Re: RFS: naev
On Sat, 09 Jul 2011 at 18:34:09 -0700, Vincent Cheng wrote: > Thanks for the review. Please also consider reviewing my most > up-to-date packaging in the Debian Games svn repository; my Naev > packaging at mentors.d.n is heavily outdated at the moment, mostly > because I'm getting tired of having to upload a 200 MB tarball every > time I want to make a minor change to my packaging. Have you considered splitting the package, along the same lines as OpenArena and Nexuiz? Even if your upstream always releases the code and data together, you're much more likely to need to fix bugs in the packaging or code than you are in the data. If you keep the .menu files and other Debian additions with the code, you'll only need to upload a relatively small .deb for fixes to either the code, or the menu entries etc. There are basically three ways you could go: * Single monolithic source package, like Wesnoth. As you have noted, this is a pain to upload! * One source package for code (and other small/easy-to-patch things like menu entries and man pages), one for data, like OpenArena in squeeze. naev Depends: naev-data with version constraints. This is quicker for you to upload, but if the -data package is too large, it won't get into debian-cd CD releases, only DVDs and BluRays (I think the cutoff for CDs is a couple of hundred MB). * One source package for code, several for data, like OpenArena in sid/experimental. naev Depends: naev-textures, naev-music, naev-data (or whatever) with version constraints. When I asked the ftp-masters, Mark Hymer said they didn't object to this. Steve McIntyre (debian-cd maintainer) recommended aiming for about 50 to 100 MB when splitting data packages like this. > As far as I understand, it's not an issue that blocks Naev from > entering the archives (while binaries/executables need to be able to > be built from source code, I don't think policy mandates that images > must be built/rendered from source...if that's the case, an awful lot > of packages currently in Debian would have to tweak their build > system). In my understanding of Policy and the DFSG, there's a difference between data not being built from source code, and data not being accompanied by source code at all. Data not *being built from* source code is a technical bug: it means upstream haven't given you a deterministic build system (and you haven't been able to construct one). It's a bug, but not necessarily a fatal one. (OpenArena has that bug too - upstream don't provide a build system for the data, probably because it involves a lot of manual exporting; the derived files are checked-in to svn alongside the source files.) Data not *having* source code is a Policy/DFSG bug. In principle, for each file in the binary package, the DFSG require you to include corresponding source code in the source package, even if it isn't actually rebuilt. For some (most?) game upstreams, it's difficult to tell what the corresponding source code *is* (is image.jpg the preferred form for modification or is there a .xcf version somewhere? we just don't know), but you should at least include a best-effort guess at what the source is. (OpenArena also has this problem; the source packages in sid/experimental contain my best guess at what the source was.) Where possible, the most reliable way to know that the "source" you're providing is the actual source is to rebuild it, but I realise this isn't always feasible, particularly for upstreams whose background is game modding rather than Free Software. S -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-games-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20110710075050.ga2...@reptile.pseudorandom.co.uk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20110710075050.ga2...@reptile.pseudorandom.co.uk
Re: RFS: naev
On Sun, Jul 10, 2011 at 9:50 AM, Simon McVittie wrote: > In my understanding of Policy and the DFSG, there's a difference between > data not being built from source code, and data not being accompanied by > source code at all. > > Data not *being built from* source code is a technical bug: it means upstream > haven't given you a deterministic build system (and you haven't been able > to construct one). It's a bug, but not necessarily a fatal one. > > (OpenArena has that bug too - upstream don't provide a build system for the > data, probably because it involves a lot of manual exporting; the derived > files are checked-in to svn alongside the source files.) > > Data not *having* source code is a Policy/DFSG bug. In principle, for each > file in the binary package, the DFSG require you to include corresponding > source code in the source package, even if it isn't actually rebuilt. > > For some (most?) game upstreams, it's difficult to tell what the corresponding > source code *is* (is image.jpg the preferred form for modification or is > there a .xcf version somewhere? we just don't know), but you should at least > include a best-effort guess at what the source is. (OpenArena also has this > problem; the source packages in sid/experimental contain my best guess at > what the source was.) > > Where possible, the most reliable way to know that the "source" you're > providing is the actual source is to rebuild it, but I realise this isn't > always feasible, particularly for upstreams whose background is game modding > rather than Free Software. In the case of naev, I was able to find the source code by interrogating upstream on the #debian-games IRC channel. I found out that the pre-built data is in the same VCS as the engine and the source for the data exists, but is in two separate git repositories (one shared with vegastrike/adonthell), is rarely rebuilt and currently the 3D stuff cannot be rebuilt with current tools, since the Blender Python API changed very incompatibility. git://github.com/bobbens/naev.git https://github.com/Deiz/naev-artwork.git http://pingus.seul.org/~grumbel/vegastrike.git/ Personally I would not be willing to upload naev in its current state. Ideally there would be multiple source packages that build their respective data/code properly into corresponding binary packages, perhaps like this: naev naev-engine naev-tools naev-gfx naev-ships naev-asteroids naev-people Fedora on the other hand are fine with this situation: http://cedarandthistle.wordpress.com/2011/07/09/naev-is-now-in-fedora/ -- bye, pabs http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAKTje6E-7vXAkdjR=zmqvuio4u76orswst3vcvvbq+40n1x...@mail.gmail.com
Re: RFS: naev
> That makes sense, yes - but where can one find the original source archive? > Below, you are speaking of some upstream changes since 0.5.0, hence there > should > be some newer version of that upstream archive!? I've just re-uploaded the latest version of Naev (along with my most up-to-date packaging) to mentors.d.n: - URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev - Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable main contrib non-free - dget http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev/naev_0.5.0-1.dsc > I'm not sure whether anybody other than upstream can help resolving those > questions!? I added a brief explanation on these "issues" to Naev's ITP bug report a few days ago. [1] As far as I understand, it's not an issue that blocks Naev from entering the archives (while binaries/executables need to be able to be built from source code, I don't think policy mandates that images must be built/rendered from source...if that's the case, an awful lot of packages currently in Debian would have to tweak their build system). I recall that this was a hotly-discussed topic a few weeks back on debian-devel [2], and I understand why it would certainly be preferable to build everything from source (not just code, but also graphics, documentation, etc.), but as mentionned in my ITP bug, I myself currently do not have the technical knowledge required to set up such a build system for Naev. I've talked to upstream about this [3], but understandably this issue isn't one of their priorities at the moment. You can't really blame them either...would you rather be hacking on an exciting new piece of code to add a cool new feature to your game, or take on the boring, time-consuming task of setting up a build system for stuff other than the code itself? Especially since several other distros/packagers don't seem to care much about it either? Personally, I'd prefer to just upload Naev as it currently stands right now, and work on setting up a build system for all of Naev's images afterwards and implement it in a later upload, but I'm not a DD so the final choice isn't really mine. :) Kind regards, - Vincent Cheng [1] http://bugs.debian.org/609295 [2] http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2011/06/msg00110.html [3] http://groups.google.com/group/naev/browse_thread/thread/54835cda1f0b6379 (scroll down to Edgar's reply) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CACZd_tB=4=MYsRdVHw7Payu_cAWx5B=8qyx7nexae+sh-l-...@mail.gmail.com
Re: RFS: naev
Hi again, > Hi Michael, > > Thanks for the review. Please also consider reviewing my most > up-to-date packaging in the Debian Games svn repository; my Naev > packaging at mentors.d.n is heavily outdated at the moment, mostly > because I'm getting tired of having to upload a 200 MB tarball every > time I want to make a minor change to my packaging. > > $ svn co svn://svn.debian.org/svn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/naev/ > That makes sense, yes - but where can one find the original source archive? Below, you are speaking of some upstream changes since 0.5.0, hence there should be some newer version of that upstream archive!? [...] > > - In src/, a few files contain copyright and license information. Those > > copyright holders (and licenses) are not reflected in debian/copyright. > > Upstream has added copyright/license info to every source file since > the latest Naev 0.5.0 release, so this shouldn't be an issue. > That update is very much appreciated; however, unless some source files were removed, there is still a need to update debian/copyright to list all copyright holders. I will provide more precise input once you let me know where to find the most recent upstream source. > > - Your debian/changelog file gives pointers to further potential issues. > > And I'd gladly accept any help in resolving those issues. > I'm not sure whether anybody other than upstream can help resolving those questions!? > > Aside these missing bits, it would be preferable if licenses found in > > /usr/share/common-licenses were not quoted in full; I'm asking for this > > because > > the copyright file is already huge anyhow. > > None of the various Creative Commons licenses (which take up the bulk > of debian/copyright) are found under /usr/share/common-licenses. > Indeed, sorry for the noise! Best regards, Michael pgpJcLEJoUfrx.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: RFS: naev
Hi Michael, Thanks for the review. Please also consider reviewing my most up-to-date packaging in the Debian Games svn repository; my Naev packaging at mentors.d.n is heavily outdated at the moment, mostly because I'm getting tired of having to upload a 200 MB tarball every time I want to make a minor change to my packaging. $ svn co svn://svn.debian.org/svn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/naev/ > - What about the file in build/? Added it to debian/copyright in svn, thanks! > - The contents of dat/ is a bit dangerous: the font files appear to lack the > sources that they were generated from!? This is already addressed in svn; naev now depends on ttf-freefont and links to the fonts contained in that package. > - In src/, a few files contain copyright and license information. Those > copyright holders (and licenses) are not reflected in debian/copyright. Upstream has added copyright/license info to every source file since the latest Naev 0.5.0 release, so this shouldn't be an issue. > - Your debian/changelog file gives pointers to further potential issues. And I'd gladly accept any help in resolving those issues. > Aside these missing bits, it would be preferable if licenses found in > /usr/share/common-licenses were not quoted in full; I'm asking for this > because > the copyright file is already huge anyhow. None of the various Creative Commons licenses (which take up the bulk of debian/copyright) are found under /usr/share/common-licenses. Thanks again for your review! Kind regards, - Vincent Cheng -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caczd_tdqhk8p+t9-z40-wb2sr6jm5bf52qezu5ew18otnop...@mail.gmail.com
Re: RFS: naev
Hi, > I am looking for a sponsor for my packages "naev" and "naev-data". > > * Package name: naev, naev-data > Version : 0.4.2-1 > Upstream Author : Edgar Simo "bobbens" > Nikola Whallon <6.satur...@gmail.com> > Josiah Schwartfeger > Deiz > Bas Fournier "BTAxis" > * URL : http://code.google.com/p/naev/ > * License : code - GPL-3 ; data - public domain, > GPLv2, GPLv3, CC-By (and -SA) 3.0 > Programming Lang: C, Lua > Section : games > Description : 2D space trading combat game > [...] I've taken a look at this package and would really hope for further input from the Games team, as they might be much more experienced with the mix of licenses that occurs when packaging graphics and sound files together with the source code. My main focus of this reviewing round was the copyright file; it is already very helpful to be in DEP-5 format, but I'm afraid it's still incomplete: - What about the file in build/? - The contents of dat/ is a bit dangerous: the font files appear to lack the sources that they were generated from!? - In src/, a few files contain copyright and license information. Those copyright holders (and licenses) are not reflected in debian/copyright. - Your debian/changelog file gives pointers to further potential issues. Aside these missing bits, it would be preferable if licenses found in /usr/share/common-licenses were not quoted in full; I'm asking for this because the copyright file is already huge anyhow. Hope this helps, Michael pgpeTYC9cZQAS.pgp Description: PGP signature
RFS: naev
Dear mentors, I am looking for a sponsor for my packages "naev" and "naev-data". * Package name: naev, naev-data Version : 0.4.2-1 Upstream Author : Edgar Simo "bobbens" Nikola Whallon <6.satur...@gmail.com> Josiah Schwartfeger Deiz Bas Fournier "BTAxis" * URL : http://code.google.com/p/naev/ * License : code - GPL-3 ; data - public domain, GPLv2, GPLv3, CC-By (and -SA) 3.0 Programming Lang: C, Lua Section : games Description : 2D space trading combat game It builds these binary packages: (naev) naev - 2D space trading combat game naev-dbg - 2D space trading combat game (debug) (naev-data) naev-data - 2D space trading combat game (data files) The upload would fix these bugs: 523834, 609295, 622982 My motivation for maintaining this package is: Naev's another fun game to go into Debian's ever expanding repository of games. :) The packages can be found on mentors.debian.net: (naev) - URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev - Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable main contrib non-free - dget http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev/naev_0.4.2-1.dsc (naev-data) - URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev-data - Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable main contrib non-free - dget http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev/naev-data_0.4.2-1.dsc I would be glad if someone uploaded this package for me. Kind regards Vincent Cheng
Re: RFS: naev
On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 2:52 AM, Niels Thykier wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA256 > > On 2011-01-11 09:18, Vincent Cheng wrote: > > Dear mentors, > > > > I am looking for a sponsor for my package "naev". > > > > * Package name: naev > > Version : 0.4.2 > > Upstream Author : Edgar Simo "bobbens" > > Nikola Whallon <6.satur...@gmail.com> > > Josiah Schwartfeger > > Deiz > > Bas Fournier "BTAxis" > > * URL : http://code.google.com/p/naev/ > > * License : code - GPL-3 > > data - public domain, GPLv2, GPLv3, CC-By (and -SA) > 3.0 > > (upstream has confirmed that the GPLv2-licensed data files are actually > > licensed as GPLv2+, > > so there shouldn't be any licensing issues) > > Programming Lang: C, Lua > > Description : 2D space trading combat game > > NAEV is a 2D space trading and combat game, in a similar > > vein to Escape Velocity. > > > > NAEV is played from a top-down perspective, featuring fast-paced combat, > > many ships and outfits, and a large galaxy to explore. The game is > highly > > open-ended, letting players proceed at their own paces. > > > > It builds these binary packages: > > naev - 2D space trading combat game > > naev-data - 2D space trading combat game - data files > > > > The package appears to be lintian clean. > > > > The upload would fix these bugs: 523834, 609295 > > > > My motivation for maintaining this package is: This is a fun game that I > > personally enjoy playing, and I hope that this package would be useful to > > other Debian users who would like to easily give Naev a try. > > > > The package can be found on mentors.debian.net: > > - URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev > > - Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable > main > > contrib non-free > > - dget > http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev/naev_0.4.2-1.dsc > > > > I would be glad if someone uploaded this package for me. > > > > Kind regards > > Vincent Cheng > > > > Hey > > Have you tried contacting the Games team about having them to review the > package? > > ~Niels > > > -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ > > iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJNMCrfAAoJEAVLu599gGRCe30P/3kpO50+OcGrSwOImjlbB5Gr > HiHI/8WR4VeqfZX5BioRUT260n/IS1GgJU3pTNXK457aJVgLQoGn7RND1l4dVpNh > 6ovoHgtjWYrUtgHoOft8wIrSlOmIrEr7F5yxouTQ/0o71KuFmPFjO+n19grHLvYq > K1GnhU6PgPsrJVTivoTtI5TdAsPOkzHEqDi/PwslkOtuiYtauZaAnWR4QJ6fRKk5 > IeWI9ZJ2LYyvba+7HKUaQ9j7Odk1Cfd7rke+R1vEF4/gfaTHl+wOmQfm7EtSTL4k > //DPIOlGITR/RfGeM5vgjBTe2dMa1yLnmsTOJdv2Phe1LG/I4phQG6YdkqOkEuTP > kwmlGiPRdc/T4wSdCnynUVvcFirgtP0jPW6ku8jHjPXCmhfwdkJ38ecR+MAKauMe > pSlILFP0XR2l7z2PKVD7155FMRrgxrpT3Q7V2CBfqF1Y0hPT3E0q6LE5dOGI8oUW > DeGxh8n45w+6BGcTE7kHqRsGHn+VqydQWyAT8ahMOP93ndX3vPM2yRMb7QRZrrGG > dV97PN0YwgbKAxFTtk9dgA5yOFUMjSeKSRVOnHCGzDLK/4O3J9fxV8LSt/ZNmoBX > xu60QCpXJtY7KQ3f78lY7kkEsCQeHlXkgAh08Z+pv0qyLG95REfq9NGdFae99ORZ > ett5NH8nAAgVTXlHjmfJ > =kz6w > -END PGP SIGNATURE- > Thanks for your suggestion; I've just sent an e-mail the Debian Games Team's mailing list. Hopefully there'll be someone there who would be interested in reviewing my package. - Vincent
Re: RFS: naev
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 2011-01-11 09:18, Vincent Cheng wrote: > Dear mentors, > > I am looking for a sponsor for my package "naev". > > * Package name: naev > Version : 0.4.2 > Upstream Author : Edgar Simo "bobbens" > Nikola Whallon <6.satur...@gmail.com> > Josiah Schwartfeger > Deiz > Bas Fournier "BTAxis" > * URL : http://code.google.com/p/naev/ > * License : code - GPL-3 > data - public domain, GPLv2, GPLv3, CC-By (and -SA) 3.0 > (upstream has confirmed that the GPLv2-licensed data files are actually > licensed as GPLv2+, > so there shouldn't be any licensing issues) > Programming Lang: C, Lua > Description : 2D space trading combat game > NAEV is a 2D space trading and combat game, in a similar > vein to Escape Velocity. > > NAEV is played from a top-down perspective, featuring fast-paced combat, > many ships and outfits, and a large galaxy to explore. The game is highly > open-ended, letting players proceed at their own paces. > > It builds these binary packages: > naev - 2D space trading combat game > naev-data - 2D space trading combat game - data files > > The package appears to be lintian clean. > > The upload would fix these bugs: 523834, 609295 > > My motivation for maintaining this package is: This is a fun game that I > personally enjoy playing, and I hope that this package would be useful to > other Debian users who would like to easily give Naev a try. > > The package can be found on mentors.debian.net: > - URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev > - Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable main > contrib non-free > - dget http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev/naev_0.4.2-1.dsc > > I would be glad if someone uploaded this package for me. > > Kind regards > Vincent Cheng > Hey Have you tried contacting the Games team about having them to review the package? ~Niels -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJNMCrfAAoJEAVLu599gGRCe30P/3kpO50+OcGrSwOImjlbB5Gr HiHI/8WR4VeqfZX5BioRUT260n/IS1GgJU3pTNXK457aJVgLQoGn7RND1l4dVpNh 6ovoHgtjWYrUtgHoOft8wIrSlOmIrEr7F5yxouTQ/0o71KuFmPFjO+n19grHLvYq K1GnhU6PgPsrJVTivoTtI5TdAsPOkzHEqDi/PwslkOtuiYtauZaAnWR4QJ6fRKk5 IeWI9ZJ2LYyvba+7HKUaQ9j7Odk1Cfd7rke+R1vEF4/gfaTHl+wOmQfm7EtSTL4k //DPIOlGITR/RfGeM5vgjBTe2dMa1yLnmsTOJdv2Phe1LG/I4phQG6YdkqOkEuTP kwmlGiPRdc/T4wSdCnynUVvcFirgtP0jPW6ku8jHjPXCmhfwdkJ38ecR+MAKauMe pSlILFP0XR2l7z2PKVD7155FMRrgxrpT3Q7V2CBfqF1Y0hPT3E0q6LE5dOGI8oUW DeGxh8n45w+6BGcTE7kHqRsGHn+VqydQWyAT8ahMOP93ndX3vPM2yRMb7QRZrrGG dV97PN0YwgbKAxFTtk9dgA5yOFUMjSeKSRVOnHCGzDLK/4O3J9fxV8LSt/ZNmoBX xu60QCpXJtY7KQ3f78lY7kkEsCQeHlXkgAh08Z+pv0qyLG95REfq9NGdFae99ORZ ett5NH8nAAgVTXlHjmfJ =kz6w -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4d302adf.2020...@thykier.net
RFS: naev
Dear mentors, I am looking for a sponsor for my package "naev". * Package name: naev Version : 0.4.2 Upstream Author : Edgar Simo "bobbens" Nikola Whallon <6.satur...@gmail.com> Josiah Schwartfeger Deiz Bas Fournier "BTAxis" * URL : http://code.google.com/p/naev/ * License : code - GPL-3 data - public domain, GPLv2, GPLv3, CC-By (and -SA) 3.0 (upstream has confirmed that the GPLv2-licensed data files are actually licensed as GPLv2+, so there shouldn't be any licensing issues) Programming Lang: C, Lua Description : 2D space trading combat game NAEV is a 2D space trading and combat game, in a similar vein to Escape Velocity. NAEV is played from a top-down perspective, featuring fast-paced combat, many ships and outfits, and a large galaxy to explore. The game is highly open-ended, letting players proceed at their own paces. It builds these binary packages: naev - 2D space trading combat game naev-data - 2D space trading combat game - data files The package appears to be lintian clean. The upload would fix these bugs: 523834, 609295 My motivation for maintaining this package is: This is a fun game that I personally enjoy playing, and I hope that this package would be useful to other Debian users who would like to easily give Naev a try. The package can be found on mentors.debian.net: - URL: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev - Source repository: deb-src http://mentors.debian.net/debian unstable main contrib non-free - dget http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/n/naev/naev_0.4.2-1.dsc I would be glad if someone uploaded this package for me. Kind regards Vincent Cheng
