How to handle ´/etc/ld.so.preload library packages?

2001-06-04 Thread Marc Haber

I have a package with a library that needs to be entered to
/etc/ld.so.preload. It is clear that this library needs to go in /lib
rather than /usr/lib because there are systems that have /usr on a
dedicated partition.

But how do I handle the entry to /etc/ld.so.preload? There are
packages that leave the ld.so.preload entry to the user, but they
probably make the system fail when they are uninstalled and the user
forgets to manually remove the ld.so.preload entry.

So, how am I to deal with this in the packaging?

(1)
Don't add the lib to /etc/ld.so.preload, display a hint for the user
to do so, but remove the entry in the prerm if the package is to be
removed?

(2)
Ask the user if I should add the lib to /etc/ld.so.preload in the
postinst and automatically remove the entry in prerm? Does order in
/etc/ld.so.preload matter?

(3)
Do everything fully automatic?

Any comments will be appreciated.

Greetings
Marc

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Re: OK to use /etc/default for non-init script default data?

2001-06-04 Thread Marc Haber

On Mon, 4 Jun 2001 10:12:19 +0100, Julian Gilbey
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Why not just /etc/foorc or /etc/foo.conf or something like that?

Because the conffile is not a "real" conffile, but rather a shell
script being sourced in, and /etc/foo.conf will probably suggest that
this conffile is an upstream feature.

Greetings
Marc

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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Michèl Alexandre Salim

--- Sam Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >
"Michèl" == Michèl Alexandre Salim
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> And if you come up with a clean solution for the
> changelog issue, I
> agree this is worth doing.  If you do that, please
> let me know what
> your solution is.
> 
As Richard Atterer said there should probably be
another set of debian scripts provided by the upstream
author (if possible) and maintained independently from
the Debian-maintained scripts.

Rather a neat idea. And certainly I have seen it
implemented - for Enlightenment 0.17 CVS for instance.
It is still the duty of the Debian maintainer to make
sure the Debian version of the scripts conform to
Debian specifications, but if something major changes
in the package the author(s) would know best what has
changes.

So it is a two-way process: if Debian policy changes
the maintainer informs the author, if the packaging
changes the author-maintained debian scripts will
still allow building of the package seamlessly while
the Debian maintainer work on integrating the changes.

There could probably be a naming scheme enforced, with
say package version x.y.z having an upstream deb at
version x.y.z.hack.n while the Debian version at
x.y.z.official.n - the names are just example, I
presume official will be seen by dpkg as being a
higher version than hack?

Just my penny's worth..

Regards,

Michel


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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Sam Hartman

> "Michèl" == Michèl Alexandre Salim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> 
Michèl> The reason I raise this issue in the first place is
Michèl> actually a notion that it would be nice for users wanting
Michèl> bleeding-edge software to update from CVS and just run
Michèl> debian/rules binary or dpkg-buildpackage, the same way
Michèl> they can rpm -tb package.tar.gz currently (granted, most
Michèl> of the time one thing or another is broken. Especially the
Michèl> changelog - rather incredible).

And if you come up with a clean solution for the changelog issue, I
agree this is worth doing.  If you do that, please let me know what
your solution is.


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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Richard Atterer

On Mon, Jun 04, 2001 at 06:31:54PM +0100, Michèl Alexandre Salim wrote:
[debian/ in upstream makes maintaining package difficult]
> The reason I raise this issue in the first place is actually a
> notion that it would be nice for users wanting bleeding-edge
> software to update from CVS and just run debian/rules binary or
> dpkg-buildpackage, the same way they can rpm -tb package.tar.gz
> currently (granted, most of the time one thing or another is broken. 
> Especially the changelog - rather incredible).

I've been thinking about this as well - it /would/ be nice for a user
to just run dpkg-buildpackage after unpacking the tarball...

Maybe a simple and straightforward solution would be to provide a
"debian.upstream" directory in the upstream sources, and a rule in the
upstream Makefile which soft-links this to "debian" before running
dpkg-buildpackage. Then the user would only have to "make deb".

Cheers,

  Richard

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Re: OK to use /etc/default for non-init script default data?

2001-06-04 Thread Julian Gilbey

On Mon, Jun 04, 2001 at 10:31:18AM +0200, Marc Haber wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> let's say I have a package foo with a binary foo. The author suggests
> the one should have a shell script wrapper to be able to call the foo
> binary with the appropriate options. I want to do so in my package.
> 
> - Have the foo-Binary in /usr/lib/foo/foo
> - Have a foo shell script wrapper in /usr/bin/foo
> - /usr/bin/foo sources /etc/default/foo so that the admin can change
>   the default values without interfering with the wrapper itself.
> 
> This is the way to do it for an init script. Is it OK to have a file
> in  /etc/default that does not provider defaults for an init script
> but for an executeable called by users?

Why not just /etc/foorc or /etc/foo.conf or something like that?  I
don't know if it's such a great idea to pollute the /etc/default
namespace, and it's not intuitive.

   Julian

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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Sam Hartman

> "Michèl" == Michèl Alexandre Salim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

Michèl> Hello, A general observation of Unix programs in general -
Michèl> a lot more of them come with RPM spec files, even
Michèl> generates them automatically from a spec.in file, than
Michèl> with debian scripts.


A lot of this has to do with the relative value of doing so.  An RPM
outside of the Redhat archive is more common than a deb outside of the
Debian archive.  Debian is willing to accept most DFSG free packages
into its archive, so users can get a good approximation of all the
Debian software available by looking at what is in unstable.

RPM-based distributions tend to be more selective about what they
accept.  Thus, a user is going to be just as likely to go to the
original author as to their distribution to find software.

As a Debian user, I will  tend to go to Debian before the original
author.  If there is a debian directory, I am likely to find it
already in Debian and never get to the original author's site.

Note that Debian directories outside of Debian have dubious utility.
Really only the maintainer  should be editing debian/changelog, but
yet if debian/changelog doesn't match the version of software, then
siginifacnt problems may result..



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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Michèl Alexandre Salim


--- Josip Rodin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Sun,
Jun 03, 2001 at 11:40:26PM -0300, Henrique
> de Moraes Holschuh wrote:
> files there.  Even if
> > upstream keeps its debian/ up-to-date, it will
> still cause you trouble if
> > you have to remove a file, as you'll need to
> either use dirty tricks, or
> 
> Adding 'rm -f debian/foo' in debian/rules clean rule
> is not a dirty trick.
> 
The reason I raise this issue in the first place is
actually a notion that it would be nice for users
wanting bleeding-edge software to update from CVS and
just run debian/rules binary or dpkg-buildpackage, the
same way they can rpm -tb package.tar.gz currently
(granted, most of the time one thing or another is
broken. Especially the changelog - rather incredible).


Then again, most of the time the diff.gz from
packages.debian.org can be applied cleanly so it is
not much of a problem - just when the software has
radically changed (like Glib 1.2 -> Glib 1.3).

Regards,

Michel


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Status update: GLib/GTK+ 1.3 CVS

2001-06-04 Thread Michèl Alexandre Salim

Hello,

A brief follow-up to my post last weekend. The current
status of my test packages are as follows:

GLib - packages created. RFC - I am not a seasoned
developer (yet!), any advice more than welcome.

Gtk-doc - needed if you want to recompile GNOME CVS
modules (including GLib). I have packaged the CVS
version, should be stable as I just applied the debian
scripts from gtk-doc-package in sid

Pango - stuck, problem with shlibs:Depends not being
accepted by dpkg-gencontrol as a result of which
package has no dependencies. See post to
debian-mentors, any help very appreciated

Atk
GTK+
   both waiting for Pango

Packages downloadable from
sourceforge.net/projects/alterdeb

Any new (and would-be) maintainers wanting to put up
Debian packages for review more than welcome to put it
there as well, just shout :)

TIA,

Michel


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Re: ITP: glib2, gtk2, inti

2001-06-04 Thread Michèl Alexandre Salim


--- Robert Bihlmeyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >
Michèl Alexandre Salim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> writes:
> 
> > Have not managed to package Pango - can anyone
> assist me in finding
> > out what is going wrong? Basically the package
> failed the install
> > stage of the rules script if installed using an
> alternate path
> > (specified using prefix or DESTDIR).
> 
> Exactly how does it break? Copy the exact error
> message if feasable.
> 
> -- 
> Robbe
Funny, could not replicate the error now, guess I was
sloppy and did not clean up and rebuild the source
before attempting it again. Have another problem
though, when building libpango0 dpkg-gencontrol
complained thus:

dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution
variable ${shlibs:Depends}

Attached are the debian/control and debian/rules
files.

If this is fixed I can finish packaing libatk0 and
then libgtk+1.3, currently a bit wary having a package
that does not depend on anything.

TIA,

Michel


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 rules


Re: OK to use /etc/default for non-init script default data?

2001-06-04 Thread Joey Hess

Marc Haber wrote:
> This is the way to do it for an init script. Is it OK to have a file
> in  /etc/default that does not provider defaults for an init script
> but for an executeable called by users?

I don't know. I don't see a lot of advantage over just putting the
conffile in /etc.

There is something to be said for leaving /etc/default/ only for init
scripts. Of course, "default" is perhaps not the best name for it if it
only holds init script configs.

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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Josip Rodin
On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 11:40:26PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote:
> Most of the time, no. Upstream debian/ cruft gets in the way of the updated
> debian/ files, especially if you need to delete files there.  Even if
> upstream keeps its debian/ up-to-date, it will still cause you trouble if
> you have to remove a file, as you'll need to either use dirty tricks, or

Adding 'rm -f debian/foo' in debian/rules clean rule is not a dirty trick.

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Re: first questions

2001-06-04 Thread Robert Bihlmeyer

Andreas Bombe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> It's just that making the package non-native makes it easier to
> handle unless it's really a native package (i.e. written
> specifically for Debian).

YMMV, obviously. I find it easier to maintain quintuple-agent without
Debian subversions; "native" if you will.

> For a native package, a small bug in packaging requires a whole new
> release.  If it's not a Debian-specific package, you inflict a new
> version number on all the users outside of Debian who feel compelled to
> download the new release to stay on the edge.

You're not forced to put the new version up for download outside of
Debian. Or you can point out in the release notes that the changes are
only relevant if you use the Debian package.

quintuple-agent in Debian is at 1.0.3 while the "upstream"
distribution point still has 1.0.0. Now, who said that Debian has only
outdated versions, huh?

-- 
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 signature.ng


Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Robert Bihlmeyer

Russell Coker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> On Monday 04 June 2001 00:59, Julian Gilbey wrote:
> > On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> > > Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under
> > > /dev MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not
> > > need to have makedev installed.
> >
> > Should this stuff go into policy?
> 
> I think so.

In this case, please also add consideration for the Hurd. "hurd"
package provides "makedev" so the above would work.

"makedev (>> 1.2.3) | devfsd" is a problem, though.

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Re: Integration of debian/ scripts in packages

2001-06-04 Thread Josip Rodin

On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 11:40:26PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote:
> Most of the time, no. Upstream debian/ cruft gets in the way of the updated
> debian/ files, especially if you need to delete files there.  Even if
> upstream keeps its debian/ up-to-date, it will still cause you trouble if
> you have to remove a file, as you'll need to either use dirty tricks, or

Adding 'rm -f debian/foo' in debian/rules clean rule is not a dirty trick.

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Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Russell Coker
On Monday 04 June 2001 10:34, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> > Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under
> > /dev MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not
> > need to have makedev installed.
>
> Well, makedev is priority: required and section: base. Is it
> necessary for packages to declare an explicit dependency in that
> case?

Currently many (most? all?) packages that need to create device nodes depend 
on makedev.  I have been filing bug reports against them because I believe 
that they should depend on "makedev|devfs".  I would be happy to have them 
depend on neither but the maintainers of some of the packages are quite 
adamant that they want to depend on such a package.

As for it being required and base, I want to remove makedev from my systems.  
I have no need for it.

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Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Russell Coker
On Monday 04 June 2001 00:59, Julian Gilbey wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> > Also make the package check for the presence of the character device
> > /dev/.devfsd first, if that device exists then your script must not
> > attempt to create the device node and it should be left for the kernel to
> > do it!  If you create a node under /dev when devfs is running it may
> > result in an attempt to load the module, also the node will disappear on
> > reboot!
> >
> > Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under
> > /dev MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not
> > need to have makedev installed.
>
> Should this stuff go into policy?

I think so.

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Re: /usr/share policy

2001-06-04 Thread Julian Gilbey
On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 07:23:08PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:
> Julian Gilbey wrote:
> > Agreed.  (And I don't think /usr/share/ is mandated.)
> 
>  Every package MUST be accompanied by a verbatim copy of its copyright
>  and distribution license in the file
>  `/usr/share/doc/__/copyright'
> 
>  Packages that are not Debian-native MUST contain a copy of
>  `debian/changelog' file from the Debian source tree in
>  `/usr/share/doc/' as `changelog.Debian.gz'.
> 
> (Caps mine.)

That's not the issue under discussion; we're talking about putting
data in /usr/share/ or elsewhere in /usr/share, not about the
copyright file, etc.

   Julian

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Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Hamish Moffatt
On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under /dev 
> MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not need to have 
> makedev installed.

Well, makedev is priority: required and section: base. Is it
necessary for packages to declare an explicit dependency in that
case?

Admittedly, it's not essential: yes. Nor is libc6.

Hamish
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OK to use /etc/default for non-init script default data?

2001-06-04 Thread Marc Haber
Hi,

let's say I have a package foo with a binary foo. The author suggests
the one should have a shell script wrapper to be able to call the foo
binary with the appropriate options. I want to do so in my package.

- Have the foo-Binary in /usr/lib/foo/foo
- Have a foo shell script wrapper in /usr/bin/foo
- /usr/bin/foo sources /etc/default/foo so that the admin can change
  the default values without interfering with the wrapper itself.

This is the way to do it for an init script. Is it OK to have a file
in  /etc/default that does not provider defaults for an init script
but for an executeable called by users?

Greetings
Marc

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Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Russell Coker

On Monday 04 June 2001 10:34, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> > Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under
> > /dev MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not
> > need to have makedev installed.
>
> Well, makedev is priority: required and section: base. Is it
> necessary for packages to declare an explicit dependency in that
> case?

Currently many (most? all?) packages that need to create device nodes depend 
on makedev.  I have been filing bug reports against them because I believe 
that they should depend on "makedev|devfs".  I would be happy to have them 
depend on neither but the maintainers of some of the packages are quite 
adamant that they want to depend on such a package.

As for it being required and base, I want to remove makedev from my systems.  
I have no need for it.

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Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Russell Coker

On Monday 04 June 2001 00:59, Julian Gilbey wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> > Also make the package check for the presence of the character device
> > /dev/.devfsd first, if that device exists then your script must not
> > attempt to create the device node and it should be left for the kernel to
> > do it!  If you create a node under /dev when devfs is running it may
> > result in an attempt to load the module, also the node will disappear on
> > reboot!
> >
> > Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under
> > /dev MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not
> > need to have makedev installed.
>
> Should this stuff go into policy?

I think so.

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Re: /usr/share policy

2001-06-04 Thread Julian Gilbey

On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 07:23:08PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:
> Julian Gilbey wrote:
> > Agreed.  (And I don't think /usr/share/ is mandated.)
> 
>  Every package MUST be accompanied by a verbatim copy of its copyright
>  and distribution license in the file
>  `/usr/share/doc/__/copyright'
> 
>  Packages that are not Debian-native MUST contain a copy of
>  `debian/changelog' file from the Debian source tree in
>  `/usr/share/doc/' as `changelog.Debian.gz'.
> 
> (Caps mine.)

That's not the issue under discussion; we're talking about putting
data in /usr/share/ or elsewhere in /usr/share, not about the
copyright file, etc.

   Julian

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Re: Adding device file to /dev.

2001-06-04 Thread Hamish Moffatt

On Sun, Jun 03, 2001 at 02:37:19PM +0200, Russell Coker wrote:
> Another thing any package that depends on the creation of nodes under /dev 
> MUST depend on "makedev | devfsd".  People who run devfsd do not need to have 
> makedev installed.

Well, makedev is priority: required and section: base. Is it
necessary for packages to declare an explicit dependency in that
case?

Admittedly, it's not essential: yes. Nor is libc6.

Hamish
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OK to use /etc/default for non-init script default data?

2001-06-04 Thread Marc Haber

Hi,

let's say I have a package foo with a binary foo. The author suggests
the one should have a shell script wrapper to be able to call the foo
binary with the appropriate options. I want to do so in my package.

- Have the foo-Binary in /usr/lib/foo/foo
- Have a foo shell script wrapper in /usr/bin/foo
- /usr/bin/foo sources /etc/default/foo so that the admin can change
  the default values without interfering with the wrapper itself.

This is the way to do it for an init script. Is it OK to have a file
in  /etc/default that does not provider defaults for an init script
but for an executeable called by users?

Greetings
Marc

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Marc Haber  |   " Questions are the | Mailadresse im Header
Karlsruhe, Germany  | Beginning of Wisdom " | Fon: *49 721 966 32 15
Nordisch by Nature  | Lt. Worf, TNG "Rightful Heir" | Fax: *49 721 966 31 29


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Re: ITP: glib2, gtk2, inti

2001-06-04 Thread Michèl Alexandre Salim

--- Robert Bihlmeyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >
Michèl Alexandre Salim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> writes:
> 
> [your mail formatting was totally messed up, BTW]
>
Yes, sorry about that :) Using the university's
network connection to do most of my e-mailing and
somehow or another it is fraught with problems, not
sure how they set up the firewalls. HTTP access was
particularly slow so I did not bother doing a preview
- sorry for that, and for sending it twice too. Timed
out loading the 'message sent' page.

> > Have not managed to package Pango - can anyone
> assist me in finding
> > out what is going wrong? Basically the package
> failed the install
> > stage of the rules script if installed using an
> alternate path
> > (specified using prefix or DESTDIR).
> 
> Exactly how does it break? Copy the exact error
> message if feasable.
> 
Thanks for the offer :) Will post it tomorrow.
Probably going to set up Red Hat on my other machine
to see if building the RPM works.

Regards,

Michel


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