Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Du, 27 feb 11, 16:40:02, Dan Serban wrote: To add fuel to the fire, I find the debian wiki somewhat archaic, I'm quite used to mediawiki, and the current articles are very tech-centric, I This comes up quite often, but so far nobody was able to point significant differences between moinmoin and mediawiki. get the feeling that I may not be the best source to be adding information/documentation to the page, so generally I just move on. If not you then who else? :) Though this could be that I feel much more disconnected to the project lately as I find out new things simply through running into difficulties with working setups on upgrade. As a side, what happened to the Debian news weekly? I felt like I used to keep my finger on the pulse... And you are subscribed to debian-news, yes? http://lists.debian.org/debian-news/ Regards, Andrei -- Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sb, 26 feb 11, 23:31:56, Peter Tynan wrote: On the registration page quite reasonably I'm asked for my email address HOWEVER I can find no link to any form of privacy statement saying what will be done with my email address so being a cautious netizen I do not register, I do not make my suggestion and I start to understand why the Debian wiki is so relatively inactive. IMVHO, that's a valid concern. Please open a bug against the www.debian.org pseudo-package (severity: wishlist). I'm sure a suggested text would be much appreciated. Regards, Andrei -- Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 23:31:56 +, Peter Tynan wrote: One of the things I've never understood about Debian is why the wiki is so inactive when compared to other distributions, the simple fact of life is that nine times out of ten I find the information I'm looking for on the Arch or Gentoo wikis - not the Debian wiki. I am now beginning to understand why, let me tell you a story... (...) http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/EditorQuickStart#Account :-) Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.02.27.11.06...@gmail.com
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
- Original message - /snip http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/EditorQuickStart#Account /snip Hello Camaléon, so we got a privacy statement, but as the wiki states, this shouldn't be part of what is editable by everyone, but become a static page. Furthermore, I suppose a link from the registration page is missing, maybe for a good reason (it could be changed by everyone who thinks e.g. he/she has to be very funny) I dont know if u read the statement, but AFAICS there is _no_ statement about the handling of submitted eMail-addresses. So the OP's concern is not resolved by this privacy policy. Regards Simon
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011, Camaleón wrote: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/EditorQuickStart#Account Thanks for the link, three thoughts... 1: II think it would be helpful if there were links to the Privacy and Copyright pages on the registration page. 2: Still does not answer my primary concern of what is the policy regarding email addresses of registered users (it makes a difference in terms of which email address I use). 3: It's way too short - I'm one of those weird people that likes reading the small print. Peter -- (\___/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. gopher://sdf.lonestar.org/1/users/happy -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/alpine.neb.2.00.1102271120310.8...@bgnxh.serrfuryy.bet
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 11:28:44 +, Peter Tynan wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2011, Camaleón wrote: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/EditorQuickStart#Account Thanks for the link, three thoughts... 1: II think it would be helpful if there were links to the Privacy and Copyright pages on the registration page. 2: Still does not answer my primary concern of what is the policy regarding email addresses of registered users (it makes a difference in terms of which email address I use). 3: It's way too short - I'm one of those weird people that likes reading the small print. All valid concerns (#2 a bit paranoid, IMO), but I think they will be better managed and properly addressed in the right mailing list: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/Contact#content-admins Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.02.27.11.52...@gmail.com
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 12:26:57 +0100, Simon Hollenbach wrote: (please, avoid using html) Hello Camaléon, so we got a privacy statement, but as the wiki states, this shouldn't be part of what is editable by everyone, but become a static page. That is something up to wiki maintainers/admins, so you should contact and discuss the right status for that page with them. Furthermore, I suppose a link from the registration page is missing, maybe for a good reason (it could be changed by everyone who thinks e.g. he/she has to be very funny) People, that is what a Wiki is: freely editable by anyone with an account. There are pages that can be protected but most of them will be susceptible to vandalism or user errors. I dont know if u read the statement, but AFAICS there is _no_ statement about the handling of submitted eMail-addresses. So the OP's concern is not resolved by this privacy policy. If you want to improve those things, try by contacting the wiki admins. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.02.27.12.00...@gmail.com
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011, Camaleón wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 11:28:44 +, Peter Tynan wrote: All valid concerns (#2 a bit paranoid, IMO), but I think they will be better managed and properly addressed in the right mailing list: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/Contact#content-admins Probably, but I'm not signing up for another mailing list just to make a single post - I've raised my concerns here mainly to see what other users think and raise awareness. I will most likely follow through on the filing a bug report advice. As to point two being paranoid, with the way that Debian has operated over the years I have used - yes probably, but times and policies change so yes I'd like a definitive statement. Peter -- (\___/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. gopher://sdf.lonestar.org/1/users/happy -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/alpine.neb.2.00.1102271206560.3...@bgnxh.serrfuryy.bet
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 12:22:48 +, Peter Tynan wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2011, Camaleón wrote: All valid concerns (#2 a bit paranoid, IMO), but I think they will be better managed and properly addressed in the right mailing list: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWiki/Contact#content-admins Probably, but I'm not signing up for another mailing list just to make a single post - I've raised my concerns here mainly to see what other users think and raise awareness. I will most likely follow through on the filing a bug report advice. For someone who wants to collaborate in writing articles for the wiki, it is indeed a good idea. Note that you do not have to subscribe it to the list, you can use a news reader (or Gmane online form) or contact them via IRC. As to point two being paranoid, with the way that Debian has operated over the years I have used - yes probably, but times and policies change so yes I'd like a definitive statement. Okay, but it's just a wiki and your e-mail address will be used only for login purposes (at least that's the way it worked in another wikis where I've participated) and I trust Debian enough to do not think they will be sending me spam or other e-mails I have not requested or that they'll be selling people's e-mails to third-party companies/projects. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.02.27.12.44...@gmail.com
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
- Original message - On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 12:26:57 +0100, Simon Hollenbach wrote: (please, avoid using html) Sorry about that, i took the time to dig in modest, my mail client, to find that option. I prefer it as well, so thanks... That is something up to wiki maintainers/admins, so you should contact and discuss the right status for that page with them. Have you got a proposed way how to accomplish that most easily? I think the bug report should be sufficient, I hereby ask the OP to post the link when a bug was opened... People, that is what a Wiki is: freely editable by anyone with an account. Sure. But thats why I think a wiki is not the best place to post a privacy statement and such. If you want to improve those things, try by contacting the wiki admins. I hesitate on doing that now as I suppose the wiki-admins got more important stuff to do. If someone would confirm that this wouldn't be 'annoying', I will write to them. Hope I got the mail format right this time, if not, tell me. Regards Simon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1298811189.1618.14.camel@Nokia-N900
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 13:53:09 +0100, Simon Hollenbach wrote: (please, avoid using html) Sorry about that, i took the time to dig in modest, my mail client, to find that option. I prefer it as well, so thanks... No problem. That is something up to wiki maintainers/admins, so you should contact and discuss the right status for that page with them. Have you got a proposed way how to accomplish that most easily? I think the bug report should be sufficient, I hereby ask the OP to post the link when a bug was opened... There are many ways. Opening a bug report is one of them. Asking in their mailing list or using IRC is another. To be sincere, I think whatever path you take it will reach the right person/people :-) People, that is what a Wiki is: freely editable by anyone with an account. Sure. But thats why I think a wiki is not the best place to post a privacy statement and such. AFAICT, that Privacy statement is just for the wiki (its content and management), not for the whole Debian web pages. OTOH, one of the advantages of most wiki based content systems is that all changes are recorded and you can monitor special pages so if someone edits a monitored page you receive a warning via e-mail (I hope moinmoin also allows that). If you want to improve those things, try by contacting the wiki admins. I hesitate on doing that now as I suppose the wiki-admins got more important stuff to do. If someone would confirm that this wouldn't be 'annoying', I will write to them. Those changes (making a wiki page closed for edition or restricted) tend to be discussed between all the members of the wiki team. I dunno if this remains true for Debian wiki. Hope I got the mail format right this time, if not, tell me. Yes, this went fine. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.02.27.13.08...@gmail.com
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2011, Simon Hollenbach wrote: - Original message - On Sun, 27 Feb 2011 12:26:57 +0100, Simon Hollenbach wrote: I hereby ask the OP to post the link when a bug was opened... At the moment it is way, way past my bed-time (I'm desperately trying to stay awake until the cricket commentary finishes) so I don't quite trust myself to file the bug report now but I'll post the link once I've has some sleep. Peter -- (\___/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. gopher://sdf.lonestar.org/1/users/happy -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/alpine.neb.2.00.1102271312590.13...@bgnxh.serrfuryy.bet
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
In alpine.neb.2.00.1102271206560.3...@bgnxh.serrfuryy.bet, Peter Tynan wrote: I'm not signing up for another mailing list just to make a single post Most Debian mailing lists do not require subscription in order to post. Most users of Debian mailing lists will honor a request to be CC'd on replies, as instructed in the code of conduct. -- Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,= ,-_-. =. b...@iguanasuicide.net ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-' http://iguanasuicide.net/\_/ signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
Peter Tynan wrote: One of the things I've never understood about Debian is why the wiki is so inactive when compared to other distributions, the simple fact of life is that nine times out of ten I find the information I'm looking for on the Arch or Gentoo wikis - not the Debian wiki. I am now beginning to understand why, let me tell you a story... This would be a better story if the privacy policies of *both* the Arch and Gentoo wikis were not empty pages: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/ArchWiki:Privacy_policy http://en.gentoo-wiki.com/wiki/Gentoo_Linux_Wiki:Privacy_policy (These wikis also ask for an email address on registration.) I think that the actual reason you see those wikis in searches is that one or both of those wikis have a community of users who contributes articles on general topics, that are not specific to those distributions. The Debian wiki, instead, tends to only contain Debian-specific information. So these other wikis tend to be linked to more, and thus a cycle is created. -- see shy jo signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Wiki participation..?
On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 23:31:56 + Peter Tynan peter.ty...@gmail.com wrote: One of the things I've never understood about Debian is why the wiki is so inactive when compared to other distributions, the simple fact ... [snip] ... netizen I do not register, I do not make my suggestion and I start to understand why the Debian wiki is so relatively inactive. Peter To add fuel to the fire, I find the debian wiki somewhat archaic, I'm quite used to mediawiki, and the current articles are very tech-centric, I get the feeling that I may not be the best source to be adding information/documentation to the page, so generally I just move on. Though this could be that I feel much more disconnected to the project lately as I find out new things simply through running into difficulties with working setups on upgrade. As a side, what happened to the Debian news weekly? I felt like I used to keep my finger on the pulse... As you've said, arch and gentoo both have very excellent wikis, though that could simply be a result of having a wiki system available much earlier than the debian project (from what I remember). Thus much more user-centric content. Maybe the IRC bot used in the #debian channels can be set to link to information in the wiki more often to encourage heavier use? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20110227164002.68f68...@ws82.int.tlc
Debian Wiki participation..?
One of the things I've never understood about Debian is why the wiki is so inactive when compared to other distributions, the simple fact of life is that nine times out of ten I find the information I'm looking for on the Arch or Gentoo wikis - not the Debian wiki. I am now beginning to understand why, let me tell you a story... On the Openbox page http://wiki.debian.org/Openbox I noticed some advice that I thought was not exactly best practice Add the following to the autostart.sh file in /etc/xdg/openbox. As I understand it a user should copy these files to ~/.config/openbox folder and edit these local files. Being a dutiful netizen I thought I'd mention this on the discussion page and see what other users thought. Hmmm... no discussion page but it seems I can create one... but wait... I need to be logged in to do that. I can understand the need to be logged in - reduce spam and all - so off I go to register. On the registration page quite reasonably I'm asked for my email address HOWEVER I can find no link to any form of privacy statement saying what will be done with my email address so being a cautious netizen I do not register, I do not make my suggestion and I start to understand why the Debian wiki is so relatively inactive. Peter -- (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. gopher://sdf.lonestar.org/1/users/happy -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/aanlktinuriwtymc9sj4vlubxvdbuayi90lfppr89j...@mail.gmail.com
