Re: apt-get upgrade - kernel-image
Ernst-Magne Vindal wrote: Hi, not sure this is a problem but I'll like to check anyway. When doing apt-get upgrade the only package listed for upgrade is the kernel image. this is working fine and I'm not sure what the upgrade will do. The sources list say stable. I got a few packages from unstable, but apt is configured to default stable. Why will apt upgrade the kernel? The installed ver. is ii kernel-image-2.6.8-2-386 2.6.8-16 and the same version no. is the one to upgrade. Can I instead hold the kernel-image? It is a security update: http://lists.debian.org/debian-security-announce/debian-security-announce-2005/msg00323.html I would advise performing the installation. -- http://debianhomepage.org http://debcentral.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Last stable kernel is from May
Hello, I saw following question on our local/national linux support site without satisfying answer: Why last stable kernel is so old (May) if there were some serious security issues discovered later: http://secunia.com/product/2719/#advisories_2005 Please note I'm not asking about kernel version but release date. Thank you very much Igor A possible work-around is to compiled your own kernels too. There's nothing preventing you from securing your systems yourself. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
Richard Lyons wrote: I'm half inclined to ignore this post as merely promotional, but debcentral looks fairly interesting, even if I couldn't create an account on its wiki (that part of the form missing). Thanks for the ideas and suggestions. I am hoping that we can accomplish some kind of agreement, and your suggestion has some possibilities. As for the wiki registration being broken, I will have to look into that, and I apologize sincerely for it. The person responsible for maintaining it has been in the midst of moving to a new house and hasn't been available for a few days, so I really have no good explanation as to why its not working. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
Josh King wrote: Don't take this the wrong way, but you asked. What is the point of your site existing? What does it achieve that has not already been achieved elsewhere, better? I like the one-question FAQ: I want to get more involved with DebCentral, what can I do to help? WHo (sic) do I need to contact? What an informative resource. To answer your first question, please read what I originally posted. I think that pretty much clearly defines what I would *like* to do. As for the FAQ comment, I'm really missing your point. The answer is pretty clearly stated. For a site thats only been around a short time, how many frequently asked questions would you expect? Maybe just make up a few and claim they're frequently asked as many do? Anyway, the point of this post was to gather ideas and suggestions. Do you have any? If you don't like it the way it is, then please give some suggestions or ideas to improve it. Jump in and help out, or at least give us an example of someplace you would consider to be doing things better. Otherwise I would return your question and ask what the point of your post existing is? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
I wonder if you or colleagues have taken a good look at what other distros and their users are doing with regard to websites. Perhaps some ideas may come of it? The only other ones I know well are SuSE and Ubuntu. SuSE's online presence is also a little bitty and spread around, largely because of the way the distro evolved before Novell took it over. I have looked at them a bit, but I'm really hoping to get a sense of what the Debian community would prefer also. I think Ubuntu's sites, both official and third party sites, such as ours, are done very well. I know also that the tone of those sites seems to be very welcoming and inclusive. From inputs I have gathered this far, I would say that that tone is one of the real strengths of such sites. My ideal website would be one that combined the material in the really useful http://www.debian-administration.org/ with simpler guides for less experienced users (such as, the basics of aptitude, how to install Nvidia/ATI 3d drivers, or the basics of Debian-specific commands like dpkg-reconfigure or invoke-rc.d) and forums where folks could discuss things, ask questions and point out helpful tips like where good apt sources are. There might also be a news section where Debian-specific items were announced or interviews run (there is no shortage of Debian developers to interview or ask for pieces from). Excellent suggestion. In fact, Steve emailed myself and my colleague from Debian-News to get the scoop on what we're trying to accomplish. I agree that the documentation for new users would probably be a very useful asset; I think someplace welcoming to new users would be a great idea. However, in my experience running a website is a great deal of hard work and many people start to flag after three months or so. Many other people enjoy running their own show and wouldn't want to combine into a bigger one, other than as, perhaps, an item in a web ring. Agreed. I have worked on several projects where this exact thing happened. In fact, some of my original volunteers have begun to peter out a bit already. The web-ring idea has been suggested to me by several people. While I agree with the sentiment, I really hate web-rings. Perhaps some kind of gateway site would work? Take something like http://linuxhomepage.com as a base model with the RSS feeds, possibly some way for visitors to review/comment on the sites? I guess your questions are pertinent and quite hard to answer, because there is already quite a lot of information out there even if it can be hard to find and is divided between various sites. Good luck, anyway! Many folks talk about doing this but few get off their backsides and make the effort. I really appreciate you taking the time to comment. I'm hoping that with a sufficiently motived group, we can get things moving and sustained. That is one problem I have seen with some of the more established sites; they seem to have slowed to a crawl in some cases. Many people have commented to me that they had tried to contact those existing sites to volunteer to help out but either didn't receive a response or other such problems. Hopefully we can get them involved in some way as well. Please keep the ideas and comments coming; the more inputs the better. Thanks! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
Antony Gelberg wrote: I don't understand what you want to do other than run a website and collaborate with other websites, whatever that means in this instance. What I want to do is cut down on the redundancy. Whether I run it or not is irrelevant. I would like to be involved, yes. Collaborating in this instance means not having 10 websites that post the same thing over and over again; working to specialize to limit overlaps, maybe even being open to trying new things and ideas. As for the FAQ comment, I'm really missing your point. The answer is pretty clearly stated. For a site thats only been around a short time, how many frequently asked questions would you expect? Maybe just make up a few and claim they're frequently asked as many do? Oh. Is the one that is there frequently asked? Yes. Of all the communications I have received regarding the website, it is far and away #1; hence the title of 'FAQ'. Anyway, the point of this post was to gather ideas and suggestions. Do you have any? Yes. Put your efforts into improving existing infrastructure rather than reinventing the wheel. Such as? You can only improve areas you can affect. For example, taking from your list below, how would you suggest people get involved with improving planet.debian.net? At the time we began forming, Debianplanet.org had basically gone dead for almost 2 months, and had been extremely sporadic prior to that. Several people have told me that they attempted to contact that site over the course of that period and received no response, so they assumed it was dead for good. I can't verify those claims; just mentioning it to illustrate my point. If you don't like it the way it is, then please give some suggestions or ideas to improve it. Jump in and help out, or at least give us an example of someplace you would consider to be doing things better. Given that your site is embryonic, I would consider almost every well-known debian resource is doing things better. Examples are: http://www.debian.org/ http://www.debian-administration.org/ http://www.debianplanet.org/ http://www.aboutdebian.com/ http://planet.debian.net/ http://www.linuks.mine.nu/debian-faq-wiki/ So, by virtue of being embryonic, things are done poorly? I'm not trying to be difficult, but it seems you're implying that a site must be well-established to be better? I know of and visit all of those sites often; some are very well done and they all serve their purpose I suppose. But comparing some of them to what I have been discussing here is really apples to oranges. I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to respond to this. I honestly do value your opinion, don't take this the wrong way and think I do not. But I get the impression that your suggestion is that we should all just forget about it and maintain the status quo. If that is your overall opinion, then I would respectfully disagree. If no one ever started something new, that list would be quite bare. If nothing else then maybe we can affect some positive change this way, maybe we find a niche and fill it for those who would welcome it, who knows? If I had all the answers I wouldn't be asking here. If I were wanting to do this just for my own sake, why would I even bother asking for suggestions? I just feel that there is plenty of room for a different and new approach to this entire subject. As was noted in another post in this thread, other distros have multiple websites run by users, why shouldn't Debian? I don't think that should be discouraged as long as it is done properly (i.e. making it clear that it *is* a third party resource and not an official Debian project, etc.). I would like to think that if we can gather some inputs and work out a way to fill a niche then that possibility deserves exploration; thats the point of this entire thread. IMO change and progress are good things as is trying to work together. I am hoping that if we gather the ideas and suggestions, we can provide something that people want and will use. If it fails, at least we can say we tried. One positive effect that has already happened from our work is that several members of DebCentral have moved from various derivatives and are now running mainline Debian. With a bit of support they realized that they already knew the basics of a Debian system from their experiences with derivatives, and all of them are very happy and satisfied with their new software. If nothing else, maybe we can educate some people and grow some into productive members of the Debian community. I would call that a niche that would have a positive effect. Anyway, I hope this finally explains to you exactly where I am coming from on this. Its my opinion, and something I believe in and want to attempt as my way of trying to give something back; hopefully it will be the first of many times I have the opportunity to help out and give back to Debian. I respect your opinion, and appreciate your time. If you're set against these ideas,
Re: Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
Andy Streich wrote: Sometimes it's about the personal requirement for individual recognition, but other times it has more to do with an individual having a vision and trying it out. That's not something we should be pushing back on. Sure it would be nice if all these people found a way to cooperatively produce all the Debian-related material we all wish for -- and that should always be tried. But figuring out how to become part of the relevant group, learning who needs to be influenced, and, frankly, playing the politics that are always part of a group can sap the creative energy from a person with a good idea. [SNIP] Exactly. I don't understand why some people believe that the sole reason anyone undertakes an idea is for personal gain...sigh But, thats for the politicos to bore each other with. So, the question is still open. What is all the Debian-related material we all wish for? At least in your view? I've received several inputs on this, both on and off this list. Its given us a good direction to start with, but I'd like to be able to define an end goal with all of this. Obviously, Debian-Administration is quite capably handling the high end and the docs cover all a developer would ever wnt to kow to get started. So, at least from what I see, the holes may be in the new users realm. Then again, I could be totally wrong. It has happened before ;-) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
Alvin Oga wrote: yes .. always give credit to those willing to put in time and effort into free documentation and other relevant info ... - and if they are looking for helpers, one could step in and help fix the problems they're having what someone doesn't like may be what others do like .. - choice is good - too many choices is bad those that put in the initial time to setup a quickie ( the ez part ) may quickly die out since it's a lot of work or stay for the duration .. a yr, or 5 yr or more depending on their goals/aspirations .. c ya alvin All I can do is give my assurances that I plan to be in this for the duration. Those who know me know I'm not one to give up easily ;-) As for help to fix the problems, I would welcome anyone willing to roll up their sleeves and dig in. I'm not claiming to have all the answers, and I definitely am not a super-guru. I know the current situation needs work, and while I've been doing what i can there is only so much one person can do. I'm hoping that in time at least, we will gain some assistance from others; websites, users, devs, and even newbies can all offer something. Everyone has their own areas of expertise, and none of us knows it all. Collectively though, and with enough time, the situation should improve. Thanks to everyone who has commented. I'm compiling a list of suggestions for review and have passed it on to the other websites I am in contact with thus far. Oh also, FWIW I did fix the wiki also. Guess I'll be giving myself a crash course in MediaWiki next...lol -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Slightly OT: Comments, ideas, or suggestions for improving websites
Hey all, Currently I am the lead admin/webmaster of DebCentral.org. I really would like to take a few minutes out of your life to gather some inputs on an idea I have. I know the general advice from this list and other Debian-* lists has generally consistent through the years I have followed them. The advice to those wanting to start a new Debian-centric website has been to support and work with an existing one. Well, in the recent weeks/months there seems to have been a significant increase in third-party web sites and communities springing up around the globe; ours included. This very subject was the basis of an article written by a colleague of mine, Christian, webmaster of Debian-News [1]. After that article, he and I began discussing ways we could cooperate between our two sites. Since then we have discussed this potential cooperation with several other website owners/administrators, with mixed results thus far. I'm hopeful that we can convince others to join us in trying to increase the quality of these sites, and possibly thereby also decreasing the quantity. There seem to be two main issues to making this happen. First is getting the cooperative spirit going; many people are unwilling to totally put aside their own creations to begin working on a group effort, or want the group effort to somehow benefit not only the new project/group but to also benefit back to the existing websites. The second issue is a lack of ideas or suggestions as to what actual project(s) can and should be undertaken so as to allow each website to be treated fairly and equally, while focusing on the maximum benefit to the community. Basically, we're stumped as to what and how to make this come about. [2] I'm looking to the community to maybe help us figure out the best way to handle this. Any ideas or suggestions for what we all could do to better work with and for the Debian community would be greatly appreciated. I'm open for any suggestions, and am hoping some of you can provide a fresh perspective on this and some fresh ideas on what to do and how to implement some form of cooperation. One idea I had was to concentrate our efforts into one mega-site. This would allow everyone involved to focus their time and effort into the areas that best fit their talent and skills. It would be a totally new endeavor, and dedicated solely to providing a service to the community at large without regard for what may be best for an existing site. However, I think my vision in this may be a bit overreaching in light of the realities from the above paragraph. Or it just plain may be a silly and bad idea. The poll [2] on DebCentral hopefully will provide some further insight to this idea of cooperative web sites. If you have any ideas, comments, or suggestions, please share them with us. I know we'd love to have some inputs from everyone on this. Also, if you are a member or administrator of a Debian focused (or close derivate distro focused) website or community and would be interested in this idea, please reply on here or off-list to my email or josh AT DebCentral.org.org If you're not affiliated with any current website or would just like to help out and get involved with any future works and/or existing sites, again please contact me so we can get you involved and up to speed on things as they sit at that moment. Thanks and I look forward to hearing your comments, even if you think the whole idea just plain sucks. 1. http://debian-news.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=354 2. http://debcentral.org/modules/news/article.php?storyid=141 -- http://debcentral.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Sarge Betting Pool
Ben Bettin wrote: Feb 31, 2005 ;) Ben Winner! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
