Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
The reply below was only sent to the d-boot list; forwarding to d-powerpc as I would guess Brian is not subscribed to d-boot. -- Forwarded Message -- Subject: Re: Debian Installer PowerPC Date: Wednesday 29 March 2006 10:12 From: Geert Stappers [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: debian-boot@lists.debian.org On Tue, Mar 28, 2006 at 10:53:44PM -0800, brian morris wrote: hi - i am getting pretty worn out myself putting Debian on a new world mac for first time lately, a G4. i have thinking now it it is a hassle. i think the installer is over automated and that increase bug problems. for instance. Default boot of D-I activates the knowledge that is in the installer, all the default answers are sane well thought decisions. You can make the decisions yourself by booting expert a) the partitioning scheme and type i was given were not much at all to my liking or need. i was not given any option to correct this only take it or leave it. i was not told that journaling was being turned on. since the partition sizes i was given were not suitable i am force to resize later. Even booted default you get the choice to choose between * Whole disk * Largest free space * Manual partitioning 'Manual partitioning' gives you the freedom to partition as _you_ want. my backup drive here is firewire and i am hearing it won't boot a backup. (the backup i made on scsi with the old world machine wouldn't boot either, but i was able to run parted by interrupting the installer - although it no longer tells you you can i guess you can ... ) That has been reported before and even filled in a bugreport. I don't known which BR number nor it's actual state. That means that it might even be done at least it is on the to do list. on more general : i for one am no windows guy. I trained on unix back in the old days and now i am 50% mac at least. i like macs, and i like unix. i can't stand windows. i really can't. is this worth it. i have done some work with Fink project/ macosx.2 jaguar. obviously it it non-free. i don't like that but i need to do some pre-production sorts of work. by the way fink commander is compared to synaptic much better ! ?suggestions ?? SMILE The Debian-Installer only looks over automated. Please have a closer look at D-I and see why it is appricated by many others. Cheers Geert Stappers --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 03:00:19AM +0200, Sven Luther wrote: - various old-world issues, including the work to free miboot, and inclusion of the free miboot version into the official archive. Mmm, i hope Colin Watson doesn't forget to add miboot support to his daily builds, or oldworld support will have been definitively killed. What do I need to do? (If at all possible, I'd prefer to produce a separate build for oldworld until such time as miboot is free, rather than having non-free material in the main daily build used on Debian CDs.) -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 11:50:04AM +0100, Colin Watson wrote: On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 03:00:19AM +0200, Sven Luther wrote: - various old-world issues, including the work to free miboot, and inclusion of the free miboot version into the official archive. Mmm, i hope Colin Watson doesn't forget to add miboot support to his daily builds, or oldworld support will have been definitively killed. What do I need to do? Install the miboot package from http://people.debian.org/~luther/miboot on the buildd. (If at all possible, I'd prefer to produce a separate build for oldworld until such time as miboot is free, rather than having non-free material in the main daily build used on Debian CDs.) bah, if you want, i actually always thought that having the miboot builds in non-free would be best, bu t this idea was coldly received (at the sarge time though). We need to build non-free installer images anyway, for the non-free modules/firmware scenario anyway, so this would be a good test to make this possible later. In this case we can upload miboot to non-free, and see if it can pass, the only problem is that we don't really have the distribution right for the apple boot block, but i kind of doubt apple will ever be bothered to give it. That said, since apple provides tools to create bootable floppies including this boot block, we only need to see the licence of those tools. I fear though that back in those times, the idea of providing a licence for a mere bootblock was kind of not so present, and i believe our usages clearly falls in the fair-use scenario. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 11:50:04AM +0100, Colin Watson wrote: On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 03:00:19AM +0200, Sven Luther wrote: - various old-world issues, including the work to free miboot, and inclusion of the free miboot version into the official archive. Mmm, i hope Colin Watson doesn't forget to add miboot support to his daily builds, or oldworld support will have been definitively killed. What do I need to do? (If at all possible, I'd prefer to produce a separate build for oldworld until such time as miboot is free, rather than having non-free material in the main daily build used on Debian CDs.) Oh, also this one : #355220: linux-kernel-di-powerpc-2.6: doesn't include tg3 modules, means Appple XServe G5 cannot netboot. Needs fixing, it is just adding the tg3 module to the di kernel modules, and reuploading. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: #355220: linux-kernel-di-powerpc-2.6: doesn't include tg3 modules, means Appple XServe G5 cannot netboot. Needs fixing, it is just adding the tg3 module to the di kernel modules, and reuploading. tg3 has the firmware issue, no? -- O T A V I OS A L V A D O R - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] UIN: 5906116 GNU/Linux User: 239058 GPG ID: 49A5F855 Home Page: http://www.freedom.ind.br/otavio - Microsoft gives you Windows ... Linux gives you the whole house. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 05:11:05PM -0300, Otavio Salvador wrote: Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: #355220: linux-kernel-di-powerpc-2.6: doesn't include tg3 modules, means Appple XServe G5 cannot netboot. Needs fixing, it is just adding the tg3 module to the di kernel modules, and reuploading. tg3 has the firmware issue, no? Sure, but it is currently shipped as part of the debian kernels, and as part of the x86 and other d-i kernel .udebs. For some obscure reason it was addeed on x86 and amd64 but not on powerpc. And then people wonder why i say that d-i kernel .udeb maintenance is a mess, and ask for neater technical solutions. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
Hi all, Sven Luther has recently announced [1] that he will no longer work on PowerPC support in Debian Installer. Colin Watson has already taken over the daily building of d-i images for PowerPC, so working daily builds are available again. Colin is willing to do that long term, but if a new porter should like to take care of that, I'm sure this can be discussed. So what does being a d-i porter involve? Mainly it means taking responsibility for architecture specific issues. Ideally this means: - regular testing of the installer, preferably on different subarches - keeping an eye out for installation reports for powerpc and following up on them (especially if architecture specific issues are reported) - taking care of architecture specific components of the installer, such as kernel udebs, bootloader installers, some partman components - reproducing, tracing and (hopefully) resolving bugs - taking care of daily builds of d-i images Familiarity with used filesystems and booting systems is a definite advantage, but in general work on the installer itself is fairly easy as most of it is scripted, with only some parts written in C. Involvement on any level is welcome. Also, as PowerPC has several fairly distinct subarchitectures, getting involved for a specific subarch is an option. The Debian Installer team is generally seen as open, friendly and helpful. And it has to be as the core team is fairly small but depends on a lot of effort from other developers, porters and translators to keep the installer in working order for all the (sub)architectures it supports. General help on the structure and inner workings of the installer and its components is always available. The last release of the installer (Etch Beta 2) had several PowerPC specific issues [2]. We'd very much like to see these resolved. There are also some open issues for the new graphical version of the installer. If you are interested, please contact us on the debian-boot list. Cheers, Frans Pop [1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2006/03/msg01075.html [2] http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/errata pgpErxgowWSKy.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
Although im not able to help in this regard i would like to express my thanks to sven for his work Dean Frans Pop wrote: Hi all, Sven Luther has recently announced [1] that he will no longer work on PowerPC support in Debian Installer. Colin Watson has already taken over the daily building of d-i images for PowerPC, so working daily builds are available again. Colin is willing to do that long term, but if a new porter should like to take care of that, I'm sure this can be discussed. So what does being a d-i porter involve? Mainly it means taking responsibility for architecture specific issues. Ideally this means: - regular testing of the installer, preferably on different subarches - keeping an eye out for installation reports for powerpc and following up on them (especially if architecture specific issues are reported) - taking care of architecture specific components of the installer, such as kernel udebs, bootloader installers, some partman components - reproducing, tracing and (hopefully) resolving bugs - taking care of daily builds of d-i images Familiarity with used filesystems and booting systems is a definite advantage, but in general work on the installer itself is fairly easy as most of it is scripted, with only some parts written in C. Involvement on any level is welcome. Also, as PowerPC has several fairly distinct subarchitectures, getting involved for a specific subarch is an option. The Debian Installer team is generally seen as open, friendly and helpful. And it has to be as the core team is fairly small but depends on a lot of effort from other developers, porters and translators to keep the installer in working order for all the (sub)architectures it supports. General help on the structure and inner workings of the installer and its components is always available. The last release of the installer (Etch Beta 2) had several PowerPC specific issues [2]. We'd very much like to see these resolved. There are also some open issues for the new graphical version of the installer. If you are interested, please contact us on the debian-boot list. Cheers, Frans Pop [1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2006/03/msg01075.html [2] http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/errata -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
Dean Hamstead wrote: Although im not able to help in this regard i would like to express my thanks to sven for his work I agree with Dean ! And I_ wish_ a _quik _return of Sven to debian (k-p, d-i ) team. Regards, Eugen Paiuc Dean Frans Pop wrote: Hi all, Sven Luther has recently announced [1] that he will no longer work on PowerPC support in Debian Installer. [snip..] [] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 02:38:53AM +0200, ee wrote: Dean Hamstead wrote: Although im not able to help in this regard i would like to express my thanks to sven for his work I agree with Dean ! And I_ wish_ a _quik _return of Sven to debian (k-p, d-i ) team. Thanks to both of you, i don't think this will happen though, at least for d-i, as it is clear i am not welcome there anymore. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 02:04:58AM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: Hi all, Sven Luther has recently announced [1] that he will no longer work on PowerPC support in Debian Installer. Colin Watson has already taken over the daily building of d-i images for PowerPC, so working daily builds are available again. Colin is willing to do that long term, but if a new porter should like to take care of that, I'm sure this can be discussed. So what does being a d-i porter involve? Mainly it means taking responsibility for architecture specific issues. Ideally this means: - regular testing of the installer, preferably on different subarches - keeping an eye out for installation reports for powerpc and following up on them (especially if architecture specific issues are reported) - taking care of architecture specific components of the installer, such as kernel udebs, bootloader installers, some partman components - reproducing, tracing and (hopefully) resolving bugs - taking care of daily builds of d-i images Current open issues that i am aware of are : - partman-prep is broken on IBM/CHRP and PREP and doesn't mark the partition as prep and doesn't pass the partition number to prep-installer or yaboot-installer, making debian uninstallable without major hurdle on prep and IBM RS6k and pseries machines. - d-i kernel .udebs need to add support for apus kernels. This was not possible pre-beta2, due to changes being needed in kernel-wedge, and these changes being too hazardous to do shortly before the etch beta2. - nubus support. There is a working 2.4.27 nubus kernel, which needs to get d-i support in order to be usefull for installing on nubus machines. Ideally, the nubus patches should be ported to 2.6.x, but that is another category of work required. - each kernel abi change needs a reupload of the powerpc d-i kernels, and a rechecking of all the modules for a new version. This is a tedious process. - debian-installer CDs don't boot on ibm rs6k 32bit machines. yaboot-installer has a problem on those, and the mkvmlinuz generated kernels with builtin initrd can also not boot (probably due to too huge ramdisk thansk to initramfs-tools). - various old-world issues, including the work to free miboot, and inclusion of the free miboot version into the official archive. Mmm, i hope Colin Watson doesn't forget to add miboot support to his daily builds, or oldworld support will have been definitively killed. - the graphical installer doesn't work anymore on powerpc, the graphical frontend crashes, some heavy debugging is needed here. Well, that is what i see right now, some of these issues are open since a couple of weeks now, if not more, and i saw nobody jump in to fix then, even after i was scheduled for expulsion, so i hope that frans calls will give more results, altough seeing as it is a tedious process with little respect from the d-i team ... Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wednesday 29 March 2006 03:00, Sven Luther wrote: altough seeing as it is a tedious process with little respect from the d-i team ... I have on purpose avoided anything like this in my mail and will not go into any past issues here. I only hope that anyone considering helping out with d-i will make their own judgement based on their own experiences instead of taking Sven's word for this. And yes, the Debian Installer team is very grateful to Sven as well for the hard work he has done for the installer and related packages like parted over the past years. pgpw73e67ozzL.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 03:10:34AM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: On Wednesday 29 March 2006 03:00, Sven Luther wrote: altough seeing as it is a tedious process with little respect from the d-i team ... I have on purpose avoided anything like this in my mail and will not go into any past issues here. I only hope that anyone considering helping out with d-i will make their own judgement based on their own experiences instead of taking Sven's word for this. And yes, the Debian Installer team is very grateful to Sven as well for the hard work he has done for the installer and related packages like parted over the past years. It would have been nice to remember that previously though, since well saying that after basically kicking someone out, well, it does sound more like giving oneself good concience than any kind of gratefullness. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
hi - i am getting pretty worn out myself putting Debian on a new world mac for first time lately, a G4. i have thinking now it it is a hassle. i think the installer is over automated and that increase bug problems. for instance. a) the partitioning scheme and type i was given were not much at all to my liking or need. i was not given any option to correct this only take it or leave it. i was not told that journaling was being turned on. since the partition sizes i was given were not suitable i am force to resize later. my backup drive here is firewire and i am hearing it won't boot a backup. (the backup i made on scsi with the old world machine wouldn't boot either, but i was able to run parted by interrupting the installer - although it no longer tells you you can i guess you can ... ) on more general : i for one am no windows guy. I trained on unix back in the old days and now i am 50% mac at least. i like macs, and i like unix. i can't stand windows. i really can't. is this worth it. i have done some work with Fink project/ macosx.2 jaguar. obviously it it non-free. i don't like that but i need to do some pre-production sorts of work. by the way fink commander is compared to synaptic much better ! ?suggestions ?? --- Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, Mar 29, 2006 at 03:10:34AM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: On Wednesday 29 March 2006 03:00, Sven Luther wrote: altough seeing as it is a tedious process with little respect from the d-i team ... I have on purpose avoided anything like this in my mail and will not go into any past issues here. I only hope that anyone considering helping out with d-i will make their own judgement based on their own experiences instead of taking Sven's word for this. And yes, the Debian Installer team is very grateful to Sven as well for the hard work he has done for the installer and related packages like parted over the past years. It would have been nice to remember that previously though, since well saying that after basically kicking someone out, well, it does sound more like giving oneself good concience than any kind of gratefullness. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wanted: Debian Installer PowerPC porter(s)
On 3/29/06, Frans Pop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, Sven Luther has recently announced [1] that he will no longer work on PowerPC support in Debian Installer. Thanks for all your work. /me asks himself: mybe is time to switch back ARCH=i386 ?! Hopefuly, not. :-) -- Regards, EddyP = Imagination is more important than knowledge A.Einstein
