Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
[Scott Kitterman, 2015-04-14] > Even after Python (meaning python2.7) is no longer in the archive (let alone > part of some type of default install), people might still roll their own. I > think the only possible answer to the question of what should /usr/bin/python > point to when there's no python2 on the system is that it shouldn't exist. > > If you want python (which include /usr/bin/python), install it. If you want > python3, then the interpreter you're looking for is found at /usr/bin/python3. > > There's no dilemma to solve. +1 PS will this meeting be streamed or recording available somewhere later? -- Piotr Ożarowski Debian GNU/Linux Developer www.ozarowski.pl www.griffith.cc www.debian.org GPG Fingerprint: 1D2F A898 58DA AF62 1786 2DF7 AEF6 F1A2 A745 7645 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/20150414065507.gf2...@sar0.p1otr.com
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On 14 April 2015 at 16:38, Scott Kitterman wrote: > On Monday, April 13, 2015 10:36:43 PM Barry Warsaw wrote: >> On Apr 14, 2015, at 01:57 AM, Matthias Klose wrote: >> >#! /bin/sh >> >python=$(shuffle /usr/bin/python2 /usr/bin/python3) >> >exec $python "$@" >> >> That was more or less the joke I made at the Pycon Language Summit. It's >> too twisted *not* to implement. :) >> >> But the idea of a (perhaps less perverse) launcher would solve the PEP 394 >> dilemma of what /usr/bin/python should point to when there's no Python 2 on >> the system by default. E.g. maybe it reads a configuration file to >> determine whether it runs /usr/bin/python2 or /usr/bin/python3. > > Even after Python (meaning python2.7) is no longer in the archive (let alone > part of some type of default install), people might still roll their own. I > think the only possible answer to the question of what should /usr/bin/python > point to when there's no python2 on the system is that it shouldn't exist. > > If you want python (which include /usr/bin/python), install it. If you want > python3, then the interpreter you're looking for is found at /usr/bin/python3. > > There's no dilemma to solve. I agree. Maybe in 2029 we can revisit it, but I've seen absolutely no good reason to push on this other than 'Gentoo did it' - scratch that, absolutely no good reason to push on it. -Rob -- Robert Collins Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/CAJ3HoZ0BPr=fbnmqrwc5mz_bcj-bua4+qlu+a64c-vjzn7o...@mail.gmail.com
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Monday, April 13, 2015 10:36:43 PM Barry Warsaw wrote: > On Apr 14, 2015, at 01:57 AM, Matthias Klose wrote: > >#! /bin/sh > >python=$(shuffle /usr/bin/python2 /usr/bin/python3) > >exec $python "$@" > > That was more or less the joke I made at the Pycon Language Summit. It's > too twisted *not* to implement. :) > > But the idea of a (perhaps less perverse) launcher would solve the PEP 394 > dilemma of what /usr/bin/python should point to when there's no Python 2 on > the system by default. E.g. maybe it reads a configuration file to > determine whether it runs /usr/bin/python2 or /usr/bin/python3. Even after Python (meaning python2.7) is no longer in the archive (let alone part of some type of default install), people might still roll their own. I think the only possible answer to the question of what should /usr/bin/python point to when there's no python2 on the system is that it shouldn't exist. If you want python (which include /usr/bin/python), install it. If you want python3, then the interpreter you're looking for is found at /usr/bin/python3. There's no dilemma to solve. Scott K -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/36643332.m5KcQVD1Ai@kitterma-e6430
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Apr 14, 2015, at 01:57 AM, Matthias Klose wrote: >#! /bin/sh >python=$(shuffle /usr/bin/python2 /usr/bin/python3) >exec $python "$@" That was more or less the joke I made at the Pycon Language Summit. It's too twisted *not* to implement. :) But the idea of a (perhaps less perverse) launcher would solve the PEP 394 dilemma of what /usr/bin/python should point to when there's no Python 2 on the system by default. E.g. maybe it reads a configuration file to determine whether it runs /usr/bin/python2 or /usr/bin/python3. Cheers, -Barry -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/20150413223643.213f4099@anarchist
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Tuesday, April 14, 2015 01:57:26 AM Matthias Klose wrote: > On 04/14/2015 01:20 AM, Scott Kitterman wrote: > > What is a /usr/bin/python launcher? > > #! /bin/sh > python=$(shuffle /usr/bin/python2 /usr/bin/python3) > exec $python "$@" > > I agree it's not perfect, there should be a preference depending on the > number of '2' and '3' digits in the date, when you're trying to execute it. So the goal is to break local python stuff someday? Somehow that doesn't strike me as a feature. Scott K -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/1705842.0hWDhC0SZA@kitterma-e6430
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On 04/14/2015 01:20 AM, Scott Kitterman wrote: > What is a /usr/bin/python launcher? #! /bin/sh python=$(shuffle /usr/bin/python2 /usr/bin/python3) exec $python "$@" I agree it's not perfect, there should be a preference depending on the number of '2' and '3' digits in the date, when you're trying to execute it. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/552c57e6.6010...@debian.org
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
Hi Scott (2015.04.14_01:20:47_+0200) > What is a /usr/bin/python launcher? I think that was what Donald was asking for. My gut feeling here is that that's a crazy idea. SR -- Stefano Rivera http://tumbleweed.org.za/ +1 415 683 3272 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/20150413233159.gb3...@bach.rivera.co.za
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On April 13, 2015 4:30:59 PM EDT, Barry Warsaw wrote: >On Apr 13, 2015, at 10:17 PM, Stefano Rivera wrote: > >>Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, >>tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? >> >>Meet outside the cPython sprint room? > >+1; +1 > >>Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. >>I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible >with >>multiple interpreters. > >After a brief chat with paultag earlier today, I'd also like to talk >about: > >* Moving the team to git + $patch_regime >* Getting to no-python2-by-default >* Bringing the relevant open-stack managed packages into the team >* Possible /usr/bin/python launcher What is a /usr/bin/python launcher? Scott K -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/a45bbe46-59f6-4eef-b102-741a43b3b...@kitterman.com
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On 04/13/2015 11:07 PM, Donald Stufft wrote: > >> On Apr 13, 2015, at 4:17 PM, Stefano Rivera wrote: >> >> Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, >> tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? >> >> Meet outside the cPython sprint room? >> >> Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. >> I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible with >> multiple interpreters. >> >> > > Does this mean PyPy too? It’d be great to have a (not just specific to Debian) > standard for how to mark a binary for a particular Python that gracefully > handles > other interpreters too. Right now we have the de facto standard of binary, > binaryX, > and binaryX.Y but that really only sanely handles CPython. can we do that in a separate session? I'm not keen on introducing another hierarchy like /usr/lib/pypy2/dist-packages, and a hierarchy of pypy-* and pypy3-* packages. This is an issue for dependency tracking (for Debian packages), and multiarch able packages. I feel that deserves some more preparation, and time. Matthias -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/552c3eb1.20...@debian.org
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Mon, 13 Apr 2015, Barry Warsaw wrote: On Apr 13, 2015, at 10:17 PM, Stefano Rivera wrote: Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? Meet outside the cPython sprint room? +1; +1 Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible with multiple interpreters. After a brief chat with paultag earlier today, I'd also like to talk about: * Moving the team to git + $patch_regime * Getting to no-python2-by-default * Bringing the relevant open-stack managed packages into the team * Possible /usr/bin/python launcher I'll be there, all of those sound fun to work on. -- Geoffrey Thomas https://ldpreload.com geo...@ldpreload.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/alpine.deb.2.10.1504131643320.18...@cactuar.ldpreload.com
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
> On Apr 13, 2015, at 4:17 PM, Stefano Rivera wrote: > > Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, > tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? > > Meet outside the cPython sprint room? > > Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. > I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible with > multiple interpreters. > > Does this mean PyPy too? It’d be great to have a (not just specific to Debian) standard for how to mark a binary for a particular Python that gracefully handles other interpreters too. Right now we have the de facto standard of binary, binaryX, and binaryX.Y but that really only sanely handles CPython. --- Donald Stufft PGP: 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA signature.asc Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Apr 13, 2015, at 04:35 PM, Paul Tagliamonte wrote: >That's it, my items are in the list above; I'll be there! Placeholder wiki page: https://wiki.debian.org/Python/StretchRoadmap Cheers, -Barry pgpppSpv6opYp.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Mon, Apr 13, 2015 at 04:30:59PM -0400, Barry Warsaw wrote: > >Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, > >tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? > > > >Meet outside the cPython sprint room? > > +1; +1; +1 to that! (+1; +1; +1, I guess) > >Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. > >I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible with > >multiple interpreters. > > After a brief chat with paultag earlier today, I'd also like to talk about: > > * Moving the team to git + $patch_regime > * Getting to no-python2-by-default > * Bringing the relevant open-stack managed packages into the team > * Possible /usr/bin/python launcher > > (what did I forget?) That's it, my items are in the list above; I'll be there! > Cheers, > -Barry Toodles, Tag -- .''`. Paul Tagliamonte | Proud Debian Developer : :' : 4096R / 8F04 9AD8 2C92 066C 7352 D28A 7B58 5B30 807C 2A87 `. `'` http://people.debian.org/~paultag `- http://people.debian.org/~paultag/conduct-statement.txt signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
On Apr 13, 2015, at 10:17 PM, Stefano Rivera wrote: >Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, >tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? > >Meet outside the cPython sprint room? +1; +1 >Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. >I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible with >multiple interpreters. After a brief chat with paultag earlier today, I'd also like to talk about: * Moving the team to git + $patch_regime * Getting to no-python2-by-default * Bringing the relevant open-stack managed packages into the team * Possible /usr/bin/python launcher (what did I forget?) Cheers, -Barry -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/20150413163059.3666d3ec@anarchist
PyCon BoF: Stretch goals for cPython, PyPy & CFFI
Matthias and I are planning to have a Debian Python BoF at PyCon, tomorrow afternoon. I think lunch is 2pm, so 3pm? Meet outside the cPython sprint room? Matthias wants to discuss general stretch goals for Python in Debian. I want to make concrete plans for py3k packages that are compatible with multiple interpreters. SR -- Stefano Rivera http://tumbleweed.org.za/ +1 415 683 3272 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-python-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/20150413201703.ga3...@bach.rivera.co.za
