Re: package transition question
On Mon, Nov 08, 2010 at 10:08:56AM +0800, Paul Wise wrote: > On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 6:58 AM, Harald Jenny > wrote: > > > Well I thought you were talking about using it in the Debian install scripts > > which would make it rather Debian specific (upstream development is done > > rather > > with Fedora). > > Well, the model you would need to write could be used by both the > Debian maintainer scripts and the equivalent for other distros. H sounds interesting, will talk to upstream maintainers about it. > > >> Combining it with the init script syntax check would be the best option. > > > > True but I'm not very comfortable with doing great steps during Squeeze > > freeze > > (about what amount of line counts for simple checks are we talking here?). > > Here I will concede, adding a Config::Model is definitely not squeeze > material, but something to consider for wheezy if there are > configuration changes from squeeze. Totally agreeing. > > -- > bye, > pabs Thanks and kind regards Harald > > http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise > > > -- > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org > Archive: > http://lists.debian.org/aanlktimrtrgxzmo4jrmjipcbuttyyjcwv0r-b+7ae...@mail.gmail.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20101108061917.ga10...@harald-has.a-little-linux-box.at
Re: package transition question
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 6:58 AM, Harald Jenny wrote: > Well I thought you were talking about using it in the Debian install scripts > which would make it rather Debian specific (upstream development is done > rather > with Fedora). Well, the model you would need to write could be used by both the Debian maintainer scripts and the equivalent for other distros. >> Combining it with the init script syntax check would be the best option. > > True but I'm not very comfortable with doing great steps during Squeeze freeze > (about what amount of line counts for simple checks are we talking here?). Here I will concede, adding a Config::Model is definitely not squeeze material, but something to consider for wheezy if there are configuration changes from squeeze. -- bye, pabs http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktimrtrgxzmo4jrmjipcbuttyyjcwv0r-b+7ae...@mail.gmail.com
Re: package transition question
On Sun, Nov 07, 2010 at 04:22:22PM +0800, Paul Wise wrote: > On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 3:08 PM, Harald Jenny > wrote: > > > That's a very nice suggestion but I think the init script option will make > > more > > sense for the OS community as a whole. > > Config::Model is not distribution-specific so I fail to see how using > it would be worse. Well I thought you were talking about using it in the Debian install scripts which would make it rather Debian specific (upstream development is done rather with Fedora). > > Combining it with the init script syntax check would be the best option. True but I'm not very comfortable with doing great steps during Squeeze freeze (about what amount of line counts for simple checks are we talking here?). > > -- > bye, > pabs Kind regards Harald > > http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise > > > -- > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org > Archive: > http://lists.debian.org/aanlktimyjgg1rw1coyruktewudvhcnvr5arehn+9r...@mail.gmail.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20101107225821.gb4...@harald-has.a-little-linux-box.at
Re: package transition question
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 3:08 PM, Harald Jenny wrote: > That's a very nice suggestion but I think the init script option will make > more > sense for the OS community as a whole. Config::Model is not distribution-specific so I fail to see how using it would be worse. Combining it with the init script syntax check would be the best option. -- bye, pabs http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktimyjgg1rw1coyruktewudvhcnvr5arehn+9r...@mail.gmail.com
Re: package transition question
On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 10:13:28PM +0800, Paul Wise wrote: > On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 8:26 PM, The Fungi wrote: > > > Alternatives would be (more user friendly) come up with a > > configuration translator if all existing options can have a 1-to-1 > > transform/mapping to new options or syntax, > > You can use Config::Model to facilitate such configuration upgrades. > The maintainers / upstream of it are enthusiastic and would probably > give you help to implement this. That's a very nice suggestion but I think the init script option will make more sense for the OS community as a whole. > > -- > bye, > pabs Kind regards Harald > > http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise > > > -- > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org > Archive: > http://lists.debian.org/aanlktimrb3kdau2bwqmixacpfp86bok7_n0oau18k...@mail.gmail.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20101104070829.gc3...@harald-has.a-little-linux-box.at
Re: package transition question
On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 12:26:00PM +, The Fungi wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 11:59:27AM +0100, Harald Jenny wrote:
> [...]
> > Our current idea is to do the installation, run the program in
> > postinst to check for config errors and if we find some we issue a
> > warning message and cease to restart the daemon - or does anybody
> > have a better idea?
>
> Basically the same, just more reusable, would be to check the
> configuration as part of the start/restart/reload sections of the
> new version's initscript. I believe this is the same mechanism
> Apache has been using for years to help prevent killing httpd when
> you try to reload a broken configuration without validating its
> syntax (or when some of its dependent pieces may have gone missing).
Will talk with upstream maitainers about implementing this as it would make
sense not only for Debian...
> Obviously this still leaves the admin in the unfortunate position of
> having to solve his configuration problem on the spot or roll back
> to a previous package version.
Hmmm but when the init script refuses to stop correctly then chances will be
higher that the admin will solve this issue before a real problem arises (at
least I guess/hope so).
>
> Alternatives would be (more user friendly) come up with a
> configuration translator if all existing options can have a 1-to-1
> transform/mapping to new options or syntax,
Not really possible as some options were merged :-/.
> or (less user friendly)
> change package names with the new version and upload a final-ish
> package of the old version which displays loud messages about what
> the new package name is and how to manually transition to it.
Possible but I'm unsure wether this would make it into Squeeze at this point...
But thanks for your suggestions, you helped us very very much (sometimes when
looking at a problem the own view gets very very narrowed indeed...)!
Kind regards
Harald
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Re: package transition question
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 8:26 PM, The Fungi wrote: > Alternatives would be (more user friendly) come up with a > configuration translator if all existing options can have a 1-to-1 > transform/mapping to new options or syntax, You can use Config::Model to facilitate such configuration upgrades. The maintainers / upstream of it are enthusiastic and would probably give you help to implement this. -- bye, pabs http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktimrb3kdau2bwqmixacpfp86bok7_n0oau18k...@mail.gmail.com
Re: package transition question
On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 11:59:27AM +0100, Harald Jenny wrote:
[...]
> Our current idea is to do the installation, run the program in
> postinst to check for config errors and if we find some we issue a
> warning message and cease to restart the daemon - or does anybody
> have a better idea?
Basically the same, just more reusable, would be to check the
configuration as part of the start/restart/reload sections of the
new version's initscript. I believe this is the same mechanism
Apache has been using for years to help prevent killing httpd when
you try to reload a broken configuration without validating its
syntax (or when some of its dependent pieces may have gone missing).
Obviously this still leaves the admin in the unfortunate position of
having to solve his configuration problem on the spot or roll back
to a previous package version.
Alternatives would be (more user friendly) come up with a
configuration translator if all existing options can have a 1-to-1
transform/mapping to new options or syntax, or (less user friendly)
change package names with the new version and upload a final-ish
package of the old version which displays loud messages about what
the new package name is and how to manually transition to it.
--
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WHOIS(STANL3-ARIN); SMTP(fu...@yuggoth.org); FINGER(fu...@yuggoth.org);
MUD(kin...@katarsis.mudpy.org:6669); IRC(fu...@irc.yuggoth.org#ccl);
ICQ(114362511); YAHOO(crawlingchaoslabs); AIM(dreadazathoth); }
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package transition question
Hi all, I'm facing a problem and thought maybe someone here has a solution or could point me into the right direction: The package openswan currently has version 2.4.12 in Lenny whereas in Squeeze version 2.6.28 will appear. As the version number suggest this means some deep changes, also concerning the configuration parameters in the according config files. With the new version comes an external configuration parsing program which checks for config errors and warns accordingly. Normally this shouldn't be such a great issue as major version changes may break configs but as this package's purpose is secure VPN access we want to take care that the program is not restarted without proper configuration. We first thought about aborting the installation in postinst when the config would not run but this would leave the package in a weird state as the new binaries would have already been unpacked. Aborting in preinst is also unfeasable because we do not have the program installed yet so we can't check if the config is ok or not. Our current idea is to do the installation, run the program in postinst to check for config errors and if we find some we issue a warning message and cease to restart the daemon - or does anybody have a better idea? Kind regards Harald Jenny -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-mentors-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20101103105927.gb3...@harald-has.a-little-linux-box.at
