian.gz (as it's not required, like the changelog is) we can't tell which file is the one we're looking for by filename alone. So, instead, we have decided that mandating NEWS.Debian is a better solution.
