Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
Speaking for myself -- Sometimes an off-topic email perks my interest so powerfully that, defying all reason of course, I neglect to disassociate the off-topic from the topic that it was off. I shall try harder now in such situations to discipline my response. PA Weaver wrote: On Sat, 08 Oct 2011 17:26:24 -0500 Stan Hoeppners...@hardwarefreak.com wrote: On 10/8/2011 4:59 PM, Weaver wrote: It's a pity that's not the case, as I sometimes have a question regarding firewalls, etc and take it to the firewall list, yet the number of questions regarding firewalls I have seen on 'debian-user' probably far out-number those on 'firewall'. This probably means that the answer to a searcher's question exists, but they have been looking where the answer isn't. Since you are apparently unable to discern on your own what is and is not on topic, do you require someone to write a detailed list of everything possibly discussed on this planet, with a little star next to each that is on topic? I think the best answer to that is just to let it stand as it is. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e921bd4.9020...@aya.yale.edu
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 10/7/2011 7:58 PM, Scott Ferguson wrote: On 07/10/11 07:32, Weaver wrote: What I have seen, with the clearly marked OT threads is the ability to ignore/delete them Agreed. I've been trying like h3ll to avoid another response to this for obvious reasons. But a point needs to be raised that everyone should read and comprehend. This list has maybe a few thousand subscribers. I would guess that English Debian has many tens of thousands of users. Most of those users find answers to their questions in the list archives, either via Google or directly searching the sites that archive this list. OT messages get archived with the rest. Depending on the search text, it's likely one will get hits to these OT threads. Do I need to elaborate on what a time waster this can be? Apparently because they are self centered individuals, many/most responders to my message assumed I was scolding the the OT threads because they were directly affecting me negatively. This is true to a very minor degree. These same people are either unaware of the bigger picture, or simply choose to ignore it. The content of this list has a much larger audience than the list members. Please keep those folks who search the archives in mind when clogging the list with OT content. -- Stan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e8fe744.9000...@hardwarefreak.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
Stan Hoeppner wrote: On 10/7/2011 7:58 PM, Scott Ferguson wrote: I've been trying like h3ll to avoid another response to this for obvious reasons. Me too. But... But a point needs to be raised that everyone should read and comprehend. OT messages get archived with the rest. Depending on the search text, it's likely one will get hits to these OT threads. Do I need to elaborate on what a time waster this can be? I can honestly say that I've yet to find this a problem - either when googling or going through list archives. Searches ALWAYS find lots of extraneous material and have to be narrowed down. When looking for technical information, things get very specific very quickly, which tends to filter out off topic discussions very quickly. Just try googling debian +some piece of software or debian +some error message --- assuming that you plug something specific into that search, you're not going to find any of the recent off-topic discussions, or this message (I realized as I was typing that using plugging in a specific example WOULD return this message in a search). -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. Infnord practice, there is. Yogi Berra -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e904f51.8010...@meetinghouse.net
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On Sat, 08 Oct 2011 02:01:40 -0400 (EDT), Stan Hoeppner wrote: I've been trying like h3ll to avoid another response to this for obvious reasons. ... I have too. But it appears that I need to speak up on list. (I've previously apologized to Stan off list.) I hereby offer my most humble apologies to those on this list who have been annoyed by the unusually high volume of off-topic posts over the last several days. I am the one who started the original off-topic thread of British vs. American English, and I very much regret doing so. Had I anticipated the huge volume of off-topic posts which would ensue, I would never have posted in the first place. I hope I have learned my lesson. I will think long and hard before making another off-topic post. Now please, gentlemen, let's cease this rancor. If you feel you must attack someone, attack me. I started this. It's my fault. I value the contributions of all on this list, whether they agree with me or not. In fact, I have learned a great deal from those with whom I do not agree. Sometimes, they have even caused me to re-evaluate my position. Now, I appeal to you all, let's get back to the business of helping each other instead of attacking each other. Peace, my friends. Peace. -- .''`. Stephen Powell : :' : `. `'` `- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1999345409.2371995.1318091576896.javamail.r...@md01.wow.synacor.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 10/8/2011 8:25 AM, Miles Fidelman wrote: I can honestly say that I've yet to find this a problem - either when googling or going through list archives. Searches ALWAYS find lots of extraneous material and have to be narrowed down. When looking for technical information, things get very specific very quickly, which tends to filter out off topic discussions very quickly. This is not my experience, and likely the same for others. Most off topic noise is injected into legitimate threads as conversation drift. Most off topic content isn't contained within posts that begin with an [OT] tag because most people aren't that considerate of others. I'm not talking about this list specifically, but all lists. For instance, you search and Google hits on the first post in a relevant thread. You read the first few posts and don't have the answer yet. Then the next 20 posts contain mostly off topic drift peppered with some on topic information. Finally toward the last few posts you might find the actual answer you're looking for as the thread comes back on topic. Maybe my experience here is different than others because I'm usually searching for things that are very new or simply obscure, and again, not necessarily specific to Debian. If you all are true believers in off topic posting, as you have so vigorously defended, why don't we _all_ commit ourselves to making one OT post per day and see where that leads? -- Stan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e90a2f3.6040...@hardwarefreak.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 8 October 2011 20:22, Stan Hoeppner s...@hardwarefreak.com wrote: If you all are true believers in off topic posting, as you have so vigorously defended, why don't we _all_ commit ourselves to making one OT post per day and see where that leads? Actually I am not one of true believers in off topic posting, neither have I so vigorously defended it. Out of the increased volume over the last several weeks, I have had a great deal of enjoyment and- dare I say it on a apparently would be totally serious, and solely, and only to the point, one true Debian list- I have learned a great deal whilst so doing. Yes, the OT topic wandered: I enjoyed the discussion on English and it's variations, found the values of units we use so casually informative, and the discussion of the costs/benefits of AC v. DC electrical distribution most educational. What's not to like? If I do not like a thread, or have no interest in it, I merely delete it at the same time I delete other lists and other threads. It takes little or no extra time, and I would be very much surprised that those who cavil at such threads read all and each message on each on topic thread. So when they delete the on topic messages in which they have no interest, would it take them much more time to delete the off topic messages at the same time. Or does it take less time to compose and post a message complaining about them. As for the merely silly latter suggestion, well, it surely does not deserve the dignity of a reply. Terence -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAFG91ENG_EgHu=pkhtboygucauvxekuc9vqzxz886l3zy-m...@mail.gmail.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On Thu, Oct 06, 2011 at 08:24:07AM -0600, Aaron Toponce wrote: On 10/06/2011 06:32 AM, Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. If you are using an MUA that supports threading, then I don't see the issue. It's all contained in one thread, and it doesn't prevent me from seeing other posts in other threads. Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. Following the Re: Wow, Evolution left me with eggs in my face thread, including all of its off-topic sub-threads, has shown a great level of maturity and tact. I see nothing juvenile about the thread personally. Maybe the occasional off topic post should be a reminder to subscribe to d-community-offto...@lists.alioth.debian.org The official Debian archive of support information would be left cleaner. Filtering into separate or joint mailboxes gives sharper organization than depending on OT in the header. The varying needs for social environment would be satisfied along with the need for a positive signal to noise ratio. -- Regards, Freeman Microsoft is not the answer. Microsoft is the question. NO (or Linux) is the answer. --Somebody -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111008214611.GA3381@Deneb.office
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On Sat, 8 Oct 2011 14:46:11 -0700 Freeman hew...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Oct 06, 2011 at 08:24:07AM -0600, Aaron Toponce wrote: On 10/06/2011 06:32 AM, Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. If you are using an MUA that supports threading, then I don't see the issue. It's all contained in one thread, and it doesn't prevent me from seeing other posts in other threads. Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. Following the Re: Wow, Evolution left me with eggs in my face thread, including all of its off-topic sub-threads, has shown a great level of maturity and tact. I see nothing juvenile about the thread personally. Maybe the occasional off topic post should be a reminder to subscribe to d-community-offto...@lists.alioth.debian.org The official Debian archive of support information would be left cleaner. Filtering into separate or joint mailboxes gives sharper organization than depending on OT in the header. The varying needs for social environment would be satisfied along with the need for a positive signal to noise ratio. It's a pity that's not the case, as I sometimes have a question regarding firewalls, etc and take it to the firewall list, yet the number of questions regarding firewalls I have seen on 'debian-user' probably far out-number those on 'firewall'. This probably means that the answer to a searcher's question exists, but they have been looking where the answer isn't. Regards, Weaver. -- In a world without walls and fences, what need have we for Windows or Gates? -Anon. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111009075936.62085fc4.wea...@riseup.net
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 10/8/2011 4:59 PM, Weaver wrote: It's a pity that's not the case, as I sometimes have a question regarding firewalls, etc and take it to the firewall list, yet the number of questions regarding firewalls I have seen on 'debian-user' probably far out-number those on 'firewall'. This probably means that the answer to a searcher's question exists, but they have been looking where the answer isn't. Since you are apparently unable to discern on your own what is and is not on topic, do you require someone to write a detailed list of everything possibly discussed on this planet, with a little star next to each that is on topic? -- Stan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e90ce10.8010...@hardwarefreak.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On Sat, 08 Oct 2011 17:26:24 -0500 Stan Hoeppner s...@hardwarefreak.com wrote: On 10/8/2011 4:59 PM, Weaver wrote: It's a pity that's not the case, as I sometimes have a question regarding firewalls, etc and take it to the firewall list, yet the number of questions regarding firewalls I have seen on 'debian-user' probably far out-number those on 'firewall'. This probably means that the answer to a searcher's question exists, but they have been looking where the answer isn't. Since you are apparently unable to discern on your own what is and is not on topic, do you require someone to write a detailed list of everything possibly discussed on this planet, with a little star next to each that is on topic? I think the best answer to that is just to let it stand as it is. -- In a world without walls and fences, what need have we for Windows or Gates? -Anon. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111009092522.0a44a181.wea...@riseup.net
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 09/10/11 09:26, Stan Hoeppner wrote: On 10/8/2011 4:59 PM, Weaver wrote: It's a pity that's not the case, as I sometimes have a question regarding firewalls, etc and take it to the firewall list, yet the number of questions regarding firewalls I have seen on 'debian-user' probably far out-number those on 'firewall'. This probably means that the answer to a searcher's question exists, but they have been looking where the answer isn't. Since you are apparently unable to discern on your own what is and is not on topic, do you require someone to write a detailed list of everything possibly discussed on this planet, with a little star next to each that is on topic? http://lists.debian.org/debian-firewall/2011/09/msg1.html -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e90eaea.5020...@gmail.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
Weaver wrote: The point has often been made that this list is for Debian 'Users' and not therefore strictly Debian subject matter. I think a bit of social interaction does have the tendency to create 'community' which is Debian's strength, so it could be viewed as productive. While this is true, it's best to keep such social interaction, on this list, grounded around things that are on-topic. (For example, let me just say that I'm a big fan of riseup.net and happy to see you here from such an address.) The listmasters have on one occasion had to intervene when debian-user was flooded with offtopic posts that became increasingly offensive. What I have seen, with the clearly marked OT threads is the ability to ignore/delete them as I do when I look through and delete any other threads that I am not currently interested in or can't help with. Not all of our situations are the same. Some read debian-user via web interfaces, without threading, or are new or prospective users who have not found great mail clients, or who may be subscribing to a high-volume mailing list for the first time. I personally develop Debian mostly from behind a dialup modem link, so every offtopic debian-user post has the potential to delay a package upload. -- see shy jo signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 07/10/11 07:32, Weaver wrote: On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 10:15:07 -0400 Miles Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net wrote: Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. Agreed (Stan), but unfortunately, like expecting people to abide by the published policies regarding language - it generally doesn't happen. In fact, on this list - the more offensive the poster - the more people throw themselves in the mud to assist them. :-( Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. Also agreed. I suspect you speak for the majority of list subscribers - those that read but don't post *unless they have a question*. What's your problem? What's yours? Comprehension? Stan clearly stated his objections. Perhaps you didn't mean to offend (Miles)... It's interesting stuff, That's your assessment/opinion. And it sounds like an ignorant, bullying, and arrogant opinion. (again, that might not be your intention - just how it reads). and everyone is being polite and marking it [OT] and all that (except you, I might note). Maybe you should learn to use your delete key and/or kill-file stuff containing [OT] Agreed - (but I don't endorse your method of saying it.) AFAIK, all MUAs allow some sort of filtering. Using a disposable, free, web mail account allows you to do that filtering without having to download the noise (and preserve the signal). The point has often been That's weasel talk (Heddle Weaver). Many people believed the world was flat also - it doesn't make it so. made that this list is for Debian 'Users' and not therefore strictly Debian subject matter. Like a Texan long horn - there's a point here, and a point there - with a whole lot of bull in-between. The code of conduct is published - if you don't like it, then vote against it instead of making s*it up to support an unsustainable argument. http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/:- *The mailing lists exist to foster the development and use of Debian. Non-constructive or off-topic messages, along with other abuses, are not welcome.* I think There's an established protocol for these issues in Debian - it's a community vote. Not an individuals thought. a bit of social interaction does have the tendency to create 'community' which is Debian's strength, so it could be viewed as productive. Plurium interrogationum - how cute. You do yourself no favours advancing that sort of fallacious logic. What I have seen, with the clearly marked OT threads is the ability to ignore/delete them Agreed. as I do when I look through and delete any other threads that I am not currently interested in or can't help with. The 'noise' on this list is nothing to what I have seen in the past. One, I remember, over communist mainland China and Taiwan that resulted, very regretfully, in a kernel developer leaving. What we have seen in the Debian lists is that people who provide genuine assistance - don't because of the difficulty of wading through torrents of irrelevant rubbish. There's never a shortage of helpers with irrelevant opinions, or pluckers of low hanging fruit (here's what Google says. Tagging [OT] - is good, keeping the subject matter to Debian software and is better. We are human beings and not automatons. Relevance? We use different oil. Indeed but what are you trying to say? Either we allow endless off-topic drivel or we lose the list?? Pure bifurcation rubbish. There are web forums for off-topic material - some even give bean ratings. Regards, Weaver. Note that in the past a list was created just for off-topic discussions. No one used it. Cheers. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e8fa03f.6030...@gmail.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On Sat, 08 Oct 2011 11:58:39 +1100 Scott Ferguson prettyfly.producti...@gmail.com wrote: On 07/10/11 07:32, Weaver wrote: On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 10:15:07 -0400 Miles Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net wrote: Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. Agreed (Stan), but unfortunately, like expecting people to abide by the published policies regarding language - it generally doesn't happen. In fact, on this list - the more offensive the poster - the more people throw themselves in the mud to assist them. :-( Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. Also agreed. I suspect you speak for the majority of list subscribers - those that read but don't post *unless they have a question*. What's your problem? What's yours? Comprehension? Stan clearly stated his objections. Perhaps you didn't mean to offend (Miles)... It's interesting stuff, That's your assessment/opinion. And it sounds like an ignorant, bullying, and arrogant opinion. (again, that might not be your intention - just how it reads). and everyone is being polite and marking it [OT] and all that (except you, I might note). Maybe you should learn to use your delete key and/or kill-file stuff containing [OT] Agreed - (but I don't endorse your method of saying it.) AFAIK, all MUAs allow some sort of filtering. Using a disposable, free, web mail account allows you to do that filtering without having to download the noise (and preserve the signal). The point has often been That's weasel talk (Heddle Weaver). Many people believed the world was flat also - it doesn't make it so. made that this list is for Debian 'Users' and not therefore strictly Debian subject matter. Like a Texan long horn - there's a point here, and a point there - with a whole lot of bull in-between. The code of conduct is published - if you don't like it, then vote against it instead of making s*it up to support an unsustainable argument. http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/:- *The mailing lists exist to foster the development and use of Debian. Non-constructive or off-topic messages, along with other abuses, are not welcome.* I think There's an established protocol for these issues in Debian - it's a community vote. Not an individuals thought. a bit of social interaction does have the tendency to create 'community' which is Debian's strength, so it could be viewed as productive. Plurium interrogationum - how cute. You do yourself no favours advancing that sort of fallacious logic. What I have seen, with the clearly marked OT threads is the ability to ignore/delete them Agreed. as I do when I look through and delete any other threads that I am not currently interested in or can't help with. The 'noise' on this list is nothing to what I have seen in the past. One, I remember, over communist mainland China and Taiwan that resulted, very regretfully, in a kernel developer leaving. What we have seen in the Debian lists is that people who provide genuine assistance - don't because of the difficulty of wading through torrents of irrelevant rubbish. There's never a shortage of helpers with irrelevant opinions, or pluckers of low hanging fruit (here's what Google says. Tagging [OT] - is good, keeping the subject matter to Debian software and is better. We are human beings and not automatons. Relevance? We use different oil. Indeed but what are you trying to say? Either we allow endless off-topic drivel or we lose the list?? Pure bifurcation rubbish. There are web forums for off-topic material - some even give bean ratings. Regards, Weaver. Note that in the past a list was created just for off-topic discussions. No one used it. Cheers. What a load of bluster, ad homonym attack, rudeness, ignorance and arrogance. *Plonk* -- In a world without walls and fences, what need have we for Windows or Gates? -Anon. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111008122047.7b7ae3c0.wea...@riseup.net
[OT] Re: Please kill the noise
Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. What's your problem? It's interesting stuff, and everyone is being polite and marking it [OT] and all that (except you, I might note). Maybe you should learn to use your delete key and/or kill-file stuff containing [OT] -- In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. Infnord practice, there is. Yogi Berra -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e8db7eb.8000...@meetinghouse.net
[OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On 10/06/2011 06:32 AM, Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. If you are using an MUA that supports threading, then I don't see the issue. It's all contained in one thread, and it doesn't prevent me from seeing other posts in other threads. Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. Following the Re: Wow, Evolution left me with eggs in my face thread, including all of its off-topic sub-threads, has shown a great level of maturity and tact. I see nothing juvenile about the thread personally. -- . o . o . o . . o o . . . o . . . o . o o o . o . o o . . o o o o . o . . o o o o . o o o -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4e8dba07.30...@gmail.com
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 10:15:07 -0400 Miles Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net wrote: Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. What's your problem? It's interesting stuff, and everyone is being polite and marking it [OT] and all that (except you, I might note). Maybe you should learn to use your delete key and/or kill-file stuff containing [OT] The point has often been made that this list is for Debian 'Users' and not therefore strictly Debian subject matter. I think a bit of social interaction does have the tendency to create 'community' which is Debian's strength, so it could be viewed as productive. What I have seen, with the clearly marked OT threads is the ability to ignore/delete them as I do when I look through and delete any other threads that I am not currently interested in or can't help with. The 'noise' on this list is nothing to what I have seen in the past. One, I remember, over communist mainland China and Taiwan that resulted, very regretfully, in a kernel developer leaving. We are human beings and not automatons. We use different oil. Regards, Weaver. -- In a world without walls and fences, what need have we for Windows or Gates? -Anon. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111007063215.28477e76.wea...@riseup.net
Re: [OT] Re: Please kill the noise
I totally agree with what Weaver said. On Oct 6, 2011 4:31 PM, Weaver wea...@riseup.net wrote: On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 10:15:07 -0400 Miles Fidelman mfidel...@meetinghouse.net wrote: Stan Hoeppner wrote: All of the off topic crap the last couple of days is making it more difficult to assist those who actually need help with Debian. Debian is an OS for _mature_ Linux users. Please act like one and stop this juvenile OT nonsense. What's your problem? It's interesting stuff, and everyone is being polite and marking it [OT] and all that (except you, I might note). Maybe you should learn to use your delete key and/or kill-file stuff containing [OT] The point has often been made that this list is for Debian 'Users' and not therefore strictly Debian subject matter. I think a bit of social interaction does have the tendency to create 'community' which is Debian's strength, so it could be viewed as productive. What I have seen, with the clearly marked OT threads is the ability to ignore/delete them as I do when I look through and delete any other threads that I am not currently interested in or can't help with. The 'noise' on this list is nothing to what I have seen in the past. One, I remember, over communist mainland China and Taiwan that resulted, very regretfully, in a kernel developer leaving. We are human beings and not automatons. We use different oil. Regards, Weaver. -- In a world without walls and fences, what need have we for Windows or Gates? -Anon. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111007063215.28477e76.wea...@riseup.net
