Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 10:25:16PM +, Brian M. Carlson wrote: On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) It should be Depends: sendmail | postfix . You cannot depend on a non-free package if you are in main. Is this package free? I could not find a license anywhere. I believe it is permitted to depend on a non-free package as a possible, but not preferred, alternative in a list. -- Steve Langasek postmodern programmer pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 03:37:25PM -0800, John H. Robinson, IV wrote: to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. well that is a slippery slope, because with that argument you could kill any dependancies anywhere. if someone is replacing a package with something outside of debians control than that person is responsible for telling debian that the dependancy is fullfilled after all. if a mail-server is needed then a mailserver is needed. therefore it should be listed as dependancy. greetings, martin. -- interested in doing pike programming, sTeam/caudium/pike/roxen training, sTeam/caudium/roxen and/or unix system administration anywhere in the world. -- pike programmer working in europe csl-gmbh.net open-steam.org (www.archlab|(www|db).hb2).tuwien.ac.at unixbahai.or.at iaeste.(tuwien.ac|or).at systemadministrator (stuts|black.linux-m68k).orgis.(schon.org|root.at) Martin Bähr http://www.iaeste.or.at/~mbaehr/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
Hi, On Tue, Feb 25, 2003 at 01:14:25PM +0100, Martin Baehr wrote: On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 03:37:25PM -0800, John H. Robinson, IV wrote: to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. well that is a slippery slope, because with that argument you could kill any dependancies anywhere. if someone is replacing a package with something outside of debians control than that person is responsible for telling debian that the dependancy is fullfilled after all. if a mail-server is needed then a mailserver is needed. therefore it should be listed as dependancy. Perhaps. However, I think that specifying a dependency on services that can be accessed using well defined protocols instead of library APIs is an equally slippery slope. For example, I'd truly hate it if something would specify a dependency on mysql-server when a package merely requires you to configure a hostname, username and password to a working database somewhere. As a suggestion: why not draw the border at network interfaces vs. programmatic interfaces? A package that that calls /usr/bin/sendmail -t to queue mail could depend on virtual package that supplies this interface, but a package that connects to port 25 somewhere should not, even though it depends on an MTA for correct operation. The same for port 80 or port 3306. It would be nice if standard programmatic interfaces such as the /usr/bin/sendmail example would always have virtual packages and an easy way for administrators to tell dpkg that something provides this common interface, without having to go out of your way to build a full package. I may be missing something that already exists though; in that case I appreciate any pointers you have. Cheers, Emile. -- E-Advies / Emile van Bergen | [EMAIL PROTECTED] tel. +31 (0)70 3906153| http://www.e-advies.info pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 03:37:25PM -0800, John H. Robinson, IV wrote: to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. well that is a slippery slope, because with that argument you could kill any dependancies anywhere. if someone is replacing a package with something outside of debians control than that person is responsible for telling debian that the dependancy is fullfilled after all. if a mail-server is needed then a mailserver is needed. therefore it should be listed as dependancy. greetings, martin. -- interested in doing pike programming, sTeam/caudium/pike/roxen training, sTeam/caudium/roxen and/or unix system administration anywhere in the world. -- pike programmer working in europe csl-gmbh.net open-steam.org (www.archlab|(www|db).hb2).tuwien.ac.at unixbahai.or.at iaeste.(tuwien.ac|or).at systemadministrator (stuts|black.linux-m68k).orgis.(schon.org|root.at) Martin Bähr http://www.iaeste.or.at/~mbaehr/
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
Hi, On Tue, Feb 25, 2003 at 01:14:25PM +0100, Martin Baehr wrote: On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 03:37:25PM -0800, John H. Robinson, IV wrote: to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. well that is a slippery slope, because with that argument you could kill any dependancies anywhere. if someone is replacing a package with something outside of debians control than that person is responsible for telling debian that the dependancy is fullfilled after all. if a mail-server is needed then a mailserver is needed. therefore it should be listed as dependancy. Perhaps. However, I think that specifying a dependency on services that can be accessed using well defined protocols instead of library APIs is an equally slippery slope. For example, I'd truly hate it if something would specify a dependency on mysql-server when a package merely requires you to configure a hostname, username and password to a working database somewhere. As a suggestion: why not draw the border at network interfaces vs. programmatic interfaces? A package that that calls /usr/bin/sendmail -t to queue mail could depend on virtual package that supplies this interface, but a package that connects to port 25 somewhere should not, even though it depends on an MTA for correct operation. The same for port 80 or port 3306. It would be nice if standard programmatic interfaces such as the /usr/bin/sendmail example would always have virtual packages and an easy way for administrators to tell dpkg that something provides this common interface, without having to go out of your way to build a full package. I may be missing something that already exists though; in that case I appreciate any pointers you have. Cheers, Emile. -- E-Advies / Emile van Bergen | [EMAIL PROTECTED] tel. +31 (0)70 3906153| http://www.e-advies.info pgpvKxVvk9UXA.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) It should be Depends: sendmail | postfix . You cannot depend on a non-free package if you are in main. Is this package free? I could not find a license anywhere. It would be even better if you could make it work with a generic mail-transport-agent. -- Brian M. Carlson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 0x560553e7 Let us think the unthinkable, let us do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all. --Douglas Adams pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
Brian M. Carlson wrote: On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) It would be even better if you could make it work with a generic mail-transport-agent. to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. it is at your discretion to not support such a setup, of course. -john -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
Hi, correct me if I am wrong... On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 03:37:25PM -0800, John H. Robinson, IV wrote: Brian M. Carlson wrote: On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like ^^^ Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) There are nullmailer and ssmtp It would be even better if you could make it work with a generic mail-transport-agent. Yes :-) Something along (exim | mail-transport-agent) ^ to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. What? Why this needs to be supported in depends: field. This is user issue. Use equives to fake it or build a local package with Provide: mail-transport-agent in terms of dependancies. it is at your discretion to not support such a setup, of course. Package should not do funky thing for dependancies, I thought. Osamu -- ~\^o^/~~~ ~\^.^/~~~ ~\^*^/~~~ ~\^_^/~~~ ~\^+^/~~~ ~\^:^/~~~ ~\^v^/~~~ + Osamu Aoki [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cupertino CA USA, GPG-key: A8061F32 .''`. Debian Reference: post-installation user's guide for non-developers : :' : http://qref.sf.net and http://people.debian.org/~osamu `. `' Our Priorities are Our Users and Free Software --- Social Contract -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) It should be Depends: sendmail | postfix . You cannot depend on a non-free package if you are in main. Is this package free? I could not find a license anywhere. It would be even better if you could make it work with a generic mail-transport-agent. -- Brian M. Carlson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 0x560553e7 Let us think the unthinkable, let us do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all. --Douglas Adams pgpFfHCPfNZlN.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
Brian M. Carlson wrote: On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) It would be even better if you could make it work with a generic mail-transport-agent. to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. it is at your discretion to not support such a setup, of course. -john
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
Hi, correct me if I am wrong... On Mon, Feb 24, 2003 at 03:37:25PM -0800, John H. Robinson, IV wrote: Brian M. Carlson wrote: On Fri, Feb 21, 2003 at 09:41:18AM +0100, Xavier Roche wrote: In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like ^^^ Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) There are nullmailer and ssmtp It would be even better if you could make it work with a generic mail-transport-agent. Yes :-) Something along (exim | mail-transport-agent) ^ to throw even more monkeywrenches in the gearbox, some people may have compiled an MTA outside of the packaging system, and be using qmail/ sendmail/postfix (the uspported MTA's) but not have it registered with apt/dpkg at all. What? Why this needs to be supported in depends: field. This is user issue. Use equives to fake it or build a local package with Provide: mail-transport-agent in terms of dependancies. it is at your discretion to not support such a setup, of course. Package should not do funky thing for dependancies, I thought. Osamu -- ~\^o^/~~~ ~\^.^/~~~ ~\^*^/~~~ ~\^_^/~~~ ~\^+^/~~~ ~\^:^/~~~ ~\^v^/~~~ + Osamu Aoki [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cupertino CA USA, GPG-key: A8061F32 .''`. Debian Reference: post-installation user's guide for non-developers : :' : http://qref.sf.net and http://people.debian.org/~osamu `. `' Our Priorities are Our Users and Free Software --- Social Contract
How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
I'm considering packaging TPC from http://www.tpc.int, and it requires configuring the MTA to accept email to specific domain names. Needless to say, it's a fairly complicated mail server configuration. In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? If so, how would I detect which MTA is installed (and possibly what directory to place the example config file)? -- If a man talks in the forest, and no woman hears himis he still wrong? -- Scott DeLucia, WTAW www.GCFL.net (The Good, Clean Funnies List): Good, clean funnies five times a week, no ads, free! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
John Price [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'm considering packaging TPC from http://www.tpc.int, and it requires configuring the MTA to accept email to specific domain names. Needless to say, it's a fairly complicated mail server configuration. In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? You can either - distribute example files for different MTAs in /usr/share/doc/tpc/examples and a README.Debian that gives hints how to use them - or use debconf to ask the user what he wants/uses and then configure that one. - or use things like /etc/postfix/main.cf - postfix, /path/to/something/else - another one For this package *I* would go with the first one. -- bye Joerg maxx Aqua mach mal man brain Aquariophile maxx: schon probiert das gibts ned msg08659/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? Is this method correct? for pkg in sendmail qmail postfix; do if dpkg -s $pkg 2/dev/null | grep -E ^Status: install ok installed /dev/null; then INSTPKG=$pkg fi done case $INSTPKG in sendmail) ... ;; qmail) ... ;; postfix) ... ;; esac -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
John Price (2003-02-21 01:54:24 -0600) : I'm considering packaging TPC from http://www.tpc.int, and it requires configuring the MTA to accept email to specific domain names. Needless to say, it's a fairly complicated mail server configuration. In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? What I do for sourceforge (not the package currently in unstable) and gforge is this: the main package (sourceforge) depends on sourceforge-mta-exim | sourceforge-mta, and then I have sourceforge-mta-exim and sourceforge-mta-postfix pacakges. Depending on which one you install, then, you know what MTA to configure for. Roland. -- Roland Mas That's one of the good fings about not existin'; they leave you alone most of the time. -- in My Hero (Tom Holt) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
John Price [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'm considering packaging TPC from http://www.tpc.int, and it requires configuring the MTA to accept email to specific domain names. Needless to say, it's a fairly complicated mail server configuration. In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? You can either - distribute example files for different MTAs in /usr/share/doc/tpc/examples and a README.Debian that gives hints how to use them - or use debconf to ask the user what he wants/uses and then configure that one. - or use things like /etc/postfix/main.cf - postfix, /path/to/something/else - another one For this package *I* would go with the first one. -- bye Joerg maxx Aqua mach mal man brain Aquariophile maxx: schon probiert das gibts ned pgpTwkIHql5YE.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file Ensure that the depends: field in control has something like Depends: (sendmail | qmail | postfix) in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? Is this method correct? for pkg in sendmail qmail postfix; do if dpkg -s $pkg 2/dev/null | grep -E ^Status: install ok installed /dev/null; then INSTPKG=$pkg fi done case $INSTPKG in sendmail) ... ;; qmail) ... ;; postfix) ... ;; esac
Re: How to detect if Sendmail/Postfix/Qmail is installed
John Price (2003-02-21 01:54:24 -0600) : I'm considering packaging TPC from http://www.tpc.int, and it requires configuring the MTA to accept email to specific domain names. Needless to say, it's a fairly complicated mail server configuration. In this case, should the package just document what the use should do (it will be different for each MTA) or at least detect which MTA is installed and copy an example config file in the correct place for whichever MTA is installed? What I do for sourceforge (not the package currently in unstable) and gforge is this: the main package (sourceforge) depends on sourceforge-mta-exim | sourceforge-mta, and then I have sourceforge-mta-exim and sourceforge-mta-postfix pacakges. Depending on which one you install, then, you know what MTA to configure for. Roland. -- Roland Mas That's one of the good fings about not existin'; they leave you alone most of the time. -- in My Hero (Tom Holt)
