a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from start to finish: https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers As one of the leading free software projects and given Debian's particularly outspoken attitude that we do not rely on third party free services there are compelling reasons to try and finally implement this entirely using our own packages and infrastructure. * do people generally agree with it? * would the DSA team be willing to provide and support the underlying infrastructure for this or have it on any existing servers? If there is consensus then I am happy to provide working configs for all the necessary processes and continue documenting it so other people can make use of it. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/52b6b468.6040...@pocock.com.au
Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
Hi,
On Sun Dec 22, 2013 at 10:44:08 +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote:
I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from
start to finish:
https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers
As one of the leading free software projects and given Debian's
particularly outspoken attitude that we do not rely on third party
free services there are compelling reasons to try and finally
implement this entirely using our own packages and infrastructure.
* do people generally agree with it?
* would the DSA team be willing to provide and support the underlying
infrastructure for this or have it on any existing servers?
zobel@kvasir ~ % ldapsearch -LLL -x -H ldap://db.debian.org -b
ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org '(host=cilea)' purpose
dn: host=cilea,ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org
purpose: voip.debian.{net,org}
zobel@kvasir ~ %
For more details, please contact Phil Hands.
Cheers,
Martin
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Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
On 22/12/13 10:52, Martin Zobel-Helas wrote:
Hi,
On Sun Dec 22, 2013 at 10:44:08 +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote:
I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from
start to finish:
https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers
As one of the leading free software projects and given Debian's
particularly outspoken attitude that we do not rely on third party
free services there are compelling reasons to try and finally
implement this entirely using our own packages and infrastructure.
* do people generally agree with it?
* would the DSA team be willing to provide and support the underlying
infrastructure for this or have it on any existing servers?
zobel@kvasir ~ % ldapsearch -LLL -x -H ldap://db.debian.org -b
ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org '(host=cilea)' purpose
dn: host=cilea,ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org
purpose: voip.debian.{net,org}
zobel@kvasir ~ %
For more details, please contact Phil Hands.
I've had some ongoing discussions with Phil but ultimately, like SMTP
for debian.org, these things would need to be formally accepted by DSA
at some point.
Amongst other things, Phil commented on the password situation but it is
ultimately up to the LDAP administrator to decide whether H(A1) hashed
passwords are supported and whether they can be accessed by these processes.
cilea.debian.org is just one host located in Europe - it is good to
start with. Once it is all running, the TURN processes would probably
need to be set up in additional regions - are we likely to have
resources for that or is this something that would take resources away
from other initiatives?
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Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
This one time, at band camp, Daniel Pocock said:
On 22/12/13 10:52, Martin Zobel-Helas wrote:
On Sun Dec 22, 2013 at 10:44:08 +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote:
I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from
start to finish:
https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers
As one of the leading free software projects and given Debian's
particularly outspoken attitude that we do not rely on third party
free services there are compelling reasons to try and finally
implement this entirely using our own packages and infrastructure.
* do people generally agree with it?
* would the DSA team be willing to provide and support the underlying
infrastructure for this or have it on any existing servers?
zobel@kvasir ~ % ldapsearch -LLL -x -H ldap://db.debian.org -b
ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org '(host=cilea)' purpose
dn: host=cilea,ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org
purpose: voip.debian.{net,org}
zobel@kvasir ~ %
For more details, please contact Phil Hands.
I've had some ongoing discussions with Phil but ultimately, like SMTP
for debian.org, these things would need to be formally accepted by DSA
at some point.
Sure. I think maybe this is turning into some sort of comic loop. The
understanding on the DSA side, as far as I'm aware, is that the VOIP
setup on cilea is still a bit fragile and not ready for wider
deployment. If that's not the case, letting us know that it's ready for
widespread adoption would be a good start. If it is the case, I think
we're expecting the people interested in VOIP for debian to make it
ready for prime time before anything else happens. If you/fil/whoever
else is involved have a different deployment strategy, I think we'd like
to hear about it.
Amongst other things, Phil commented on the password situation but it is
ultimately up to the LDAP administrator to decide whether H(A1) hashed
passwords are supported and whether they can be accessed by these processes.
I don't think we want to use regular LDAP bind, if we can help it.
For some other things, we've introduced servicePassword (we have a sudo
password field and so on). Is it possible to do a similar thing for VOIP?
cilea.debian.org is just one host located in Europe - it is good to
start with. Once it is all running, the TURN processes would probably
need to be set up in additional regions - are we likely to have
resources for that or is this something that would take resources away
from other initiatives?
We have hosting in several places. Depending on how much resource these
servers need and how difficult the deployment is, I can't imagine it
should be an impossible problem.
Cheers,
--
-
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| : :' :sg...@debian.org |
| `. `'Debian user, admin, and developer |
|`- http://www.debian.org |
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Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 5:44 PM, Daniel Pocock wrote: I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from start to finish: https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers DSA have traditionally only provided forwarding services for communications, not hosting services (cf email). This seems quite a departure from that. -- bye, pabs http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAKTje6G_Ar4=cqNZe_6EUzOv4VRFQXL9YzbBH=scfnityrk...@mail.gmail.com
Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
Paul Wise p...@debian.org wrote: On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 5:44 PM, Daniel Pocock wrote: I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from start to finish: https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers DSA have traditionally only provided forwarding services for communications, not hosting services (cf email). This seems quite a departure from that. What is described in phase 1 and 2 is the VoIP equivalent. The items in the final section after phase 2 could be run through debian.net based services without any demand on DSA -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-project-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/9c970208-f050-4b5d-9f35-5df57c87b...@email.android.com
Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
Daniel Pocock dan...@pocock.com.au writes:
On 22/12/13 10:52, Martin Zobel-Helas wrote:
Hi,
On Sun Dec 22, 2013 at 10:44:08 +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote:
I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed plan from
start to finish:
https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers
As one of the leading free software projects and given Debian's
particularly outspoken attitude that we do not rely on third party
free services there are compelling reasons to try and finally
implement this entirely using our own packages and infrastructure.
* do people generally agree with it?
* would the DSA team be willing to provide and support the underlying
infrastructure for this or have it on any existing servers?
zobel@kvasir ~ % ldapsearch -LLL -x -H ldap://db.debian.org -b
ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org '(host=cilea)' purpose
dn: host=cilea,ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org
purpose: voip.debian.{net,org}
zobel@kvasir ~ %
For more details, please contact Phil Hands.
I've had some ongoing discussions with Phil but ultimately, like SMTP
for debian.org, these things would need to be formally accepted by DSA
at some point.
I think I've become something of a blocker on this I'm afraid, as I
decided to settle on Freeswitch, which is a fine bit of software in many
ways, but is also pretty close to unpackagable for Debian because of
their tendency to shovel any library they notice into their code tree.
That being the case, I've repeatedly beaten my head against the brick
wall of Freeswitch packaging, rather than getting something deployed
that people can use -- sorry about that -- it seemed like a good idea at
the time.
That being the case, taking a different tack, and deploying a more
federated setup, as Daniel suggests, seems very worthwhile, and means
that the users would be isolated from whatever PBX we end up using,
which would make it easier to chop and change between Asterix,
Freeswitch, or whatever for bridging via SIP providers to the POTS.
One thing that I think we should aim for is the ability to offer
sub-accounts, so that our users can offer their friends and relatives
VoIP accounts, so that DDs (etc.) get to do video conferencing with
their relatives using Free Software, rather than being forced to use
facetime/skype or nothing.
Cheers, Phil.
--
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|-| HANDS.COM Ltd.http://ftp.uk.debian.org/
|(| 10 Onslow Gardens, South Woodford, London E18 1NE ENGLAND
pgpE6wf9JKIeO.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Re: a SIP or XMPP service for debian.org
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256
On 22/12/13 13:25, Philip Hands wrote:
Daniel Pocock dan...@pocock.com.au writes:
On 22/12/13 10:52, Martin Zobel-Helas wrote:
Hi,
On Sun Dec 22, 2013 at 10:44:08 +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote:
I've started a wiki on this topic, it provides a detailed
plan from start to finish:
https://wiki.debian.org/UnifiedCommunications/DebianDevelopers
As one of the leading free software projects and given Debian's
particularly outspoken attitude that we do not rely on third
party free services there are compelling reasons to try and
finally implement this entirely using our own packages and
infrastructure.
* do people generally agree with it?
* would the DSA team be willing to provide and support the
underlying infrastructure for this or have it on any existing
servers?
zobel@kvasir ~ % ldapsearch -LLL -x -H ldap://db.debian.org -b
ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org '(host=cilea)' purpose dn:
host=cilea,ou=hosts,dc=debian,dc=org purpose:
voip.debian.{net,org}
zobel@kvasir ~ %
For more details, please contact Phil Hands.
I've had some ongoing discussions with Phil but ultimately, like
SMTP for debian.org, these things would need to be formally
accepted by DSA at some point.
I think I've become something of a blocker on this I'm afraid, as
I decided to settle on Freeswitch, which is a fine bit of software
in many ways, but is also pretty close to unpackagable for Debian
because of their tendency to shovel any library they notice into
their code tree.
That being the case, I've repeatedly beaten my head against the
brick wall of Freeswitch packaging, rather than getting something
deployed that people can use -- sorry about that -- it seemed like
a good idea at the time.
It is a good idea: it does have benefits and competition from
FreeSWITCH is good for Asterisk.
That being the case, taking a different tack, and deploying a more
federated setup, as Daniel suggests, seems very worthwhile, and
means that the users would be isolated from whatever PBX we end up
using, which would make it easier to chop and change between
Asterix, Freeswitch, or whatever for bridging via SIP providers to
the POTS.
The SIP proxy is really just an elaborate message routing mechanism.
It doesn't do any of the media handling, voicemail or anything else
really. So it is easier to get started quickly, relatively more
secure (as there is less code), easier to support, etc
One thing that I think we should aim for is the ability to offer
sub-accounts, so that our users can offer their friends and
relatives VoIP accounts, so that DDs (etc.) get to do video
conferencing with their relatives using Free Software, rather than
being forced to use facetime/skype or nothing.
There are various ways to do this. One thing I would like to offer is
similar to the webrtc.lumicall.org service - basically, every DD will
be able to tell their friends go to webrtc.debian.org, type my user
ID and click 'call'. The callers will not need to register, it will
be simple and anonymous, like a web form.
Other users could register through Lumicall or another service and due
to federation, they can then quickly and easily exchange calls with
@debian.org users
I've now updated the wiki page with more thorough infrastructure
requirements and submitted an RT ticket to the DSA team with IP
addressing requirements, that is the first step to enable everything
else. Once the boxes, IPs and certificate details are confirmed by
DSA I will then make another ticket with details of package
installation and config files to use.
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