Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
On Monday 22 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 06:47:44AM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: I guess for the icon issue you mean #561902? I don't see any problem with the search engine dropdown list without libgnomeui-0 installed under KDE. No, I mean a different issue. #561902 only requires gtk. But I can still be wrong, there is maybe no issue. The code linked from #555162 looks like it is used for moz-icon:// urls, which, in turn, are heavily used in the default theme. If I look at the code the BR refers to, then that looks to be protected by tests to see if it is running in a Gnome environment: if it's there it's used, if not, no problem. I see no reason for a dependency from that, but I may be wrong. Can't tell about external handlers without knowing what exactly to try. Edit Preferences Applications, opening a downloaded file, opening a downloaded file containing folder, etc. I tested it for mailto: I was asked what application to use. kmail was not listed, so I added it and told it to remember that. After that iceweasel perfectly opened kmail's composer for me every time. I also tried downloading a .deb, which did not yet have a handler. In the open/save file dialog I told it to open .deb files with kpackage and to remember that setting. Works fine. If I don't tell it to remember the setting, it will show the open with/save as dialog again. I've checked against iceweasel 3.06 and that works identically. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/201002221233.13947.elen...@planet.nl
Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 06:47:44AM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: clone 570579 -1 reassign -1 tasksel 2.81 retitle -1 iceweasel is no longer a desktop environment independent browser thanks (Fairly full quote because of CCs.) Thanks a lot for your detailed reply Mike. On Saturday 20 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: On Fri, Feb 19, 2010 at 10:18:09PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: But I question if the Recommends of those packages is policy compliant as Recommends should only be used for packages that would be found together with this one in all but unusual installations [1]. And that's only true for systems running a GNOME desktop environment. For systems running KDE the GNOME packages are not needed and even in a lot of cases very much not desired. Except that Iceweasel has various things that break when the gnome libraries are not installed, such as icons for libgnomeui, and external handlers for libgnomevfs and libgconf (it still does broken things under KDE, but it actually works better than without). I guess for the icon issue you mean #561902? I don't see any problem with the search engine dropdown list without libgnomeui-0 installed under KDE. No, I mean a different issue. #561902 only requires gtk. But I can still be wrong, there is maybe no issue. The code linked from #555162 looks like it is used for moz-icon:// urls, which, in turn, are heavily used in the default theme. Can't tell about external handlers without knowing what exactly to try. Edit Preferences Applications, opening a downloaded file, opening a downloaded file containing folder, etc. Cheers, Mike -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100222072404.gb16...@glandium.org
Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 12:33:12PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: On Monday 22 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 06:47:44AM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: I guess for the icon issue you mean #561902? I don't see any problem with the search engine dropdown list without libgnomeui-0 installed under KDE. No, I mean a different issue. #561902 only requires gtk. But I can still be wrong, there is maybe no issue. The code linked from #555162 looks like it is used for moz-icon:// urls, which, in turn, are heavily used in the default theme. If I look at the code the BR refers to, then that looks to be protected by tests to see if it is running in a Gnome environment: if it's there it's used, if not, no problem. I see no reason for a dependency from that, but I may be wrong. Re-reading the code, it looks like stock icons (moz-icon://stock/ urls) will work without gnome libraries, but not other moz-icon urls, such as moz-icon://.txt?size=32 It seems mostly stock icons are used in the default theme, but there are also various places where these others moz-icons:// urls are used. Not sure what kind of impact that would have. Can't tell about external handlers without knowing what exactly to try. Edit Preferences Applications, opening a downloaded file, opening a downloaded file containing folder, etc. I tested it for mailto: I was asked what application to use. kmail was not listed, so I added it and told it to remember that. After that iceweasel perfectly opened kmail's composer for me every time. I also tried downloading a .deb, which did not yet have a handler. In the open/save file dialog I told it to open .deb files with kpackage and to remember that setting. Works fine. If I don't tell it to remember the setting, it will show the open with/save as dialog again. I've checked against iceweasel 3.06 and that works identically. Could you send the output for reportbug --template xulrunner-1.9.1 on your machine ? Mike -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100222120545.ga30...@glandium.org
Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
On Monday 22 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: Could you send the output for reportbug --template xulrunner-1.9.1 on your machine ? -- System Information: Debian Release: squeeze/sid APT prefers unstable APT policy: (500, 'unstable') Architecture: i386 (i686) Kernel: Linux 2.6.32-trunk-686 (SMP w/1 CPU core) Locale: LANG=en_US.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash Versions of packages xulrunner-1.9.1 depends on: ii libasound2 1.0.22-2 shared library for ALSA applicatio ii libatk1.0-0 1.28.0-1 The ATK accessibility toolkit ii libbz2-1.0 1.0.5-4 high-quality block-sorting file co ii libc6 2.10.2-5 Embedded GNU C Library: Shared lib ii libcairo2 1.8.8-2 The Cairo 2D vector graphics libra ii libdbus-1-3 1.2.20-2 simple interprocess messaging syst ii libfontconfig1 2.8.0-2 generic font configuration library ii libfreetype62.3.11-1 FreeType 2 font engine, shared lib ii libgcc1 1:4.4.3-2GCC support library ii libglib2.0-02.22.4-1 The GLib library of C routines ii libgtk2.0-0 2.18.7-1 The GTK+ graphical user interface ii libhunspell-1.2-0 1.2.8-6 spell checker and morphological an ii libjpeg62 6b-16.1 The Independent JPEG Group's JPEG ii libmozjs2d 1.9.1.8-3The Mozilla SpiderMonkey JavaScrip ii libnspr4-0d 4.8.3-1 NetScape Portable Runtime Library ii libnss3-1d 3.12.5-2 Network Security Service libraries ii libpango1.0-0 1.26.2-1 Layout and rendering of internatio ii libpng12-0 1.2.42-2 PNG library - runtime ii libreadline66.1-1GNU readline and history libraries ii libsqlite3-03.6.22-1 SQLite 3 shared library ii libstartup-notification 0.10-1 library for program launch feedbac ii libstdc++6 4.4.3-2 The GNU Standard C++ Library v3 ii libx11-62:1.3.3-1X11 client-side library ii libxrender1 1:0.9.5-1X Rendering Extension client libra ii libxt6 1:1.0.7-1X11 toolkit intrinsics library ii zlib1g 1:1.2.3.4.dfsg-3 compression library - runtime Versions of packages xulrunner-1.9.1 recommends: ii libdbus-glib-1-2 0.84-1 simple interprocess messaging syst pn libgconf2-4 none (no description available) pn libgnome2-0 none (no description available) pn libgnomeui-0 none (no description available) pn libgnomevfs2-0none (no description available) xulrunner-1.9.1 suggests no packages. -- no debconf information -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/201002221328.33758.elen...@planet.nl
Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 01:28:32PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: On Monday 22 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: Could you send the output for reportbug --template xulrunner-1.9.1 on your machine ? -- System Information: Debian Release: squeeze/sid APT prefers unstable APT policy: (500, 'unstable') Architecture: i386 (i686) Kernel: Linux 2.6.32-trunk-686 (SMP w/1 CPU core) Locale: LANG=en_US.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash Versions of packages xulrunner-1.9.1 depends on: snip M... looks like I was too conservative... Let's try to demote these to suggests once the current version hits testing. Mike -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100222144931.ga6...@glandium.org
Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
On Monday 22 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: M... looks like I was too conservative... Let's try to demote these to suggests once the current version hits testing. Cool. Thanks Mike. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20100044.52465.elen...@planet.nl
Re: Bug#570579: xulrunner: please reconsider recommends for GNOME packages
clone 570579 -1 reassign -1 tasksel 2.81 retitle -1 iceweasel is no longer a desktop environment independent browser thanks (Fairly full quote because of CCs.) Thanks a lot for your detailed reply Mike. On Saturday 20 February 2010, Mike Hommey wrote: On Fri, Feb 19, 2010 at 10:18:09PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote: But I question if the Recommends of those packages is policy compliant as Recommends should only be used for packages that would be found together with this one in all but unusual installations [1]. And that's only true for systems running a GNOME desktop environment. For systems running KDE the GNOME packages are not needed and even in a lot of cases very much not desired. Except that Iceweasel has various things that break when the gnome libraries are not installed, such as icons for libgnomeui, and external handlers for libgnomevfs and libgconf (it still does broken things under KDE, but it actually works better than without). I guess for the icon issue you mean #561902? I don't see any problem with the search engine dropdown list without libgnomeui-0 installed under KDE. Can't tell about external handlers without knowing what exactly to try. I'm unlikely to encounter issues myself as I run Lenny on my desktop systems and as I'm only a very light user of iceweasel anyway (only for sites that konqueror does not handle correctly). The only one that really isn't strictly required in the libdbus-glib one. As iceweasel is supposed to be desktop environment independent, I urge you to reconsider this change. IMO the current Recommends make iceweasel unsuitable for default installation. I also feel that for packages like iceweasel integration support for specific desktop environments should always be optional. Reality is different from theory. While Iceweasel is supposed to be DE independent, it really isn't. Sad reality, but still reality. That is indeed very sad. One would hope upstreams, especially ones for important software such as ice*, would have more clue. Now, as I said, there are several things that will break if these libraries are not installed (note you can still prove me wrong), but there are things we can probably do to make things better: - As said above, libdbus-glib-1-2 is not strictly necessary. - IIRC, in 1.9.2, upstream switched most gnomevfs uses to gio, which is in glib. That may help making the dependencies lighter. - There are patches for better KDE integration in opensuse, but we can't take them as-is. The first two above could be worked in the squeeze time-frame. I doubt the latter can. In any case, dependencies on libgnome2-0, libgnomeui-0 and libgconf2-4 are here to stay, IMHO. I'd go as far as saying they should be strong dependencies, but I allow those people that don't like gnome libraries and who want to shoot themselves in the foot to do it. In that case I personally don't think we can maintain iceweasel's status as desktop independent browser for new installations and we'll have to consider removing it from the common desktop task in tasksel. Given that the default browsers for the various desktop environments have become much more mature since Sarge, I don't actually see that as a big problem. It may even help relieve some of the pressure for CD1. Possibly we should keep it as the default browser for XFCE and/or LXDE. Therefore cloning to tasksel for further discussion. I'm leaving the original report against xulrunner as I personally still do consider this whole issue a regression when compared to earlier Debian releases, but I appreciate that your hands are tied. I hope that things will improve. Thanks, FJP -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-qt-kde-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/201002220647.45548.elen...@planet.nl
