Timer doing apt update

[Erwan David]

Hello,

After each boot, the equivalent of apt update is automatically done in 
background, through policykit (apt database is locked by policykitd). So 
I think there is a timer triggroing this. I'd like to disable this when 
my laptop is on expensive link (eg 4G link, or abroad). So I'd like to 
disable this timer, but I did not find it. If someone knws better than me...



--
Erwan David

off-topic spamassassin issue

[Byunghee HWANG]

Hellow Debian Hackers,

This email[0].

The submitter use reportbug(1) program of Debian.
And it seems that submitter use `reportbug.debian.org' as relay SMTP.
And the contents are good i think.

By the way, SpamAssassin did mark as SPAM (X-Spam-Flag: YES).

What do you guys think about this issue?

At least i think that email[0] should not be treated as SPAM. Really i
want to talk with each others here Debian users, thanks!

[0] Take from my Mailbox (With debian-bugs-dist mailing) 
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/Gnus/-/raw/d563c3f3865ae6726d7094734102ff0ced11fc14/stuff/170832481599.2657.12127301583661701514.reportbug@debian


Sincerely, Byunghee from South Korea


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Re: partition reporting full, but not

[David Christensen]

On 2/18/24 19:20, Keith Bainbridge wrote:

I am convinced that the missing space is used by btrfs snapshot process.



Perhaps.  But, are you re-balancing your btrfs file systems regularly?

https://manpages.debian.org/bookworm/btrfs-progs/btrfs-balance.8.en.html


Doing it by hand was not practical for me.  I wrote a Perl script to 
automate the process.  On SSD's, the results were decent.  On USB flash 
drives, not so much.



Searching for a power tool today, I see:

2024-02-18 23:27:43 dpchrist@laalaa ~/stretch-amd64
$ apt-cache search btrfs | grep mainten
btrfsmaintenance - automate btrfs maintenance tasks on mountpoints or 
directories


https://packages.debian.org/bookworm/btrfsmaintenance


I suggest installing and trying the btrfsmaintenance package.


David

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[tomas]

On Mon, Feb 19, 2024 at 02:20:20PM +1100, Keith Bainbridge wrote:

[...]

> I am convinced that the missing space is used by btrfs snapshot process. But
> WHY is the used space reporting on my daily driver LESS than that on the
> spare machine  29G vs 35G? The original install was the same .iso  Ah well

Perhaps because you upgrade your daily driver more often? May be
because it has more packages installed?

Another post of yours upthread suggests that your upgrade process roughly
is:

 1. take snapshot
 2. upgrade

Do you remove your snapshots if/after all went well? (note that I
have no idea how snapshots are removed under btrfs and whether they
are somehow visible to "du" -- I guess the second is a "no").

If not, the space is taken by all the files which have been overwritten
in the upgrade process. More "versions", less space.

Cheers
-- 
t


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Re: sudo udisksctl

[David Wright]

On Sun 18 Feb 2024 at 12:41:29 (+0700), Max Nikulin wrote:
> On 18/02/2024 11:40, David Wright wrote:
> >$ ssh bhost
> >$ udisksctl unlock --block-device /dev/disk/by-partlabel/Nokia01
> >Passphrase:
> > AUTHENTICATING FOR org.freedesktop.udisks2.encrypted-unlock ===
> >Authentication is required to unlock the encrypted device Multiple Card  
> > Reader (/dev/sdc1)
> 
> It should be possible to modify policy to allow a specific user or a
> group to perform disk operations, see polkit(8).

This is basically a single-user network here, and I simplify matters
by keeping all the permitted privileged operations in one place,
under sudoers.d/. I'm happy to let policykit look after the way that
system components work together, but I'm not interested in getting
involved in that stuff myself. The flexibility in configuration,
desirable in multiuser systems, comes with a learning curve that
I'm not interested in climbing.

> When sudo is
> involved, I still do not see any advantage of udisk[s]ctl over
> "cryptsetup open".

I'd be more worried about disadvantages. About the only difference
I see is that   cryptsetup open   requires a name.

> As third option, if I remember it correctly, pmount
> relies on group membership, not on systemd-logind "uaccess", so local
> vs. remote user should not matter. This variant combines unlock and
> mount into a single command.

That would be pointless for me. After udev creates correctly-named
mountpoints using my rules, entries in fstab set the appropriate
flags for each individual device. That contradicts the expressed main
purpose of pmount: "permits normal users to mount removable devices
without a matching /etc/fstab entry." — precisely what I don't want.

Cheers,
David.

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[Keith Bainbridge]

On 19/2/24 10:26, Keith Bainbridge wrote:


On 18/2/24 14:49, Keith Bainbridge wrote:


On 18/2/24 07:34, debian-u...@howorth.org.uk wrote:

Keith Bainbridge  wrote:

Yes the / partitions are btrfs


So the apparently missing space is perhaps taken up by btrfs snapshots.



Seems to be the prime suspect.   If that's the case, btrfs is NOT 
hard- linking the snapshots as timeshift claims it does. The only way 
to check is install on ext4 and compare. I have saves enough free 
space to do this.


My effort to date is to move my home to /mnt/data and sim-link it 
into / home. df is now showing 2.3GB free on /.  df showed /home as 
2.2GB yesterday.  At least there is a little space to play with; and 
give me time to consider. A fresh install may be worth checking in 
snapshots are as big as this all makes them look.


a few brief answer to other comments will follow



So later yesterday afternoon I created a new snapshot with no obvious 
change is free space.


I then update/upgrade.   The initial attempt told me
63 upgraded, 3 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
Need to get 337 MB of archives.
After this operation, 473 MB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue? [Y/n]

But the 3 kernel related packages failed to install a couple of times. 
When I finally figured I should check space, there was none.   I rolled 
back to prior to the upgrade, but still no free space.


I said sometime in this thread that timeshift (and BiT) use hard links 
to create progressive copies of the system. The more I think about how 
hard links reportedly work, I reckon it can't be simply hard links.


So I'm starting a new thread on that topic.




So I'm back to see some more helpful hints. Thanks folk

I am convinced that the missing space is used by btrfs snapshot process. 
But WHY is the used space reporting on my daily driver LESS than that on 
the spare machine  29G vs 35G? The original install was the same .iso 
 Ah well


I could add some of the spare space the the / partition, but how much? 
Play safe and use the lot, making it 60G compared to 63G on my daily 
driver. (And create some free space off the data partition before it's 
too late.)


Just as well I have time on my hands

Again, thanks to all for your suggestions

--
All the best

Keith Bainbridge

keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com
+61 (0)447 667 468

UTC + 10:00

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[Keith Bainbridge]

On 19/2/24 13:41, Felix Miata wrote:

would be some places to start. Didn't you do your
https://btrfs.readthedocs.io/en/latest/btrfs-filesystem.html
reading yet? ?_?



My eyes have glazed over too often, already.  I know I have to get back, 
but that NEED to do it is making it harder.

--
All the best

Keith Bainbridge

keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com
+61 (0)447 667 468

UTC + 10:00

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[Felix Miata]

Keith Bainbridge composed on 2024-02-18 14:49 (UTC+1100):

> debian-u...@howorth.org.uk wrote:

>> So the apparently missing space is perhaps taken up by btrfs snapshots.

> Seems to be the prime suspect. 

While snapshotting is obviously a consumer, until you use the right tool for the
job, you won't know anything meaningful about overall space usage on btrfs.

btrfs filesystem df
btrfs filesystem du
btrfs filesysten show

would be some places to start. Didn't you do your
https://btrfs.readthedocs.io/en/latest/btrfs-filesystem.html
reading yet? ?_?
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is, like religion,
based on faith, not based on science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata

Re: Hard links - How do they work

[Keith Bainbridge]

On 19/2/24 11:15, Kushal Kumaran wrote:

Have you read their FAQ page about hard links?
https://github.com/bit-team/backintime/blob/dev/FAQ.md#how-do-snapshots- 
with-hard-links-work



Very interesting.  Thank you


I have totally missed the concept of copying all files as a starting point.

I was dismayed to read that a file that was deleted disappears from the 
back up as well.  UMMM I didn't know I had deleted that file. A 
month/year later I NEED it quickly. What to do?


I went back to timeshift and looking again, this concept of copying all 
files seems to be used here as well. The author does say that the app 
uses btrfs inbuilt snapshot process when available.


I have to look harder when I browse over something.   Is it looking 
obvious that I never really learnt how to read, 70 years ago in primary 
school.



--
All the best

Keith Bainbridge

keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com
+61 (0)447 667 468

UTC + 10:00

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[Max Nikulin]

On 19/02/2024 06:26, Keith Bainbridge wrote:


So later yesterday afternoon I created a new snapshot with no obvious 
change is free space.


Effect of snapshots is delayed. When you remove a file that does not 
belong to any snapshot, some disk space is reclaimed. However to restore 
a file (even a removed later) from a snapshot, it must be stored 
anywhere. That is why snapshots consume disk space.


Try to remove unnecessary snapshots. I have no idea if btrfs requires 
additional maintenance.

Re: Hard links - How do they work: TANSTAAFL

[Charles Curley]

On Sun, 18 Feb 2024 16:15:01 -0800
Kushal Kumaran  wrote:

> Have you read their FAQ page about hard links?
> https://github.com/bit-team/backintime/blob/dev/FAQ.md#how-do-snapshots-with-hard-links-work

An excellent writeup. The only thing I would add is that creating a
hard link does require an entry in a directory somewhere. If that
requires adding a block to the directory entry, that will happen. So
hard links are not entirely free. TANSTAAFL: There Ain't No Such Thing
As A Free Link.

But I doubt that this explains all of Keith Bainbridge
's problem.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: Hard links - How do they work

[Kushal Kumaran]

On Mon, Feb 19 2024 at 10:52:16 AM, Keith Bainbridge  
wrote:
> As promised:
> I said sometime in this thread that timeshift (and Back in Time) use
> hard links to create progressive copies of the system. The more I
> think about how hard links reportedly work, I reckon it can't be
> simply hard links.
>
> So I'm starting a new thread on that topic.
>
> My understanding is that a hard link (ln with no option) will list the
> file in another directory, but the file remains the same no matter
> where I may edit it.I use cp -lru as a quick and dirty way to
> protect me against accident deleting a file. (Sym-link doesn't give
> that protection, but does allow me to keep my home on a separate
> partition so that a fresh install is a LOT easier; but that is another
> topic)
>
> Snapshots reportedly hard link the directory/ies (generally means /
> but not limited ). a new snapshot copies the latest set and then
> updates any new files in the base.The more I try to visualise that
> process the more I reckon there must be more to it
>
> Anybody care to fill me in please?
>

Have you read their FAQ page about hard links?
https://github.com/bit-team/backintime/blob/dev/FAQ.md#how-do-snapshots-with-hard-links-work

> I am mindful that it is late Sunday night for many of you

Timeshift / Back In Time - How do they work

[Andy Smith]

Hi,

On Mon, Feb 19, 2024 at 10:52:16AM +1100, Keith Bainbridge wrote:
> I said sometime in this thread that timeshift (and Back in Time) use hard
> links to create progressive copies of the system. The more I think about how
> hard links reportedly work, I reckon it can't be simply hard links.

I can tell you how hardlinks work but I can't tell you how
Timeshift or Back In Time work as I have never used them. So you
might want to alter your subject line, because your email goes on
only to ask how these solutions work

Thanks,
Andy

-- 
https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[Keith Bainbridge]

On 18/2/24 14:49, Keith Bainbridge wrote:


On 18/2/24 07:34, debian-u...@howorth.org.uk wrote:

Keith Bainbridge  wrote:

Yes the / partitions are btrfs


So the apparently missing space is perhaps taken up by btrfs snapshots.



Seems to be the prime suspect.   If that's the case, btrfs is NOT hard- 
linking the snapshots as timeshift claims it does. The only way to check 
is install on ext4 and compare. I have saves enough free space to do this.


My effort to date is to move my home to /mnt/data and sim-link it into / 
home. df is now showing 2.3GB free on /.  df showed /home as 2.2GB 
yesterday.  At least there is a little space to play with; and give me 
time to consider. A fresh install may be worth checking in snapshots are 
as big as this all makes them look.


a few brief answer to other comments will follow



So later yesterday afternoon I created a new snapshot with no obvious 
change is free space.


I then update/upgrade.   The initial attempt told me
63 upgraded, 3 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
Need to get 337 MB of archives.
After this operation, 473 MB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue? [Y/n]

But the 3 kernel related packages failed to install a couple of times. 
When I finally figured I should check space, there was none.   I rolled 
back to prior to the upgrade, but still no free space.


I said sometime in this thread that timeshift (and BiT) use hard links 
to create progressive copies of the system. The more I think about how 
hard links reportedly work, I reckon it can't be simply hard links.


So I'm starting a new thread on that topic.


--
All the best

Keith Bainbridge

keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com
+61 (0)447 667 468

UTC + 10:00

Re: partition reporting full, but not

[Keith Bainbridge]

On 18/2/24 14:08, Max Nikulin wrote:

On 17/02/2024 09:52, Greg Wooledge wrote:

If so, you *could*  have data inside the /home directory
of the root file system, which is hidden by the /home file system that's
mounted over it.  You'd need to unmount /home to check.


A less intrusive way to inspect shadowed directories is bind mounts.

     mkdir /tmp/root
     mount --bind / /tmp/root




Thank you Max

This has proved a real boon
--
All the best

Keith Bainbridge

keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com
+61 (0)447 667 468

UTC + 10:00

Re: Emoji broken in gnome-terminal

[Byunghee HWANG]

Hellow Ash!

On Mon, 2024-02-19 at 11:14 +1300, Ash Joubert wrote:
> On 2024-02-19 08:57, Ash Joubert wrote:
> > I removed /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf (as root) and ran 
> > "fc-cache -f" (as user). I still have a few missing emojis in 
> > xfce4-terminal (flags and combined emojis) but geany is fixed.
> Working test-emoji screenshot attached (xfce4-terminal on sid). 😊
> 

Now solved problem, it works, thanks ^^^ (⚡🌾🏞️🌛🐂🐧⚡⚡)
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/commit/56d70211802fc69938411ab4c06747c7dc102d90


Sincerely, Byunghee from South Korea


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Re: Emoji broken in gnome-terminal

[Ash Joubert]

On 2024-02-19 08:57, Ash Joubert wrote:
I removed /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf (as root) and ran 
"fc-cache -f" (as user). I still have a few missing emojis in 
xfce4-terminal (flags and combined emojis) but geany is fixed.

Working test-emoji screenshot attached (xfce4-terminal on sid). 😊

--
Ash Joubert (they/them) 
Director / Game Developer
Transient Software Limited 
New Zealand

Re: GRUB lost graphical terminal mode

[Michael Kjörling]

On 18 Feb 2024 21:28 +0100, from borde...@tutanota.com (Borden):
> what the default is when neither of those are set (which doesn't
> work). Is this another "undocumented feature" of GRUB?

Would you be willing to post your /boot/grub/grub.cfg for a setup
where you get the blank screen GRUB?

-- 
Michael Kjörling 🔗 https://michael.kjorling.se
“Remember when, on the Internet, nobody cared that you were a dog?”

Re: Re: GRUB lost graphical terminal mode

[Borden]

> Or perhaps you have all colors set to blank.
> Try add something like
> GRUB_COLOR_NORMAL="light-blue/black"
> GRUB_COLOR_HIGHLIGHT="light-cyan/blue"

Unfortunately, that didn't work. Still a blank screen. I'm curious that if 
GRUB_TERMINAL=gfxterm works and 
GRUB_TERMINAL=console works, what the default is when neither of those are set 
(which doesn't work). Is this another "undocumented feature" of GRUB?

Re: Emoji broken in gnome-terminal

[Ash Joubert]

On 2024-02-19 07:08, Ash Joubert wrote:

On 2024-02-18 23:33, Byunghee HWANG wrote:

On Sun, 2024-02-18 at 16:23 +0900, Byunghee HWANG wrote:

I am using Gnome desktop in Debian Sid. Today, after upgrade package
via apt update/upgrade, i can not see emoji in gnome-terminal.


I am also on sid and see similar (loss of colour emojis) in 
xfce4-terminal and geany under X. There was fontconfig update on sid.


Partial solution:
https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=2141395#p2141395

I had the same issue and deleting the /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf 
symlink fixed it for me. I guess fontconfig 2.15 considers Noto Color Emoji a 
bitmap font.


I removed /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf (as root) and ran 
"fc-cache -f" (as user). I still have a few missing emojis in 
xfce4-terminal (flags and combined emojis) but geany is fixed.



Cheers,

--
Ash Joubert (they/them) 
Director / Game Developer
Transient Software Limited 
New Zealand

Re: Emoji broken in gnome-terminal

[Ash Joubert]

On 2024-02-18 23:33, Byunghee HWANG wrote:

On Sun, 2024-02-18 at 16:23 +0900, Byunghee HWANG wrote:

Hellow,
I am using Gnome desktop in Debian Sid. Today, after upgrade package
via apt update/upgrade, i can not see emoji in gnome-terminal.
(...)

Just now, i did clean-up with screenshots [1],[2],[3].
[1] test screenshot in bullseye
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/raw/ab63bd169a9c3deb60063398518c5a055d0ee9b8/gnome-terminal/test-emoji-bullseye.png
[2] test screenshot in sid
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/raw/1a95638c7722b52a1a2aae0111b29a630ae013f9/gnome-terminal/test-emoji-sid.png
[3] test source code (text UTF-8 emoji)
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/raw/ab63bd169a9c3deb60063398518c5a055d0ee9b8/gnome-terminal/test-emoji.txt
Both bullseye and sid are under Wayland.
Consider this one please... if it is not a bug.
Thanks, Byunghee from South Korea


I am also on sid and see similar (loss of colour emojis) in 
xfce4-terminal and geany under X. There was fontconfig update on sid.


Cheers,

--
Ash Joubert (they/them) 
Director / Game Developer
Transient Software Limited 
New Zealand

Re: hexchat being discontinued?

[Byunghee HWANG]

On Sat, 2024-02-17 at 18:00 -0500, Default User wrote:
> On Mon, 2024-02-12 at 09:16 +0900, Byunghee HWANG (황병희) wrote:
> > Hellow^^^
> > 
> > On Sat, 2024-02-10 at 19:54 -0500, Default User wrote:
> > > :(
> > > (...)
> > > Any recommendations for a GOOD alternative?
> > 
> > How about Emacs?
> > 
> 
> Hi to all. 
> 
> I am just going to continue to use hexchat for a while, and then
> switch
> to Pidgin. 
> Thanks for the replies!
> 


Always welcome! Happy hacking ^^^


Thanks, Byunghee from South Korea



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Re: Emoji broken in gnome-terminal

[Byunghee HWANG]

On Sun, 2024-02-18 at 16:23 +0900, Byunghee HWANG wrote:
> Hellow,
> 
> I am using Gnome desktop in Debian Sid. Today, after upgrade package
> via apt update/upgrade, i can not see emoji in gnome-terminal.
> 
> (...)

Just now, i did clean-up with screenshots [1],[2],[3].

[1] test screenshot in bullseye
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/raw/ab63bd169a9c3deb60063398518c5a055d0ee9b8/gnome-terminal/test-emoji-bullseye.png

[2] test screenshot in sid
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/raw/1a95638c7722b52a1a2aae0111b29a630ae013f9/gnome-terminal/test-emoji-sid.png

[3] test source code (text UTF-8 emoji)
https://gitlab.com/soyeomul/stuff/-/raw/ab63bd169a9c3deb60063398518c5a055d0ee9b8/gnome-terminal/test-emoji.txt


Both bullseye and sid are under Wayland.
Consider this one please... if it is not a bug.


Thanks, Byunghee from South Korea




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