Success of iPhone apps (was: Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?)
Charles Plessy ple...@debian.org wrote: And in conclusion, I would like to remind the extraordinary success of non-free software on the iPhone, which I think can be explained by the easiness of micropayement through the Apple webstore. It's clearly not the only reason, and it's not even the first one on the list. You should have told about the high level of integration of the whole platform, the overall quality of the (top) apps, the ease of use, the sexiness of the apps, ... and lots of other things that free software apps do, more often than not, lack. But you absolutely do have a point in that there are lessons to be learned, though the one you are highlighting isn't the most important of all. JB. -- Julien BLACHE - Debian GNU/Linux Developer - jbla...@debian.org Public key available on http://www.jblache.org - KeyID: F5D6 5169 GPG Fingerprint : 935A 79F1 C8B3 3521 FD62 7CC7 CD61 4FD7 F5D6 5169 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87wrok1del.fsf...@sonic.technologeek.org
Re: Success of iPhone apps (was: Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?)
Hello, Julien in reply to Charles Plessy ple...@debian.org wrote: And in conclusion, I would like to remind the extraordinary success of non-free software on the iPhone, which I think can be explained by the easiness of micropayement through the Apple webstore. It's clearly not the only reason, and it's not even the first one on the list. You should have told about the high level of integration of the whole platform, the overall quality of the (top) apps, the ease of use, the sexiness of the apps, ... and lots of other things that free software apps do, more often than not, lack. But you absolutely do have a point in that there are lessons to be learned, though the one you are highlighting isn't the most important of all. the iPhone/Pad/Pod app store was such successful that Apple now started to adopt that thing also for the desktop. There must be something to it that escapes us. We do not even need to run a DebStore ourselves, in principle. Anybody could start that. But why has not for instance Mark has already started one? He must have thought about it and certainly has the resources, too. My personal interest would be less in the applications themselves but into good tutorials that should be sold through us - and possibly even be cross platform and cross packages to some degree. Some larger book store should have an interest to support such as an experiment to conquer new markets, possibly. Best regards, Steffen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010084303.228...@gmx.net
Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
[ Please note that this is my very personal opinion and does not neccesarily need to cover the opinion of any of the teams I am in. ] Dear planet folks, I have been made aware that people use Debian resources for personal financial gain using the planet.d.o syndication platform, by for instance including 'flattr' links and images in the text present on planet. Furthermore there are reports of webbugs in some feeds syndicated on planet, or things that systematically leak browsing behaviour to third parties by including images directly from these sides. I think these occurrences might conflict with the rules that govern use of Debian resources. At the very least I consider them to be of extremely bad taste. Therefor I ask you, the maintainers of planet.d.o, to please draft a policy or set of guidelines that will prevent such abuse. Violation of this policy should probably be grounds for removal from planet.debian.org. Cheers, Martin -- Martin Zobel-Helas zo...@debian.org | Debian System Administrator Debian GNU/Linux Developer | Debian Listmaster Public key http://zobel.ftbfs.de/5d64f870.asc - KeyID: 5D64 F870 GPG Fingerprint: 5DB3 1301 375A A50F 07E7 302F 493E FB8E 5D64 F870 signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Hi! Am 11.11.2010 10:56, schrieb Martin Zobel-Helas: [..] Therefor I ask you, the maintainers of planet.d.o, to please draft a policy or set of guidelines that will prevent such abuse. Violation of this policy should probably be grounds for removal from planet.debian.org. +1 Best regards, Alexander -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJM28DWAAoJEMJLZaJnLIsSZzAP/2yBdF67qfLxogKWHucpTosq lIjfNgqEwitKQBK+vYPW2eygba7nZW4icRV0iNaEb/+UVFX+zsHW6Equ0kEV0ike gG4VMpHRt1gnB+Kj9AdeJN+3/VdL2nHAu97K3fKNlOByK1ATR/WLVIfB6icSmfyP H1F+kege9h3ztkcb/UrmmUt4APdO7oNYqlLbzvv7BmUvlpfmdYtOPqWoUUEc0u/Y 0PZJUu6lkfxnwdL+KH2JJ3jJY2fo4D9IDtAE454fLLPN7G3fzULhZV3m0NLEebhZ NTkKuYbKe+lBxG9eptoKnGBw6h6Y1TDJsVqaG0po5aVz4pSr0/FXJ6OCjo9n8iP5 g8HPE9D0n9Hm4qvufJtgl3C9qiuRPyTvyjPIhh73VKPJ8dEK6qMHCFLtaB/TvtZY JcZefOawKYpIv8b7mpnqdfM643lCmByZrSEekd1PQJIdcZnyqyrj2N4/orfDG+Pu JNwv5aYHnquKcusgmupl58SNfg9qMvP57Ee3K8Rl6cAu4OVh4/jqv5ztMu2lY8YB huIN4nt5le84K3dsWNdvjnOQeWSI+e/uIScLQvB1WO+dxLa+nLFhw4oFrdK+oJ/I PoCYJojdmniyQ9grJQC1zvqWQyAXF4p5ftcD/UFQIpsys39NEjKk3/2q9qHBNIWO m3IoHR36ippZA8sCJjX0 =vvRm -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4cdbc0db.5040...@debian.org
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
Hi! * Martin Zobel-Helas zo...@debian.org [2010-11-11 10:56]: I have been made aware that people use Debian resources for personal financial gain using the planet.d.o syndication platform, by for instance including 'flattr' links and images in the text present on planet. Furthermore there are reports of webbugs in some feeds syndicated on planet, or things that systematically leak browsing behaviour to third parties by including images directly from these sides. I think these occurrences might conflict with the rules that govern use of Debian resources. At the very least I consider them to be of extremely bad taste. Therefor I ask you, the maintainers of planet.d.o, to please draft a policy or set of guidelines that will prevent such abuse. Violation of this policy should probably be grounds for removal from planet.debian.org. +1 Martin -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010101602.gi4...@anguilla.debian.or.at
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
[Charles Plessy, 2010-11-11] I would like to underline that the posts on Planet that contain a Flatter button tend to be more about free software than the others in general. I am much more annoyed by family albums for instance, and large pictures in general, because then the whole screen is taken by one post, and it becomes sometimes necessary to scroll a lot to get to the next one. In comparison, the Flatter button does not each much space. +1 [...] The one thing that I find difficult to accept is the use of tracers. I expect debian.org sites to not contain them, nor to use javascript and cookies when avoidable. +1 (pure links are OK, IMHO) -- Piotr Ożarowski Debian GNU/Linux Developer www.ozarowski.pl www.griffith.cc www.debian.org GPG Fingerprint: 1D2F A898 58DA AF62 1786 2DF7 AEF6 F1A2 A745 7645 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010102224.gc1...@piotro.eu
Re: Success of iPhone apps (was: Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?)
And in conclusion, I would like to remind the extraordinary success of non-free software on the iPhone, which I think can be explained by the easiness of micropayement through the Apple webstore. You should have told about the high level of integration of the whole platform, the overall quality of the (top) apps, the ease of use, the sexiness of the apps, ... and lots of other things that free software apps do, more often than not, lack. We do not even need to run a DebStore ourselves, in principle. Anybody could start that. But why has not for instance Mark has already started one? He must have thought about it and certainly has the resources, too. We do not have a DebStore, but we can help the upstream developers who ask for financial support to receive donnations, by providing links to the URL of choice they provide. I have drafted a system to feed the Ultimate Debian Database with metadata about upstream. I and Andreas tested it on a local UDD clone for bibliographic information, and I think it could be used for financial support as well. Since this is not related to planet.debian.org, I will start a new thread when a test system will be implemented with the real UDD, rather than giving more details here. What I wanted to underline by the parallel with the Apple Webapps, is that it seems that some developers like it because it fits their aspiration of becoming self-employed. I have the impression that at least some Flattr buttons on Planet have the same purpose. Given how manpower is lacking in Debian, I find the initiative quite welcome, even if Flatter is not ideal and the first enthousiastic uses can be a bit loud. Cheers, -- Charles Plessy Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010105055.ga14...@merveille.plessy.net
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 11:56, Martin Zobel-Helas zo...@debian.org wrote: [ Please note that this is my very personal opinion and does not neccesarily need to cover the opinion of any of the teams I am in. ] Dear planet folks, I have been made aware that people use Debian resources for personal financial gain using the planet.d.o syndication platform, by for instance including 'flattr' links and images in the text present on planet. -1 for flattr; it's a great way to contribute a few cents; and these people are great contributors to Debian anyways, so why don't they get rewarded? while on that topic, maybe each package on package.qa.d.o should have a flattr button ;-) Furthermore there are reports of webbugs in some feeds syndicated on planet, or things that systematically leak browsing behaviour to third parties by including images directly from these sides. I don't know much about this one, so no positive or negative vote from me. -- blog: http://tshepang.tumblr.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlkti=pd4lr+hv+0bg+fp1mmejuwlwhxh-wpew8-...@mail.gmail.com
Re: commercial spam on planet
Dne, 11. 11. 2010 01:23:51 je Stefano Zacchiroli napisal(a): general unhappiness (at least as it appears from this list, which is not necessarily representative of all developers, users, etc., obviously). I'll take the above statement as an invitation to add my 2¢. (As merely a user of Debian, I've never posted to this list before). FWIW It is hard to pinpoint what exactly bothers me with flattr on Debian Planet. It's more a general sense of unease than a well-defined feeling. I can isolate some points though: 1. flattr being a commercial entity (if it were SPI or FSF instead of flattr, I'd have absolutely no problem with it); again, hard to pinpoint exactly why, it's just a gut feeling of mine; 2. flattr telling its users what their minimum monthly expenditure should be (comes across as preposterous; amounts that are negligible for a Westerner, may be prohibitive in some parts of the world); 3. flattr taking 10% of each transaction (definitely greedy; if this was a not-for-profit organization, again, I'd have no problem with giving it 10%, or more; but I'd never click on links that give a *commercial* entity such high margins; and there's no way I'm buying the BS about their reducing the percentage as soon as flattr takes off); 4. Debian being a love child and all that ... I mean, just look at the etymology of its name; I get uneasy when Debian is mixed with activities that are too obviously (or should I say basely) lucrative; there's enough of that out there already, no need to overly pollute Debian Planet too; 5. Given the above reservations, and those already expressed by other posters, how many Debian Planet readers would eventually join flattr? Would it make sense to taint Debian Planet with something that, to say it mildly, is considered dubious by at least some of its readers, just for perhaps a few dozen click-throughs a month? Despite all this, I *strongly* support: -- the general idea that there should be (many, and various) mechanisms enabling users to tangibly thank both the members of the Debian team individually, and the Debian Project as a whole (besides buying pre-packaged Debian CDs and DVDs) -- the proliferation of alternative forms of micropayment enabling netizens to award persons and projects they are grateful to -- by which I mean forms that skip the middle-men and finally enable us to directly thank *the* person, *the* project, without some corporation taking its share on that (yet again). -- it's high time some free/libre micropayment project for replacing PayPal, flattr et al. finally emerged ;-) /FWIW -- Cheerio, Klistvud http://bufferoverflow.tiddlyspot.com Certifiable Loonix User #481801 Please reply to the list, not to me. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1289476904.2740...@compax
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, 11 Nov 2010, Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: while on that topic, maybe each package on package.qa.d.o should have a flattr button ;-) And one for the packages.d.o guys. And one for the QA guys. And one for DSA. And one for the mirror people. And the ftp-team. And the buildd and wanna-build folks. At which point is this getting silly? Nothing in Debian is a one-man-show. -- | .''`. ** Debian GNU/Linux ** Peter Palfrader | : :' : The universal http://www.palfrader.org/ | `. `' Operating System | `-http://www.debian.org/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010121142.gk10...@anguilla.noreply.org
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 02:44, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote: Michael Gilbert michael.s.gilb...@gmail.com writes: Raphael has every right to attempt to pursue his field of endeavor in any tolerant/respectful manner he chooses. ...using his own property. But not using Debian project resources. Raphael is among the most notable (visible) of all DD's, so why not? If he became a millionaire using flattr, why not? Why not create money where there wasn't? Why is the money topic so sensitive? I'm the sort of person who gets excited by seeing Release Managers get paid for their heroic work. -- blog: http://tshepang.tumblr.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktinf0bwcbsxlkfwpqgl9vfksmgxip+7hfmkya...@mail.gmail.com
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 02:44, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote: Michael Gilbert michael.s.gilb...@gmail.com writes: Raphael has every right to attempt to pursue his field of endeavor in any tolerant/respectful manner he chooses. ...using his own property. But not using Debian project resources. Raphael is among the most notable (visible) of all DD's, so why not? If he became a millionaire using flattr, why not? Why not create money where there wasn't? Why is the money topic so sensitive? I'm the sort of person who gets excited by seeing Release Managers get paid for their heroic work. For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain The problem here is not about Raphael being allowed to become millionaire with flattr or not; it is about people using the Debian planet (which is Debian resources) for private financial gain. This has nothing to do with the money topic, but with the rules in place regarding the Debian machines. [0] http://debian.org/devel/dmup.en.html -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/ibgn6e$rn...@dough.gmane.org
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On to, 2010-11-11 at 14:01 +0200, Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: -1 for flattr; it's a great way to contribute a few cents; and these people are great contributors to Debian anyways, so why don't they get rewarded? while on that topic, maybe each package on package.qa.d.o should have a flattr button ;-) I see the smiley, but I object anyway: please let's not start promoting non-free services on debian.org. There's a bigger problem lurking in the background, though. We could replace Flattr with a (hypothetical) free service, but we would still have money involved. Money is a powerful motivator. It is not the only thing that motivates people, but it is powerful enough that it can easily warp decision making. If micropayments take off, and the amounts of money grow to become significant, then it's likely that people will work to increase the amount of money they get. If they have to choose between the technically correct option and the money-making one, there is a conflict. Right now that conflict is missing, and the quality of Debian is high because of it. Also, micropayments like Flattr are most likely to go to popular, high-visibility things. Debian mostly consists of the long tail: most packages have fairly few users, but Debian as a whole is stronger for having such a wide variety of packages. If people have to choose between money and working on an unpopular package, there is again a conflict. There's more source conflict: if there's a micropayment button on packages.debian.org, how will the money be divided between members of a packaging team? People who do NMUs? Should people who report particularly useful bugs be rewarded, too? What about people who maintain the Debian infrastructure? There may be a way to collect money via Debian and not have conflicts. But on the whole I would prefer for us to not experiment and avoid this entirely. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1289478460.2957.119.ca...@havelock.lan
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 01:22:54PM +0100, Didier 'OdyX' Raboud wrote: Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 02:44, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote: Michael Gilbert michael.s.gilb...@gmail.com writes: Raphael has every right to attempt to pursue his field of endeavor in any tolerant/respectful manner he chooses. ...using his own property. But not using Debian project resources. Raphael is among the most notable (visible) of all DD's, so why not? If he became a millionaire using flattr, why not? Why not create money where there wasn't? Why is the money topic so sensitive? I'm the sort of person who gets excited by seeing Release Managers get paid for their heroic work. For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain The problem here is not about Raphael being allowed to become millionaire with flattr or not; it is about people using the Debian planet (which is Debian resources) for private financial gain. This has nothing to do with the money topic, but with the rules in place regarding the Debian machines. [0] http://debian.org/devel/dmup.en.html Debian Facilities - debian webserver -Planet- blog posts-flattr links ..- debian email server-email - email signature that links to: ...their personal webpage with paypal or flatter ...their business website both these can generate income. are they both potential DMUP violations? -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux ==.| http://kevix.myopenid.com..| | : :' : The Universal OS| mysite.verizon.net/kevin.mark/.| | `. `' http://www.debian.org/.| http://counter.li.org [#238656]| |___`-Unless I ask to be CCd,.assume I am subscribed._| -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010123502.ga22...@horacrux
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 07:35:03AM -0500, Kevin Mark wrote: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 01:22:54PM +0100, Didier 'OdyX' Raboud wrote: Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 02:44, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote: Michael Gilbert michael.s.gilb...@gmail.com writes: Raphael has every right to attempt to pursue his field of endeavor in any tolerant/respectful manner he chooses. ...using his own property. But not using Debian project resources. Raphael is among the most notable (visible) of all DD's, so why not? If he became a millionaire using flattr, why not? Why not create money where there wasn't? Why is the money topic so sensitive? I'm the sort of person who gets excited by seeing Release Managers get paid for their heroic work. For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain The problem here is not about Raphael being allowed to become millionaire with flattr or not; it is about people using the Debian planet (which is Debian resources) for private financial gain. This has nothing to do with the money topic, but with the rules in place regarding the Debian machines. [0] http://debian.org/devel/dmup.en.html Debian Facilities - debian webserver -Planet- blog posts-flattr links ..- debian email server-email - email signature that links to: ...their personal webpage with paypal or flatter ...their business website or mailing lists archives, for that matter. both these can generate income. are they both potential DMUP violations? I won't say anything about a DMUP violation, but surely the two things you mention should be treated equally. Mike -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010123825.ga16...@glandium.org
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
Kevin Mark wrote: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 01:22:54PM +0100, Didier 'OdyX' Raboud wrote: For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain (…) Debian Facilities - debian webserver -Planet- blog posts-flattr links ..- debian email server-email - email signature that links to: ...their personal webpage with paypal or flatter ...their business website both these can generate income. are they both potential DMUP violations? Ha. At first I thought: damn, good argument. But after thinking of it a bit, I think there is one slight difference though: the use of Debian email servers does _not_ require the acknowledgement of the DMUP (anybody can send a mail transitioning trough Debian email servers, see e.g. the amounts of spam), where being syndicated on planet does (it is not possible to send spam to the planet without first getting the blog added to it by a DD), if I understand the issue correctly. So I'd say that emails are not under the scope of the DMUP, hence cannot be a violation of it. IMHO, huh… -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/ibgrv5$m6...@dough.gmane.org
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 01:38:25PM +0100, Mike Hommey wrote: Debian Facilities - debian webserver -Planet- blog posts-flattr links ..- debian email server-email - email signature that links to: ...their personal webpage with paypal or flatter ...their business website or mailing lists archives, for that matter. both these can generate income. are they both potential DMUP violations? I won't say anything about a DMUP violation, but surely the two things you mention should be treated equally. I'm sorry, but refering to the *own* website (with whatever content) in an e-mail signature is different to linking from a debian.org website to a *foreign* *webservice* which does some stuff. At minimum the bad things are one more click away (if at all). Kind regards Andreas. -- http://fam-tille.de -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010134852.gc28...@an3as.eu
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On 11/11/2010 06:01 AM, Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: Furthermore there are reports of webbugs in some feeds syndicated on planet, or things that systematically leak browsing behaviour to third parties by including images directly from these sides. I don't know much about this one, so no positive or negative vote from me. So that essentially means no inline images on blogs. Because any img tag that appears in a feed on planet -- regardless of if it is a 1x1 transparent image or a 500x300 photo of something at Debconf -- will, let's face it, reveal certain data to the non-Debian server it's on. To me, this is a point where we go, life sucks, but at some point we take it and move on because images in feeds are nice to have. -- John -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4cdbf83e.1070...@complete.org
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 14:22, Didier 'OdyX' Raboud did...@raboud.com wrote: Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 02:44, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote: Michael Gilbert michael.s.gilb...@gmail.com writes: Raphael has every right to attempt to pursue his field of endeavor in any tolerant/respectful manner he chooses. ...using his own property. But not using Debian project resources. Raphael is among the most notable (visible) of all DD's, so why not? If he became a millionaire using flattr, why not? Why not create money where there wasn't? Why is the money topic so sensitive? I'm the sort of person who gets excited by seeing Release Managers get paid for their heroic work. For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain I'm sure this is just a guideline of course, else the following should be adhered to: Don't mention a book you've just written if that piece of writing will show up on Debian Planet, even if the book is about Debian. -- blog: http://tshepang.tumblr.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktinmwanf3tdtktbhsshq9xjmmr0qmgvtmy-ua...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 14:11, Peter Palfrader wea...@debian.org wrote: On Thu, 11 Nov 2010, Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: while on that topic, maybe each package on package.qa.d.o should have a flattr button ;-) And one for the packages.d.o guys. And one for the QA guys. And one for DSA. And one for the mirror people. And the ftp-team. And the buildd and wanna-build folks. I was half-joking, but if they so choose, why not. Fundraising doesn't hurt. At which point is this getting silly? When it becomes an eyesore I guess, but this is a design issue I guess. -- blog: http://tshepang.tumblr.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlkti=yszrtxvysofs7+cc=zkn9jput2=h69-74x...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 14:27, Lars Wirzenius l...@liw.fi wrote: On to, 2010-11-11 at 14:01 +0200, Tshepang Lekhonkhobe wrote: -1 for flattr; it's a great way to contribute a few cents; and these people are great contributors to Debian anyways, so why don't they get rewarded? while on that topic, maybe each package on package.qa.d.o should have a flattr button ;-) I see the smiley, but I object anyway: please let's not start promoting non-free services on debian.org. There's a bigger problem lurking in the background, though. We could replace Flattr with a (hypothetical) free service, but we would still have money involved. Money is a powerful motivator. It is not the only thing that motivates people, but it is powerful enough that it can easily warp decision making. If micropayments take off, and the amounts of money grow to become significant, then it's likely that people will work to increase the amount of money they get. If they have to choose between the technically correct option and the money-making one, there is a conflict. Right now that conflict is missing, and the quality of Debian is high because of it. Also, micropayments like Flattr are most likely to go to popular, high-visibility things. Debian mostly consists of the long tail: most packages have fairly few users, but Debian as a whole is stronger for having such a wide variety of packages. If people have to choose between money and working on an unpopular package, there is again a conflict. There's more source conflict: if there's a micropayment button on packages.debian.org, how will the money be divided between members of a packaging team? People who do NMUs? Should people who report particularly useful bugs be rewarded, too? What about people who maintain the Debian infrastructure? You are exposing issues I didn't even think about, thanks. There may be a way to collect money via Debian and not have conflicts. But on the whole I would prefer for us to not experiment and avoid this entirely. If there's a way, why not? Waste of time? Too busy fixing RC bugs? This issue will keep coming back because it's left unresolved. There's people who want to be financially rewarded for their work on Debian, and there people who don't care. Both do matter. Don't let those who don't care disadvantage those who do. -- blog: http://tshepang.tumblr.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlkti=bg4q=qb6ojg4qnacu7yjtsnzsrpnrpfskg...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 12:27:40PM +, Lars Wirzenius wrote:
There's more source conflict: if there's a micropayment button on
packages.debian.org, how will the money be divided between members of a
packaging team? People who do NMUs? Should people who report
particularly useful bugs be rewarded, too? What about people who
maintain the Debian infrastructure?
AOL.
This, in fact is the main risk for our community that I see coming from
Flattr (and yes, this comment is obviously specific to Flattr rather
than generic). Let's assume that nowadays the given maintenance team of
package foo is composed by developers X, Y. Great, they have been
doing all the work up to now, they are fully entitled to be flattr-ed
and share the gain among them. Then, tomorrow, a new enthusiastic
developer, Z, start working on package maintenance. At which point he
gets the right of asking a share of the gain? Should it be equally
distributed among X, Y, and Z, or not?
The mere possibility of this scenario and of the debates and unhappiness
that can descend from it, is enough to scare me away from the idea of
mass Flattr in the context of FOSS.
There aren't many chances of musing about the characteristics of a pure
gift-economy, but when those chances come, let's appreciate the
important *advantages* gift-economies have over other models.
Cheers.
--
Stefano Zacchiroli -o- PhD in Computer Science \ PostDoc @ Univ. Paris 7
z...@{upsilon.cc,pps.jussieu.fr,debian.org} -- http://upsilon.cc/zack/
Quando anche i santi ti voltano le spalle, | . |. I've fans everywhere
ti resta John Fante -- V. Capossela ...| ..: |.. -- C. Adams
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Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 10:56:23AM +0100, Martin Zobel-Helas wrote:
Therefor I ask you, the maintainers of planet.d.o, to please draft a
policy or set of guidelines that will prevent such abuse.
I second this request, although my request does not anticipate that they
*are* abuses :). For me, it's just a matter of intellectual honesty: if
we ask Planet maintainers to propose guidelines about this topic, we
should be ready to accept the possibilities that they are not considered
abuses in their opinion.
I take this chance to remind all readers that the current guidelines are
available at http://wiki.debian.org/PlanetDebian, which has been
recently cleared linked from planet.d.o (Planet maintainers: thanks for
that!). I point that out for two reasons: 1) some recurrent complains
about planet.d.o posts, other than commercial spam, are clearly
addressed in the guidelines already; 2) highlight that current
guidelines are not clear cut (and that is not necessarily bad IMHO),
there are already behaviors which are considered OK-ish if applied
sporadically and a bit less so if applied recurrently.
Cheers.
--
Stefano Zacchiroli -o- PhD in Computer Science \ PostDoc @ Univ. Paris 7
z...@{upsilon.cc,pps.jussieu.fr,debian.org} -- http://upsilon.cc/zack/
Quando anche i santi ti voltano le spalle, | . |. I've fans everywhere
ti resta John Fante -- V. Capossela ...| ..: |.. -- C. Adams
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Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
* Tshepang Lekhonkhobe tshep...@gmail.com [2010-11-11 16:14:37 CET]: On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 14:27, Lars Wirzenius l...@liw.fi wrote: There may be a way to collect money via Debian and not have conflicts. But on the whole I would prefer for us to not experiment and avoid this entirely. If there's a way, why not? Waste of time? Too busy fixing RC bugs? I think Lars did point it out pretty well, but I can try to phrase it in my words again: There are people that are pushing for the tasks that seemingly are more prominently appreciated. Also people actively hindering the progress of specific improvements until some sponsors for the tasks are found. This leads to a fair amount of interest in such prominent areas, and no interest in the boring tasks that are needed to get the whole thing running. Just follow which teams are regularly asking for help, are known to be looked down upon (politely put) by a fair amount of other developers to do minor stuff but on the other hand have to work their asses off for next to little appreciation. This issue will keep coming back because it's left unresolved. There's people who want to be financially rewarded for their work on Debian, and there people who don't care. Both do matter. Don't let those who don't care disadvantage those who do. Right, but Debian is actually by definition a project of volunteers. Noone can be expected to get paid for it, and that's one of the core principles that is a driving force behind a lot. If some are suddenly starting to prominently push more effort in their blogging round trip time then things get skewed because it's not the driving force that people who have joined the project did expect. What one does on their own blog is their own thing, what one pushes explicitly to planet.debian is a different area. Just my thoughts, Rhonda -- dholbach Last day of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek starting in 34 minutes in #ubuntu-classroom on irc.feenode.net * ScottK hands dholbach an r. Rhonda Are they fundraising again? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010160337.ga26...@anguilla.debian.or.at
Re: commercial spam on planet
Hi Holger, Holger Levsen hol...@layer-acht.org (08/11/2010): since a while, we see unsolicted commercial links and images on planet, mostly about flattr. […] How much spam do you find tolerable? Would it be ok if I sell advertisment space on my blog and syndicate this to planet? You know, I need to eat too... for sure I didn't imagine a 100x17 bitmap was generating so strong reactions. I guess I shall thank you for having started this thread, which showed how many people are annoyed. Feed updated to conform (strictly) to the DMUP, thanks. (I guess I didn't have “financial gain” in mind when I added this link at the bottom of my posts, rather the opportunity to see whether people liked getting status updates about the packages I maintain, or stuff I do in general.) Mraw, KiBi. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: commercial spam on planet
On 2010-11-11, Cyril Brulebois k...@debian.org wrote: at the bottom of my posts, rather the opportunity to see whether people liked getting status updates about the packages I maintain, or stuff I do in general.) it is because I like reading what people do in and outside debian that I read planet. /Sune -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/slrnido8t1.rvp.nos...@sshway.ssh.pusling.com
Re: No general political content on Planet
Ben Finney dijo [Fri, Nov 05, 2010 at 11:06:26AM +1100]: (...) Hopefully the suggestion to split non-Debian topics out to a separate feed (or, equivalently, to provide a Debian-topics-only feed which is the only one provided on Planet Debian) will be followed more often. Many of us don't bother setting tags for each of our blog postings. If it were to become a policy to have it set for a Planet Debian On-Topic subplanet, we probably would... although it's far from automatic. And many of the interesting messages are not strictly Debian-related, even if they are technical. Meeting one's fellow developer in person also (at least for me) helped a lot in turning random political content I strongly disagree with from something that pissed me off into something that just makes me roll my eyes and remember the good conversation we had. :) Agreed. Others have expressed the position that reading occasional non-Debian posts in the Planet Debian flow helps to relate to other members as people with lives outside Debian; that seems something of value that we should be careful not to sacrifice cheaply. Yes, please subscribe me to that group. For me, the planet is a window to the lives of the people that form up this social group. We share a technical affinity, so we tend to write technical topics, but we write about our political views - As much as we write about our hobbies, our families, our lives. For me, Debian is as much a technical project as a social one. And that's the reason I enjoy the planet. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010171310.gf29...@gwolf.org
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
Tshepang Lekhonkhobe tshep...@gmail.com writes: Didier 'OdyX' Raboud did...@raboud.com wrote: For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain I'm sure this is just a guideline of course, else the following should be adhered to: Don't mention a book you've just written if that piece of writing will show up on Debian Planet, even if the book is about Debian. Indeed, and therefore there's already been a lot of discussion on this thread about how the boundary is fuzzy, we don't want to be too literal about it, some amount of incidental use is fine, and so forth. But because the boundary is fuzzy, that means we sometimes have to have these conversations, and it means that the topic is legitimate. I probably come to this from a slightly different perspective than some of the people here since I work for a non-profit educational institution, which has similar requirements around use of university facilities for personal gain for tax reasons. If someone at Stanford used Stanford computing facilities directly for personal financial gain, Stanford could get into serious trouble with the US government because it's a violation of our tax-free non-profit status. As you would expect, just like with the Debian systems, the boundary is fuzzy and complicated, and there's a lot of things that fall into a grey area (note, for example, that both Yahoo and Google started as student projects and originally ran on Stanford's network, but notice also that we kicked both of them off our network onto their own bandwidth long before they became companies). The university, like most places with this issue, has guidelines that allow for incidental use, where incidental is left open to a common-sense interpretation. But there's still a real rule there, and the university occasionally has to enforce it. I personally felt quite uncomfortable with hosting my web site, which as previously mentioned has some affiliate links to an on-line bookstore, on the Stanford network even though it was on my personal hardware, and felt much more comfortable about that once I moved my personal web site to my own VMs hosted elsewhere. -- Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87hbfnn58b@windlord.stanford.edu
Re: commercial spam on planet
Cyril Brulebois k...@debian.org writes: (I guess I didn't have “financial gain” in mind when I added this link at the bottom of my posts, rather the opportunity to see whether people liked getting status updates about the packages I maintain, or stuff I do in general.) Not that I have time to do this, but it occurs to me that setting up something fairly similar to Flattr but not involving money would be straightforward. I'm imagining a system where someone can sign up for an account and is automatically given some standard amount of kudos per month, which are then divided among every project that person wants to give kudos to during that month, like Flattr. The difference would be that there would be no money involved, and the kudo accumulation wouldn't be useful for anything other than what you mention: determining what things people like and are interested in. I would have absolutely no concerns about such a thing on Planet, provided that the links were constructed such that they didn't become accidental web bugs. -- Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87d3qbn51h@windlord.stanford.edu
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
John Goerzen jgoer...@complete.org writes: So that essentially means no inline images on blogs. Because any img tag that appears in a feed on planet -- regardless of if it is a 1x1 transparent image or a 500x300 photo of something at Debconf -- will, let's face it, reveal certain data to the non-Debian server it's on. To me, this is a point where we go, life sucks, but at some point we take it and move on because images in feeds are nice to have. I mostly agree with this, but I would draw a distinction between img tags intended to display *images* and pointing back to the hosting site of the person writing the blog and img tags for invisible images that are routinely added to every post and point to some third-party service. (Looking at Page Info on Planet Debian is interesting. There are a *lot* of web bugs.) If the only use of img tags is for actual images that are intended to be displayed, and which aren't added routinely to every post, that's a much different situation (and much less information to disclose) than if every post is routinely tagged with a web bug. The latter seems to be what many people's blogs currently do. I suspect a blacklist on the Planet Debian side could kill most of the bugs after looking over Page Info. I personally blocked four different sites and that got 95% of them. -- Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/878w0zn4ta@windlord.stanford.edu
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 19:24, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote: Tshepang Lekhonkhobe tshep...@gmail.com writes: Didier 'OdyX' Raboud did...@raboud.com wrote: For a simple reason, the DMUP [0]; which every user of Debian resources must follow. It says (in its introduction, point 1). * Don't use Debian Facilities for private financial gain I'm sure this is just a guideline of course, else the following should be adhered to: Don't mention a book you've just written if that piece of writing will show up on Debian Planet, even if the book is about Debian. Indeed, and therefore there's already been a lot of discussion on this thread about how the boundary is fuzzy, we don't want to be too literal about it, some amount of incidental use is fine, and so forth. But because the boundary is fuzzy, that means we sometimes have to have these conversations, and it means that the topic is legitimate. I probably come to this from a slightly different perspective than some of the people here since I work for a non-profit educational institution, which has similar requirements around use of university facilities for personal gain for tax reasons. If someone at Stanford used Stanford computing facilities directly for personal financial gain, Stanford could get into serious trouble with the US government because it's a violation of our tax-free non-profit status. An attempt at an analogy: the worry with Stanford is legal issues with USA; the worry with Debian is that money can corrupt (undermines the volunteer foundation on which this great OS if founded upon) and gimme money icons are annoying to some? Just wanted to be clear. Anyway the arguments against flattr sway me towards them, but maybe that's not ok since Raphael, according to me, isn't at all abusing Debian project resources (and flattr is a great way to say thanks, and more meaningful than those words if you ask me). That little green button at the bottom of his posts isn't intrusive at all, and I am ever impressed by a person so bold to ask for financial support. Most others are embarassed, since money is so taboo. But I guess we have different opinions on what intrusive is. I personally dislike sites where you get an ads in the beginning or the middle of an article (such arrogance!), while someone else will find that okay, even sympathizing with author gotta eat. -- blog: http://tshepang.tumblr.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktinm3wsncj0pgbybw1mtdse57kj4ofb_xh�...@mail.gmail.com
Re: No general political content on Planet
On 2010-11-11, Gunnar Wolf gw...@gwolf.org wrote: Yes, please subscribe me to that group. For me, the planet is a window to the lives of the people that form up this social group. We share a technical affinity, so we tend to write technical topics, but we write about our political views - As much as we write about our hobbies, our families, our lives. full ack /sune -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/slrnidojc7.rvp.nos...@sshway.ssh.pusling.com
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
I have been made aware that people use Debian resources for personal financial gain using the planet.d.o syndication platform, by for instance including 'flattr' links and images in the text present on planet. Furthermore there are reports of webbugs in some feeds syndicated on planet, or things that systematically leak browsing behaviour to third parties by including images directly from these sides. I think these occurrences might conflict with the rules that govern use of Debian resources. At the very least I consider them to be of extremely bad taste. Therefor I ask you, the maintainers of planet.d.o, to please draft a policy or set of guidelines that will prevent such abuse. Violation of this policy should probably be grounds for removal from planet.debian.org. Well. Fine. As you might know from reading http://wiki.debian.org/PlanetDebian we actually DO have a policy for content on Planet Debian. This is *intentionally* kept vague and we do not want to have it much more specific. Planet is about the people, their life and doings, their thoughts and feelings. We want as much to have about one developer's children and their adventures as we want to have the occasional rant about politics from another Maintainer. We want to have a translator write about their adventures when they are Lost in Translation; we also want to learn about the new company one of our fellow developers just founded, and what problems both face and how they solved them. We also want to learn what other things people are doing, what they like, and so on. A detailed policy will only hurt Planet, and so we keep it short and simple. Should you have a question, comment or even complaint, feel free to mail us at pla...@debian.org. But we do not want, nor do we, rule on general behaviour of people. That is not our place, that needs to be dealt with elsewhere. Note: If you are doubting whether a post is fine for Planet, ask yourself What will the thousands of readers think, with their expectations of Planet, not Will *I* like it?. Planet is for the people to get to know who is behind Debian, not a stage to perform an act. Show your life, do not optimize your posts for the possible readers you might address. :) What Can I Post On Planet? Planet Debian aims to aggregate the blog posts of people who are active in Debian and not only to aggregate the blog posts about Debian. The point is to provide a window into the community itself. Posts that are about Debian are a great idea and some people will choose to only syndicate on topic posts. But other posts are also welcome! We want to learn about the people, their life, opinions (even political) and doings. And so here is our small set of rules about the content on Planet Debian: - Provide individual feeds for each language you post in. The main language for Planet is English.[1] - Try not to annoy people. While there is absolutely no requirement that posts need to be about Debian, if there are a subset of posts that are annoying a large number of people and generating many complaints, you may be asked to consider providing a feed without the posts in question. If you stay away from advertising content (or content that might be confused as such) and from excessively personal information, you should be fine. - Be very careful including material from external sites (ie, not your own blog/domain). The occasional picture from elsewhere is fine, but anything that can be (or is) used to track reader's behavior (commonly called webbugs[2]) is considered bad and grounds for exclusion from Planet. If you regularly need external content, consider providing that from your own site. [1] There are Planets in other languages. Should yours not yet have one, mail pla...@debian.org and ask for one. Have 5 people with you to join the new Planet and it will get created. [2] Feedburner, Google adwhatever/analytics, etc. Hackergotchi Hackergotchi are the little face pictures that can appear next to your entry. They should be a transparent PNG of *just* *your* *head*, with a little shadow if you like. Aim for around 65x85; it's not a strict size, but please don't make them much bigger than this. Please do stick to your head, not a whole square of whatever environment the head happened to be in at the time the picture was taken. It is not hard to get one done right. == And with that above repeated here: Yes, we do think it's bad to have Flattr buttons below every post. (And we would think the same about any other such service.) We are fine with the occasional post sharing which projects you like and would Flattr, but when you do that please make sure to not link the Flattr image from Flattr servers (see webbugs above) but from your own resources. This holds equally true for image links to Facebook/Twitter/delicious/whatevertheyarenamed services. -- bye, Joerg
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
Hi, (I'm hert...@d.o and not b...@d.o) On Thu, 11 Nov 2010, Joerg Jaspert wrote: What Can I Post On Planet? [...] - Be very careful including material from external sites (ie, not your own blog/domain). The occasional picture from elsewhere is fine, but anything that can be (or is) used to track reader's behavior (commonly called webbugs[2]) is considered bad and grounds for exclusion from Planet. If you regularly need external content, consider providing that from your own site. This is not in the current policy. I understand and accept that you might decide to not want them on planet.debian.org but then I believe you should filter them on the planet side. I think I have the right to have them in my RSS feed and planet should not be a tool to impose any point of view about the topic of privacy on Debian contributors. We have agreed to build free software together, not to fight against privacy issues in personal blogs of individual developers. They are not too difficult to identify: strip 1x1 images hosted on another domain than the blog article, and images from the major offenders (http://feeds.feedburner.com in my case). Russ said that 4 domains cover 95% of the cases. Note that many blogs hosted on wordpress.com have webbugs as well and I don't know if they can disable them. FYI, I changed my footer to not include the Flattr image and the social button instead I've put a textual link. I will continue to use feedburner however. Cheers, -- Raphaël Hertzog ◈ Debian Developer ◈ [Flattr=20693] Follow my Debian News ▶ http://RaphaelHertzog.com (English) ▶ http://RaphaelHertzog.fr (Français) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2010224329.gb17...@rivendell.home.ouaza.com
Re: What is annoying in the flattr buttons?
Raphael Hertzog wrote: It's going to be a condorcet-based poll where you have to rank the following statements: I'm annoyed by Flattr buttons because * The picture catches the attention too much in a post which contains only text. * The picture allows Flattr to gather statistics about me. * Debian contributors should not make money from posts syndicated on planet. * I believe Flattr is a bad micro-donation system and it should not be promoted. * The button indirectly promotes a service run by a private company unrelated to Debian. * I don't share the concerns quoted below. (i.e. NOTA) * All of the above, which I personally endorse. Thanks -- ·''`. If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, : :' : come sit next to me - Alice Roosevelt Longworth `. `' `-Proudly running Debian GNU/Linux signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Please draft a policy for planet.debian.org
On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 05:03:38PM +0100, Gerfried Fuchs wrote: * Tshepang Lekhonkhobe tshep...@gmail.com [2010-11-11 16:14:37 CET]: snippage What one does on their own blog is their own thing, what one pushes explicitly to planet.debian is a different area. Just my thoughts, Rhonda snippage So, at the moment, there are blogs with some content relating to donations that are on planet. Lars says that these posts might lead to a change in the focus wrt which packages are developed or motivation in the project. Now what would happen if these people either a) removed their blog from planet or b) removed the donation-related post BUT kept producing these donation-related posts outside of debian resources, which would remove the DMUP violation. Would it remove the objections that Lars mentioned? I would assume not, at it would still affect Debian. This might be a seperate issue. -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux ==.| http://kevix.myopenid.com..| | : :' : The Universal OS| mysite.verizon.net/kevin.mark/.| | `. `' http://www.debian.org/.| http://counter.li.org [#238656]| |___`-Unless I ask to be CCd,.assume I am subscribed._| -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20101112010633.ga18...@horacrux
