Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 05:11:26PM -0500, Joey Hess wrote: > Michael Bramer wrote: > > The ddtp will produce also po-debconf files in future. I must only write > > some scripts for it... > > I did something like: > > for lang in cs da de es fr hu it ja nl pl pt_BR ru ; do wget > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/template_unstable/base-config/templates-$lang; > done > rename 's/-/./' templates-* > debconf-gettextize templates nice... if some one use debconf-po-files. > I don't want to use the result for base-config though. The generated po > files reference only the downloaded templates file, while base-config > uses three seperate templates files which should be referenced prperly > by the po files. And I have no tools to tell which of the translations > on this site are more up-to-date than the ones in debconf. I see the problem. I am not sure, but can you make something like: for $file in ddtp-po.* do cat $file >> po/template.po done after your sripte. Gettext should handel this... Maybe 'msgmerge' can help. If I understand it in the right way, you can use this to merge two po-files... > And of course base-config is in debian cvs where anyone can check in a > translation, in the po-debconf form that I prefer. So all this close to > a step backwards for base-config, maybe not so for everything else > though. maybe for base-config. But 'all' the other packages don't use cvs.debian.org, don't use translated debconf templates, don't support changes in search some translators etc. Maybe some of the base-config template translators can use this translations in the ddtp and can update your po files per hand... Gruss Grisu FYI: only 800 debconf templates and we have all debconf templates from sid translated into german :-) -- Michael Bramer - a Debian Linux Developer http://www.debsupport.de PGP: finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Linux Sysadmin -- Use Debian Linux "Wissensdurst ist die fluessige Form von Bildungshunger"
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 05:11:26PM -0500, Joey Hess wrote: [...] > And of course base-config is in debian cvs where anyone can check in a > translation [...] Being able to automatically extract upstream homepage URL from package meta-data has already been discussed (even if I don't remember clearly where this discussion has gone), but having a standardized way to extract URLs for development version would also be very helpful. Denis
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 11:26:24PM +0100, Michael Bramer wrote: > IMHO this changes of the translation is the big problem. > > And the server translate the description not on a package base. If I > templates file has 10 templates, the server will submit 10 bug reports > per language. I'm sure people are willing to work with you to figure out a reasonable frequence. I think that one wishlist severity bug per source package per month, filed only if there are new translations relative to the package in unstable, is sufficient. It would be even nicer if the reports could be sent as followup to pre-existing debconf translation bugs sent by this mechanism, but that might be tedious to code. Bugs like this piling up might be a useful metric for measuring maintain inactivity or indifference to l10n, anyway. -- G. Branden Robinson|The first thing the communists do Debian GNU/Linux |when they take over a country is to [EMAIL PROTECTED] |outlaw cockfighting. http://people.debian.org/~branden/ |-- Oklahoma State Senator John Monks pgpLQsh5vLfej.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
Michael Bramer wrote: > The ddtp will produce also po-debconf files in future. I must only write > some scripts for it... I did something like: for lang in cs da de es fr hu it ja nl pl pt_BR ru ; do wget http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/template_unstable/base-config/templates-$lang; done rename 's/-/./' templates-* debconf-gettextize templates I don't want to use the result for base-config though. The generated po files reference only the downloaded templates file, while base-config uses three seperate templates files which should be referenced prperly by the po files. And I have no tools to tell which of the translations on this site are more up-to-date than the ones in debconf. And of course base-config is in debian cvs where anyone can check in a translation, in the po-debconf form that I prefer. So all this close to a step backwards for base-config, maybe not so for everything else though. -- see shy jo pgplZy5KhFMKD.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 02:23:56PM +0100, Simon Richter wrote: > Javier/Michael, > > On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 02:04:28PM +0100, Javier Fernández-Sanguino Peña > wrote: > > > some other with this opinion? > > > I believe most Debian Developers share this opinion. The BTS is > > the place to keep track of package issues, I, personally, don't like to go > > to other places (or don't have time to investigate them) to include > > patches/bug fixes (excluding upstream of course). > > I believe that translations change so often that the "real" bugs would > get lost in a pile of auto-generated bug reports. IMO it would be nice > to have a note "new translations available" on the BTS and PTS pages, so > you know that you need to call "ddtp-update-translations" or whatever > the mighty script will be called. IMHO this changes of the translation is the big problem. And the server translate the description not on a package base. If I templates file has 10 templates, the server will submit 10 bug reports per language. Gruss Grisu -- Michael Bramer - a Debian Linux Developer http://www.debsupport.de PGP: finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Linux Sysadmin -- Use Debian Linux "Every use of Linux is a proper use of Linux." -- John "Maddog" Hall, Keynote at the Linux Kongress in Cologne pgpWI0bJKT6vP.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 01:03:59AM +, Colin Watson wrote: > On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 01:41:34AM +0100, Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis > wrote: > > On Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 05:54:21PM -0600, Steve Langasek wrote: > > > > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. > > > > See http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/gnuplot/ddts-stat.png > > > > It seems that you don't use po-debconf: isn't it? > > AFAIK we all should switch to po-debconf for a better translation system. > > If we're going to do that I think it would be a good idea to get > po-debconf into a stable update, so that backporting packages to woody > doesn't become more difficult than it needs to be. A po-debconf package for woody is available at http://people.debian.org/~barbier/devel/woody/ But take care that dh_installdebconf in woody does not handle po-debconf templates, you have to call po2debconf as explained in the README.Debian file. Denis
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 12:00:20PM -0600, Steve Greenland wrote: > On 27-Nov-02, 11:04 (CST), Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > [use the BTS to notify maintainers about debconf translation updates] > > What he said. An e-mail to the BTS (perhaps maint-only) with the > attached po file would be exactly what I'd want. (The BTS suport MIME > attachements now, right?) Correct. There should be no problem attaching .po files, and I'd encourage translators to do this because it's then less likely for mailers to mangle their encoding in transit. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On 27-Nov-02, 11:04 (CST), Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [use the BTS to notify maintainers about debconf translation updates] What he said. An e-mail to the BTS (perhaps maint-only) with the attached po file would be exactly what I'd want. (The BTS suport MIME attachements now, right?) Steve (another one) -- Steve Greenland The irony is that Bill Gates claims to be making a stable operating system and Linus Torvalds claims to be trying to take over the world. -- seen on the net
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 01:10:33PM -0200, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote: > On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Simon Richter wrote: > > I believe that translations change so often that the "real" bugs would > > get lost in a pile of auto-generated bug reports. IMO it would be nice > Rate-limit them to one per (week, month, maintainer-defined). And make them > simple notifications that there are new updates to the po-debconf structure > for package foo... Why create such a complicated system just to avoid integrating this information into the BTS where it belongs? I would be *elated* if any of my packages ever received translation bugs often enough for two of them to sit open at a time. As it is, getting debconf translations for packages is a lot like pulling teeth, and any system that would have maintainers add another step to their routine (besides keeping track of bug reports) in order to get this information is little better. > > Most people will probably make a cron job that updates the descriptions > > on all of their packages. Notifying these people is unnecessary. I have never heard anyone complain about receiving bug reports (at the proper severity) containing new debconf translations. Perhaps notifications are not /necessary/, but why are they /inappropriate/? What are the implications for packages whose maintainers don't feel bothered to set up cronjobs? -- Steve Langasek postmodern programmer pgpQkYZff2dwe.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Simon Richter wrote: > I believe that translations change so often that the "real" bugs would > get lost in a pile of auto-generated bug reports. IMO it would be nice Rate-limit them to one per (week, month, maintainer-defined). And make them simple notifications that there are new updates to the po-debconf structure for package foo... > Most people will probably make a cron job that updates the descriptions > on all of their packages. Notifying these people is unnecessary. As long as the ddtd server is changed for po-debconf, that would be feasible IMHO. Heck, I'd love to have it export the translations as a CVS repository... -- "One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond where the shadows lie." -- The Silicon Valley Tarot Henrique Holschuh
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
Javier/Michael, On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 02:04:28PM +0100, Javier Fernández-Sanguino Peña wrote: > > some other with this opinion? > I believe most Debian Developers share this opinion. The BTS is > the place to keep track of package issues, I, personally, don't like to go > to other places (or don't have time to investigate them) to include > patches/bug fixes (excluding upstream of course). I believe that translations change so often that the "real" bugs would get lost in a pile of auto-generated bug reports. IMO it would be nice to have a note "new translations available" on the BTS and PTS pages, so you know that you need to call "ddtp-update-translations" or whatever the mighty script will be called. Most people will probably make a cron job that updates the descriptions on all of their packages. Notifying these people is unnecessary. Simon -- GPG Fingerprint: 040E B5F7 84F1 4FBC CEAD ADC6 18A0 CC8D 5706 A4B4 pgpcdhMk9xfJp.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
* Michael Bramer | The ddtp will produce also po-debconf files in future. I must only write | some scripts for it... Would you please also nice your scripts on gluck? They are eating loads and loads of CPU time. Also rewriting them to keep state would be a good thing. (Or running them on your own box and uploading the results to gluck.) -- Tollef Fog Heen,''`. UNIX is user friendly, it's just picky about who its friends are : :' : `. `' `-
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 08:01:13AM +0100, Michael Bramer wrote: > > > > I would like to recive the translation as bugs, so i hope you'll set it up > > in > > this way sooner or later. > > some other with this opinion? > I believe most Debian Developers share this opinion. The BTS is the place to keep track of package issues, I, personally, don't like to go to other places (or don't have time to investigate them) to include patches/bug fixes (excluding upstream of course). Regards Javi pgp2NXpsqB7yr.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
* Michael Bramer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2002-11-27 00:21]: > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. Good to see that those are coordinated now, too. > If you are a package maintainer, you can obtain a package-related > file from > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/maintainer/$PACKAGE with more > information. It would be nice if it can be sorted by $MAINTAINER, too. I dislike the idea to have to look for every single package instead of having a pool for all of my packages. Have fun, Alfie -- char *strstr(const char *haystack, const char *needle); -- STRSTR(3) Linux Programmer's Manual pgp7GgVDBucJC.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Michael Bramer wrote: > But IMHO the best should be, if some dh_-script download the last > translations from some web site. comments about this? Not bad. But I often build packages while beeing off-line ... (Sorry for my previous mail. I should check debian-devel before replying to mails at debian-announce...) Kind regards Andreas.
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002, Michael Bramer wrote: > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. > See http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/gnuplot/ddts-stat.png Great. > If you are a package maintainer, you can obtain a package-related > file from > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/maintainer/$PACKAGE with more > information. What about generating a bug report against the package. I would love an information via e-mail about translations because I would definitely forget to check this page before uploading a new package version. Kind regards Andreas.
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 01:41:34AM +0100, Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis wrote: > On Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 05:54:21PM -0600, Steve Langasek wrote: > > > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. > > > See http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/gnuplot/ddts-stat.png > > It seems that you don't use po-debconf: isn't it? > AFAIK we all should switch to po-debconf for a better translation system. The ddtp will produce also po-debconf files in future. I must only write some scripts for it... > > Is it your intention for these translations to only be made available on > > the ddtp website, instead of being submitted directly to maintainers as > > bug reports? > > I would like to recive the translation as bugs, so i hope you'll set it up in > this way sooner or later. some other with this opinion? Gruss Grisu -- Michael Bramer - a Debian Linux Developer http://www.debsupport.de PGP: finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Linux Sysadmin -- Use Debian Linux >| X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (Win98; I) Wie sollst Du auch verstehen können? -- Stefan Scholl in dasr pgpg6czFCTgUf.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 05:54:21PM -0600, Steve Langasek wrote: > On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 12:21:28AM +0100, Michael Bramer wrote: > > You can download translated template files from > > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/template_unstable/$PACKAGE (like > > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/template_unstable/base-config/templates-de > > for German) > > Is it your intention for these translations to only be made available on > the ddtp website, instead of being submitted directly to maintainers as > bug reports? I can do this. But IMHO the best should be, if some dh_-script download the last translations from some web site. comments about this? I write some scripts to make links in the PTS to the ddtp now. Gruss Grisu -- Michael Bramer - a Debian Linux Developer http://www.debsupport.de PGP: finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Linux Sysadmin -- Use Debian Linux >| X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (Win98; I) Wie sollst Du auch verstehen können? -- Stefan Scholl in dasr pgpuMXyzI2CSD.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 07:32:06PM -0600, Steve Langasek wrote: > Debconf translations that aren't delivered into the maintainers' hands > become a waste of translators' time. Well, all maintainers could just be automatically subscribed to an opt-out mailing list to which *all* debconf translations, for *all* packages are mailed. -- G. Branden Robinson|I just wanted to see what it looked Debian GNU/Linux |like in a spotlight. [EMAIL PROTECTED] |-- Jim Morrison http://people.debian.org/~branden/ | pgpSke4qTKzx0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 01:41:34AM +0100, Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis wrote: > > Is it your intention for these translations to only be made available on > > the ddtp website, instead of being submitted directly to maintainers as > > bug reports? > I would like to recive the translation as bugs, so i hope you'll set it up in > this way sooner or later. I think it's even more important that these be submitted as bug reports for those maintainers who /don't/ particularly like to receive them: the criticism that DDTP description translations should not be filed as bugs stands because maintainers are not currently empowered to make use of these translations, but in the case of debconf templates, maintainers can make use of them -- and *must* do so for them to be of benefit to users. Debconf translations that aren't delivered into the maintainers' hands become a waste of translators' time. -- Steve Langasek postmodern programmer pgpVNb5RXSUpN.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 01:41:34AM +0100, Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis wrote: > On Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 05:54:21PM -0600, Steve Langasek wrote: > > > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. > > > See http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/gnuplot/ddts-stat.png > > It seems that you don't use po-debconf: isn't it? > AFAIK we all should switch to po-debconf for a better translation system. If we're going to do that I think it would be a good idea to get po-debconf into a stable update, so that backporting packages to woody doesn't become more difficult than it needs to be. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Tue, Nov 26, 2002 at 05:54:21PM -0600, Steve Langasek wrote: > > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. > > See http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/gnuplot/ddts-stat.png It seems that you don't use po-debconf: isn't it? AFAIK we all should switch to po-debconf for a better translation system. > Is it your intention for these translations to only be made available on > the ddtp website, instead of being submitted directly to maintainers as > bug reports? I would like to recive the translation as bugs, so i hope you'll set it up in this way sooner or later. ciao, -- Luca - De Whiskey's - De Vitis | Elegant or ugly code as well aliases: Luca ^De [A-Z][-A-Za-z]*[iy]'?s$ | as fine or rude sentences have Infinite loop: see `Loop, infinite'.| something in common: they Loop, infinite: see `Infinite loop'.| don't depend on the language.
Re: debconf template translations from ddtp
On Wed, Nov 27, 2002 at 12:21:28AM +0100, Michael Bramer wrote: > We've started the translation of debconf templates some weeks ago. > See http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/gnuplot/ddts-stat.png > The debconf template translation is still in a beta stage and only > few translators from 2-3 language teams are making translations > every now and then. > But now the first translated debconf templates from the ddtp is > downloadable from the ddtp web site. > At http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/maintainer/new.all.txt you'll get > a list of all packages including new translated debconf templates. > (File http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/maintainer/new.all.sort.txt is > sorted by number of new translated templates) > The ddtp server has 84 new translated templates for the base-config > package (first line). The package uses 33 templates of which: > - 29 are translated into German, and > - 12 are in ddtp's db only (not in the unstable base-config package) > You can download translated template files from > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/template_unstable/$PACKAGE (like > http://ddtp.debian.org/debconf/template_unstable/base-config/templates-de > for German) > Comments? Is it your intention for these translations to only be made available on the ddtp website, instead of being submitted directly to maintainers as bug reports? -- Steve Langasek postmodern programmer pgpgJhR2JZpvR.pgp Description: PGP signature
