Re: OT: less v. more CCing
On 02 Aug 2000, Bolan Meek [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On topics arisen from this discussion, Gerfried Fuchs wrote: ...BTW, please refrain from sending to _both_ the list and me, I read the list. ... One may assume that those whose names one sees often are subuscribed, but how to be sure, generally? I propose One can't know. But one should read the list s/he's posting to. If s/he doesn't it's not your fault. In general, on open lists you should assume one is reading the list s/he is posting to. For this one her (debian-user, to which this thread was crossmailed) this isn't right for my person. But the original discussion was on debian-devel and I also sent this to this special list. a habit of including in the .sig a notice: I'm on this list A signature is a signature is a signature. And has in general nothing to do with the article. I say in general, some people tend to add special signature according to the topic (like Sven Guckes, if you know him). As you can see from the headers, the list of Cc: is getting longer every time, then. And how should I know what e.g. Ben had in his signature about being on the list or not? How should one know what your intention was to Cc: him? This might work for the first time, but not for the next replies (which, on a discussion-list are very likely). And removing it when not needed. I think that will help newcomers, as well as those who have the habit of leaving the poster on the To/Cc: list. I go another way: I included now a header that should be respected by most MUAs: Mail-CopiesTo: never I think newcomers should rather be guided to _not_ Cc: one posting to a list than to rely on some obscure sentence in one's signature. The header I noticed is a proposed draft that is included in some MUAs, and will quite possibly be in by more in the future. In other news, in accordance with the OT in the Subject:, I'm sending my reply to -user... Which I don't read, so if you want to reply to this you might want to Cc: me, but I hope this is not neccesary. I'm not likely to subscribe -user, I'm on far too many lists. Have fun! Alfie -- Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday
Re: OT: less v. more CCing
Gerfried == Gerfried Fuchs [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gerfried I go another way: I included now a header that should Gerfried be respected by most MUAs: Mail-CopiesTo: never The mail-copies-to header does sound good, but I have mixed feelings as to if it really solves the problems. Oh, BTW, Mail-CopiesTo: never is obsolete, use nobody instead. See http://www.newsreaders.com/misc/mail-copies-to.html Mostly coming from this: Gerfried I think newcomers should rather be guided to _not_ Cc: Gerfried one posting to a list than to rely on some obscure Gerfried sentence in one's signature. The header I noticed is a Gerfried proposed draft that is included in some MUAs, and will Gerfried quite possibly be in by more in the future. In Gnus, you followup an article with 'f'. There are two modes: 1. default: f replies to everybody, unless there is a mail-copies-to: nobody header. 2. after config: f replies to predefined mailing list only, unless mail-copies-to says otherwise. Both of these, in my mind, have serious problems: Mode 1: Should be obvious. Not everybody sets the mail-copies-to header. Mode 2: When replying to some mailing lists, replying to the mailing list is not always appropriate. Some examples of when the default mailing list address is wrong: - Mail sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED], appears on debian-private. Replies should go to [EMAIL PROTECTED], not debian-private. - often bug reports are cross posted to debian-devel, and replies often should be copied to the BTS. - policy requests are done via the BTS, but appear on debian-policy. - cross posts between multiple mailing lists. Sometimes this can be important, for instance, if a discussion with an upstream mailing is relevant to debian-devel. Another limitation, IMHO, is that the header mail-copies-to: nobody, doesn't provide the MUA enough information where the reply should go. Ok, it shouldn't go to the sender. But what about the list of addresses under the To: header? What about the list of addresses under the Cc: header? Which address/addresses should be used? How can you guess in such a way as to avoid the above problems? I do not see how these limitations could be avoided, as the MUA has no way of knowing where the reply should go. The MUA can find out where the message was sent, but how does it know which addresses are mailing lists, which ones are private individuals, and which private individuals want CCs? I would prefer another header (does the followup-to header do this??), that is like reply-to:, except it works for group followups, rather then private replies. Even better, if it supported mailing lists *and* newsgroups... If the poster hasn't submitted one, the mailing list software could add a default one. If there is already a header, it shouldn't be replaced. Another-words, I think it should be up to the sender to specify exactly where the group reply should go. If the sender doesn't say, then the mailing list should be able to specify. This should happen without affecting private replies (so reply-to can't be used). As a side affect, this would eliminate the need for the debates of the form: but I really do have an email address called nobody! -- Brian May [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: less v. more CCing
Ben Pfaff wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David N. Welton) writes: Edward Betts [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: more offers backwards paging, it is in the man page I am suprised that you missed it. ps auxw | more How do you scroll backwards? b doesn't work. `more' supports backward paging only for files, not for pipes. I've noticed this, and have been irritated enough by not being able to back-up on man pages, which are from pipes, that I've installed less. On topics arisen from this discussion, Gerfried Fuchs wrote: ...BTW, please refrain from sending to _both_ the list and me, I read the list. ... One may assume that those whose names one sees often are subuscribed, but how to be sure, generally? I propose a habit of including in the .sig a notice: I'm on this list And removing it when not needed. I think that will help newcomers, as well as those who have the habit of leaving the poster on the To/Cc: list. In other news, in accordance with the OT in the Subject:, I'm sending my reply to -user... -- I'm on the list. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 972-729-5387 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (home ph. on Q) http://www.koyote.com/users/bolan RE: xmailtool http://www.koyote.com/users/bolan/xmailtool/index.html RMS of Borg: Resistance is futile; you shall be freed.
